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Old 12-15-2010, 12:57 PM   #51
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Payscale for the Canadian Forces: http://www.forces.ca/en/page/payscal...icersregular-1

Pay is per month.

And to get it, basically just have to fill out all the online application forms (I've got four packages to hand in) and then hand it in and apply for the ROTP program when you get there. And either they'll make something up when you get there about them not taking anymore pilots or they'll take it and then you have to go back for testing (medical and academic) and then the process begins.

As far as being a fighter pilot, assumign you get into the program, everyone does the same thing for the first 3 years and does the regula flying. At the end of that, the top classmates, get to choose what they want; fighter, transport, helicopter.

That's what i've understood. JD, if i've got anything wrong let me know.

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It varies from country to country but I am going through the process right now here in Canada. I tried with the US first but was denied by the USMC and USAF simply because I was a non-resident. I'll answer this in detail for you tonight.
I've got the application mostly filled out on my table right now. Gotta hand that thing in in the next week. Do you have any flight experience or just applying straight on?
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Old 12-15-2010, 01:21 PM   #52
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Payscale for the Canadian Forces: http://www.forces.ca/en/page/payscal...icersregular-1

Pay is per month.

And to get it, basically just have to fill out all the online application forms (I've got four packages to hand in) and then hand it in and apply for the ROTP program when you get there. And either they'll make something up when you get there about them not taking anymore pilots or they'll take it and then you have to go back for testing (medical and academic) and then the process begins.

As far as being a fighter pilot, assumin you get into the program, everyone does the same thing for the first 3 years and does the regula flying. At the end of that, the top classmates, get to choose what they want; fighter, transport, helicopter.

That's what i've understood. JD, if i've got anything wrong let me know.



I've got the application mostly filled out on my table right now. Gotta hand that thing in in the next week. Do you have any flight experience or just applying straight on?
Yeah that's basically correct. Everyone follows the same path through Moose Jaw. Students study a little bit of jet, multi-engine, and rotary. Top students can put in a "request" for where they'd like to go but it is not always accepted. If they get fighters they do their first course on the Hawk jet trainer in Moose Jaw to learn jet basics, BFM, etc before being transferred to Cold Lake to train on the F18.

Shockingly, the trend these days is that pilots don't want fighters and are trying to get on multi-engine aircraft instead. The C17 is the top pick! Apparently they are desperate for fighter pilots and the Canadian Forces in general is 130 operators short at the moment.

I personally have limited flight experience, nothing outside little Cessna's but my dad is a 23 year fighter vet and is currently a private contractor assisting in the training of our Air Force and Navy. He's got more than 14,000hrs logged now I believe. So I grew up a base brat and have been surrounded by jets most of my life. I've got a picture of me at like age 6 or 7 in the cockpit of an F104 in Germany somewhere at my parents place I am going in as a DEO as I already have a degree.

EDIT - Don't believe the BS the recruiting center feeds you about wait times and how you'll never get in. Just say "yep ok" and push your application in and get in the line. It's shocking how discouraging they are to would-be applicants. Perhaps it's a method of testing how dedicated applicants are. Just don't take no for an answer and make sure they take in and process your application. After being told I would be waiting for years I got a phone call within 3 months to book me in for my CFAT.

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Old 12-15-2010, 01:32 PM   #53
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Abbotsford Airshow 2009:
that was an awesome airshow, the states really brought up some serious hardware that year.
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Old 12-15-2010, 01:35 PM   #54
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Yeah that's basically correct. Everyone follows the same path through Moose Jaw. Students study a little bit of jet, multi-engine, and rotary. Top students can put in a "request" for where they'd like to go but it is not always accepted. If they get fighters they do their first course on the Hawk jet trainer in Moose Jaw to learn jet basics, BFM, etc before being transferred to Cold Lake to train on the F18.

Shockingly, the trend these days is that pilots don't want fighters and are trying to get on multi-engine aircraft instead. The C17 is the top pick! Apparently they are desperate for fighter pilots and the Canadian Forces in general is 130 operators short at the moment.

I personally have limited flight experience, nothing outside little Cessna's but my dad is a 23 year fighter vet and is currently a private contractor assisting in the training of our Air Force and Navy. He's got more than 14,000hrs logged now I believe. So I grew up a base brat and have been surrounded by jets most of my life. I've got a picture of me at like age 6 or 7 in the cockpit of an F104 in Germany somewhere at my parents place I am going in as a DEO as I already have a degree.
You know I can see that because getting on the multi stuff would give you a bit of a leg up when you get out of the AirForce. The way I see it if you go fighter I believe you would have much less flight hours than the transport guys, mind you you would have godlike stick and rudder skills haha. I'm wanting to go the fighter route so that's good news for me!

I'm just worried about getting shot down at the recruitement centre. My friend was there handing is pilot application in and literally as he's filling out the forms another kid walks in and says he's here to hand in his pilot application and the recruitement officer says sorry we're not taking anymore pilots at this time. I got the same thing when I went there to get more info, except I didn't inquire about the ROTP. So here's to wishing me luck when I go in haha.

Ya I got my PPL last year and am currently working on my Commercial through Coastal Pacific so I think I have a leg up already in the application process so we'll see.

Anyways, nice to see there's someone I can fire all my questions towards haha.

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EDIT - Don't believe the BS the recruiting center feeds you about wait times and how you'll never get in. Just say "yep ok" and push your application in and get in the line. It's shocking how discouraging they are to would-be applicants. Perhaps it's a method of testing how dedicated applicants are. Just don't take no for an answer and make sure they take in and process your application. After being told I would be waiting for years I got a phone call within 3 months to book me in for my CFAT
You know that's what i'm thinking. The lady wanted to put in ASOP, or something like that (the guy who monitors the radars and what not on the planes) when I was there...
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Old 12-15-2010, 01:37 PM   #55
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Yeah that's basically correct. Everyone follows the same path through Moose Jaw. Students study a little bit of jet, multi-engine, and rotary. Top students can put in a "request" for where they'd like to go but it is not always accepted. If they get fighters they do their first course on the Hawk jet trainer in Moose Jaw to learn jet basics, BFM, etc before being transferred to Cold Lake to train on the F18.

Shockingly, the trend these days is that pilots don't want fighters and are trying to get on multi-engine aircraft instead. The C17 is the top pick! Apparently they are desperate for fighter pilots and the Canadian Forces in general is 130 operators short at the moment.

I personally have limited flight experience, nothing outside little Cessna's but my dad is a 23 year fighter vet and is currently a private contractor assisting in the training of our Air Force and Navy. He's got more than 14,000hrs logged now I believe. So I grew up a base brat and have been surrounded by jets most of my life. I've got a picture of me at like age 6 or 7 in the cockpit of an F104 in Germany somewhere at my parents place I am going in as a DEO as I already have a degree.
The C17 (USAF) and the Hawk at Abbotsford this summer (the CC-177 arrived after the show on the first day, so I couldn't take any pics of it - the cars leaving the show had to wait for it to taxi across though):
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Old 12-15-2010, 01:45 PM   #56
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You know that's what i'm thinking. The lady wanted to put in ASOP, or something like that (the guy who monitors the radars and what not on the planes) when I was there...
Like I said the CF is desperate for pilots. Don't take no for an answer!

They tried to push me into MARS Officer, I politely declined over and over again.
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Old 12-15-2010, 02:05 PM   #57
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And one of the best all around attack helicopters in the world

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Old 12-15-2010, 02:18 PM   #58
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Old 12-15-2010, 03:32 PM   #59
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Old 12-15-2010, 04:26 PM   #60
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Just heard that the British government is going to be retiring Harriers.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...-farewell.html
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Old 12-15-2010, 06:44 PM   #61
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Is there any technical data to support this claim or is it more opinions from "experts in armchair air combat"? IMO, nothing the Russians make can "out anything" made by the Americans today, when comparing similar-type role fighters. It doesn't matter what the Russians build, when it comes down to it the Americans have the lead in fighter technology, reliability and most importantly, training and flight hours.
no point arguing. i just remembered the the SU37 isnt even a production plane.. just a technology demonstrator

experimental planes are pretty awesome..

F15 ACTIVE (thrust vectoring + canards)

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Old 12-15-2010, 07:30 PM   #62
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Yeah that's basically correct. Everyone follows the same path through Moose Jaw. Students study a little bit of jet, multi-engine, and rotary. Top students can put in a "request" for where they'd like to go but it is not always accepted. If they get fighters they do their first course on the Hawk jet trainer in Moose Jaw to learn jet basics, BFM, etc before being transferred to Cold Lake to train on the F18.

S.
My boss was a Moose Jaw dropout. He said that the people in the program with him were incredibly cutthroat, competitive, and back-stabbing. Everybody is just looking out for #1.

It worked out for the better for him, he makes boatloads more money now.
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Old 12-15-2010, 07:56 PM   #63
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no point arguing. i just remembered the the SU37 isnt even a production plane.. just a technology demonstrator

experimental planes are pretty awesome..

F15 ACTIVE (thrust vectoring + canards)

Not arguing, discussing.

I think ultimately it comes down to the fighter control stick operator's experience, training and hours. One F-15 Pilot opinion.


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Like I said the CF is desperate for pilots. Don't take no for an answer!
They aren't desperate, but they are short yes. The pilots in our squadron are extremely busy right now due to attrition. It seems that as soon as a fighter pilot gets fully combat operational, he/she gets posted out to another assignment, leaving a hole.
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Old 12-15-2010, 11:28 PM   #64
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My boss was a Moose Jaw dropout. He said that the people in the program with him were incredibly cutthroat, competitive, and back-stabbing. Everybody is just looking out for #1.

It worked out for the better for him, he makes boatloads more money now.
I could totally see that. Out of curiosity what's he do now?
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Old 12-16-2010, 05:14 AM   #65
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watching this.. most people wont believe planes could fly like this..
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Old 12-16-2010, 08:33 AM   #66
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Not arguing, discussing.

I think ultimately it comes down to the fighter control stick operator's experience, training and hours. One F-15 Pilot opinion.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M-CRINeb9_A
all i will say is that: The 'Bison' radar : the USAF should be aware that the 'Bison' does not have an Israeli radar, it is Russian Phazatron Kopyo . Nor does the Su-30MKI have Tumansky engines (but the NPO-Saturn). Surprisingly the Colonel seems oblivious of such facts, yet tries to convey that he is an authority on the matter. (does this have turbo )

and IAF , during all exercises , with US/RAF/FAF, didn't turn on active mode radars (its common knowledge- do research again on this), they didnt use data link. as it was requested by russians.

FOD: sure they will take 60sec, as if they dont fly to nellis AFB with spare engines, just in case an engine gets FOD damage.

turn rate: su-27 has a about the same turn rate (without tvc than su-30mki that employs tvc?) source: http://www.fighter-planes.com/info/su27.htm

amazingly he does admit that su-30mki are better than F-15/16 but not f-22,which is a 5gen AC, su-30/35 are 4.5





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Old 12-16-2010, 08:33 AM   #67
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So today was the last flight for the Harrier...
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Ezekiel 25:17. The path of the righteous man is beset on all sides by the inequities of the selfish and the tyranny of evil men. Blessed is he who, in the name of charity and good will, shepherds the weak through the valley of the darkness. For he is truly his brother's keeper and the finder of lost children. And I will strike down upon thee with great vengeance and furious anger those who attempt to poison and destroy my brothers. And you will know I am the Lord when I lay my vengeance upon you.
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Old 12-16-2010, 08:43 AM   #68
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So today was the last flight for the Harrier...
So sad

http://www.bfbs.com/news/england/las...ier-42214.html

I will always remember it as from the scene from true lies.
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Old 12-16-2010, 09:22 AM   #69
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harriers are still in action in other parts of the world.


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Old 12-19-2010, 02:15 PM   #70
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Sorry for the delay in getting this up, but here is a basic breakdown of the steps for becoming a pilot in the Canadian Forces:

- Initial aptitude test, interview, security check, and medical screening done at your local Recruiting Centre
- Aircrew Selection at 8 Wing CFB Trenton (Ontario). Additional aptitude tests and 4 missions in the 'Canadian Automated Pilot Selection System'. If you pass all these you then head to Defence Research and Development Canada in Toronto for almost a week of medical testing to determine your suitability. Very indepth testing including an ultra-sound of your heart.

Assuming you pass everything and are offered a position here's what's next:

- Phase I - Primary Flying Training is conducted with 28 hours on the Grob 120A in Portage La Prairie, Manitoba. This is essentially the same as getting your private license.

- Phase II - 90 hours on the Raytheon CT-156 Harvard II in Moose Jaw, Saskatchewan. You also study basics of rotary, jet, and multi-engine. The decision of where you will go for Phase III is made during Phase II.

Phase III (Fighters) - 72 hours on the BAE CT-155 Hawk remaining in Moose Jaw.

Upon completion of all that you will head off to the OTU 419 Squadron at CFB Cold Lake, Alberta. Here you will spend even more time on the Hawk and transition from not just flying a jet but being a fighter pilot. Following that course you finally move "next door" to 410 Squadron and commence training on the F18 Hornet. There is an 8 part mini series that aired on Discovery Channel a few years ago that followed students going through their training on the F18. Definitely worth the watch!

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Old 12-19-2010, 11:38 PM   #71
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My boss was a Moose Jaw dropout. He said that the people in the program with him were incredibly cutthroat, competitive, and back-stabbing. Everybody is just looking out for #1.

It worked out for the better for him, he makes boatloads more money now.
Your boss just didn't have what it takes to become a fighter pilot. I doubt those guys go in it for the money.
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Old 12-19-2010, 11:51 PM   #72
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Old 12-20-2010, 05:47 AM   #73
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Somehow I doubt the F22 can fly like that...
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Old 12-20-2010, 02:44 PM   #74
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Your boss just didn't have what it takes to become a fighter pilot. I doubt those guys go in it for the money.
What he told me is absolutely believable. When you have so many people competing for such little available flight time, teamwork and comraderie takes a bit of a back seat.

Maybe he didn't have what it takes, if what it takes is to be a bit of an asshole, which he isn't, which is rare to say about a boss
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Old 12-20-2010, 02:49 PM   #75
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I could totally see that. Out of curiosity what's he do now?
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