Vancouver's Real Estate Market

[punkwax]

Originally Posted by multicartual

Rent and be happy


Real estate is just a status symbol for the weak

lol... actually, most of the world's elite and powerful invest in real estate

[multicartual]

Originally Posted by westopher

I'm all for being rewarded for hard work and good ideas, but maybe we would be a better society if profitable investments were limited to things that aren't basic needs, like shelter, water and basic raw foods.

I was at the Langley Porsche dealership opening drinking from the open bar a couple Wednesdays ago


This short, 5'2 dude arab looking dude with a buzz cut was bragging loudly about how he owns a McLaren and he's putting out feelers to get a 918. I asked what he does for a living and he said Real Estate agent. He then asked me if I had a hookup for blow!


Seriously, fuck real estate agents. They are the fakest fucking people, even worse than drug dealers!

[multicartual]

Originally Posted by punkwax

lol... actually, most of the world's elite and powerful invest in real estate

The more evil and greedy you are the more you'll be respected by ghouls

[godwin]

Well tell that to the multitude of teachers, cops etc who had bought in before the last few years.. at this rate the price doubles every 6 years. In a few years, even a 50% crash most houses will still be a million. I can see immediate family buying too, what else are the parents going to do with the money anyways. Real estate is way more practical than boats, RVs or other crazy stuff people like to get when they retire.

Most who are new to the market now wants buy because they have a stable job and mortages are cheap. Some people prefer to have tangible investments. A newish med grad remarked, it is easier than her student loan.

In fact at one of the local firms I am involved in, we noticed we get a lot more hires who originate from Maritimes and now they are decamping from Ab to come here.

As long as Canadians keep piling into the west coast and US keeps H1B numbers low (important), so firms like Amazon, Microsoft etc have to open offices here to keep their foreign hires, there will be no shortage of greater fools to can afford real estate.

I had lived in Copenhagen and Berlin, those places have 70%+ of the population renting.. it is no big deal honestly.. personal choice, personal responsibility.

Originally Posted by multicartual

Why buy?


When you keep buying, you just pay into the Vancouver housing pyramid scheme that is driven by fear of being "priced out" and a desire for the status of saying you own instead of rent.

[Stormspirit]

How much do new apartments in Richmond getting built go up in value by... maybe 1-2% a year? Is it worth investing in one and renting it out considering tenant fee is enough to pay mortgage + strata fees.

[4444]

Originally Posted by punkwax

lol... actually, most of the world's elite and powerful invest in real estate

that's not really fair to say, world's elite own everything, businesses (whole/partial/common stock), bonds, commerical, and residential real estate.

they also buy vintage cars, ridiculously expensive wine (as an investment or for their own shits and giggles), art - no world elite has an investment plan of "all my worth in 1 asset in 1 city" which is what ppl in vancouver think will make them rich.

also, the uber wealthy either pay with cash, or use leverage because they can, not because they have to - the wealthy own debt, the poor take on debt - this is what you should take home from the wealthy vs. the rest.

[4444]

Originally Posted by Z3guy

I never doubted your happiness, just your advice about buying or not. You bring up many valid logical points, but everything about real estate in Vancouver is illogical! Makes no sense, but it continues to rise. I just came back from hk\china and have a different perspective now from their perspective. 5m in hk buys you a nice 1500 sq ft apartment in a nice area like central or repulse bay. When they see what you can get in van for 5m they are laughing! Actual houses in hk are 40m and up.

To answer your question, no I would not buy in ths market, but i feel fortunate I did jump in in 2007.

that was actually a mature, pleasant response for once - thank you

to be honest, i was looking to buy in 2008, i'm so glad i didn't as it turns out I wanted the mobility (didn't realize at that time), and looking at the price appreciation for 2 bed apartments, i don't think i'd have made any money after buying, renovating, selling costs, and the own vs. rent differential especially when you look at what a diversified stock portfolio has done since 2008.

i always come back to one thing that scares the living shit out of me when buying real estate when the ownership premium is more than small, and that is when you buy, you lock in at that price, but pay for it over 25 years. if you rent and invest the monthly savings (which most ppl won't do), you buy at every month's price.

the above may not be a concern for everyone, but i would find it very hard to lock in at one price knowing i could only sell it at one price in the future vs. buying over years and selling over years.

[Mr.HappySilp]

Originally Posted by Stormspirit

How much do new apartments in Richmond getting built go up in value by... maybe 1-2% a year? Is it worth investing in one and renting it out considering tenant fee is enough to pay mortgage + strata fees.

Depends on the place and where it is located. Personally I wouldn't pick Richmond. Too many c-lais who doesn't know how to drive and is too crowded.

[pengu]

Ive yet to find a place that can be rented out enough to cover all fees+mortgage. It doesn't work as well with Vancouver real estate prices being so high and rent being somewhat cheaper.

[4444]

Originally Posted by pengu

Ive yet to find a place that can be rented out enough to cover all fees+mortgage. It doesn't work as well with Vancouver real estate prices being so high and rent being somewhat cheaper.

you buy real estate in vancouver for speculation on capital appreciation, not cash flow (why people like me would not call it investing, rather, gambling).

this is, unless you're a (corrupt) Chinese dude that is looking to buy residency or launder money

[jing]

Originally Posted by pengu

Ive yet to find a place that can be rented out enough to cover all fees+mortgage. It doesn't work as well with Vancouver real estate prices being so high and rent being somewhat cheaper.

While few and far between, I've found a few places that can still net a positive cash flow without breaking the bank either. Don't take my word for it though, since I'm not even sure myself if it's worth taking the plunge.

[waddy41]

BBY condos by skytrain are around $330k, or DT bachelors around $310k

Both can be rented out for $1400+ per month

Originally Posted by pengu

Ive yet to find a place that can be rented out enough to cover all fees+mortgage. It doesn't work as well with Vancouver real estate prices being so high and rent being somewhat cheaper.

[Z3guy]

If you have balls to jump in the real estate market now, you gotta get dirt, otherwise you are better off renting. I have a few buddies in the south Granville condo market that are asking the same price they paid in 2010. Too many smaller new condos coming online at similar price pts.

[adambomb]

Rent and be happy?!

Ask these renters who never bothered to purchase a home when houses in Metro Vancouver were "affordable". I'm sure they enjoy the freedom of being able to move around without having to worry about debt.

Burnaby seniors losing rental due to redevelopment, again

You buy real estate so you don't end up on the front page of some local newspaper like these schmucks.

[Hehe]

Originally Posted by adambomb

Rent and be happy?!

The whole concept of renting is that you invest elsewhere that makes financial sense. GVR RE is maintained by nothing but hype (RE boards and current owners, as they all benefit from higher RE) and artificial manipulation (historical low interest rates, CMHC... etc). Few years ago when I had enough money to buy a house, I decided against it and invested in commercial RE in US instead. Today I sit on a positive cashflow that my friend, who bought his place back then can only dream of. Sure he owns 3 houses and they have appreciated 25%, he still works his ass off every month just to make the end meets. Since my properties also increased in value and they are paying for itself plus something for me.

Low interest rate cannot go on forever. It creates high inflation. Sadly, BoC is nothing but political tool now with the news that BoC is considering to allow higher inflation target in exchange of maintaining longer the low interest rate. The longer this continues, the closer it leads us to the steps of Japan.

Japan maintained 0% (or close to it) for the last 2.5 decades, its economy didn't simply boom out of control, rather, it entered a prolonged recession/deflation. And what happened before that? They had record high property prices. The trend of declining property prices didn't stop to about early 2010s. Even then, there wasn't increases... but rather, it stopped declining.

If one can afford comfortably owning a place, by all mean go ahead. But it is not an INVESTMENT. It's simply your shelter. Don't stretch yourself and don't buy into the hype.

For investment, cashflow is still king. And Vancouver is SHITTY at that.

[westopher]

My "downpayment money" put into proper investments made 10% in the last 7 months and paid for my wife's schooling. I can Hmmm and hawwww as much as I want about not jumping into the real estate market all I want, but a 600 sq. foot condo, which is all would could comfortably afford, couldn't have done that for me.

[Mr.HappySilp]

Originally Posted by pengu

Ive yet to find a place that can be rented out enough to cover all fees+mortgage. It doesn't work as well with Vancouver real estate prices being so high and rent being somewhat cheaper.

depends on hot big your mortgage. If you only have 10% on a 600sq ft apartment then yea rent won't cover it. If you have 30 to 35% downpayment then most likely the rent will cover the mortgage.

[Hondaracer]

Originally Posted by adambomb

Rent and be happy?!

Ask these renters who never bothered to purchase a home when houses in Metro Vancouver were "affordable". I'm sure they enjoy the freedom of being able to move around without having to worry about debt.

Burnaby seniors losing rental due to redevelopment, again

You buy real estate so you don't end up on the front page of some local newspaper like these schmucks.

thats just poor life planning.

it's like the elderly couple a while back who lived in point grey but couldnt afford 10k in property taxes every year and went bitching to the news about it.

Yea.. you CANT afford to live there.. where's the misunderstanding?

[iEatClams]

Looks like our governments won't even gather the data on foreign money/investors.
Guy is comparing our city to London and Tokyo, yet doesn't account for income or population differences. Thinks RE prices in vancouver are "pretty reasonable"






Province has no plans to collect data on foreign real estate investment

B.C. Housing Minister Rich Coleman has said neither his ministry or the province has any plans to collect data on foreign ownership, stating that housing costs in B.C. are “pretty reasonable”.

Coleman was referring to the price of real estate in B.C. and the Lower Mainland region compared to other cities such as London and Tokyo after a prompt from Vancouver-Point Grey MLA David Eby.

“It would be greatly worthwhile, from the perspective of many people, to measure the impact of [foreign investment] on the B.C. real estate market,” said Eby.

“There is a lot of concern about this in my community, and people need to know whether their concern is overblown or whether it’s legitimate, and if it’s legitimate that people are using housing as investments and driving up prices, then the province should look at what actions should be taken.” He then asked if Minister Coleman would consider and take forward the conversation within his government to measure international and domestic investment in properties when the unit is vacant.

“I believe that the market place adjusts. If you notice over the years, it has fluctuations up and fluctuations down. If you look at the mean cost of housing across British Columbia and you compare it to other major cities worldwide, the reason it is attractive internationally is because it’s actually pretty reasonable compared to other cities like London, Singapore, Tokyo,” Coleman answered.

Image: Craig Paterson via Flickr / Province of BC via Flickr
SEE ALSO: Christy Clark says no to taxing foreign real estate investors
But noting statistics, Vancouver’s housing costs are not comparable to many of Coleman’s sampled cities due to the differences in income across these markets. While real estate prices are expensive across the board, income in cities such as London are much higher compared to Vancouver.

According to 2014 National Statistics, the median salary in London was $65,336 (£34,473) while Statistics Canada reports the median income for people living in Vancouver in 2013 was only $28,726, less than half of what Londoners make.

“I don’t believe we should be in the market place,” Coleman said, referring to his ministry, “and we have not had any request to go and do this work … There is no initiative at this time in government to go and interfere in the market place in regards to housing.”

Eby then said he was “disappointed” the Minister refused to consider measuring the data.

Coleman’s comments come after another dividing week in regards to foreign real estate investment. On Tuesday, B.C. Premier Christy Clark she said worries that if taxes on foreign real estate investors are implemented, “housing prices will drop.”

“That’s good for first-time home buyers but not for anybody who is depending on the equity in their home to maybe get a loan or use that to finance some other projects,”Clark added.

shutterstock_50097079
SEE ALSO: April hottest month for B.C. real estate in a decade
However, after Coleman’s comments, it is clear the government is opposed to even researching the effects of foreign ownership on B.C. housing prices and its economy, let alone impose taxes.

Meanwhile, the British Columbia Real Estate Association reported Thursday morning a 45.5 per cent increase from April 2014 in the total sales dollar volume for B.C. real estate and a 28.7 per cent increase in number of home sales, totaling $6.3 billion worth of real estate sold in April, making the month the hottest April for home sales in a decade.

[iEatClams]

Some people at land titles and other bodies are saying that the numbers for foreign buyers are really high in places like Vancouver and South Burnaby.

I guess if you are a homeowner - we have a record percentage of the population participating in this market - or someone who works in a real estate related field (record # of people who work in a field that depends on real estate and have a huge vested interest in high prices), you wouldn't want anything would decrease your assets by hundreds of thousands of dollars, or even millions. Or anything that would reduces your profits, income or job.

Too many parties have a vested interest.

Don't want to mess with $6.3 Billion dollars worth of Real estate sold in a Month.

[godwin]

I don't think it was point grey. It was southlands right next to UBC (North of the junction point where SW Marine breaks off with W41) which belongs to the Musqueam band. The lease was up and Musqueam wanted to increase the lease rate.

Again personal choices, personal responsiblity.. just note it also affects your progeny if you choose to have any. As I say a lot of parents I know, who own primary property and are getting to the stage where they have paid off the residence, now buy extra properties for their kids with extra mortgages, reverse mortgage etc etc. Once you have built momentum it is really easy.

Honestly it is the federal gov's job to see who owns who, no the province.. they are the primary controller for CRA, border agents, banks etc. It is stupid to get the province to do it. But we all know the Conservatives won't do it. It is election year folks.

Originally Posted by Hondaracer

thats just poor life planning.

it's like the elderly couple a while back who lived in point grey but couldnt afford 10k in property taxes every year and went bitching to the news about it.

Yea.. you CANT afford to live there.. where's the misunderstanding?

[zyzzjr]

[Gululu]

show you guys just a fraction of Chinese buying power
this was yesterday, in richmond, a bus carrying 2 dozen families from China part of tour group (all visitors) specifically to purchase your real estate.

[multicartual]

There is a never-ending supply of chinamen

[GLOW]

Originally Posted by multicartual

There is a never-ending supply of chinamen

literally bus loads of 'em!!!