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Vancouver Off-Topic / Current EventsThe off-topic forum for Vancouver, funnies, non-auto centered discussions, WORK SAFE. While the rules are more relaxed here, there are still rules. Please refer to sticky thread in this forum.
Companies don't save money by bringing foreign nationals in. Period. It's federal law that dictates you have to pay them the going wage. This isn't Dubai.
Secondly, there is a labour shortage.
How many of you read and hear about the wages and salaries up North and actually are willing to sacrifice and take the leap of faith to go try it for a few years? Be introspective. You've read the articles, you might know people who have done it, but how many of you are just too content to go outside your comfort zones for an opportunity? How many of you are willing to sacrifice your so called work-life balance?
During occupy Vancouver, the mayor of a small town in BC (Dawson Creek) came down and offered jobs to the protesters, as long as they were willing to relocate they would be paid 50-80K/year even with no post secondary or trades education. How many people took him up on his offer? Zero.
You can't have it both ways, this thread is full of hypocrisy and scape goating. You can complain about these opportunities being given to foreign nationals (not just Chinese btw, the Americans have been allowed to do this forever, but we're ok with the US stealing "our jobs"), or you can get off your asses and go make money that would allow you to retire at 40.
Like I said earlier, we're fortunate enough to live in what is one of the strongest economies in the WORLD right now. You can choose to be a part of it, or whine and protest against it.
two of those three have products in their lineup made overseas or are comprised of components made over seas.
For those of you that think products and services made over seas are only done to line the pockets of the corporations doing so and not passing at least some of the savings on to you look no further than car audio.
There was a time not to long ago when amplifiers cost $1000 for a 25-50 watt per channel power made in the good ole USA. Guess what they dont sell nearly as good as the 25-50 watt made overseas amps. Why cuz people are cheap (all of us) and they'd rather buy an overseas made one at a fraction of the price. Walmart wouldnt exist if it wasnt for the cheapness of consumers
Locally made used to mean something, be it electronics, cars or produce and our economies used to do better.
When I spend my money I do my damnedest to keep it here. Be it hiring someone or buying a product. No one person can fight globalization and the way I see it, globalization will just average out the global economies and the way of life.
Every dollar sent to a rice patty to bring that worker one step out of it will just bring me one step closer to it.
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Companies don't save money by bringing foreign nationals in. Period. It's federal law that dictates you have to pay them the going wage. This isn't Dubai.
Secondly, there is a labour shortage.
How many of you read and hear about the wages and salaries up North and actually are willing to sacrifice and take the leap of faith to go try it for a few years? Be introspective. You've read the articles, you might know people who have done it, but how many of you are just too content to go outside your comfort zones for an opportunity? How many of you are willing to sacrifice your so called work-life balance?
During occupy Vancouver, the mayor of a small town in BC (Dawson Creek) came down and offered jobs to the protesters, as long as they were willing to relocate they would be paid 50-80K/year even with no post secondary or trades education. How many people took him up on his offer? Zero.
You can't have it both ways, this thread is full of hypocrisy and scape goating. You can complain about these opportunities being given to foreign nationals (not just Chinese btw, the Americans have been allowed to do this forever, but we're ok with the US stealing "our jobs"), or you can get off your asses and go make money that would allow you to retire at 40.
Like I said earlier, we're fortunate enough to live in what is one of the strongest economies in the WORLD right now. You can choose to be a part of it, or whine and protest against it.
In this case, the companies in question are saving money by using foreign workers. With a $1.4 billion investment coming from China, companies aren't going to sit around twiddling their thumbs waiting for enough local workers; they'll be losing on that investment if they do. Otherwise, what's the big rush?
This begs the question: what have our governments done to address this and like worker shortages? No, the TFWP isn't acceptable, I want local workers. HD Mining is requiring a minimum of 3 years' experience for every one of their open positions. If we want to attract people to work in mining, we have to help them get those three years under their belt. If the proposal is to have them work under the arriving skilled Chinese and learn and gain experience that way, I'm concerned.
Mining companies will have to invest in the young and small workforce if we are to have Canadian miners working the mines for coming decades. But that costs money, money that the companies can save whilst they solicit the federal government to allow them to bring over foreign workers.
Fuck. I'll go to Dawsons Creek. I'll go to Armpit, Alberta. Just tell me where these jobs are.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by MG1
She taught me right from wrong and always told me to stay positive and help others no matter how small the deed - that helping others gives us meaning to carry on. The sun is out today and it's a new day. Life is good. I just needed a slap in the face.
When Premier Christy Clark announced more than $1 billion of Chinese investment in B.C. coal mining last year, she bragged that thousands of jobs would be created in the province as a result.
But she didn't mention one of the apparent requirements for landing some of those jobs: the ability to speak Chinese.
Online want ads from some of the Chinese mining companies setting up shop in B.C. say they're looking for workers with routine qualifications, like experience in mining, a training certificate or a college degree.
But several ads also contain this line: "Other languages: Mandarin."
"In 40 years in the mining industry, I've never seen an ability to speak Mandarin mentioned in a want ad for a job in a Canadian mine," fumes Steve Hunt, western director of the United Steelworkers union.
"A requirement like that would immediately eliminate 98 per cent of Canadian job applicants."
The Chinese mining companies recently won federal approval to bring hundreds of temporary foreign workers into B.C., arguing not enough Canadian workers possess the skills to do the work.
But Hunt wonders if the Chinese companies truly wanted to hire Canadians, when they list Mandarin as a language requirement in their help-wanted ads.
"It's a set-up," said Hunt, whose union is considering legal action to stop the introduction of the Chinese workers.
Janet Yan, a spokeswoman for one of the Chinese companies that ran the online want ads, said she was surprised the ability to speak Mandarin was included.
"We want to hire skilled underground miners, not people who speak Mandarin," said Yan, of HD Mining International. "We will double-check this."
But Yan did not return repeated followup phone calls and emails on Monday.
HD Mining is developing a coal mine near Tumbler Ridge, one of four B.C. projects by a Chinese-backed consortium. About 200 federally approved Chinese workers will soon arrive to work on the projects, part of a first wave of up to 2,000 temporary Chinese miners.
Other want ads mentioning Mandarin language skills for B.C. coal-mining jobs have been placed by the Canadian arms of Chinese companies Dehua International and Kailuan Dehua Mines.
The B.C. government said it's concerned Mandarin language skills are included in the ads.
"It's certainly not acceptable for that to be a requirement for a job in British Columbia," said Labour Minister Pat Bell, who has asked the companies involved for a "clarification" of their ads.
But Bell also said the Chinese companies have told him that early phases of the mine projects require highly skilled and specialized workers who aren't available in Canada.
"This is a unique situation for the next six to eight months," Bell said. "Once those mines go into full production, I expect those jobs will be filled by British Columbians first and Canadians second."
But Bell said he still wants an explanation of why Mandarin language skills are mentioned in the ads, adding a lack of Chinese-speaking workers in Canada would not be considered grounds for approval of temporary workers being allowed into the country.
- The Chinese mining companies recently won federal approval to bring hundreds of temporary foreign workers into B.C., arguing not enough Canadian workers possess the skills to do the work. In their help wanted ads for canadians:
- they list Mandarin as a language requirement in their help-wanted ads, thus eliminating 98% of the canadian population that cant speak mandarin.
I was listening to this on cbc radio one the other day. Apparently the chinese workers will get paid the same as canadian workers and will have the same training. The main factor is that not a lot of canadians have the type of training to work in an underground coal mine. I personally think this is because of our lack of youth taking trades courses. More and more teenagers these days seem to take trades courses as a last resort or as a failure course. I really wish the government of canada promoted trades courses a lot better then they currently do. Possibly giving a highly reduced tuition cost for select trades that are in high demand, just to give people the motivation to take them.
When I listened to the debate on cbc i couldn't help thinking of some of my art graduate friends and their beliefs as to why post secondary education should be free... Well for one, we don't need more slackers in this world, and for two, the taxes on making secondary schooling free would be astronomical. And a majority of those people would probably fail because it's fuckin free and there's no consequences to their failure in school afterwards... I'm getting off track obviously, sorry. But in the end I think the future generations should seriously consider trades as a more positive career choice then the arts. But if you seriously think you can crack it then please, do your best. But if that shit were free, I wouldn't be able to comprehend how many absent stoners there would be in every class, and how much tax dollars that would never be replenished would be flushed down the drain.
I don't blame any of us for not wanting to be coal miners... Growing up we heard nothing but horror stories about black lung, mines collapsing, short lives, etc.
At least where I grew up (an area which had been primarily coal mining and logging).
I don't blame any of us for not wanting to be coal miners... Growing up we heard nothing but horror stories about black lung, mines collapsing, short lives, etc.
At least where I grew up (an area which had been primarily coal mining and logging).
There's definitely a stigma attached with working in coal mines, even in North American ones. I'm sure things are a hell of a lot better now, but I just can't see myself working in one. If someone else wants to do it, all the power to them. I'd be far more inclined to work as a rig pig up north than a mine, however.
Who the FUCK wants to work in a fucking COAL MINE???
Fuck off!!!
My grandfather worked in a coal mine when he moved to B.C.
Hell, the country my father is from is synonymous with coal mining.
I don't agree with coal energy and think its dirty as fuck, but that coal is gonna get mined anyway and it doesn't mean I shouldn't cash in. Unfortunately, I only speak an official Canadian language and that makes me ineligible for this job posting in Canada.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by MG1
She taught me right from wrong and always told me to stay positive and help others no matter how small the deed - that helping others gives us meaning to carry on. The sun is out today and it's a new day. Life is good. I just needed a slap in the face.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by El Bastardo
My grandfather worked in a coal mine when he moved to B.C.
Hell, the country my father is from is synonymous with coal mining.
I don't agree with coal energy and think its dirty as fuck, but that coal is gonna get mined anyway and it doesn't mean I shouldn't cash in. Unfortunately, I only speak an official Canadian language and that makes me ineligible for this job posting in Canada.
You don't want to work in a coal mine, nor are you trained to work in one. That's the reason they are saying they're bringing in people from China. And yes you will cash in but not as much as if you did become a coal miner, which you're not going to do right?
Are there any coal miners here who are unemployed because these people are stealing there jobs? Would like to hear your perspective
Companies don't save money by bringing foreign nationals in. Period. It's federal law that dictates you have to pay them the going wage. This isn't Dubai.
Secondly, there is a labour shortage.
There is the market wage, and there is minimum wage. Companies by law have to pay at or above the minimum wage. When you increase the supply of workers by importing foreign workers, the market wage rate for this type of work is driven down. So no, they will not be paid the going wage.
There is also strangely, no diversity in hiring. Miners can come from many different countries; yet, all the workers are Chinese. I conjecture that the company will make these workers pay them the equivalent of a "wage rebate" back in China.
__________________
Poor is the man whose pleasures depend on the permission of another.
The B.C. Federation of Labour says documents show it will be 14 years before Canadians replace all the temporary foreign workers from China hired to work at an underground coal mine in northern B.C.
Two unions are in court challenging more than 200 temporary foreign worker permits obtained by HD Mining for its Murray River underground coal mine near Tumbler Ridge, B.C. The employer says there were no qualified Canadians to do the specialized work at the underground mine.
Documents tendered in the case include HD Mining's previously unreleased transition plan, which outlines how the company won't start hiring Canadian miners for more than four years and plans to continue using temporary foreign workers for the next 14 years.
"What the document says categorically is it will be 4½ years before a single Canadian will be working underground at the mine," said B.C. Federation of Labour president Jim Sinclair.
"After 4½ years, it will be 10 years before it will be a majority of Canadians working underground, and it will be 15 years before the temporary foreign workers are finished working in that mine."
The plan says temporary foreign workers will be used for 30 months of construction and then for two more years as they set up a training school and start recruiting and training Canadians.
HD Mining says it will take 10 years to transition work to Canadians, but documents show it will take more than four years for that process to begin. (iStock)
After that, the plan indicates it will take another decade to shift the work to Canadians at a rate of 10 per cent of the mine's workforce per year.
The company has already said it will take 10 years to transition work to Canadians, but it has not said it will take more than four years for that process to begin.
The International Union of Operating Engineers and the Construction and Specialized Workers Union are in Federal Court this week asking for an injunction to stop more foreign workers from arriving until the unions' larger challenge against the permits is heard.
If this was really about hiring skilled miners, there are lots of countries that you can recruit from, some of which who can actually speak English and train Canadians. Why all from China?
Worked alright during the Gold Rush... and building the railroads...
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by Godzira
Does anyone know how many to a signature?
..
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brianrietta
Not a sebberry post goes by where I don't frown and think to myself "so..?"
Who the FUCK wants to work in a fucking COAL MINE???
Fuck off!!!
I know this is meant somewhat tongue-in-cheek, but this IS a part of the problem. I listen to a lot of talk radio while driving around for work, and over the last few months, I've heard a lot of calls from managers and industry organizers in mining, drilling, and other such resource sectors, all stating pretty much the same thing: that they HAVE posted jobs for local workers, they ARE union jobs requiring them to pay union scale... and they can't get Canadians who want to do the work for what's being offered.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by Godzira
Does anyone know how many to a signature?
..
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brianrietta
Not a sebberry post goes by where I don't frown and think to myself "so..?"
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