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Vancouver Off-Topic / Current EventsThe off-topic forum for Vancouver, funnies, non-auto centered discussions, WORK SAFE. While the rules are more relaxed here, there are still rules. Please refer to sticky thread in this forum.
reads most threads with his pants around his ankles, especially in the Forced Induction forum.
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Vancouver
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She's been here 10 fucking years. My parents who didn't even graduate from elementary back in china is able to communicate in simple English just fine. They are able to order food from McDonald's , restaurants, shopping, ask for advice. How my parents did it? Coz they made an effort to learn English.
This lady didn't even try........ we should find out where works and ask to speak to her directly in English, if she can't we can all say she is discriminating against English speaking citizens.
we should find out where works and ask to speak to her directly in English, if she can't we can all say she is discriminating against English speaking citizens.
Well, you don't have to necessarily find where she works but there's a shit ton of restaurants in Richmond (and a little in Vancouver) who already don't have a single English literate employee in their staff.
Although it's not like they're going to discriminate and refuse service to you, they're not actually making any effort to accomodate english speaking customers as well. So... there goes that.
Well, you don't have to necessarily find where she works but there's a shit ton of restaurants in Richmond (and a little in Vancouver) who already don't have a single English literate employee in their staff.
Although it's not like they're going to discriminate and refuse service to you, they're not actually making any effort to accomodate english speaking customers as well. So... there goes that.
I disagree; in my experience after moving to Richmond in 1998 is that they are very accommodating. "These" restaurants get a bad rep, but if you are polite and kind to them, they usually act the same way in return. Only the assholes aren't, and well there are assholes everywhere, regardless of what kind of restaurant they work at, or what language they speak.
yeah a couple years ago i went into a hot pot place in richmond with a chinese friend and it was good. Then came back a week later with a Filipino and a japanese and he waved his hands before we even walked in saying no english no english(same guy who was there last time to). Really rustled my jimmies.
I disagree; in my experience after moving to Richmond in 1998 is that they are very accommodating. "These" restaurants get a bad rep, but if you are polite and kind to them, they usually act the same way in return. Only the assholes aren't, and well there are assholes everywhere, regardless of what kind of restaurant they work at, or what language they speak.
Epic truth.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Godzira
Does anyone know how many to a signature?
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brianrietta
Not a sebberry post goes by where I don't frown and think to myself "so..?"
I disagree; in my experience after moving to Richmond in 1998 is that they are very accommodating. "These" restaurants get a bad rep, but if you are polite and kind to them, they usually act the same way in return. Only the assholes aren't, and well there are assholes everywhere, regardless of what kind of restaurant they work at, or what language they speak.
We're not talking about jerks existing in the service industry.
With respect to this topic, it's kind of hypocritical for this Chinese woman (and her son) demanding Mandarin accommodation from a business establishment when clearly Richmond doesn't even have a strong culture of accommodating English within their business establishments.
Like mentioned examples:
1) Currently existing restaurants that do not have (or at best, poorly) English literate staff.
2) The strong sentiment against the recent motion to change Chinese only business signs, bus ads, etc to accommodate for English communication/translation. How many pages did that thread get? How mixed was that discussion in that thread alone?
I'm going to go to the most asian place in Richmond, speak French and English to them and demand that they understand me. If they don't I'm going to wear a Canadian shirt and hold up a sign with the Charter of Rights and Freedoms. The funny thing is, my actions would be WAY more justified, seeing as I am speaking English in CANADA..
This article has been popping up in my Facebook news feed over the past few days and I thought I'd share it since it does reference this whole Richmond McDonald's incident:
Canada has long been known for being one of the most diverse, polite, accepting and accommodating countries on the planet. Canadian citizens who are born and raised here are by-and-large taught to be tolerant and non-discriminatory of all races, cultures and people with various lifestyle preferences. The unfortunate part is that a growing portion of people who were not born and raised here seem to be taking this tolerance for granted or even abusing it. Take, for example, the recent case of a Chinese woman in Richmond who demanded a formal apology from a local McDonald’s restaurant after being refused service because the order-taker could not understand her due to her inability to speak proper English.
The woman, Hai Xia Sun – who allegedly immigrated to Canada roughly 10 years ago – ordered a hot chocolate from the fast-food chain but instead she received a mocha (cue the violin music). She then complained and tried to correct the order in broken English, but the manager who was serving her could not understand her and finally asked her to leave because there was a long lineup and it didn’t seem like they were getting anywhere. Sun then took her story to the media claiming racial discrimination and demanding a formal apology from the company.
Forgive me if somehow I’m wrong here, but the last time I checked this was Canada and our national languages were English and French. Doesn’t it make sense then that if you make the decision to move here, you should be responsible for learning at least one of these two languages? Apparently not to some people who think that rather than adapting to our culture and language, everybody else has to adapt to theirs, like Coco Lo, who is also a regular customer of the same McDonald’s restaurant, and who was quoted by CTV News saying that “I would say maybe they could speak some Chinese, Mandarin, because it’s Richmond.” Again, last time I checked, Richmond was in Canada, not China, although sometimes I truly do wonder.
It’s no secret that Vancouver (and Richmond in particular) is beginning to look a lot more like China than Canada in many areas. In central Richmond, Chinese-language signs dominate the skyline and Asian malls, shops and restaurants seem to far outnumber that of any other race. That’s all well and fine, except for the fact that if you are not of Asian descent, you are not always welcome in these establishments. I can’t even count the number of times I or others I know have been gawked at or refused service in English in places like Parker Place or Aberdeen Mall in Richmond. If you walk into these places and you are not of East-Asian descent, there is a large chance you will get stared at as if you were an unwelcome cockroach.
As far as the employment market is concerned in Canada, the national rules dictate that you should be able to speak English and/or French in order to be eligible for many jobs. But just take a look at the jobs listed on Vancouver Craigslist nowadays. Many positions require you to speak Chinese if you want to stand a chance. Is that not racial discrimination in a country where Chinese is not a national language?
And yet it seems that those who possess ESL language skills that are difficult to understand at best are welcome to apply for many English-speaking companies in Canada, like my local Starbucks where the manager communicates in broken English and clearly gets frustrated when English-speaking customers don’t understand her: yet another establishment where I no longer feel welcome, but am I going to file a formal complaint over it? No, because that would somehow make me intolerant and racist because I’m a white Canadian. After all, it’s rare that you hear Canadians who were born and raised here playing the racial discrimination card because somehow it has become engrained in us that it’s only racist if it offends the immigrant community.
Newsflash: Almost everybody who calls Canada home has ancestors who immigrated here at some point in time, and unless those ancestors were of strictly British descent, they probably had to assimilate and learn English to survive here. Personally, my family is Eastern European and when my great grandfather came here he had to learn English if he expected to be served at an establishment in Canada. His friend who had immigrated a few years before him taught him the phrase “apple pie coffee,” and so he was able to enter a diner and order an apple pie and coffee. When he got tired of that, his friend taught him the phrase “cheese sandwich.” When he asked for a cheese sandwich, the waitress asked him if he wanted it on white or brown bread. Not knowing how to respond, he ordered an apple pie and coffee because he understood that it was not up to the server to learn his language, it was up to him to learn English in an English-speaking country.
I know we’ve come a long way since the time when my ancestors moved here, but the message is still the same: if you choose to come here of your own free will because clearly you would rather live in Canada than your own home country, then the responsibility is on you to adapt to Canada, not on Canada to adapt to you.
Maybe it’s high time we take a cue from countries like Australia where immigrants are more than welcome and their cultures are embraced on the one condition that they agree to adapt to Australian customs, like speaking English. After all, I think Australian former-Prime Minister Julia Gillard said it best when she said that “Immigrants, not Australians, must adapt. Take it or leave it …
“I am tired of this nation worrying about whether we are offending some individual or their culture … We speak mainly ENGLISH, not Spanish, Lebanese, Arabic, Chinese, Japanese, Russian, or any other language. Therefore, if you wish to become part of our society, learn the language …
“We will accept your beliefs, and will not question why. All we ask is that you accept ours, and live in harmony and peaceful enjoyment with us. This is our country, our land and our lifestyle, and we will allow you every opportunity to enjoy all this. But once you are done complaining, whining, and griping about our flag, our pledge, our Christian beliefs, or our way of life, I highly encourage you take advantage of one other great Australian freedom: the right to leave. If you aren’t happy here then leave. We didn’t force you to come here. You asked to be here. So accept the country YOU accepted.”
I thought it was an interesting article but I don't really know how I feel about it. The writer does bring up some good points but the whole "learn English or get out" mentality doesn't completely sit right with me.
I thought it was an interesting article but I don't really know how I feel about it. The writer does bring up some good points but the whole "learn English or get out" mentality doesn't completely sit right with me.
The sad thing is, it rarely starts out that way... but you try to be accommodating, you try to be understanding, and people just keep pushing it and pushing it to the point that all you want to say is, "You know what, fuck you, it's YOUR turn to give a little... my way or the highway."
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by Godzira
Does anyone know how many to a signature?
..
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brianrietta
Not a sebberry post goes by where I don't frown and think to myself "so..?"
That article was well written and provides the best support for saying 'enough is enough' but Canada doesn't care, we need immigrants to keep our weak economy ticking along
That article was well written and provides the best support for saying 'enough is enough' but Canada doesn't care, we need immigrants to keep our weak economy ticking along
i liked the article, but why cant those immigrants who are wanting to come here learn the language? is it really to much to ask for someone to learn a language while living in a foreign country? should we start handing out *insert language here* to English phrase books at the air ports? or should we just make it less appealing for immigrants to come here by making everything French and accommodating to nobody who cant speak otherwise?
you give them an inch and they take a mile. we've gladly let them come and start a new life in this country, but they get here and figure fuck it. its not Canada to them, its a more appealing china/hong kong/any other country.
i liked the article, but why cant those immigrants who are wanting to come here learn the language? is it really to much to ask for someone to learn a language while living in a foreign country? should we start handing out *insert language here* to English phrase books at the air ports? or should we just make it less appealing for immigrants to come here by making everything French and accommodating to nobody who cant speak otherwise?
you give them an inch and they take a mile. we've gladly let them come and start a new life in this country, but they get here and figure fuck it. its not Canada to them, its a more appealing china/hong kong/any other country.
all thru out history Immigrants have come to North America and have forced the locals to learn there language.
__________________ Until the lions have their own historians, the history of the hunt will always glorify the hunter.
Some of the sentiments in this thread are the same sentiments used by Québecers to defend their insane language laws.
True. Except here, rather than saying "They shouldn't use the language of that woman's nation in a business!" they're saying "A woman who comes to a business here should not automatically expect to be served in her native tongue!"
If the manager wanted, he could hire mandarin speakers and place mandarin signs throughout the store. Apparently he hasn't done either, and because this woman was slighted she feels that he is being discriminatory.
While both are discussions about language, the two are fairly different.
reads most threads with his pants around his ankles, especially in the Forced Induction forum.
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Vancouver
Posts: 10,645
Thanked 2,191 Times in 1,131 Posts
Is easy lol. Just make sure any immigrants who comes to Canada pass a simple English or french test that includes communications thru verbal and written. If they fail their application are simply decline.
The test should be aim and everyday communication rather that wiring formal essay or research papers. Just something simple to make sure they can communicate in basic English.
New Zealand have something like this in place I believe and is been great for them.
Before anyone fails me. Think of it how will you report a crime if you can't even communicate in basic English? Say someone is robbing your house, you call 911 well most likely the other on the other end will speak either English or French. Or when you get into a car accident how will you communicate to the police or the other people involve in the accident?
Some of the sentiments in this thread are the same sentiments used by Québecers to defend their insane language laws.
La francaise est une langue officielle du Canada. All the Quebecers are trying to do is preserve french because most other provinces lean towards english.
You see similar sentiments in this thread because there are people (like this McAsian woman) who just plain refuse to learn the language and make their laziness a human rights issue. McAsian woman has lived in Canada for ten years but is still unable to enunciate the difference between "Hot Chocolate" and "Cafe Mocha" but the person behind the counter is guaranteed to have a grasp of atleast one of our official languages. Do you know how hot chocolate/cafe mocha is pronounced in french? Its chocolate chaud/cafe mocha. One of the words are identical!!! yet this woman living here for 10 years can't figure out either. I don't think anyone who is posting that immigrants should learn the language is out of line.
This is Canada. It is clean and safe. A great country to call home. We speak french and english. choose one. Merci mes amis.
It'll likely get shot down by the general public given that family reunion makes up for a big part of the immigration applications. Granted, we (as in, Canada) is shifting away from the family reunion immigration applications, but we still have the 10 year super visa for this family reunion stuff, so the problem is not gonna go away.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr.HappySilp
Is easy lol. Just make sure any immigrants who comes to Canada pass a simple English or french test that includes communications thru verbal and written. If they fail their application are simply decline.
The test should be aim and everyday communication rather that wiring formal essay or research papers. Just something simple to make sure they can communicate in basic English.
New Zealand have something like this in place I believe and is been great for them.
Before anyone fails me. Think of it how will you report a crime if you can't even communicate in basic English? Say someone is robbing your house, you call 911 well most likely the other on the other end will speak either English or French. Or when you get into a car accident how will you communicate to the police or the other people involve in the accident?
i dont get this, my friend works at that McD & he been working for about a good 7 years or so
hes chinese & so are some of the co-workers that work there that i know, every time someone struggles with ordering in english there would always been a chinese worker to help
this looks like a fuck cheap way to get some money by playing the blood race card
This, I'm willing to bet that she's got "Canada" confused with "America" ...our legal system is set up entirely differently here, there's actually a law in place that protects our courts against "frivolous lawsuits" which is why we don't have the same civil suit scenery as the US does with everybody suing each other and their neighbor's dog all at once.
McDonalds is an easy target, a big corporation, and one that gave a huge settlement to someone for its coffee being "Too hot" (Though I watched a documentary on that and it wasn't nearly as 'frivolous' as it sounds) it could be easy for someone whose english isn't awesome, to think that they're an easier target than they actually are.
The other part of this that really confuses me though is since when does McDonalds serve you your own drink unless its Drive-Thru? Admittedly I don't go there often but for the last few years anytime I've set foot inside a McDonalds and ordered a "meal" they've handed me an empty cup and I've had to go pour my own drink from the handy dandy drink fountain.
There's a lot wrong with this situation, and none of it has anything to do with the McDonalds lol
La francaise est une langue officielle du Canada. All the Quebecers are trying to do is preserve french because most other provinces lean towards english.
You see similar sentiments in this thread because there are people (like this McAsian woman) who just plain refuse to learn the language and make their laziness a human rights issue. McAsian woman has lived in Canada for ten years but is still unable to enunciate the difference between "Hot Chocolate" and "Cafe Mocha" but the person behind the counter is guaranteed to have a grasp of atleast one of our official languages. Do you know how hot chocolate/cafe mocha is pronounced in french? Its chocolate chaud/cafe mocha. One of the words are identical!!! yet this woman living here for 10 years can't figure out either. I don't think anyone who is posting that immigrants should learn the language is out of line.
This is Canada. It is clean and safe. A great country to call home. We speak french and english. choose one. Merci mes amis.
all thru out history Immigrants have come to North America and have forced the locals to learn there language.
Which works great (in theory) if you have a large group of immigrants that only speak one language, wanting to force that on another single existing group that only speaks one language...
But once they force all the English-speakers to learn Mandarin, what then? The Punjabi speakers have to learn it too? Does that mean the EI population can then force the English AND Chinese speakers to learn their language too?
I think I'll learn Klingon, and then insist everyone else MUST learn it so they can communicate with me without violating my Charter rights. Those who can't take my Klingon order for prune juice are obviously discriminating against me!
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