REVscene - Vancouver Automotive Forum

z3german · 09-20-2016, 06:55 AM

Seeking some general legal advice, really appreciate you guys reading it.

on Friday, Sept 16 I went to Metrotown ICBC to do the steps required to get my international license. The rep asked for my license before doing the knowledge test, so I handed over my Sri Lankan license assuming it was just for information purposes.

After passing the knowledge test I ask for my license back, she refuses saying that because I passed it must be destroyed. I questioned it a bit, and she said I have to book my road test online, and I can drive with the BC international license when I pass. I VERY reluctantly trusted her, and left it at that.

I went home and to my dismay (my fault for not asking in all honesty) the earliest road test is 3 MONTHS AWAY! I honestly can not wait that long because I have to be able to drive in Sri Lanka, as I am going there first week of December. I am getting married, and I NEED to be able to drive.

I am quite certain it is illegal (especially for a private company like ICBC) to confiscate and destroy another nations property. I tried searching it up but all that comes up is stuff regarding terrorism forfeiture etc.

Anyways, I went back to Metrotown ICBC to speak with a manager, she was rude, told me I am rushing it too much, I should post pone my wedding, I dont have to drive in Sri Lanka, the license has went to head office and I can't do anything about it. I crafted a letter to give her in the event that she was not cooperative basically stating that it is illegal to confiscate another nations property, and that I would be pressing charges if a suitable solution can not be agreed upon (Obtaining original license back, or setting priority with road tests before my fly date to Sri Lanka, in the event of a failed test, priority must be given to me for tests until pass. Reason being, if I had my Sri Lankan license, and I failed the road test, I would still be able to drive in Sri Lanka...)

Anyways, I did some brief searching on it and can see people posting it is illegal, but I am having trouble finding the exact section which shows this. I will be calling ICBC head office later today to see if they can come up with a solution for me before perusing legal action.

Do you guys think I have a case? Do you guys have any suggestions as to what I can do instead?

Thanks for reading

nsx042003 · 09-20-2016, 07:36 AM

a bit confused about your overall intention. You have sri lanka driver's licence, you will be going there to drive....why did you need to go ICBC for international licence? Besides, ICBC doesn't issue international licence....BCAA does.

So what did you tell ICBC when you went in?

NVM: i'm guessing you need a BC licence and you went in to do that and ICBC told you to get International driver's licence to drive in sri lanka but failed to tell you how long it would take. Try booking your roadtest in Victoria to speed things up? Or go to ICBC everyday and hope no one show up for a road test

z3german · 09-20-2016, 07:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nsx042003

a bit confused about your overall intention. You have sri lanka driver's licence, you will be going there to drive....why did you need to go ICBC for international licence? Besides, ICBC doesn't issue international licence....BCAA does.

So what did you tell ICBC when you went in?

I have a job offer that requires me to drive, that's the only reason I went to get it. I don't even own a vehicle here.

When I went in I told them I want to get my international license so I can drive here. Didn't go into detail about my future plans with my wedding and all.

yray · 09-20-2016, 08:07 AM

You pretty much have to wait for the next road test appointment here.

I always thought IDPs have to be issued at home country and cannot be issued aboard.

As for your sri lankan license, go back to sri lanka and report you lost your license. Not legal but only way with your situation.

originalhypa · 09-20-2016, 09:07 AM

We bitch and moan about foreign licenses all the time on RS. About how you can come here and drive on your own nation's license, and the issues this causes on the roads.

You can fail me all you want for saying this, but I'm glad they're making it hard for foreign drivers to come and go as they please.

Quote:

basically stating that it is illegal to confiscate another nations property, and that I would be pressing charges if a suitable solution can not be agreed upon

You're not a lawyer, and you can't press charges. Only the crown can do that. I recommend that you speak to an actual lawyer about this, because honestly, coming on RS for legal advice is not a good idea.

Good luck with your wedding.

meme405 · 09-20-2016, 09:34 AM

You cannot hold two drivers licenses at the same time. The rules do not allow for that. So as soon as you got your BCDL she was mandated to remove your other DL.

Proof:

Moving from outside Canada

Quote:

When you qualify for your new B.C. driver's licence, you’ll need to surrender your previous licence to ICBC. B.C. law requires that you only have one driver's licence.

It's not a good position you are in. But My recommendation is to look out to places like abby or chilliwack to try and do your test sooner. Anything beyond that you will need to hire a lawyer, but I don't know what they will do, I don't think ICBC has done anything wrong. Maybe they should have explained it more clearly, but maybe you also should have read up and actually realized what is required of you to get your license here?

z3german · 09-20-2016, 10:12 AM

Thanks for all the advise.

I was prepared to face the reality that I really might be blowing smoke here with the threat of legal action. Only did it to scare em a bit and maybe get the situation in my favor, I readily accept the consequences of my oversight.

I wish they were a bit more clear with me when I first handed the license over. Even after I questioned it when I asked for it back, they should honestly just give me the options to take back the license and invalidate the passed driving test. Wishful thinking is all haha.

Quote:

Originally Posted by meme405

You cannot hold two drivers licenses at the same time. The rules do not allow for that. So as soon as you got your BCDL she was mandated to remove your other DL.

Proof:

Moving from outside Canada

It's not a good position you are in. But My recommendation is to look out to places like abby or chilliwack to try and do your test sooner. Anything beyond that you will need to hire a lawyer, but I don't know what they will do, I don't think ICBC has done anything wrong. Maybe they should have explained it more clearly, but maybe you also should have read up and actually realized what is required of you to get your license here?

Thanks for the tip, I will definitely look into it

z3german · 09-20-2016, 10:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by originalhypa

We bitch and moan about foreign licenses all the time on RS. About how you can come here and drive on your own nation's license, and the issues this causes on the roads.

You can fail me all you want for saying this, but I'm glad they're making it hard for foreign drivers to come and go as they please.

You're not a lawyer, and you can't press charges. Only the crown can do that. I recommend that you speak to an actual lawyer about this, because honestly, coming on RS for legal advice is not a good idea.

Good luck with your wedding.

I went to get my BC license only so I can drive and not use the whole "Oh I thought my Sri Lankan license is good for a year here" like I heard in the news about all these China drivers doing that and ICBC defending them.

Just was looking for general advise, to see if its even worth perusing to a lawyer. I have come to the conclusion that it is not, and I am happy with the resolutions you all have given me.

inv4zn · 09-20-2016, 11:54 AM

First thing, you can keep checking the ICBC website for an earlier test date. They do come up as people cancel.

Second, with the 7L license you have, can you not get an international driver's permit from BCAA? I donno if they issue for non-class 5, but you can ask.

Thirdly, if you back for your wedding, can't you retake the Sri Lankan test first thing you arrive back in Sri Lanka?

fsy82 · 09-20-2016, 01:17 PM

Your best bet is to claim you lost your Sri Lanken license and they will issue a new one to you. My wife did this when ICBC took her New Zealand license. She has both right now and shows the BCDL when requested and uses the New Zealand when she goes back.

meme405 · 09-20-2016, 01:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fsy82

Your best bet is to claim you lost your Sri Lanken license and they will issue a new one to you. My wife did this when ICBC took her New Zealand license. She has both right now and shows the BCDL when requested and uses the New Zealand when she goes back.

I wouldn't openly admit this. What you are doing goes against BC law, and actually invalidates your BCDL. You are essentially driving here illegally if you hold a License anywhere else.

Don't ask me why they do it like this, but that's how they do it.

smoothie. · 09-20-2016, 01:39 PM

cause its the easiest way to prevent prohibited driving or something

z3german · 09-20-2016, 05:29 PM

Blowing smoked worked haha, ICBC manager called me today really apologetic about everything.

Road test scheduled next friday.

Thanks for all the insight guys!

nsx042003 · 09-20-2016, 05:39 PM

So what is ICBC's policy then? Glad you are able to get it back.

The notion that you cannot have another driver's licence means they acknowledge other country's licence here and let you drive with it? I understand it if you hold another province's DL, but other countries as well?

zulutango · 09-20-2016, 06:38 PM

(4) If the applicant for a driver's licence has at any time before making the application held a driver's licence issued under this Act or in another jurisdiction, the applicant must, at the time that he or she is issued a driver's licence under this Act, surrender the last driver's licence or duplicate of it held by him or her, unless the Insurance Corporation of British Columbia on cause shown to the corporation's satisfaction dispenses with its production.
(5) At the same time that he or she has a driver's licence issued under this Act, a person must not have a driver's licence issued by another jurisdiction or have another driver's licence previously issued under this Act.

zulutango · 09-20-2016, 06:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fsy82

Your best bet is to claim you lost your Sri Lanken license and they will issue a new one to you. My wife did this when ICBC took her New Zealand license. She has both right now and shows the BCDL when requested and uses the New Zealand when she goes back.

As a former Kiwi who has friends in my former career still active there, your wife is breaking the laws in both NZ and Canada. Should she ever become involved in any crash/accident etc, her insurance coveerage will NOT be valid in BC....and likely also in NZ. She is probably commiting fraud if she signs any statement denying having another licence. Her BCDL is NOT valid and was fraudlently issued here as she lied to the ICBC staff when they specifically asked her if she had a DL issued in any other jurisdiction and she said no.

zulutango · 09-21-2016, 08:11 PM

BTW fsy82 ...tell your GF that she is a "blimin Bludger"....and you are a "Bush Lawyer"...

and don't you "Spit the dummy" over this....and you and she are "Skites" for boasting about it.

murd0c · 09-21-2016, 08:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by z3german

Blowing smoked worked haha, ICBC manager called me today really apologetic about everything.

Road test scheduled next friday.

Thanks for all the insight guys!

you better pass the test now after all of this!!

6793026 · 09-22-2016, 11:36 PM

To be VERY honest I have someone who works in ICBC and I also know someone who was in your situation so I can shed some light.

BC (and other parts of the world) wanted to eliminate the risk of having multiple identities of 1 individual; think about it, before the amazing technology, you could get away with a lot of things. eg// you get 12 pts removed from say speeding and tickets in BC, next time you get pulled over, you would just being out an Alberta license and start fresh.

This was one of the key concerns and reason for the rule.

In your shoes, I fully agree with you 10000% ICBC shouldn't have the right to remove another license from another country. You would be in shit if you didn't pass the Van. license and you won't be able to drive when you go home.

What I don't understand is why they didn't do a direct swap is beyond me. Say you have a class 6 motorcycle license, don't you automatically get a license in BC. Or if you're a US drivers license, you get a direct swap.

zulutango · 09-23-2016, 04:22 AM

A DL is not a right...so are not entitled to one wherever you want. If you want a BC one to continue legally driving in BC as a BC resident, then you surrender your out of BC DL...if you do not want to surrender it, then you do not get a BC DL...that simple. If you become a Canadian citizen then you surrender your former residence pasport.

I agree 100% with your statement concerning the reasons for the rule. We know people here who got too many tickets here so they got a "fake" Alberta DL to avoid the prohibitions and fines..

As someone who slso trains new BC residents in both car and motorcycle, there are many diferences between the driving skills and requirements from different countries. Our requirements are much higher (you may find that hard to believe) than those of many places. To issue a DL without having to have some sort of assessment of your ability to drive and comply with our laws, is asking for disaster.

320icar · 09-23-2016, 06:25 AM

Quote:

If you become a Canadian citizen then you surrender your former residence pasport.

That's not true. You can have dual citizenship with lots of countries and Canada. Just ask half my family who are both British and Canadian citizens

nsx042003 · 09-23-2016, 07:22 AM

It's one thing to confiscate another province's DL, because of said problems with prohibitions and fines, but confiscating a non canadian licence is beyond me. It's quite stupid actually. All ICBC need to do is not recognize non canadian DL and be done with this non sense.

I also think it's all entirely based on what agent you got when you go in, they have repeatedly asked if i had any other DL everytime i renew my licence and I would tell them I have a Chinese one, they just say ok and nothing else.

zulutango · 09-23-2016, 08:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 320icar

That's not true. You can have dual citizenship with lots of countries and Canada. Just ask half my family who are both British and Canadian citizens

Do they retain both British AND Canadian valid, current passports and are permitted to use both of them? I know landed immigrants who retained their US citizenship, lived in Canada BUT had a US passport, not a Canadian one.

zulutango · 09-23-2016, 08:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nsx042003

It's one thing to confiscate another province's DL, because of said problems with prohibitions and fines, but confiscating a non canadian licence is beyond me. It's quite stupid actually. All ICBC need to do is not recognize non canadian DL and be done with this non sense.

I also think it's all entirely based on what agent you got when you go in, they have repeatedly asked if i had any other DL everytime i renew my licence and I would tell them I have a Chinese one, they just say ok and nothing else.

Actually what the LAW says is...
(4) If the applicant for a driver's licence has at any time before making the application held a driver's licence issued under this Act or in another jurisdiction, the applicant must, at the time that he or she is issued a driver's licence under this Act, surrender the last driver's licence or duplicate of it held by him or her, unless the Insurance Corporation of British Columbia on cause shown to the corporation's satisfaction dispenses with its production.
(5) At the same time that he or she has a driver's licence issued under this Act, a person must not have a driver's licence issued by another jurisdiction or have another driver's licence previously issued under this Act

inv4zn · 09-23-2016, 08:30 AM

^You missed the point.

What nsx is saying is that the law itself is stupid and unreasonable in certain circumstances.

If ICBC just didn't recognize any other driver's license from another country, then they wouldn't need to confiscate it, and problem would be solved.

If that were the case, people visiting would have to apply and get a fresh BCDL (with tests and everything), or a temporary IDP from their home country.