The Official 2011/2012 Canucks Thread

[sonick]

I cheered my ass off when Hordi knocked that cocky douche Turco into the boards.

[Gh0stRider]

Dominik Hasek takes out Marian Gaborik - YouTube

[trancehead]

on OTR today, they kept on reaming the Sabres for not sticking up for miller at the time of the hit.

Lucic is a big dude, but someone has to step up.

ive seen it in baseball where if a pitcher throws a ball at an opposing player intentionally, the other teams pitcher will simply do the same. So, they couldve taken a run at Tim Thomas

[Gh0stRider]

BUF vs BOS on November 23 should be interesting.

[Vale46Rossi]

^ Hasek trip made that guy FLYYYYYYYYYY

[clowe]

Rule 42.1, it states: "A goalkeeper is not 'fair game' just because he is outside the goal crease. The appropriate penalty should be assessed in every case where an attacking player makes unnecessary contact with the goalkeeper. However, incidental contact will be permitted when the goalkeeper is in the act of playing the puck outside the goal crease, provided the attacking player has made a reasonable effort to avoid such unnecessary contact."

I don't like the idea of making goalies fair game if they're just coming out to play the puck...what if Byfuglien or Eager charges at Luongo or Schneider when we have the Sedins, Burrows, Edler and Salo on the ice?

[skippynixx]

We all know Lucic is a BIG guy and is very capable of running guys over (I recall with the Giants he had broke a guys helmet in a fight) nonetheless. The hit was shoulder to shoulder, no intent to injure, as a matter of fact it doesn't look like Lucic saw him till almost the "last minute" (as he was chasing a loose puck) and "put the shoulder into him", Miller's head didn't seem to hit anything (just spun around fast enough to have his helmet to fall off). They're both big boys and the next game will be a good one.

[Durrann]

Long but nice read on team chemistry

VANCOUVER — It’s not like they sit around the dressing room, hold hands and sing Kumbaya, but the Vancouver Canucks are a tight group.

Tighter than any NHL team Chris Higgins has been a part of.

"It is night and day compared to some other teams I have been on," Higgins said Monday. "I have been on a couple of teams where it was just very cliquey. Outside the rink certain guys just don't hang out with other guys."

The Canucks, Higgins says, are different.

"On this team it seems like you are never in the same group of guys if you are hanging out away from the rink," he says. "And I think that is pretty refreshing to see."

Higgins, who had four previous NHL stops before he was traded to the Canucks at last season's deadline, was immediately struck by the team's chemistry as well as its talent when he joined Vancouver.

He was welcomed with open arms and has seen the same happen to other players who have subsequently joined the team.

"I am a big believer in that the better you get along with guys off the ice the better you are going to play with them," he says. "Some people may disagree with that, but that's the way I feel. You see that personality with this team, guys are willing to spend time away from the rink with each other and really enjoy their time."



Read more: Canucks chemistry key to team

[DanHibiki]

Originally Posted by Gh0stRider

Dominik Hasek takes out Marian Gaborik - YouTube

the commentators sound like idiot homers. "what are you supposed to do?!?"

How bout stay in your fucking net! It's not like it was a chase for a loose puck.

[Bouncing Bettys]

IMO Lucic knew damn well what he was doing and made no attempt at all to avoid Miller and fed Shanny and the media a load of bullshit. It reminds me of the bullshit Chara fed everyone about being innocent and not knowing where he or the stantion were when he clobbered Pacioretty. You want to tell me a veteran like Chara hasn't learned the layout of a rival's arena he plays in at least 6 times a season? If you have no spacial awareness or can't anticipate a play, after all these years playing hockey, you should hang your skates up.

To those believing the next Bruins/Sabres game will be interesting to watch because of the prior game, it won't. Seldom do these rematches ever live up to the hype and with the league watching, they will back down. Additionally, the Sabres have no one that can really stand up to the Bruins physically. They showed what they are made of immediately after the hit - nothing.

[Noir]

Originally Posted by clowe

I don't like the idea of making goalies fair game if they're just coming out to play the puck...what if Byfuglien or Eager charges at Luongo or Schneider when we have the Sedins, Burrows, Edler and Salo on the ice?

Nahhh, we don't want Luongo leaving his net and/or playing the puck himself to begin with.



Anyways, considering how this game has evolved, I don't see the reason why goalies have creases anyways.

1. Goalies are protected regardless where they are on the crease.
2. Opposing players are allowed to pass through a crease as long as they don't obstruct the goalie (where goalie protection isn't just limited to the crease anyways)
3. I've seen goals regularly scored by players within the crease anyways; I've watched the NHL for nearly 2 decades and the crease violation is rarely ever used/called.

[rsx]

Shoulder to shoulder. Lucic could've bent his knees, dipped his shoulders or even lunged at Miller, he straightened out and that's the best he could do at that speed. Miller saw him, turned his shoulder and it was clean.

What the media is forgetting to tell everyone was when Leino (BUF) pushed a BOS player into Miller that same game.

[tonyzoomzoom]

the Bruins must know where Bettman hid the dead bodies...

[MarkyMark]

I wonder if it would have made a difference if miller pretended to get knocked out and stretchered off the ice lol
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[kwy]

^This ain't soccer.

[TheKingdom2000]

I've watched this clip a number of times and this is my opinion.
You can clearly see Lucic STOP skating at 0:05 because he see's miller is going to get the puck first. He is now gliding at this point. He continues to glide into Miller without any indication of avoiding him.

I honestly believe there was enough time to at least try and avoid Miller. Lucic does no such thing. His instincts kick in and it's just easier for him to run into someone as he is used to doing.
But, just because I feel there was enough time to avoid Miller, I think Lucic just reverted to his instincts and plowed Miller down sub-consciously.

I don't think Lucic is a dirty player. This was just a difficult circumstance. Besides, I think running into Miller is safer than trying to avoid Miller. ie. (knee to pad contact) could have blown out his knee if he tried avoiding Miller, etc.

Milan Lucic hits Ryan Miller Nov 12, 2011 - YouTube

Miller calls Lucic a POS

YouTube

[shawn79]

No one can beat up lucic in a fight not even enforcers who are paid to protect star players... Lucic would toss chara around the ice if they werent team mates.

he is the most feared player in the nhl, 10 years ago was todd bertuzzi

[Gumby]

I'm in the camp that thinks Lucic is lucky he didn't get suspended. Under the current rules, goalies are protected and if you hit them like that, you should get more than just a 2-minute minor.

Here's former NHL referee Kerry Fraser's take, from TSN:

Spoiler!

Hi Kerry,

I caught the highlights of Milan Lucic bowling over Ryan Miller on Saturday night. There is no attempt made by Lucic to let up, it actually appears as if he gets his hands and stick up quite high and if Miller had not turned his shoulder he would have caught him clean in the head.

If you were the official in this case would you have assessed a minor penalty for charging or would you have upped the ante by tacking on intent to injure? On top of that do you feel it would be appropriate for the league to give Lucic any supplemental discipline?

Jake in Thunder Bay

-----

Hi Kerry,

On Saturday, Boston's Milan Lucic 'ran into' Buffalo's Ryan Miller and received a charging penalty on the play.

What protection is granted to a goaltender while out of the crease and do you think there will be any supplementary discipline by the NHL against Milan Lucic for his hit on Ryan Miller?

I appreciate your blog and find your explanations of the rules helpful. Keep up the good work.

Mike

-----

Hey Kerry,

Watching the Buffalo/Boston game, I was just wondering what your thoughts were about the hit Lucic put on Miller. Why was it only a minor penalty?

Tyler

-----

Kerry,

In the Boston-Buffalo game, I'm sure you saw the hit Lucic gave on goalie Ryan Miller. I know suspensions are up to Shanahan and his crew (not on-ice officials), but my question is what call would you have made as the on-ice official?

Thanks in advance,
Josh

Jake, Mike, Tyler & Josh:

I apologize for getting this response to you late. The day has been crazy here in Toronto with the Hockey Hall of Fame activities and my media/book signing schedule.

Brendan Shanahan and the Player Protection Committee have already ruled on the body check Milan Lucic delivered on Ryan Miller of the Buffalo Sabres that has left the goalie with concussion-like symptoms. I have been a strong advocate of the work that Shanny has been doing to this point of the season with supplementary discipline but I have to disagree with his ruling on this one.

I believe he really missed this call and has sent the wrong message. Like it or not, goalies enjoy preferential treatment similar to endangered species in the wild; at least up until this latest decision. It would now appear they are subjected to the same rules as any other player once they leave the "protection of their nest!" Lindy Ruff has every right to call foul on this non-suspension. Milan Lucic should have been suspended for the next two games.

I attended a meeting one summer with team general managers and coaches to discuss various topics on the game. A hot topic on the agenda was protection of the goalkeepers. It was generally agreed that goalies deserved preferential treatment and marked "untouchable" for a variety of reasons. (Rule 42- charging - pretty much makes goalies immune to body contact from opposing players.)

During that meeting I recalled Glen Sather, as GM of the Edmonton Oilers at the time, voice a word of caution that granting goalies immunity from body contact created an unfair advantage because players such as Ron Hextall and Martin Brodeur could pass and shoot the puck better than most defensemen in the League,. In spite of this consideration goalies became pretty much off-limits.

Rule 42 pretty much make goalies immune from body contact by opposing players. It reads: "A minor, major or a game misconduct shall be imposed on a player who charges a goalkeeper while the goalkeeper is within his goal crease."

In a practical application, any time that a player takes a run at a goalie from a distance and hits him with velocity while within this crease a major penalty (and likely a game misconduct) is applied.

The next portion of the rule applies to the Lucic hit on Miller where it goes on to state, "A goalkeeper is not 'fair game' just because he is outside the goal crease area. The appropriate penalty should be assessed in every case where an opposing player makes unnecessary contact with a goalkeeper. However, incidental contact, at the discretion of the referee, will be permitted when the goalkeeper is in the act of playing the puck outside his goal crease provided the attacking player has made a reasonable effort to avoid such contact."

In plain and simple terms this translates to DON'T TOUCH THE GOALIE.

This was not a race to a loose puck where a collision resulted through a tie in the footrace. This was not "incidental contact" nor was any effort, let alone a "reasonable effort" made by Milan Lucic to avoid Ryan Miller after the goalkeeper released the puck.

This was very clearly a hard shoulder body check finished with elevated hands, delivered by an attacking forward on a goalie that did not expect to be hit under protection of the playing rules. Any other player would expect to be hit on the finish of a check - a goalkeeper does not. I deem it a dangerous play and it creates an even more dangerous precedent.

In my judgment this open-ice check on the goalie deserved more than a 2 minute minor penalty. A major for charging would be the most appropriate penalty for this type hit on a goalkeeper. (A game misconduct would only be added if an injury resulted to the face or head of Miller. He remained in the game for a period of time so this would be impossible for the referee to ascertain when the penalty assessment was made.)

The end result of the body check was a concussion to the Sabres goalkeeper; arguably their best and most important player on the team.

A strong message should be been sent throughout the hockey community with the assessment of a two (2) game suspension to Milan Lucic through supplementary discipline. Players (and more importantly goalies) would know that the League still considers them endangered and will continue to protect them from full blown body checks. It now appears that hunting season is now open. The license only takes "two minutes" to fill out and can be completed from the penalty box.

[b0unce. [?]]

I could care less whether or not lucic could have stopped or got out of the way.
I think the real debate is whether or not goalies should are free game when they wander off out their crease. If Miller is going to run out that far from the blue paint, expect to get hit. Goalies are already viewed as untouchables within their crease. 9/10 times a penalty is awarded if a player bumps into the goalie.
I think players should have the green light to bulldoze a goalie if he decides to take a stroll out there. As long as the same rules applied to hitting, apply to goalies, I think it's fine. I mean Lucic and Miller were both going for the puck, Lucic didn't elbow or hit him in any sort of dirty manner imo.
Miller should be upset his players didn't stick up for him.

[RRxtar]

that hit is right on the borderline. at first i was a firm believer he should have been suspended. but the more i watch it, the less i think so
he had less than a second and less than 10 feet between the time he lifted his head up to the time he hit miller. you could see he was skating 100% to catch the puck and looked up and was probably surprised to see miller there. when you watch the close up slow motion it looks like he wiggles his left foot trying to put some brakes on but hes like 5 feet from miller at that time.

the question in my mind is about the shove he gave during the hit.

its definitely a penalty worthy hit, but i think its just inside the borderline of suspendable. JUST inside the line.

[Tim Budong]

Originally Posted by shawn79

No one can beat up lucic in a fight not even enforcers who are paid to protect star players... Lucic would toss chara around the ice if they werent team mates.

he is the most feared player in the nhl, 10 years ago was todd bertuzzi

i think i like my chances with Jarome Iginla or Chris Pronger

[shawn79]

tyler myer was pushing chris pronger around and jamie benn > iginla or he was just lucky that he cut him

[MarkyMark]

Chara is a big dude I'd like to see him and Lucic go at it
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[clowe]

From the Kerry Fraser article:

The next portion of the rule applies to the Lucic hit on Miller where it goes on to state, "A goalkeeper is not 'fair game' just because he is outside the goal crease area. The appropriate penalty should be assessed in every case where an opposing player makes unnecessary contact with a goalkeeper. However, incidental contact, at the discretion of the referee, will be permitted when the goalkeeper is in the act of playing the puck outside his goal crease provided the attacking player has made a reasonable effort to avoid such contact."

Definitely not incidental and made no effort to avoid the contact IMO

Borderline or not, I think Shanahan should've gave him a game or two him to send a message to the rest of the league that injuring goaltenders like that is unacceptable. If concussing a team's goaltender is only worth a 2 minute minor, then we should've sent Tanner Glass in to barrel Tim Thomas, kill off the 2 minutes, and we'd probably have ourselves a Stanley Cup banner hanging from the rafters of Rogers Arena right now.

[RiceIntegraRS]

^its only a 2 minute minor for players in a Bruins uniform. I dont know what the call is for the rest of the teams though.