More Metro Vancouver residents turning to vans, trailers, RVs to avoid high housing costs
On Oleksandr Iaremko’s Facebook page is a poster of an old brown camper van draped in clothes and parked in the middle of nowhere with a saying underneath by Foster Hunting: “Home is where you park it.”
It’s a message Iaremko, and others in Metro Vancouver, are taking to heart, by living in vans, trailers and RVs, as a cheaper alternative to paying high-priced rents across the region.
The vehicles can be spotted in almost every municipality — in clusters on industrial lots, on residential side streets or in parking lots of big-box stores. For some, the truly homeless, vehicles are the only option in this overheated housing market, which has resulted in record low vacancy rates and high rents. For others, they are a choice, a way to buck conventional society, save money and avoid paying for someone else’s investment. In some cases, the vans or RVs have out-of-town licence plates, suggesting they are also serving as cheaper forms of accommodation for travellers to B.C.
“It has its pluses and minuses,” said Iaremko, a 26-year-old roofer who has been living in a cargo van for more than a month. “There are some conveniences. You don’t have to go home after work and it forces you out more. You’re not staying in your apartment.”
Iaremko’s van is a tidy, cosy home, with a raised bed under which he has tucked his belongings, tools and food. An electric piano is strapped to the side panel behind the driver’s seat, while sheets of plywood are tucked in beside the bed, waiting to cover the insulation he’s installing to make his home warmer for the winter. He doesn’t have the luxury of his own shower, toilet, or even a sink, but Iaremko has creative ways to make up for such shortfalls by being creative.
A raw foodie who occasionally eats cooked foods, Iaremko uses a gas-powered camp stove to make coffee and the odd fried egg, while he always parks near all-night coffee shops for those late night pit stops or to wash out his mug.
A pass to Vancouver swimming pools provides him with swims and showers, while big-box stores have high-speed and super-fast Internet, especially at night when no one is using it.
“I’m flexible with this life,” he said, but noted it’s not for everyone. “You’re stepping outside your comfort zone and that’s how you grow.”
City officials say they have no idea how many people are living in their vehicles, either by necessity or choice. In the annual homeless count in Vancouver, such people are lumped in with the so-called “hidden homeless” — people who do not have a rented place of their own, but stay in “other” places, such as jail, hostels, hotels, or a friend’s place, rather than shelters.
Ethel Whitty, a director at the Carnegie Centre who oversees Vancouver’s homeless services, said there’s no way to pinpoint how many people are truly homeless, as many don’t want to be found. But the city will reach out to them, she said, in an attempt to get them housing and income assistance. Those who live in vehicles do not qualify for welfare.
“There are just more people struggling with poverty and homelessness,” she said. “There are probably places you can park where you won’t be noticed and can stay for quite awhile.”
But Judy Graves, a longtime advocate for the homeless in Vancouver, said people have been living in vehicles across the city for decades for many reasons. Some are “homeless in the classic sense,” she acknowledged, but noted many others are like Iaremko — young people who are apprenticing in the trades and travel around the region every day — or are older retired, or semi-retired, men who don’t want to pay rent in their golden years. The movement, she said, harks back to the 1960s when people were shedding societal norms.
“There are some guys who don’t like to pay rent,” Graves said. “With the cost of housing, it’s probably increasing a little bit gradually over time but I don’t think we’ve seen an explosion of people living in their cars.”
Living in a van is a slightly watered down dream for Iaremko, a budding musician who had grand schemes last year of driving an RV across Canada and busking along the way.
When the RV kept breaking down, he scoured Craigslist, jumping at the chance to buy his current home, a cargo van, for $1,680.
His annual expenses include insurance, which is about $1,200, along with gas and his pass for Vancouver recreation centres.
Before moving to a vehicle, Iaremko was paying about $600 a month in rent. These days, he will often park his van for the night in Surrey or Squamish, or wherever his roofing job happens to be that week to save on gas. “I can go anywhere,” he said. “My house moves.”
There are trade-offs, though, to living in a vehicle. Iaremko said he was hurt when his boss suggested he was living off the backs of his friends, whom he sometimes joins for dinner or get-togethers. And with no shower or bathroom, he has to plan his parking stops.
And if someone steals his van, they’re taking his entire home.
Although his van is insured, the Insurance Corp. of B.C. said it doesn’t have specific coverage for people living in their vehicles, which are licensed for their specific uses on the road. In order to be covered for a stolen vehicle, a person would need comprehensive coverage or specified perils, spokeswoman Lindsay Olson said in an email, but noted these coverages don’t apply to the contents of a vehicle.
But Iaremko isn’t daunted. He intends to stick it out in his van, if only to prove to his boss he can be self-sufficient, until he can get himself a tiny house or an RV that is roadworthy enough to get him across Canada. Since adopting his new lifestyle, he’s made a lot of new friends, he said, who offer tips for easier and cheaper living, such as converting vehicles to run on vegetable oil and how to wash dishes with vinegar and water spray.
“We’re not tied to one spot,” said Iaremko, originally from Ukraine. “I’ve been travelling all my life. Everyone I’ve met who lives in a van has something they can do. It saves time and money. While the other guys are travelling back home, I’m playing the piano in my van. I don’t have a shower but I have music. That’s very important to me.”
Nathanael Lauster, associate professor of sociology with the University of B.C., blames the region’s housing crisis for the rising number of people living in vehicles, noting cities have been built in such a way that they’re amenable to cars.
Proponents say the movement is not much different from the early 2000s when people were living in boats in False Creek before the police cracked down, saying the anchored boats were a pollution problem and a navigation hazard.
The police don’t seem to be as strict with people living in vehicles; the city says in many cases, they will find out if the people are OK and need housing but not much else if they aren’t breaking a bylaw.
“These vans and RVs can be a relatively warm and dry place to stay and rest your head,” Lauster said. “It’s an adaptable way people are facing this housing crisis.”
One fellow, who we will call Jack because he didn’t want The Vancouver Sun to reveal his real name, is a relative newcomer to mobile living. Semi-retired, he spends his winters running a restaurant in the Philippines and the rest of the year here, where he works as a drywaller. When he returned to Vancouver this year, Jack was astounded at the high rents, which were $800 or more for a room in a house, and didn’t even include a bed. When he spotted a trailer on Craigslist for $2,900 he jumped at it, calling the seller three times in 30 minutes until he got him on the phone, and then drove out immediately to get it.
“It’s a steal,” he said, looking around his home on wheels. “I couldn’t get out there fast enough.”
The trailer, which was snug and dry on a recent rainy night, is lived-in but not messy, stuffed with running gear, a couple of DVDs and boxes of cereal. With a fridge, stove and toilet, Jack, 60, said the trailer has all the amenities of a real home, where he can have his son over for dinner and watch rented DVDs after he’s gone. He doesn’t have a shower, but what Jack saves in rent, he spends at the local recreation centre, where he can work out, swim and shower for the price of admission. He’s also started frequenting the public library, where he can rent DVDs.
The biggest expense, he said, is to service the trailer every month and pay the monthly data plan on his phone, but it’s nothing compared to what he’s saving. “Every time at the end of the month, I think ‘oh I have to get rent money together.’ But then I realize I don’t have to,” he said.
He’s not the only one. Social media site Pinterest has a “van living” page, which offers tips on “How to stay warm in the winter when you live in a van or trailer (and some alternatives to toughing out the cold weather).”
At least five vans or RVs, with their curtains closed, were parked along one street in East Vancouver recently while a couple of vans were spotted near Trout Lake community centre. A cluster of RVs are also frequently parked near the overpass at Glen Drive and First Avenue.
Vancouver Police Const. Brian Montague said police don’t keep statistics on people living in vehicles. And although Jack said he met an officer once running his plates, he hasn’t had any problems with the police but noted he never parks in front of residential homes.
“I’m not doing anything wrong,” he said, but added: “I’m pretty low-key.”
But parking is just one consideration when living in a van or RV. Jack, who plans to head to the Philippines in January, has made plans to park his truck and trailer at his niece’s place so it’s here when he gets back next year. At the same time, Iaremko is looking to lease a garage or storage place.
“It is difficult,” Iaremko said. “There are some challenges to it, and some romantic sides, but it’s life.”
Why will prices go down with the way the market is, multiple offers, offers way over asking, hundreds of people showing up to open houses. Interest rates will never go up over 4% and if they do start to go people will lock in for 5 years at a low rate. Does that mean the market will stay hot for 5 years? Or does it mean as interest rates raise alittle sales will flatline but prices won't drop from these extravagant prices? Just curious to what peoples thoughts are.
Why will prices go down with the way the market is, multiple offers, offers way over asking, hundreds of people showing up to open houses. Interest rates will never go up over 4% and if they do start to go people will lock in for 5 years at a low rate. Does that mean the market will stay hot for 5 years? Or does it mean as interest rates raise alittle sales will flatline but prices won't drop from these extravagant prices? Just curious to what peoples thoughts are.
The problem is not when it's doing that. It's when it stops.
What happens when there's no more multi-offers on your place, offer over asking and not a single fly showing up to open houses when one bought a place less than a year earlier at record high?
Sure you can lock in low rates. But that only lasts 5 years. And assuming one continues to hold because he/she believes she could ride out the wave, then the market suffers a relatively soft 20% cut on prices, wiping out any equity the owner has.
At the end of 5yr, when the mortgage is up for renewal, what do you do? put up another 20% of the original price (minus whatever amount it had paid off), which is no longer worth as much and payment is higher because interest rate is not at record low anymore?
Can we assume that the frenzy would continue forever? Sure! But we can also assume that it would stop the very next day, because it's still back to fundamentals. We can have all the foreign investor we want. But when locals have forever been priced out (income can't support the price), you'd either have massive wave of people moving out, and/or the market would collapse
Anjew
11-14-2015 10:36 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr.HappySilp
(Post 8699071)
Good luck trying to get a gf or even get laid.
i think at that point they are more worried about food on the table?
JHatta
11-15-2015 07:46 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr.HappySilp
(Post 8699071)
Good luck trying to get a gf or even get laid.
If you resort to living in a vehicle because of high living costs in Vancouver, getting laid / gf is probably the least of your problems.
I knew a guy who tried to do this, claiming that it was more 'convenient' and that he was making better use of his time than sitting in traffic than others.
What bullshit.
Move to the city that you work in if you want to decrease your commute. I'd rather sit in traffic for 45 min and take a shit in my own bathroom then sit in a walmart parking lot and use the public toilet that probably has feces all over it.
Hondaracer
11-15-2015 08:07 AM
lol!
yea, like i prefer to live in a "structure" that actually feels like you're you know.. "inside" ? lol
EvoFire
11-15-2015 09:37 PM
What DOES happen when say, you are upside down and you are up for renewal?
I know that to get a mortgage without paying the CMHC insurance, I have to have 20% down. But what if when at renewal it's worth is less than the mortgage + 20%? Would I have to renew and pay the insurance, or any other difficulties? Obviously I have never bought a property before so I would have no idea, but even if it's useless to me now, it's not a useless piece of information.
Hehe
11-15-2015 10:33 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by EvoFire
(Post 8699362)
What DOES happen when say, you are upside down and you are up for renewal?
I know that to get a mortgage without paying the CMHC insurance, I have to have 20% down. But what if when at renewal it's worth is less than the mortgage + 20%? Would I have to renew and pay the insurance, or any other difficulties? Obviously I have never bought a property before so I would have no idea, but even if it's useless to me now, it's not a useless piece of information.
It's based on bank's calculation when processing your mortgage application. They factor the CMHC (or actually apply for such insurance) in if needed.
Say your home is 1M (in both price and how bank values it), you put 200k down and carries an 800k mortgage, no CMHC needed from bank viewpoint.
You are up for renewal, your home is now worth 800k (again, both price and how bank values it), and you have paid down say 50k over the course of 5yrs, so you still need to borrow 750k on mortgage, with 800k in equity. From bank's perspective, it means that now you only have 6.25% of assets/down payment/equity in this mortgage (50/800). So, they could potentially qualify you for a renewal, assuming you still pass their test, but they would apply CMHC as your equity no longer satisfy the condition to go without CMHC.
VR6GTI
11-16-2015 08:07 AM
all this chatter about wood frame vs concrete anyone have any info on new duplex construction?
Hondaracer
11-16-2015 08:22 AM
For the most part you can take what soundy and I said on the last page and apply it to a wood frame duplex.
The upside is that you only have one neighbor to consider.
Honestly, if you're moving into an older duplex, or even a townhouse with someone already living beside you, I'd just go knock on the door and either make up some BS to get a look at who knocks, or legitamitely ask them about the sound transfer and other neighbors before you buy lol
EvoFire
11-16-2015 08:33 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hehe
(Post 8699387)
It's based on bank's calculation when processing your mortgage application. They factor the CMHC (or actually apply for such insurance) in if needed.
Say your home is 1M (in both price and how bank values it), you put 200k down and carries an 800k mortgage, no CMHC needed from bank viewpoint.
You are up for renewal, your home is now worth 800k (again, both price and how bank values it), and you have paid down say 50k over the course of 5yrs, so you still need to borrow 750k on mortgage, with 800k in equity. From bank's perspective, it means that now you only have 6.25% of assets/down payment/equity in this mortgage (50/800). So, they could potentially qualify you for a renewal, assuming you still pass their test, but they would apply CMHC as your equity no longer satisfy the condition to go without CMHC.
Thanks for the reply, so going by that, if the mortgage is higher than what the value of the property is (value @ 700k, mortgage @750k) you'll have to cough up the extra to make it?
I know it's pretty unlikely to lose 25%+, but you never know.
Hehe
11-16-2015 09:06 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by EvoFire
(Post 8699461)
Thanks for the reply, so going by that, if the mortgage is higher than what the value of the property is (value @ 700k, mortgage @750k) you'll have to cough up the extra to make it?
I know it's pretty unlikely to lose 25%+, but you never know.
You still need to be able to pass the mortgage requirement. So if you are now underwater (owing more than its worth), and you still want to meet the requirement, you'd have to put up whatever it's required to meet the criteria.
SumAznGuy
11-16-2015 09:17 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hehe
(Post 8699387)
It's based on bank's calculation when processing your mortgage application. They factor the CMHC (or actually apply for such insurance) in if needed.
Say your home is 1M (in both price and how bank values it), you put 200k down and carries an 800k mortgage, no CMHC needed from bank viewpoint.
You are up for renewal, your home is now worth 800k (again, both price and how bank values it), and you have paid down say 50k over the course of 5yrs, so you still need to borrow 750k on mortgage, with 800k in equity. From bank's perspective, it means that now you only have 6.25% of assets/down payment/equity in this mortgage (50/800). So, they could potentially qualify you for a renewal, assuming you still pass their test, but they would apply CMHC as your equity no longer satisfy the condition to go without CMHC.
Depends on who you get your mortgage from, but this is what RBC and TD say.
As long as you stick with the same lender as your first mortgage.
If you try to shop around, then you will need to re-qualify.
Each lender will have their own policies regarding mortgage renewals. But, at TD, if a mortgage borrower has maintained their household payments, i.e. mortgage, property taxes, utilities, home insurance, in good standing throughout their current term, then most often at renewal, we will offer renewal options without needing for the borrower to re-qualify for the mortgage.
VR6GTI
11-16-2015 10:10 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hondaracer
(Post 8699455)
For the most part you can take what soundy and I said on the last page and apply it to a wood frame duplex.
The upside is that you only have one neighbor to consider.
Honestly, if you're moving into an older duplex, or even a townhouse with someone already living beside you, I'd just go knock on the door and either make up some BS to get a look at who knocks, or legitamitely ask them about the sound transfer and other neighbors before you buy lol
Hmmm good to know
Its a bran new duplex the framing hasn't been started yet. So its a gamble to see who your neighbor is.
Hondaracer
11-16-2015 10:25 AM
If you're interested in buying, go have a look while they are framing
SumAznGuy
11-16-2015 10:40 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hondaracer
(Post 8699512)
If you're interested in buying, go have a look while they are framing
Out of curiosity, why is that?
Gumby
11-16-2015 11:26 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by SumAznGuy
(Post 8699516)
Out of curiosity, why is that?
Huh? That way you'll get an idea of what materials and construction practices are being used? As opposed to buying when the house is fully completed?
Gucci Mane
11-16-2015 11:35 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by VR6GTI
(Post 8699509)
Hmmm good to know
Its a bran new duplex the framing hasn't been started yet. So its a gamble to see who your neighbor is.
since it hasn't been built yet, can't you add into the purchase agreement that you'd like sound deadening, resilient channel etc. added in at your cost for the materials?
i think this is something you should inquire about if this is a property that may work well for you.
Hondaracer
11-16-2015 12:09 PM
Depending on the developer that's totally acceptable in most cases. The problem is ensuring that it actually happens.
With the proper documentation I guarantee you'd get that initial investment back upon seeing as opposed to a unit without.
VR6GTI
11-16-2015 06:03 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pidish
(Post 8699531)
since it hasn't been built yet, can't you add into the purchase agreement that you'd like sound deadening, resilient channel etc. added in at your cost for the materials?
i think this is something you should inquire about if this is a property that may work well for you.
When i purchased from this developer last time they were open to custom features.
Now it seems like they have a list of custom options but I'm gonna go back this sunday and inquire about extra soundproofing and some other custom options.
blkgsr
11-16-2015 06:03 PM
how many large scale residential towers have you done Hondaracer? I'm not talking about renos etc.
NEVER have i see a potential home owner or prospective buyer be allowed to tour an active site (while in early construction) just to "check it out"
now if you're talking suites worth $2M+ that's a different story but not the cookie cutter basic units that this town is so good a pumping out
