Originally Posted by CharlesInCharge (Post 8061379)

And all I got was this lousy user title.
Sorry guys, walls of text intimidate me... Im taking a break.

Originally Posted by MindBomber (Post 8061104)

....
Imagine for a moment that the culture passed down to you by your ancestors has been distilled to a single community. All your peoples' unique history and traditions exist no where outside of that community and furthermore is intrinsically tied to a specific piece of land; your language, religion, oral history, art, lifestyle. You now have two options: remain in that community, or move on to live in another more multicultural community.


You're not opposed to living in a multicultural community; quite the opposite, it offers many benefits. Moving to the multicultural community, however, comes with the inevitable reality that your culture will be somewhat diluted, because practicing it will become even less something that surrounds you daily and more something that you embrace on special occasions. Picture a Chinese or South Asian immigrants child raised in a very white neighborhood (like, Kamloops level white), how distant would that child feel from his cultural traditions at age twenty? Now picture, the child's grandchildren, after three generations, how diluted and distant would their ancestry be to them?

My answer to that question: it would be borderline non-existent; your answer may differ slightly, but I'm sure we can agree that with each generation significant dilution would occur.

In that lies the answer to the real reason reserves are important to First Nations people. Moving off the reserve amounts to a decision to allow the culture to go extinct, and that is a sacrifice which is just to great for many to make. If it had not been for residential schools, maybe First Nations culture would be burning that much stronger, and moving off the reserve would be that much more viable an option, but we can only speculate.

Whether on a reservation or not, television and/or a youths friends that watches mainstream television/movies, will taint a person with degenerate views.
Things like sex before marriage and smoking are the very things that slip unnoticed but they are setting kids up to have an unstructured family life with materialism and stimulants to be addicted to.
Mr.Dankof and the speaker after better describe this. 8min to 15min mark.
'Massacres inevitable in America' - YouTube

Some families should be given incentives, such a good community, private schools and funding to isolate children from the mainstream to definitely bring back languages like you mentioned and to even go further as being role models and teachers for future generations.

Originally Posted by MindBomber (Post 8061308)

Galloway travels to the Middle East because he's active in Middle Eastern issues. Nelson travels to the Middle East because he's incapable of receiving positive airtime on issues pertaining to Canada within Canada. The two scenarios are not comparable, and thus your argument is unsound.

You said yourself that "those willing to give him airtime are distinctly anti-western", Galloway seams like he's in the same boat.


What First Nations groups advocate the importance of sovereignty aside from Nelson?
You say none, but I'm not aware of a First Nations group that does not advocate the importance of sovereignty. Sovereignty is considered fundamental to First Nations rights, and it's something that every Chief and advocate speaks on and works to defend and expand.

Since you seem to know first nations politics well, I was expecting you to post something as good as Nelson, but after watching the new chiefs speech to Harper, he doesnt seem as nationalistic as Nelson. He asks to be full partners, which seems grand but at the beginning of this video it seems like the "crown" wants to privatize first nations land to further exploit it.
I wouldnt have my hope up for these negotiations to go too far... where as Nelson seems like he demands land rights with consequences for territory disputes if they arent met.
New chief to Harper speech.
You seem to be justifying Saddam's invasion of Kuwait through the fact that it once was a part of Iraq, which is hypocritical, given that earlier in this thread you advocated in favour of independence for Scotland and Quebec. If Scotland secedes, Great Britain would not be justified in an invasion; if Quebec secedes, Canada would not be justified in an invasion; if Alaska secedes (which is becoming increasingly probable), America would not be justified in an invasion.
It depends on if your on the Imperial Zionist side or not.

Originally Posted by Lomac (Post 8061315)

.........

Barring that, yes, they have their Reserves (maybe it's just me, but I don't like that word... some how it feels like that word has become synonymous with everything bad and stereotypical of the Natives... but I digress...). Admittedly I don't know a whole lot about Native Americans as I was never really interested in their history, so some of what I'm going to say may come as naive or negative, and I apologize if I do. It's out of sheer ignorance, not hate or anything else. The typical stereotype of the typical Native is that of laziness, drink-happy, and unwilling to do anything to change it. Whether that stereotype is deserved or not isn't the issue; the fact is that unless the typical non-Native "Canadian" is able to let go of that stereotype, I'm sure many Natives can't be bothered to prove them otherwise. I know there are plenty of successful Natives in Canada -- and I'm sure there are many more that I don't know about, or just simply aren't famous for it -- but there will be those few that continue to live up to the stereotype and forever drag the rest of their kind down with them. Yes, there will always be delinquents in every group out there, regardless of race, but it seems that there's such a larger focus on the Natives because many people feel like they get the world handed to them on a silver platter and then complain that it wasn't coated in gold.

You grew up in Canada, who told you natives get the world handed to them?.. did you go to university with someone that was studying for free or what? I would like to know


I don't know if there will ever be a genuine solution to the Natives v. Everyone Else issue, but there definitely needs to be a better compromise on both sides before it will change. I don't think going to other countries will help in any way; if anything else, it can often give the appearance of running to Mommy to tattle on the bully that's pushing you at school. Maybe it will work, maybe not. But the problem can only be dealt with internally, within the Canadian government and the citizens of Canada.
To say that the leaders of Iran, or Sudan, or Botswana, or whatever other country out there, can help... well, it's foolish to believe it. We all have to look into ourselves and genuinely feel what's best for ourselves, for the Natives, and for everyone in Canada.

Why would Canada help when its in an illegal war for geopolitical and profit means over indigenous Afgans?

Have you comprehended that Canada is ruled by higher ups yet?

A solution can be reached if the first nations get a good portion of their land and resource extraction rights back and we'll see which peoples excel.

Also why would you even name these African countries in the same light to Iran? Its pretty ridiculous as your trying to subliminally downgrade Irans prestige in the world stage.

Speaking of Sudan, a few days ago the Zionist put their isreali military base to use and bombed that country, what a surprise :rolleyes:

Originally Posted by MindBomber (Post 8061358)

......
......
I recognize that the continual pointing of blame to residential schools is probably frustrating to the casual observer, but cultural genocide has a massive impact on a people and it continued to take place until so very recently.

Originally Posted by MindBomber (Post 8066365)

Update.

First Nations chiefs blast Terry Nelson's Holocaust comparison

WINNIPEG – First Nations and Jewish community leaders are speaking out against accusations that the Canadian government is attempting to "exterminate" Aboriginal Peoples.

At least two Manitoba community leaders say the comments made by former chiefs Terry Nelson (Roseau River) and Dennis Pashe (Dakota Tipi) on Iranian state television Sunday were completely unacceptable.

The comments included a description of reserves as "concentration camps."

"I'm scared to even compare that tragedy with our history," Birdtail Sioux First Nation Chief Kenneth Chalmers said of the Holocaust. "That's not acceptable. It's totally different. We're not lining up for gas chambers."


This is a good example of a brainwashed buzzword reaction... Canada had its own concentration camps only 90 years ago... I wonder if any kids of that time are still alive today.
http://i.imgur.com/Rst0n.jpg
WOW 22,000!!!!

this is from another website

They built a big stake in farming and fishing — which was sold at giveaway prices when Japanese-Canadians were pushed into wartime concentration camps.
...
P.C. 5523 - The Director of Soldier Settlement is given authority to purchase or lease farms owned by Japanese Canadians. He subsequently buys 572 farms without consulting the owners.


I wonder what the other camps looked like... but I did find this of the old PNE
http://i.imgur.com/mvpQP.jpg

Japanese concentration camps in Canada
Japanese Internment In Canada - Part 1 - YouTube
Japanese Internment In Canada - Part 2 - YouTube




The leader of the Assiniboine River Valley community said the pair's claim Canada's 600 murdered and missing First Nations women are evidence of an effort to wipe out Aboriginal Peoples from the Canadian population are equally misguided.

"That's way out there too. The exploitation of our women is not a government program," said Chalmers. "The economic situations our people are in makes them open for exploitation."

Yeah right, its a racist system. Look at the Pickton case, in 97 an aboriginal girl was able to fight back and escape an attempt on her life... they found him not guilty and with all the other witness plea's for the cops to look into this guy, they were ignored and later even files were "accidentally" destroyed to further hide evidence.
Was it because Pickton was a millionaire who setup parties that the mayor, cops and criminals attended so they had to let him go on? or the commanders at the top knew he was guilty but it was serving a larger sinister plot... or more likely these mostly none white women's lives were not worth what Pickton had to offer overall.


Nelson and Pashe travelled to Tehran, Iran, last week to highlight what they believe to be Canada's human rights abuses against aboriginals, defying the federal government's suspension of diplomatic relations with the country.

They booted the Iranian embassy staff and cut relations because of the chiefs trips Im betting!

Chalmers said he's concerned the trip will hamper the progress made on legitimate aboriginal concerns, including poverty and a lack of adequate reserve housing.

So the Canadian gov might collectively punish all aboriginals for what Terry is doing... is this a pattern from the past it makes me wonder..

Current Dakota Tipi First Nation Chief Cornell Pashe, Dennis Pashe's cousin, agreed.

"We've worked long and hard to be where we're at,” he said. “We have to work realistically to resolve issues. Sure, injustices have occurred, but it's the past and we have to work within the current system."

Work within the current system, like bend over.

Jeffrey Smith, of the Calgary Jewish Federation, said Nelson's comments linking Canada's human rights record to Iran's is an insult to all Canadians.

Canada vetoing Palestintian rights in the U.N. and some days ago telling a U.N. investigator for his resignation after standing up for human rights is an insult to Canadians!

Here is what the investigator said.
The UN special investigator on human rights in the Palestinian territories called Wednesday for a boycott of all companies that have dealings with Israeli settlements in the West Bank and East Jerusalem until they adhere to international rights standards and practices.


"For him to go to a country like Iran, which is probably one of the world's foremost human rights abusers, and use that as a platform, I think it's not helpful at all to the challenges that the First Nations find themselves with in Canada," said Smith.

"one of the world's foremost human rights abusers"... then why have 120 countries met in Iran, as its the current president of the NAM group? What a fucking joke.

The lighter blue countries are observer states
http://georgiebc.files.wordpress.com...ssia.png?w=869


A spokeswoman for the Assembly of Manitoba Chiefs said Grand Chief Derek Nepinak was unavailable when contacted by QMI Agency.

Nepinak told CBC on Tuesday that he doesn't agree with Nelson's controversial statements.

"I don't think it necessarily represents the views or perspectives of the bulk of indigenous people that live here," he said.

"I think we live here peacefully within western Canadian society, and I think some of the messaging is not doing any good."
fight for your rights old man :fullofwin:

Originally Posted by MindBomber (Post 8066544)

I don't believe isolating children from the mainstream would be a benefit, it would leave them crippled and able to function outside the First Nations community. I do believe it is important to instill cultural values in our children, but we do not live in a pre-contact civilization and cannot pretend as such.
Not knowing who Justin biever is or how the Kardashians got famous surely will cripple these children. :p

Pre-marital sex and smoking are prohibited by Islam, but not First Nations religions so that's a null point.
I dont believe any irresponsible, resource-less youth should be having babies or taking addictive, unhealthy and taxing substances.

Marriage is also fundamental to dedicating ones life with his/her partner in raising children together.


No, Galloway is controverstial, and a pompous ass at times, but he is given a measure of respect in the UK.
I think he won his new MP position thanks to his PressTV show.
Press TV

Shawn Atleo is very close to the Harper Government, it's an issue that draws frequent criticism. My understanding of Alteo's position is essentially that he feels more progress can be made on the issues at hand through a good relationship than a conflicting one. I do not agree with Atleo's overly friendly relationship. Sovereignty is still crucial to Atleo though.

If you want to hear someone very uncensored, like Nelson, Google: Arthur Manuel.
I watched a couple of videos on Youtube, he sounds good.

You seem to be justifying Saddam's invasion of Kuwait through the fact that it once was a part of Iraq, which is hypocritical, given that earlier in this thread you advocated in favour of independence for Scotland and Quebec. If Scotland secedes, Great Britain would not be justified in an invasion; if Quebec secedes, Canada would not be justified in an invasion; if Alaska secedes (which is becoming increasingly probable), America would not be justified in an invasion.
It depends on if your on the Imperial Zionist side or not.
I don't understand your response....
Kuwait, Alaska, Quebec and Scotland were never originally a part of the big imperialist in the first place, and any place is better off without them.

No, that's not what he means. He means, Nelson trivializes concerns and that affects how seriously First Nations rights are considered by the public and elected officials.
Chalmers said he's concerned the trip will hamper the progress made on legitimate aboriginal concerns, including poverty and a lack of adequate reserve housing.
The public and elected officials have no say here, this isnt about good public relations, thats not going to get land rights back, atleast nowhere close to what Terry wants.
Poverty and housing will be thing of the past if Terry's legit sovereignty claims are given back.


Internment, not concentration.

There is a distinction between the two, and it's important.
This is not what the Queens English defines it as.
con·cen·tra·tion camp
Noun:
A place where large numbers of political prisoners or members of persecuted minorities are imprisoned,


The internment camps weren't luxurious, but they weren't horrible squalid conditions and to my knowledge serious mistreatment did not occur. The very, very significant majority of people taken to internment camps chose to remain in Canada following the end of the war, and I think that's telling.

I've met people who were in internment camps through school, so I'm not just paraphrasing my textbook. I'm also not trying to make Canada's actions seem okay, I'm just trying to retell history with as little bias as possible and to the best of my knowledge.

What happened was wrong. Especially the seizure of assets.

It was 70 years ago though, society as a whole was much more xenophobic, and we were at war with Japan. The internment was relatively brief, and not entirely motivated by racism.

Originally Posted by MindBomber (Post 8066807)

JB and KK are the worst examples of pop culture swill. There are examples that aren't bad at all, and a familiarity with them would not harm a child. Completely isolating a child from contemporary culture would make it difficult for them to associate with peers from outside their community though.
Some music should be alright but I would even question the videos.
For example how old are these kids in this video, 15? Do you think little girls in the conservative Islamic Iran walk the streets like this?
http://i.imgur.com/q3Zlj.jpg

I havent watched any Kardashian shows yet, but Im betting its filled with filth. Dont you think kids would want to know how these celebrities got famous in the first place... thats right she sucked a penis on video, what a great role model.

Young kids these days probably size up other kids in terms of looks and money status too above other things before judging how mainstream they are.



I believe having children too young can only be detrimental to both the parents and child, but sex doesn't necessarily equate to having children.

Just go on plenty of fish and look at all the young single mothers that didnt have an abortion that could've possibly made them infertile after.
Im betting most of these pregnancy were unplanned... so no I would not say having sex at a young age is alright.


'Unhealthy' substances is sort of relative. No substance is terribly unhealthy when used in considered moderation, and many drugs are certainly less unhealthy than the things people eat today. Natural mind altering substances and tobacco are also a part of traditional culture, so I believe the use of these substances should not be prevented and actually encouraged.

The tobacco thats readily available today is addictive and the 5k chemicals found in it play against cell function. I think ceremonial weed bong hits for a developed 20+ year old brain could be okay, but other then that its working against a healthy lifestyle, brings about addiction to smokes, and daily expenses that could be put toward better quality food.

Marriage is important to traditional culture, and sexual relationships post-marriage were monogamous. Premarital sex was permissible though.

Select elements of First Nations culture will conflict with your own, and you'll feel the need to advocate against it, but that's exactly the same idea missionaries had and look where that has brought us. It think it's important to not interfere with or denounce the practices of other cultures, as difficult as it may be at times.

Dont/didnt the first nations have strict hierarchy of ruling chiefs and elders and its/was important what clan you marry in to? Having sex with random women only brings unplanned pregnancy and I doubt it was like you say.

......

If Terry's sovereignty claims were to proceed the rest of Canada would suffer in a way too profound. Long term, a mutual respect needs to re-established between ancestral and non-ancestral Canadians. If Terry's ideal were made a reality, First Nations people would initially benefit, but long term would suffer.
Like how other Canadians would be jealous with the first nations newly acquired wealth?
Do I resent the Saud monarch and their extended family members that drive Aston One-77 cars in pairs... yes, but that is only because there puppet state is nourishing the war machine and rest of their population is in poverty.
But I would not resent aboriginals having big houses and nice cars because its rightfully theirs just as I would feel if I went to Norway and see the wealth acquired in that country from its high oil resources.

Originally Posted by MindBomber (Post 8066807)

Both internment and concentration are technically correct, but concentration isn't really fitting.

Concentration has a very strong connotation related to the Nazi slave labour and death camps, and so it's inflammatory and doesn't suit the description of Japanese camps in Canada.

Originally Posted by MindBomber (Post 8066862)

I don't believe teaching abstinence is an effective strategy. Even the most religious people often break from no sex before marriage teachings. I think people should be more actively taught to use a condom, instead of hoping people will wait till marriage. That would work towards preventing the maximal possible number of unwanted/unplanned pregnancies.
Perhaps masturbation is the answer.
Sexual diseases, ones that transfer even with condoms on, are another concern and people who are eating empty nutrient foods will have compromised immune systems that wont handle some bacteria and viruses.
I recommend an 80%+ fruit diet for optimal health thanks to Youtube's Dr.Morse.

I was watching a documentary on Lyme disease, "Under our skin", and how it could be spread through sex. The Lyme bacterium can travel to all parts of the body because of the corkscrew (syphilis like) shape it has, causing all types of aliments which are diagnosed as other diseases.

A doctor in the video said he ordered 10 heads of dead alzheimer's patients and found this bacterium in 7 of those brains... which was most likely the cause of their memory problems.
Medial insurance companies and the doctors in the U.S. try not to care for Lyme victims as it would serve them better if they can hold the patient out to save/collect money.


Is it a conspiracy? Lets just look at the track record of some of the most outrageous things that have knowingly been done... like testing STD's on black men, the Guatemalan infections, and testing drugs on U.S. patients
pt1
Press TV-Fine Print-US & Guatemala Syphilis Experiments-10-12-2010-(Part 1) - YouTube
pt2
Press TV-Fine Print-US & Guatemala Syphilis Experiments-10-12-2010-(Part 2) - YouTube

Lets not forget the spreading of AIDS and hepatitis tainted blood through out the world... including Canada with its AIDS scandal being as late as the early 90's... that's like 10 years ago!.
Bayer Exposed ( HIV Contaminated Vaccine ) - YouTube

So its not just the pregnancies, there are diseases out there that only certain anti-biotics will cure or just a strong immune system.

Vaccines are another problem, besides the toxic agents used in the past and maybe today, there are certain Mycoplasma bacteria in the creation pools that slip through the filters and can make you sick.
I have a 2-3 hour presentation of a scientist that goes into detail of this with an explanation for the whole "gulf war syndrome" effecting thousands in the world... but the video has gone private unless someone can track it down
Prof Garth Nicolson http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...36843859172148


I don't think it's that a resentment over new found wealth would emerge. I think people cannot help but resent a massive disparity in entitlement by birthright.

I think that non-ancestral Canadian's and First Nations people should all benefit relatively equally from the land we share.

As it stand, First Nations don't benefit enough.
As Nelson proposes, non-ancestral Canadian's wouldn't benefit enough.
There's the potential for a balance where we all benefit, and that's my ideal and what a lot of leaders are trying to achieve.
It will be one hell of a challenge for some of Nelson's dreams to come true... and if the other Canadians want a share from the "Crown", they should look at how Quebec students and families marched for their gains.

Originally Posted by Lomac (Post 8066912)

I didn't say that's what I believed; simply, that's what the stereotype is. I did, however, date a Native American (well, half Native, anyway) girl for just shy of three years, so I've some experience with what they're entitled to and what's simply assumed by the Canadian general public.

All the biased CBC Crown news reports I was watching on the Attawapiskat crises and reading so many ignorant Canadian comments in the news articles really makes me wonder how people believe in the things they say.


Suppositions don't equate to facts, nor do they have any direct correlation between the two topics.
Truth is Canada is like a crackhead with its gang of buddies the US and Nato looting and murdering the Afghans. Crackheads should not be trusted.

No.
If you havent the time to read the sources of information I clue to in post 48, then surely you would believe a former president talking about this unseen power... and as a result he and his brother both get capped in the head, gangster style. No Lizard shape shifting here.

Originally Posted by Lomac (Post 8066912)

Ah, so you do recognize subliminal messaging and things also associated with loaded language. For a while in my earlier posts, I was worried that you didn't understand what I was trying to say about PressTV.
Its not loaded when they speak the truth.

That said, those were the first countries that popped into my mind. No parallels were intended to be drawn. Sudan was because I had just finished talking with a friend from there, and Botswana because I had watched the Top Gear special earlier in the day.

:P

I'm not quite sure about Iran's "prestige" in the world stage, however...
If you havent noticed the western world is out to target Islam mainly because political Islam has brought a very significant revolution in history called the Iranian revolution which ousted the Zionists entity. This very religion with Irans strong influence in the world can be said to also be responsible for the Arab spring and even the 99% movement after. This is not good for Zionist occupiers when thousands upon thousands of people line the streets and demand real justice and reforms.

Is there a point to that comment?
Yeah, I think I broke a RevScene record on the amount of times I used the word Zionist and Isreal in a thread.

Originally Posted by CorneringArtist (Post 8067288)

Hate to sound like a broken record, but if you believe that Canada is such a terrible place to be, then WHY ARE YOU STILL HERE? Stating this is absolutely hypocritical if you've emigrated from a place that you think is a beacon of perfection in the world. If you hate Canada so much, simply up and leave, or stop using Canadian resources as further use is contradictory to your beliefs, and is a much worse case if you've taken Canadian citizenship.

If you sidestep this for the umpteenth time, or call me a racist for asking this simple question then there's no hope for you.

Originally Posted by CharlesInCharge (Post 8067409)

This is not the ruling governments land, you are reinforcing this occupation... you should leave because people here and the first nations want freedom.

Originally Posted by CharlesInCharge (Post 8067628)

I wonder if what ever RacingMetro92 posted about me was meant to refute Kennedy's speech in anyway. Should he have left the America's too for wanting a just system? Maybe he should have... he sure would've lived longer.

Originally Posted by CharlesInCharge (Post 8067677)

Is this a personal question to me or do you want a general answer as to why conscious people who have migrated, in their life time or past generations, to Zionist occupied lands should remain or leave their host countries?

Originally Posted by Graeme S (Post 8067645)

Speaking of wanting to distract people, you still haven't answered the reason that you are choosing to continue your Zionist-sponsored occupation of Ancestral Canadian/First Nations' land.

Originally Posted by CharlesInCharge (Post 8067689)

Short answer is Im flat broke. Ideally and eventually I'd like to raise a family in Iran and also have a summer house in Zionist occupied sunny L.A.

Originally Posted by Graeme S (Post 8067692)

Serious followup: If you cannot move back to a nation where you actually have family and first-generation connections to, how can you reasonably expect people who are generations removed from their homelands (or who come from families who have no unilateral heritage and instead have blended ones) to "go back where they came from"?

Originally Posted by Graeme S (Post 8067692)

If you, a person who has such strong feelings cannot or will not return, then how can you apply a higher standard to others who have weaker ties outside of Canada?
-edit-
Also, what's the long answer?