Just because Person A and Person B might have been acting irresponsibly doesn't mean that everyone else deserves to be taken advantage of. Ignoring the OP's tale (mainly because none of us know for a fact whether it's 100% correct or some information was left out), a company that keeps individual's deposits for simply being in the same group is not just poor business, but illegal. Those who weren't involved in the crash returned their gear undamaged. It doesn't matter in the slightest whether they were goofing around or not; the fact that they fulfilled their contractual obligations is enough to warrant the return of their money. A company can't refuse to return a deposit simply out of spite or because someone else in the group fucked up, especially if each person signed for their own sled.

This is the waiver we sign when we rent sleds off a guy in kamloops:

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y13...psqhygybat.jpg

Almost every one I've rented uses similar wording, this is the only one I've got a copy of however.

This guy though is excellent, you damage a sled he will take your deposit, tell you within two days the total cost of damage + send an invoice

lol Offtopic but how was the Crossfire?

And yeah, that's how it should be done, not the way that this place allegedly did.

Crossfire is underpowered and I blew one of the plug wires about 50k from the cabin so can't say much to it lol..

To be clear like I said in the beggining I'm not saying that the company is in the right or that it's not illegal to pull off what they are trying to do. All I'm saying is in the end it's probably less of a hassle and way less time to just have the person who damaged the sea doos pay the amount once they've seen the invoice and square up with everyone who had the deposits taken.

As I said before I think almost all companies who rent stuff like this deal in a similar fashion as my and my friends experienced almost the exact same situation to the T in Vernon. Ideally this type of thing has to be dealt with immediately at the scene not a few weeks down the road. If everyone had stayed and said were calling the cops if the deposits are not refunded I'm sure it would have been resolved right there.

If I was the two individuals involved in the crash I would do the following;

a) grow a spine (no disrespect intended)
b) go visit the business owner in PERSON (this is not comfortable but it's the adult thing to do)
c) demand that refunds be processed for the four individuals that were NOT involved in the crash - it's the least you can do if they are your friends. Don't drag them into a fucking legal battle that they are not responsible for regardless of whether the business owner is acting "shady" or not
d) in exchange for processing refunds for the four individuals that were not involved in the crash, ask the company for all invoices and bills associated with repairing the units that were damaged
e) live up to the contract you signed and pay for those damages

Case closed.

This guy wrecked his rental

Need Mike Ross to deal with this

:troll:

So whats the verdict?

a) Agree. Stop whining and do something to get it done.
b) Drive out to Cultus Lake to meet with someone who might not even be there to discuss it when you arrive? Better to simply phone the owner and get a feel for whether they want to settle or not.
c) Who's dragging friends into court? The friends didn't get screwed by the two riders that got crashed - they got screwed over by the rental company who kept their deposits illegally. They should be filing cases, not the two who crashed.
d) I still highly doubt the rental company has even got the machines repaired or has any invoices for such repairs.


I would still send out the demand letters. Then see if the owners bother to contact you to try and settle. If they do, then you know they're willing to make some type of deal. If they IGNORE the letters, or respond with additional threats, then they are not the type of people who were going to come to a reasonable settlement anyway.


What it all boils down to is this:

Assholes like these guys pull illegal shit all the time on customers. And 99% of the time the customers bend over, drop their pants and say "how far to you want to fuck me?" These guys know it, which is why they act the way they do. They know the chances of someone actually going through the trouble of small claims court are slim, so they aren't going to do shit until they realize you're not one of those people who will let this slide. And they're going to keep on doing the same shit to other customers because they've never had to suffer the consequences of screwing anyone over.

I've brought up the case of my wife with the spa, and NOTHING happened until we went to court. We tried talking to the owners several times (all very civil with no yelling, swearing or rude behavior on our part) and they wouldn't budge. We then sent the demand letter and still nothing. Even when we delivered the court notice and tried one last time to settle, they refused.


You're wasting your time if you think they'll settle (if the OP's posts about how they acted are true, then their character seems pretty clear). Send the letters and see if they respond. You're going to find out very quickly what type of people they are.

Either that or stop posting about it on RS and telling us what's been "happening" all the while doing nothing to try and solve the problem.

My friends shop screws over people all the time. They love the people who say just "man up and ignore the issue". They'll just keep doing it over and over again. Which is funny cause you'll think they'll be out of business using these tactics but they're not and actually making more nickel and diming people. They know people won't give a sht cause they're too scared or don't want to bother. There's this mentality that going to court is expensive but it's not when it's small claims court. It's Supreme Court cases that are usually $30k+

it's not going to court thats expensive, it's the lawyers fees that are expensive. Your initial consultation with the lawyer may be free but you'll definitely be charged for time and for the demand letter. Depending on the lawyer, it may end up costing you more than the $500 deposit you're going after. That's why people don't hire lawyers to go after someone. It takes time and money to do it and most people say "fuk it, it's only a couple hundred or whatever." In most cases, lawyers will charge you a fee to look into the matter and advise you that it's not worth it to use a lawyer and to just cut your losses and move on.

If you show up to small claims court with a lawyer, you will get laughed at.

Small claims court is the "Peoples court", its designed to be fair and provide an equal place for anyone who has been wronged for less that $25000 to recoupe their money.

It only costs about $100 to file, and if you win, that $100 is reimbursed.

This case doesn't have to cost OP hardly anything, and the fact that you believe that it is going to be expensive kinda shows you know very little about how our court system actually works for matters like these.

OP does not need to go see a lawyer, he has a clear cut case, go file in small claims court, you will be given a series of dates, for mediation and such, if something cannot be reached then it will go to a judge and they will make a ruling. No lawyers involved.

:lol Thank you! Got to love when people are caught talking out their ass like they are experts.

I didn't say he should show up to small claims court with a lawyer or retain one for small claims court, i was talking about the costs associated with going to a lawyer for the matter in general. Lawyer's costs are set for what they do. That has nothing to do with you filing in small claims. The average person sees lawyers costs as a barrier and small claims is an afterthought. They think to go to a lawyer or people tell him to go to a lawyer before trying to deal with it themselves in small claims. The court system is independent of lawyer dealings. I wasn't talk about the court system. The average lawyer has a consultation fee which could be X amount of dollars, he hears you out, and advises you to deal with it in small claims. Thats still an extra cost. And as people have been posting, to ask a lawyer to send a demand letter is also an extra cost independent of the court system. For some people, it may be worth it to take those lawyer fees and not have to waste their own time going to small claims.

I agree, OP doesn't need a lawyer, he probably doesn't need to do small claims either if they dealt with the situation appropriately but assuming what he's saying about the business is all true, he really has no choice but to file a claim.

I used to work at a seadoo dealership. Takes like an hour to fix a bit of gel coating. Rubber bumpers pop on and off really easily. If the hull was completely damaged or the impeller then I could understand that. But for a scratch that didn't go through the hull? Not likely. 1-2 hours tops plus drying time. Do it in the evening so you don't loose revenue since they can still be used with the dent/scratch.

The extent of the damage is irrelevant.

The problem here is that a number of the people were charged money for damage to equipment which had nothing to do with them.

These people deserve to have their deposits returned since they returned the machines in good condition.

The damage to the remaining two machines needs to be dealt with between the two people who returned damaged machines and the owners of the rental place.

This is a clear cut case for OP.

Not going to take sides but I find that the main problem is not the operators, because as we all know it shit happens.

I don't see why everyone's deposit is taken rather than the 2 individual that crashed. It's un-right and shady as fuck.

I have nothing against the company recouping the cost and charging the 2 individuals that crashed. That's the companies and the 2 individuals problem not the other 3 operators.

If the 3 other individuals that got charged take them to small-claims court they would win because they are all bonded by a contract where they are individuals as the contract does not say that as a group they will collect their cost of damage from other individuals.

It's the companies problem to deal with the other 2 people and they can take legal actions. But by no means are they allowed to solve it some other way and let the group of friends figure among themselves. Also if they want to collect more money from the 2 individuals they cannot make a random price themselves, they need to get it assessed and they need to bill the 2 individuals directly. That is their cost of business and shit happens this is what they need to deal with. Not fucking pulling some numbers out of their asses and make a group of friends argue and turn on each other.

I bet the OP chicken out and didn't even send any lawyer letters to the rental company.

And this is what pisses me off about these threads. Someone posts about something that happens to them. They get good advice from fellow members (often advising them to talk to a lawyer or file a case in small claims). Things get dragged out with more info, phone calls or e-mails and nothing gets resolved. Eventually the thread disappears and nothing ever gets solved.


Original asshole who did the scamming continues scamming because nobody ever sticks up for themselves.

See this is what I don't understand.

All of these idiots who dispute tickets, when they in fact were speeding, or did have illegal tint, or did run the red light or w/e the case may be.

Yet when they were actually wronged, they just let it slide.

:seriously:

See, this is why I'm a bit skeptical of the OP's story. We're not just talking about absorbing a loss of under $20 - $50. We're talking about $500. Per person

Taking into account the amount involved, and supposedly the story being rather cut-and-dry, something is just not adding up why the OP is satisfied just leaving a defamatory BBB review and a riling forum thread.

re: anthony... is-f... mike... how long has it been now? 2+ years? maybe more?

wow i missed this thread originally...so it's been 1.5 months what's happened?

1) they can't take all your deposits,
2) go to small claims the judge may even reward you more than $500 each because of the companys actions


you making a post on here and some internet review sites aren't "showing them" anything, they expect childish attempts like that and don't care
you want to show them hit em where it actually hurts

Pretty sure Giardino's would beg to differ on that point.

But I agree with you that OP needs to do something more than moap around an internet forum...