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-   Suspension, Brakes , Wheels & Tires Tech (https://www.revscene.net/forums/suspension-brakes-wheels-tires-tech_191/)
-   -   Anyone using KW V1 Coilover's or BC Racing? (https://www.revscene.net/forums/699423-anyone-using-kw-v1-coilovers-bc-racing.html)

E-SPEC 11-05-2014 09:47 AM

Anyone using KW V1 Coilover's or BC Racing?
 
I'm leaning towards the KW V1's with non-dampening adjustment, because the V2 and V3 are not available for my car. I'm only worried that i will find them a little too soft for my liking seeing as though they are pre-set to a neutral setting. The BC Racing on the other hand has dampening adjusting and seems like the nest best choice. Anyone using either of the two? Thanks inadvance for any input.

EvoFire 11-05-2014 10:13 AM

I would 100% pick a matched set of springs/shocks over BC coils.

As for the KW's, I'd say go for unless you really want it to be adjustable. What other options are there? Any chance you can get a ride with someone who has KW's on their car right now?

E-SPEC 11-05-2014 08:23 PM

Thats an idea, but not an available one. I'll most likely go w/ the KW's i think. But just worried i might find them a little too soft.

bcrdukes 11-06-2014 01:37 AM

What are you using the coilovers for?

v_tec 11-06-2014 02:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bcrdukes (Post 8553191)
What are you using the coilovers for?

Hipsters won't understand...

E-SPEC 11-06-2014 07:39 AM

Mostly street, but maybe the track on rare occasions. Even on my old Tein SS, i found them not stiff enough for my personal liking on the stiffest setting, if i'm gonna spend upwards of 2k i wanna REALLY be happy with them thats all. thanks

bcrdukes 11-06-2014 08:05 AM

I can't speak for the Tein SS but for the KW V1, it should be valved to accommodate a range of spring rates but you will have to do your homework as to what will work within its range.

I'm not a huge supporter of BC Racing but if you are simply going to crank the compression and rebound to full max in order to achieve the stiffness you want, you should be prepared replace them in 1 - 2 years.

underscore 11-06-2014 09:49 AM

I've got BC Racing coilovers on my GTFour, the adjustment is noticeable from one extreme to the other but it doesn't seem to cover a very wide range. That said I got them with very stiff springs.

ncrx 11-06-2014 09:23 PM

please do not buy bc racing/jic/ksport/megan... they're all garbage , but they're awesomly cheap to just hang low, thats about all they're good at.

they all have less than inch of travel (travel is one of the most important aspects of ride quality),
have terrible valving (the most important aspect of ride quality),
their many 3000 clicks of adjustment only adjust rebound, barely, typically linearly


Entry Level
koni sport with gc coilover kit

Mid range
kw v3/ ohlins dfv/ koni 8611/3011 double adjustable with gc coilover kit

High end
ohlins/penske/moton/ast/koni 2812/2817 high end



only please. your friendly autocrosser

E-SPEC 11-07-2014 08:52 AM

Thanks. i have currently the Ground Control / Koni yellow setup on my car w/ NO custom spring rates, and i'm sick of them. Car doesn't perform great at all (i would expect better thats all) I'll most likely go with the KW V1, The V2 and V3 is not available for my car.

bcrdukes 11-07-2014 09:38 AM

What kind of springs are you running right now? If stock, it will be cushy and not as stiff to your liking. You may also want to look into having your suspension components freshened up i.e. bushings, control arms, end links etc.

And which car is this?

E-SPEC 11-07-2014 10:21 AM

99-03 TL. Ground control coil sleeves (which uses an Eibach spring) and Koni Yellow shocks.

bcrdukes 11-07-2014 10:25 AM

Before you pour in a thousand or so into getting KWs, you may want give Eibach a call and see if they can recommend a higher spring rate that is compatible with the kit for your car.

I'm confident if you tell them how the car is now and what you're looking for, they will have a product for you.

EvoFire 11-07-2014 11:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by E-SPEC (Post 8553752)
Thanks. i have currently the Ground Control / Koni yellow setup on my car w/ NO custom spring rates, and i'm sick of them. Car doesn't perform great at all (i would expect better thats all) I'll most likely go with the KW V1, The V2 and V3 is not available for my car.

What car is this for? I would be almost certain you'll be happier with GC/Koni over BC, though you don't seem too thrilled with them.

I find it interesting that the GC/Koni setup isn't working for you. For my platform(MS3) we just finished development on a GC/Koni setup and the Eibach springs for it are supposed to be matched to the shocks. We can also specify heavier spring rates and the shocks would be valved to match the rates.

And for more info on the KW, their philosophy is that spring rates don't matter, rather its the damping that matters. To the point that they don't usually disclose spring rates, but people have their best guesses as to what they might be. I do know that you can have the coilovers disassembled and put in your own springs at a custom rate, you can also order custom rates from them. I've heard really good things about people using Swift springs from Japan or Hyperco in their coils.

bcrdukes 11-07-2014 12:08 PM

The coilover kit for OPs car (Acura TL MY99-03) comes with basic performance springs that don't compromise daily driving. I can only assume OP drives a bit more spirited so the handling is in question where the springs may be too soft. He may be better off consulting with Eibach to see if they have a different spring rate that will work with his kit.

EvoFire - Where does KW publish that spring rates don't matter but dampening does? I'm not questioning what you posted, but moreso if KW is actually serious about their claim.

EvoFire 11-07-2014 01:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bcrdukes (Post 8553825)
The coilover kit for OPs car (Acura TL MY99-03) comes with basic performance springs that don't compromise daily driving. I can only assume OP drives a bit more spirited so the handling is in question where the springs may be too soft. He may be better off consulting with Eibach to see if they have a different spring rate that will work with his kit.

EvoFire - Where does KW publish that spring rates don't matter but dampening does? I'm not questioning what you posted, but moreso if KW is actually serious about their claim.

Don't remember honestly, but I've read it multiple times, and I'd have to dig it out for you. I think I might have worded that wrong, probably better if it was stated this way: "They believe the spring rates they have chosen are correct and the end user don't stand to gain much changing it around." I'd have to dig for it and I can't remember right off the top of my head.

E-SPEC 11-07-2014 01:31 PM

See the thing that is bothering me so much is the fact KW V1 do NOT come with dampening control. I wish i knew how soft/stiff they are before i buy them, YES BCRDUKES i do sometimes like to drive a little hard on rare occasions. My current susp rather sucks IMO when trying to hit a corner at a fun speed. And especially the rear has too much travel. garageFive wasn't very helpful in terms of different options i could have done ie. Spring rates, top hats. They used my stock top hats which are pretty much obliterated now, fuck sakes..lol. Also i'm running some wide wheels also 19x10 +30 in the rear, and plan on getting some wide squared setup of 19's in future, so i want minimal suspension travel.

bcrdukes 11-07-2014 03:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EvoFire (Post 8553841)
Don't remember honestly, but I've read it multiple times, and I'd have to dig it out for you. I think I might have worded that wrong, probably better if it was stated this way: "They believe the spring rates they have chosen are correct and the end user don't stand to gain much changing it around." I'd have to dig for it and I can't remember right off the top of my head.

Ah, okay. That makes sense. It goes back to my original post where a high quality coilover will be valved properly to work with a bunch of different spring rates. Any high end coilover should be able to accept softer or stiffer springs. Companies like KW etc. have found the balance that will suit everybody's needs. If KW really did not believe in the spring rates and solely depended on dampening, then I'd have to question that! :toot:

@E-Spec

Do you know what dampening is for and what its purpose is? If not, you shouldn't factor it as a solution to your problem. Your Koni Yellows already have it.

As I said before, call Eibach up. A bunch of your worries will be resolved when you speak to their techs - 1-800-507-2338. Garage 5 won't be able to help you. They aren't suspension specialists.

EvoFire 11-07-2014 08:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by E-SPEC (Post 8553853)
See the thing that is bothering me so much is the fact KW V1 do NOT come with dampening control. I wish i knew how soft/stiff they are before i buy them, YES BCRDUKES i do sometimes like to drive a little hard on rare occasions. My current susp rather sucks IMO when trying to hit a corner at a fun speed. And especially the rear has too much travel. garageFive wasn't very helpful in terms of different options i could have done ie. Spring rates, top hats. They used my stock top hats which are pretty much obliterated now, fuck sakes..lol. Also i'm running some wide wheels also 19x10 +30 in the rear, and plan on getting some wide squared setup of 19's in future, so i want minimal suspension travel.

I've never heard of people complaining about too much travel. I have not enough travel on my car and I would be very happy for another inch.

Did you ever try turning your Koni's to full stiff? Or are they already full stiff? If you shorten the travel, the car will just behave unpredictably when you drive aggressively.

bcrdukes 11-07-2014 09:36 PM

You should not set any adjustable shock or coilover to full soft or stiff - it will shorten the lifespan of it and also not perform ideally.

Travel is necessary in a proper suspension setup. I think in OPs case, the springs are simply not stiff enough for his driving style. That and it's not a new car; suspension components probably need to be refreshed.

Bonka 11-07-2014 11:25 PM

Koni Yellows are the best affordable off-the-shelf damper available and even their dampening adjustments are not linear. Dial locked on full stiff on one damper will probably mean 3/4 stiff dial locked on the other.

Since you already have a good base to start with and it sounds like you're stancing your TL; high spring rates (probably at least 10-12k springs) and re-valved dampers are what you want as the Yellows are only rebound adjustable. You still want suspension travel so if the Yellows can't cut it whatever new coilover setup you use (obviously with shorter damper bodies) you'll still want higher spring rates and a re-valve.

Dumped and stiff on a family sedan realize you are sacrificing a ton of handling for street use.

ncrx 11-08-2014 12:18 AM

your stanced 19x10's which probably have all kinds of fk'd up offset

have messed with your scrub kpi and endless proper alignment settings are now thrown out the window and the fact your rear's are wider on a fwd car wtf?

on top of that, you're likely mistaking too much rear travel with lack of spring rate and roll. im guessing you're dumped to the ground on unknown soft rates, and not running a rear sway bar
*also, your stock hats are fine, what you're probably hearing is a clunking sound, this is a dead shock from being overly dumped / bottomed out repeatedly. get your yellows sent back to koni for warranty just dont tell them its been dumped. you need more travel, and more spring if u want to run that low.

its not so much as your suspension that makes your car handle poorly, its your choice of form over function, and outright lack of suspension knowledge

i have also driven on a number of vehicles with shocks that cost 1500$ a corner alone. and also on bc coils and the like
the yellows are half decent from a cost performance point of view

besides i have driven an ek sir with koni yellows, gc top hats and coils. it handles great in my opinion.
i've driven on these on a mildly stc prepped ef civic, and set fastest time of day at the ubc enduro
i've had them on an old crx si ive had in the past

u dont have to take my opinion, i've won ubcscc slush index group, street touring group with vcmc, won the novice cup with vcmc, placed 2nd at packwood national tour, placed 3rd at canadian nationals in sts


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