[Harvey Specter]

More than $2,000 a month for day care. Some of the highest phone bills in the country. Jam-packed, 50-plus-minute commutes to work.

You knew it was tough to live in New York City — but this tough?

A new report shows just how ugly — and expensive — New York City can be, especially for the middle class, squeezed by skyrocketing living costs and stagnant wages.

The study, released Thursday by the Center for an Urban Future, shows that New York City is hands-down the most expensive place to live in the country.

Among the findings:

A New Yorker would have to make $123,322 a year to have the same standard of living as someone making $50,000 in Houston.
In Manhattan, a $60,000 salary is equivalent to someone making $26,092 in Atlanta.
You knew it was expensive to live in Manhattan, but Queens? The report tagged Queens the fifth most expensive urban area in the country.
The average monthly rent in New York is $2,801, 53% higher than San Francisco, the second most expensive city in the country.
“Income levels that would enable a very comfortable lifestyle in other locales barely suffice to provide the basics in New York City,” the report concludes.

Other belt-tightening details include:

New Yorkers paid about $34 a month for phone service in 2006. In San Francisco, similar service cost $17 a month.
Home heating costs have jumped 125% in the past five years and are up 243% since 1998.
Full-time day care costs can run up to $25,000 a year for one child, depending on the neighborhood, or about as much as some college tuitions.
Meanwhile, wages in the city have remained mostly flat in all boroughs but Manhattan — even during the boom years from 2003 to 2007.
It’s not only money that makes life here hard, researchers said — which might not be news to most New Yorkers.

Take commutes, for example. The report found that many New Yorkers put up with commutes double the national average of 25.5 minutes.

Commuting to Manhattan from St. Albans, Queens, can take 51.7 minutes, while getting there from Canarsie, Brooklyn, can run 50.8 minutes.

Researchers said the combination of skyrocketing costs, stagnant wages and a deteriorating quality of life forced hundreds of thousands of New Yorkers to flee the city for cheaper areas during the boom years from 2002 to 2006.

The report found that more New Yorkers left each year during the boom than left during the dark days of the early 1990s.

Center for Urban Future Director Jonathan Bowles noted that the number of people fleeing the city has slowed since 2007 as the rest of the country has sunk into recession, jobs have dried up nationwide and home values here started to sink.

Mayor Bloomberg downplayed the report but said he is concerned about the constant drumbeat of job losses in the city.

“There is turnover all the time. That’s very healthy,” Bloomberg said. “We’re doing fine, but it is very worrisome, the number of people who are losing their jobs.”.

[willystyle]

Nevermind.

[yson_3]

34 a month for phone service? thats still a lot cheaper then what myself and all my friends have been paying!

[E=mc²]

lol
unless you have a data plan, paying $35+ is expensive man
milk the carriers for all they're worth, negotiate with the retention department, or try to find a store that can put you on a corporate plan.

None of my friends who know what they're doing are paying more than $30 after taxes for their phone plans. I'm paying around $25.

Of course if you have a data plan it'l be more expensive, but the voice portion shouldn't be that expensive (i'm referring to minutes, SMS, and mobile browser )

[slammer111]

^ What plan are you on? Please do tell :)

[b-dub]

wtf?
i'm paying 100+ bucks for my plan

City fido - $50
3G plan - $30
Visual voicemail bundle - $15
+ various fee and tax.

[Good_KarMa]

If i can make it in New York, i can make it anywhere!

[achiam]

Prime property in Vancouver is still nowhere close to that of major world cities. I really don't know what those silly reporters were thinking writing that Vancouver was one of the most expensive in the world.
Most would agree that an extreme house in Vancouver would be over $10M CAD, but in London or NYC there are whole areas where that's the norm.

[nipples]

yeah but the states has much much cheaper cell phone plans than us in canada.
after talking with all my friends here from the states and realizing that they don't have roaming....i was choked.

i think i roam even when i go to like whistler!

and my cell phone here right now is cheaper than i paid in vancouver...despite having to pay the foreigner penalty prices!!

[Mancini]

They didn't specify mobile phone service. I think the pricing is for a land line.

[micbain]

Prime property in Vancouver is still nowhere close to that of major world cities. I really don't know what those silly reporters were thinking writing that Vancouver was one of the most expensive in the world.
Most would agree that an extreme house in Vancouver would be over $10M CAD, but in London or NYC there are whole areas where that's the norm.

Because vancouver is expensive when you compare median income to median house prices. This is a standard metric used to measure affordability.

Saying middle class in NY at $123k is just sensationalism...yes middle class is $123k but you get paid more to work in NY to factor in cost of living. Even a doorman makes $50k.

If you're in the market for $10m homes, then yah vancouver probably isn't an expensive city...but for the rest of us working folk, a $10m home is a fantasy and is in no way a realistic way of determining if a city is affordable.

[jigga250]

an extreme house in Vancouver would be over $10M CAD, but in London or NYC there are whole areas where that's the norm.


no there aren't

obviously bigger cities will have larger numbers of 10+ million houses, but there aren't any significant areas where "thats the norm"

[hotjoint]

wtf?
i'm paying 100+ bucks for my plan

City fido - $50
3G plan - $30
Visual voicemail bundle - $15
+ various fee and tax.

damn you gettin jacked,

I pay around 60 ish for mine

$17.50 Epp plan
200 daytime minutes
Free weekends and evening after 6pm

$30 Iphone Essentials Data Plan
500 Mb data
10,000 text mesages
caller id
Visual voicemail

My plan is the best :thumbsup:

[yson_3]

damn you gettin jacked,

I pay around 60 ish for mine

$17.50 Epp plan
200 daytime minutes
Free weekends and evening after 6pm

$30 Iphone Essentials Data Plan
500 Mb data
10,000 text mesages
caller id
Visual voicemail

My plan is the best :thumbsup:

while you get 200 minutes. he gets unlimited.

it all depends on what you need and actually want. If 200 minutes + unl e+w are enough, then great. but for a lot of phone users - they'll be far over that amount in no time.

[woozzle]

they live in New Jersey

[hotjoint]

while you get 200 minutes. he gets unlimited.

it all depends on what you need and actually want. If 200 minutes + unl e+w are enough, then great. but for a lot of phone users - they'll be far over that amount in no time.

thats true, I barely ever use my phone so 200 daytime mins are more then enough for me

[Eastwood]

What's teh most expensive: Victoria, Vancouver, or Kelowna?

I always thought Kelowna was teh most expensive in BC.

[BoneThug]

i use to commute 50 mins to work all the time. wasn't even that bad. grab a coffee and and a book, newspaper or mp3 player and you're set.

[Meowjin]

Prime property in Vancouver is still nowhere close to that of major world cities. I really don't know what those silly reporters were thinking writing that Vancouver was one of the most expensive in the world.
Most would agree that an extreme house in Vancouver would be over $10M CAD, but in London or NYC there are whole areas where that's the norm.

we make shit wage here.

[BoneThug]

we make shit wage here.

never post again so that your post count can stay the same.

[3xta]

they didn't cover food costs?

[CivicBlues]

Sounds like sensationalist journalism again in a climate of "bad news is the only news".

It's not really fair to compare the "average" monthly rent for New yorkers when there are obviously huge differences between high rent penthouses and the low rent controlled boxes some people in the city pay that'll skew the results. A better indicator would be the median rent and the median commute times. Come on, basic statistics 101 people!!

Oh and the fact that many NYCers do get paid NYC wages, whereas here in Vancouver we get paid Houston-type wages to cover San Francisco-type expenses.

[Synaptik]

Oh and the fact that many NYCers do get paid NYC wages, whereas here in Vancouver we get paid Houston-type wages to cover San Francisco-type expenses.

QFT.

This is why we're ranked high on least affordable, not on most expensive. Affordability is relative to wages, expensiveness is an absolute value.

[Nocardia]

Sounds like sensationalist journalism again in a climate of "bad news is the only news".

It's not really fair to compare the "average" monthly rent for New yorkers when there are obviously huge differences between high rent penthouses and the low rent controlled boxes some people in the city pay that'll skew the results. A better indicator would be the median rent and the median commute times. Come on, basic statistics 101 people!!

Oh and the fact that many NYCers do get paid NYC wages, whereas here in Vancouver we get paid Houston-type wages to cover San Francisco-type expenses.

good to hear people still use common sense before they believe what they read.

[wouwou]

Sounds like sensationalist journalism again in a climate of "bad news is the only news".

It's not really fair to compare the "average" monthly rent for New yorkers when there are obviously huge differences between high rent penthouses and the low rent controlled boxes some people in the city pay that'll skew the results. A better indicator would be the median rent and the median commute times. Come on, basic statistics 101 people!!

Oh and the fact that many NYCers do get paid NYC wages, whereas here in Vancouver we get paid Houston-type wages to cover San Francisco-type expenses.

nicely put

now only if someone came in and claim all the high NYC costs are coming from immigration and as a result only natives should stay

:haha:

[bcrdukes]

Suckers. My wireless phone plans are free.

[racerman88]

property prices in Manhattan are $$$.
Cell phone plans are better in the USA. Got to love the roll over minutes every month, not just for one month.

[E=mc²]

^ What plan are you on? Please do tell :)

SFU plan + Retentions add-ons
300 mins
6pm E/W
500 SMS
unlimited mobile browser
Bell to bell
SAF +911 included

$25ish after taxes

nowhere near the best but beats 90% of the plans out there (unless you're lucky and get put onto the enbridge plan which is seriously insane)
That, plus the mobile browser is compatible with the HTC TOUCH (only smartphone from bell that can use the mobile browser in place of a data plan) + unlocked the Touch + installed a custom ROM making it much smoother faster, better UI = major WIN

damn you gettin jacked,

I pay around 60 ish for mine

$17.50 Epp plan
200 daytime minutes
Free weekends and evening after 6pm

$30 Iphone Essentials Data Plan
500 Mb data
10,000 text mesages
caller id
Visual voicemail

My plan is the best :thumbsup:

Pretty good too. The only reason I'm sticking with bell is because of my plan and the htc touch.

wtf?
i'm paying 100+ bucks for my plan

City fido - $50
3G plan - $30
Visual voicemail bundle - $15
+ various fee and tax.

nothing wrong with this. City Fido is a crazy deal assuming you actually use a lot of daytime minutes. If you don't then maybe not so much....really depends anyway. I don't use daytime minutes that much so 300 + bell 2 bell is enough for me.




Suckers. My wireless phone plans are free.

how so
you work for one of the carriers or something?


Anyway, definitely try to milk your phone company for all they're worth. I'm pretty amazed at some of the retention plans I've seen from either redflagdeals or howardforums where people post their plans. sick sh*t

[E=mc²]

yeah but the states has much much cheaper cell phone plans than us in canada.



The only thing the US have over us IMO is the fact that domestic long distance is free, and possibly caller ID/voicemail included in all plans.
If you're a student or looking for a plan under $30 it might be kinda hard.

e.g Verizon's cheapest indiv plan starts at $40.
compare that to a corporate plan or retentions plan where you could get more for the same price, or the same features (minus the free LD) for $10 cheaper or even more.

bottom line, screw consumer plans, we have retentions/corp plans. the US don't.

[int36ra]

There was a listing of median income:housing prices posted sometime last week and Vancouver was number 3 where as NYC was either 7 or 8.


Housing prices in Zimbabwe are in the trillions!111 omgawd we'd never be able to afford /endsarcasm

[CivicBlues]

LOL only on Revscene does a discussion about international living costs turn into a phone plan pissing match. Talk about penny-wise, pound-foolish:lol

[hk20000]

it's all about that damned cell phone man.

[skholla]

it's all about that damned cell phone man.

the report probably wasn't even talking about cellphones... all it said was "phone service", this most likely refers to a land line. $17-34 a month sounds about right when compared to shaw or telus phone offerings.

[bcrdukes]

:lol @ this thread.

/failsauce

[Chuck Norris]

There should be an IQ test before your account is approved for posting.

The bright side is I feel much more intelligent after looking at how dumb so many people on here are.

I've worked in both Boston and New York. If you're a hard working, intelligent person, the opportunity to make significantly more money in large cities such as Boston, New York and London over little villages like Vancouver are immense.

After you take into account the cost of income tax, property tax, sales tax and lack of tax savings tools in Vancouver versus the cost of living and the opportunity to make money, it becomes very clear that we are a joke on the global scale and significantly over priced.

Many native born and raised Canadians complain about the 'rich Asians' coming from Hong Kong and Korea. This is because while those parts of the world are more expensive, the amount of money that can be made there is astronomical compared to Vancouver.

The only market Vancouver has is construction and Real Estate, a dangerously concentrated market that functions like a self propelled suicide machine.

Vancouver is a great place to retire, it's a horrible place to make a future.

[bengy]

I find it funny this guy is comparing a city like New York to Vancouver, but you need a high double digit salary or six figures to live comfortably here too.

[brokentelephone]

no there aren't

obviously bigger cities will have larger numbers of 10+ million houses, but there aren't any significant areas where "thats the norm"

Like achiam, I live in London. Speaking in Canadian dollars, there are entire areas with average home prices in the 10 million dollar range. Of course, some buildings are broken up into smaller flats (a rarity), but the average house in Belgravia/Mayfair would exceed 10 million dollars cdn, easily.

In my area, most large homes were rezoned ages ago with 1,000sq apartments going for roughly £1,000,000. In the proper 'posh' areas, there was no such redevelopment, and most homes go loads of cash.

Don't be a pen15 and make assumptions about things you know nothing about.

[Noir]

:lol @ this thread.

/failsauce

Uhh, you were one of the participants of the phone plan pissing match.

Suckers. My wireless phone plans are free.

[bcrdukes]

^
You take my posts far too seriously. Relax. It's only Monday. Lets' go have a beer. :)

[SlySi]

I find it funny this guy is comparing a city like New York to Vancouver, but you need a high double digit salary or six figures to live comfortably here too.

Exactly...
You need 6 figures in Vancouver to be middle class these days as well..

[hotjoint]

SFU plan + Retentions add-ons
300 mins
6pm E/W
500 SMS
unlimited mobile browser
Bell to bell
SAF +911 included

$25ish after taxes



nice thats a dope plan. Wish I could get everything I currently have for $25ish a month

[achiam]

no there aren't

obviously bigger cities will have larger numbers of 10+ million houses, but there aren't any significant areas where "thats the norm"

Where are you referring to?
I really hope you're not speaking of Chelsea in London, or the Upper East Side in Manhattan, or the Peak in Hong Kong.

[achiam]

What's teh most expensive: Victoria, Vancouver, or Kelowna?

I always thought Kelowna was teh most expensive in BC.

I believe the record was a Whistler condo in 2004. It was listed for $26M but was sold to an American family for $22M.
The other really expensive property that usually peaks for Greater Vancouver is the massive house on Celtic Avenue in the Southlands. Its ownership has changed several times in the past 5 years but has consistently sold for between $19M to I believe $22M.

[achiam]

There should be an IQ test before your account is approved for posting.

The bright side is I feel much more intelligent after looking at how dumb so many people on here are.

I've worked in both Boston and New York. If you're a hard working, intelligent person, the opportunity to make significantly more money in large cities such as Boston, New York and London over little villages like Vancouver are immense.

After you take into account the cost of income tax, property tax, sales tax and lack of tax savings tools in Vancouver versus the cost of living and the opportunity to make money, it becomes very clear that we are a joke on the global scale and significantly over priced.

Many native born and raised Canadians complain about the 'rich Asians' coming from Hong Kong and Korea. This is because while those parts of the world are more expensive, the amount of money that can be made there is astronomical compared to Vancouver.

Vancouver is a great place to retire, it's a horrible place to make a future.

Completely agree. My only advice to people in Vancouver is to get the fuck out when you're still young. Save up a stash, and move to a big world city.
Everytime I go back to Vancouver, my friends are STILL doing the same shit jobs, and nothing ever changes.

[Synaptik]

I can't wait for the economy to improve so I can head to a real financial centre like NYC, London, or HK. Vancouver is just embarrassing as a job market for finance people.