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http://www.ctvbc.ctv.ca/servlet/an/local/CTVNews/20090214/BC_ICBC_Sells_Car_090214/20090214/?hub=BritishColumbiaHome

Updated: Sat Feb. 14 2009 18:59:52

ctvbc.ca

http://images.ctv.ca/archives/CTVNews/img2/20090214/160_BC_Car_After_090214.jpg










A Langley family is angry they're out a car and thousands of dollars in insurance after the Insurance Corporation of B.C. sold their car without their consent.




Brendan Lillies, 19, wanted to fix his 1992 Acura Integra after it was rear-ended -- but ICBC sold the car for scrap, and despite a four-month protracted dispute, still hasn't settled with the family.




"[A reasonable person] would go to the police and report the car stolen," said Brendan's dad, Charlie Lillies.




After being contacted by CTV News, ICBC apologized to the family.




"In this case we made an error," said ICBC's Adam Grossman. "We acknowledge it and we're doing everything we can to make that up with the customer."




In the accident, Brendan was hit from behind and then pushed into a car in front of him. The at-fault driver fled -- and ICBC assigned fault to Brendan.




ICBC said they would pay $2700 for the car, even though only days before Brendan had put in a new engine, rims and tires worth more than $3000. That, combined with the value of the car itself, should total more than $6000, said the Lillies.




That's when Brendan's dad Charlie decided the family would pay out the claim and just fix the car themselves.




"We asked for the vehicle back, and they said, 'Sorry, the vehicle's been sold. You can't get the car back,'" said Charlie.




Even though they didn't sign a salvage waiver -- the paperwork that transfers the ownership from Brendan to ICBC -- ICBC had already sold the car.

That was months ago -- but ICBC kept charging Brendan for his insurance premiums. When Brendan tried to get a refund for the premiums, his dad says a clerk demanded that he sign the salvage waiver after the fact.




"It's just a lesson," said Charlie. "Do your homework before you make a claim -- they're not going to do it for you. They'll take advantage of someone who's just a young guy."




When ICBC writes off a car they sell it to a salvage yard, who sell it for parts. The Lillies tracked down the Acura to a salvage lot in Surrey, where they found its engine had been stripped, its rims and tires were gone, and there wasn't much left.




"I'm a bit angry about it," said Brendan. "It's not like I can walk across the street to my neighbour's house, grab his keys, throw his truck on Craigslist and sell it."




ICBC has made a new offer on the car, but only increased their offer by $600. That's not enough, say the Lillies.




"We want the cost of a comparable car," said Charlie. "Branden's been without a vehicle for going on five months now. For us it's absolutely frustrating because he doesn't have the money to get another vehicle."


With a report from CTV British Columbia's Jon Woodward

[thumper]

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[CanadaGoose]

fuck icbc

[dai3yuen]

Adding a new engine and rims and tires won't increase the value of a car by $3000. :rolleyes:

[tiger_handheld]

its just the replacement costs. icbc should give 2700+ cost of engine + rims provided he has receipts for those! + refund his premium. that would be the right thing to do!

[Rich Sandor]

wow. major screwup by ICBC.

They should re-imburse 100% of the insurance paid by Brendan while the car was at ICBC, and they should reimburse him for the costs of the aftermarket parts that he should have been able to sell seperately if he got the car back, and also the value of the slightly damaged car.

edit: tiger beat me to it.

[InvisibleSoul]

Wow. He got screwed over nicely.

[hk20000]

hahahah it's a 1992 Integra it shouldn't be difficult for ICBC to source another one and give them back a working piece for less than $2700

that would show some gesture.

[Volvo-brickster]

"In the accident, Brendan was hit from behind and then pushed into a car in front of him. The at-fault driver fled -- and ICBC assigned fault to Brendan. "

brutal. absolutely brutal.

[twitchyzero]

poor guy
got rear-ended in a hit and run accident (who knows..maybe even whip-lash since his front got fucked too)
then probably spent all his pay cheque for new parts
then gets it all ripped away from ICBC

[elyk]

so the back of his car is hit and damaged but ICBC calls it his fault? idiots

[JesseBlue]

icbc probably call him ramming the car in front of him as his fault...f*ck icbc turning a blind eye...especially if it was pretty evident

[phatpower]

count on ICBC to to something like that..

it looks like ICBC is making a lot of mistakes lately...

[El Bastardo]

ICBC will probably give him an even $3000 and call it even

[Kilinim]

those capitalist bastards

[thumper]

when i first saw this, i thought this could easily be one of many of us here on RS :(

this part still chaps me the most :flamemad: :

Even though they didn't sign a salvage waiver -- the paperwork that transfers the ownership from Brendan to ICBC -- ICBC had already sold the car.

That was months ago -- but ICBC kept charging Brendan for his insurance premiums. When Brendan tried to get a refund for the premiums, his dad says a clerk demanded that he sign the salvage waiver after the fact.


fighting icbc in court... it could take years?

[2damaxmr2]

icbc FTL

[!Aznboi128]

Adding a new engine and rims and tires won't increase the value of a car by $3000. :rolleyes:

maybe its a k24 with 24" dubs

[phatpower]

the cars at westwood auto wreckers

[JSALES]

fucking icbc

[Mancini]

The adjuster likely suspected that the claimant wouldn't want the car back and thought he/she was being efficient by selling the car in advance. It amounts to theft by error.

What strikes me as more sinister is holding the entire reimbursement hostage, in the absence of a more reasonable offer, without signing a retroactive salvage waiver.

I also thought ICBC was required to refund prorated premium despite the existence of a claim. Perhaps the fact that the claim isn't settled is a factor. Still, given the circumstances, this just adds to the calamity of errors and injustice.

When you screw up this badly you need to make amends. Give the kid market value, plus the cost of his recent work. This would be a sign of good faith and, in light of the error(s), no further justification is required.

[phatpower]

they should but you know as well as I do they will not. They need to make a profit BOTTOM LINE

[greendb7]

maybe its a k24 with 24" dubs

LOL that's what I was thinking too, minus the dubs..maybe some nice Volks or something haha

[orange7]

damn.. sometimes i wonder if it's even worth not buying the most basic insurance? I mean, ICBC might not even cover what's suppose to be covered..

why am i paying the extra for insurance when ICBC will probably screw me over when accidents happen...

[ericthehalfbee]

its just the replacement costs. icbc should give 2700+ cost of engine + rims provided he has receipts for those! + refund his premium. that would be the right thing to do!Why should he get the value of the engine?

If I have a $2,000 car, and the engine is worn out and I put in another engine, the car is still only worth $2,000. I doubt he put in a "brand new" engine - it was probably another used engine from a similar car. In fact, since he admits to paying $3,000 for the engine, wheels and tires this shows it wasn't some high-performance or "special" engine - it was just the going rate for a used engine from a wrecker to match his vehicle.

ICBC doesn't give out extra money if you happened to repair your car just before an accident. I see this all the time where someone drops $1,000 on a new brake job, then writes the car off. ICBC sure as hell won't give you back the $1,000 for the brakes. Therefore they shouldn't give the money back for the engine.

There's more to this regarding the rear-ender as well. If the at fault driver fled, then the driver of the first vehicle should have been a witness to this fact. It's only in cases of hit & run where there are no witnesses that the person getting hit is assigned fault, since there's no "evidence". It's easy for the first driver to know: did he hear a bang and then fell the impact, or did he feel the impact and then hear another bang.


But hey, it's fun to pick on ICBC cuz their the big bad suits out to fuck the little guy over. In my dealings with ICBC I see people getting what they deserve, and many more getting even more than they deserve. This guy is fucking whining over a mistake ICBC made on some PSO fucking junk car. This kinda stuff makes the news?

[MegaMx]

Adding a new engine and rims and tires won't increase the value of a car by $3000. :rolleyes:
x2
its just the replacement costs. icbc should give 2700+ cost of engine + rims provided he has receipts for those! + refund his premium. that would be the right thing to do!
Why?? $2700 is for the same car like that that works. I doubt he put in a '08 engine, it's a engine out of another car that "works" so it should be cars + rims (proof of rims cost) as I have a feeling they're only worth a few hundred.

$2700 is more than the average '92 integra on craigslist.

[racerman88]

ICBC did screw up though

[Mancini]

Why?? $2700 is for the same car like that that works. I doubt he put in a '08 engine, it's a engine out of another car that "works" so it should be cars + rims (proof of rims cost) as I have a feeling they're only worth a few hundred.

$2700 is more than the average '92 integra on craigslist.

Good point.

[Lomac]

Why should he get the value of the engine?

If I have a $2,000 car, and the engine is worn out and I put in another engine, the car is still only worth $2,000. I doubt he put in a "brand new" engine - it was probably another used engine from a similar car. In fact, since he admits to paying $3,000 for the engine, wheels and tires this shows it wasn't some high-performance or "special" engine - it was just the going rate for a used engine from a wrecker to match his vehicle.

ICBC doesn't give out extra money if you happened to repair your car just before an accident. I see this all the time where someone drops $1,000 on a new brake job, then writes the car off. ICBC sure as hell won't give you back the $1,000 for the brakes. Therefore they shouldn't give the money back for the engine.

There's more to this regarding the rear-ender as well. If the at fault driver fled, then the driver of the first vehicle should have been a witness to this fact. It's only in cases of hit & run where there are no witnesses that the person getting hit is assigned fault, since there's no "evidence". It's easy for the first driver to know: did he hear a bang and then fell the impact, or did he feel the impact and then hear another bang.


But hey, it's fun to pick on ICBC cuz their the big bad suits out to fuck the little guy over. In my dealings with ICBC I see people getting what they deserve, and many more getting even more than they deserve. This guy is fucking whining over a mistake ICBC made on some PSO fucking junk car. This kinda stuff makes the news?

When my MX6 got written off, I submitted an entire stack of receipts, ranging from new Toyo Proxes tires (literally installed the day before the car burnt down) to a ton of engine work I had done over the past month. My adjuster took all the work I had done on modifying the engine into account and increased her offer quite substantially. They even offered 90% of the retail value of the tires on top of the offer. And while I wasn't given the amount that I put into the car, they offered so close a number that I wasn't going to complain. So no, they don't have to pay out for any work on the car, but if you state your case and have a nice adjuster, you can get paid back for a good chunk of work you've put into the car.

That said, ICBC also sold a car out from under a friend's nose after it was in an accident. He never signed the salvage waiver because he wanted to get the car back for parts. A week later he found out that it was sold to a salvage yard. Of course in this case he was offered a substantial amount for the "troubles" he was given, and not shown the run-around as it appears this other family is.

[Volvo-brickster]

come to think about it, the guy should request 4 tickets to the mens hockey finals and call it a day :p

[Soundy]

^In both cases, ICBC sold a car that they didn't hold title to... no matter what else, it amounts to theft, and should be treated accordingly.

[Mancini]

damn.. sometimes i wonder if it's even worth not buying the most basic insurance? I mean, ICBC might not even cover what's suppose to be covered..

why am i paying the extra for insurance when ICBC will probably screw me over when accidents happen...

Basic Autoplan is mandatory in BC.

It covers up to $200,000 of third party liability, accident benefits (medical & rehab) and first party coverage (uninsured & unidentified motorist protection). It does not include your collision & comprehensive.

Most of the people I've talked to that make these blanket statements typically have both collision and comprehensive, as well as more than the mandatory minimum of third party liability. If you really feel that it's a rip off then you can just get the basics for much cheaper. Your risk, your call.

Accident benefits operate on a "no fault" system, meaning ICBC will pay.

Third party liability operates on an "absolute liability" concept, meaning ICBC will pay.

Most of the disputes seem to arise from the valuation of the claim, not the fact that ICBC refuses to pay.

[tonyvu]

ICBC ARE DOUCHE BAGSSS

[InvisibleSoul]

^In both cases, ICBC sold a car that they didn't hold title to... no matter what else, it amounts to theft, and should be treated accordingly.
I guess he should report the theft to ICBC...

[MegaMx]

A week later he found out that it was sold to a salvage yard. Of course in this case he was offered a substantial amount for the "troubles" he was given, and not shown the run-around as it appears this other family is.
Big difference, the family is asking for 2x more than what the car is worth because they want to take advantage of the situation. They probably clued in that ICBC sold it under them so they can rip them off now. What ICBC offered them is fair and if they handled it properly rather than acting like PMSing high school girls I'm sure the adjuster would have been more than happy to give them a bit more. Service people react much better and are willing to do much more for you if you're nice to them.

ICBC did f*k up but then again we're all used to it by now more or less. If you're unhappy go check out the DMV, insurance and all the fiasco that happens in the US. There's no "utopia" in the car insurance world, here nor south of the border.

[jimzilla]

holy, fuck icbc!

[fetched]

Don't let ICBC get away with this.
I stole your car, i got caught, i pay you what the car's worth and nothing happens to me. Does that go well with you?
Sue ICBC for every single penny you can get out of them for doing that shit

[B-DiZzLe]

ICBC offers $600 increased from original offer, what a fuckin joke. These fuckin jew's rape every fuckin driver in BC for insurance but can't afford to fuckin pay an appropriate amount for their own fuck up, poor kid. This angers me.

[phatpower]

Don't let ICBC get away with this.
I stole your car, i got caught, i pay you what the car's worth and nothing happens to me. Does that go well with you?
Sue ICBC for every single penny you can get out of them for doing that shit

I so agree with this ICBC is a joke and should be taught a lesson :mad::mad::mad:

[MegaMx]

ICBC offers $600 increased from original offer, what a fuckin joke. These fuckin jew's rape every fuckin driver in BC for insurance but can't afford to fuckin pay an appropriate amount for their own fuck up, poor kid. This angers me.
I don't quite see why everybody is worked up over this. They already offered him over the market price and now increased it by $600 more and they're still complaining? Why does he get 30% more than his car is worth? I was thinking about selling my range rover but i guess i can just get rear ended and then expect ICBC to pay me double what it's worth so people don't get their panties up in a bunch.

They did screw up but it happens and who knows how long ICBC had to park and store the car for them before they decided to sell it. If they wanted to keep the car, why didn't get it towed back to their home right away or right after the adjuster was done with it? It took them 4+ months to find out their cars been sold? I had no idea ICBC was a free garage. Check out the insurance in the US and other parts of the world, not much better than ICBC and often a lot worse.

Get over yourselves people and your self-entitlement to a utopian world and undeserved money.

[MegaMx]

Don't let ICBC get away with this.
I stole your car, i got caught, i pay you what the car's worth and nothing happens to me. Does that go well with you?
Sue ICBC for every single penny you can get out of them for doing that shit
Yea that's exactly how it goes. Go steal a car, get caught and see what happens. You'll barely get a slap on the wrist. So better yet go steal a car that's a write-off and barely worth the tow truck fees to get it out of there and then come back and complain. I guess I forgot that all these car thieves loose so much money every time they steal a car (sarcasm :twirleye:).

[BoneThug]

"In the accident, Brendan was hit from behind and then pushed into a car in front of him. The at-fault driver fled -- and ICBC assigned fault to Brendan. "

brutal. absolutely brutal.

thats one side of the story. dont know if its what actually happened.

[fetched]

Megamx
Are you dumb?
It doesn't matter if it's a write off, doesn't matter if it's worth less than the tow truck fees, it doesn't even matter if the car is undrivable.
It's the principle that ICBC broke by selling the car before any waiver/consent was signed, and it doesn't matter what the car is worth in your eyes, because you are not the owner. In this case, ICBC should pay whatever value the car was worth in the owners eye, up to 2x the market value i guess is perfectly fair.

I'm going to steal your car tomorrow, return it to you without the engine and strip the shit out of it, give you what I THINK the car's worth, and tell you to fuck off. But then shit doesn't work that way in the real world, you'll probably call the cops, they'll find me and arrest me. Charge me for PSP, go to jail, have court date, and get bum fucked in jail while i wait for my trial. I guess big corporations like ICBC have supporters like you, who pays ICBC huge premiums each month to have them rape you when that day comes.


Show ICBC your post and they'll probably hire pricks like you. Have no respect for the law and for consumer confidence

[MegaMx]

Megamx
Are you dumb?
It doesn't matter if it's a write off, doesn't matter if it's worth less than the tow truck fees, it doesn't even matter if the car is undrivable.
It's the principle that ICBC broke by selling the car before any waiver/consent was signed, and it doesn't matter what the car is worth in your eyes, because you are not the owner. In this case, ICBC should pay whatever value the car was worth in the owners eye, up to 2x the market value i guess is perfectly fair.
No but it's obvious you are. The justice system does not pay for "what it's worth to you" otherwise next time I have a thief break into my car, steal my radio, then sell it and I catch him, I'll sue him for millions because it was my first radio ever and that's what it's worth to me. If he offers me 30% more than it's worth I guess I'll tell him to fuck off and pay me a shitload more. If you're paying people based on sentimental value how come I can't sue somebody who rear-ends me because it's no longer mint and for me my car mint is worth 100x more?

I'm going to steal your car tomorrow, return it to you without the engine and strip the shit out of it, give you what I THINK the car's worth, and tell you to fuck off. But then shit doesn't work that way in the real world, you'll probably call the cops, they'll find me and arrest me. Charge me for PSP, go to jail, have court date, and get bum fucked in jail while i wait for my trial. I guess big corporations like ICBC have supporters like you, who pays ICBC huge premiums each month to have them rape you when that day comes.
Can I nominate this for stupid post of the year? They're not giving him what they think it's worth, they're giving him ABOVE market value for a object. Can a '92 integra that's been compeltely wrecked at somebody else's fault (or even his own) really hold that much sentimental value? Also how did ICBC rape him? His car got totaled and they're giving him more money than it was worth? Also how come in your scenario where you steal my car you're not talking about financial compensation of what the car is worth to me which is your entire premise for the argument?


Show ICBC your post and they'll probably hire pricks like you. Have no respect for the law and for consumer confidence
First of all, :2finger:, I've been ripped off by ICBC before by getting blamed for a accident that wasn't my fault. It doesn't make me loose judgement in anger and being a fucking hippie and "sticking it to the man" so don't tell me I'm a huge fan of theirs. I'm just saying they made a mistake in paperwork and who knows the other side of the story. Did they never pick it up from ICBC or were they trying the entire time to pick it up? If you crash your car in front of my house and park it on my lawn for months on end, I'll sell it and tell you to fuck off when you ask me for the money. Everybody wants to sue ICBC over everything. It's a totaled piece of shit car that's barely worth $500 in scraps and they're paying him 30% more than it's worth to replace with a mint working one.

ICBC did fuck up by selling it before it's signed but that's an accident and overlooked not a intentional criminal action.

[fetched]

No but it's obvious you are. The justice system does not pay for "what it's worth to you" otherwise next time I had a thief break into my car, steal my radio, then sold it and I caught him, it could be worth millions to me because it was my first radio ever. If you're paying people based on sentimental value how come I can't sue somebody who rear-ends me because it's no longer mint and for me my car mint is worth millions?


Can I nominate this for stupid post of the year? They're not giving him what they think it's worth, they're giving him ABOVE market value for a object, can a '92 integra really hold that much sentimental value? How did ICBC rape him? His car got totaled and they're giving him more money than it was worth? Also how come in your scenario where you steal my car you're not talking about financial compensation of what the car is worth to me?



It's fucks like you the reason why we have to pay the premiums. Everybody wants to sue ICBC over everything. It's a totaled piece of shit car that's barely worth $500 in scraps and they're paying him 30% more than it's worth to replace.

ICBC did fuck up by selling it before it's signed but that's an accident and overlooked not a intentional criminal action.

Too bad it wasn't a thief, it's ICBC. ICBC of course arn't going to charge their adjuster or whoever responsible to take the blame, so the rightful way to solve this issue is to repay the sentimental value of the car to the owner up to 2x the market price or whatever the judge feels appropriate.
We trust ICBC to safeguard our future in case of an accident or stolen property, and for them to do the opposite of what their suppose to do, the owner has the gounds to sue them for everything from the payout and compensation for BREAKING THE LAW.
It's fucks like you that doesn't understand the underlying problem with this incident, this incident has nothing to do with our premiums as he has a legit reason to sue ICBC for whats rightfully theirs.
It is an accident, but also a criminal action, intentional or not, if ICBC isn't going to man up and pay what the owner thinks of what the car's worth, then a lawsuit is reasonable under the grounds that ICBC FUCKED UP. Will ICBC give you leniency if you do something that is not included in your policy such as driving drunk or not wearing a seat belt? No, they will not, they will adjust their payout accordingly to the circumstances. In this case, they have to adjust their payout to the circumstance the owner of the vehicle experienced, and the mistake that they made.

PS: A thief = Someone that jacks your car.
ICBC = You pay them alot to jack your car. Therefore a bigger payout is necessary hence my point. I did not say anything about the payout being absurd, neither did the owner of the vehicle, they simply wanted 2x the value of the car which is under reasonable grounds, and of course the final settlement will probably be somewhere in the middle of those two numbers.

[MegaMx]

Too bad it wasn't a thief, it's ICBC. ICBC of course arn't going to charge their adjuster or whoever responsible to take the blame, so the rightful way to solve this issue is to repay the sentimental value of the car to the owner up to 2x the market price or whatever the judge feels appropriate.
We trust ICBC to safeguard our future in case of an accident or stolen property, and for them to do the opposite of what their suppose to do, the owner has the gounds to sue them for everything from the payout and compensation for BREAKING THE LAW.
It's fucks like you that doesn't understand the underlying problem with this incident, this incident has nothing to do with our premiums as he has a legit reason to sue ICBC for whats rightfully theirs.
It is an accident, but also a criminal action, intentional or not, if ICBC isn't going to man up and pay what the owner thinks of what the car's worth, then a lawsuit is reasonable under the grounds that ICBC FUCKED UP. Will ICBC give you leniency if you do something that is not included in your policy such as driving drunk or not wearing a seat belt? No, they will not, they will adjust their payout accordingly to the circumstances. In this case, they have to adjust their payout to the circumstance the owner of the vehicle experienced, and the mistake that they made.
I'm pretty sure for it to be criminal you need to prove intent. If ICBC encourages people to do this, then yes it's criminal. If it's a accident, it's not.

Tell me this, if a registry clerk short changes you on a purchase (accidentally), is that criminal?

Anyways I updated my top post and I am in NO WAY a ICBC fan. I just got to -10% instead of being a lot lower because a long time ago I got blamed for an accident that wasn't my fault (not going to get into it) but just because I dislike ICBC doesn't mean every case that comes up I'll be all for otherwise our premiums would be MUCH higher if ICBC kept on paying out people what they want or what people think it's worth. Look at the US system and then you'll be thankful you have ICBC.

Regardless, no matter what court you go to, every judge will tell you the same thing, they can't compensate on sentimental value. Why? because that opens up a whole new precedent for future cases. Sure for this car it would be only $3000 but what if it was a Ferrari that it happened to. ICBC should now pay a extra $500,000 on top of the $500,000 that it's worth? (Don't forget who pays these fees in the end, which then goes back to the rest of us starting up a new thread complaining about how our rates went up.) In other words, no matter what nubmer ICBC gets to, it sets a precedent that somebody in the future can do. So if they pay him 50% over value and tomorrow I total my Range Rover and I just ignore their letters and wait for them to sell it without my permission (keep in mind even PO Boxes will open and sell the boxes that you haven't picked up within a certain amount of time) I'll ask them for 50% more because I heard in this case that's what they did. If they try to say it was a lower amount, i'll just sue them for discrimination then (sarcasm) for even more and bring up the case in court.

[Soundy]

^The point is, the kid should have had the CHOICE to keep the car, or take the buyout from ICBC. What the car is "worth" market value is irrelevant - if YOU had just finished dumping $3000 into your car when it got smacked up, wouldn't you want the option to keep it and salvage your new parts yourself?

He wasn't given that choice; ICBC's actions were, quite frankly, fraudulent and illegal. Put bluntly, they sold a vehicle they didn't own.

[CanadaGoose]

MegaMx, i think you're missing the point...

SOundy hit the nail on the head. because mistake or not, they sold a vehicle they did not own. it's not their decision what to do with someone else's property. $3000 or $30,000....what a ridiculous mistake to be making

[Poonpee]

Sure for this car it would be only $3000 but what if it was a Ferrari that it happened to. ICBC should now pay a extra $500,000 on top of the $500,000 that it's worth? (Don't forget who pays these fees in the end, which then goes back to the rest of us starting up a new thread complaining about how our rates went up.)

So you are saying if i own a Ferrari and a Honda Civic, their insurance will be the same ?

Thats why we hate ICBC...."(Don't forget who pays these fees in the end, which then goes back to the rest of us starting up a new thread complaining about how our rates went up.)"

[FatalCloud]

icbc's at fault for sure, how much do you guys think icbc should pay then to be fair? it's hard to be on the Lillies side of things though when they're asking for over $6000, that's just ridiculous.

[J-Wangsta]

fuck icbc... total bullshit... they arent there to help you.. there are just there to do the bare minimum and/or screw you over....

[Nightwalker]

I have 0 claims over 8 years and much of that time with multiple vehicles insured. Last month I had a smash and grab on my Jeep and the window deductible was about the same cost of fixing the window ($300) so my insurance was useless.

I hope that one day when I need my insurance for something bigger, they'll be there for me though. This kind of thing makes me weary that if something bigger happens, I won't be taken care of.

It feels terrible when you pay for thousands of dollars in insurance coverage and you don't get any help when something goes wrong.

[Mugen EvOlutioN]

fuck ICBC

seirously no joke, my family has been fucked over by them TWICE now. wasting my fucking time going to court for some absolutely Bullshit non at fault reason is seriously a fucking waste of time.


fuck u ICBC, no seriously fuck u
ppl run redlight and i could be at fight, go fucking figure.


:2finger::2finger::2finger:

lol selling the car without the owner's consent....ICBC u guys are great :thumbsup:

this is the time i wish US laws kick in, so ppl can sue the fuck out of ICBC when they get raped in the ass

[Mancini]

fuck icbc... total bullshit... they arent there to help you.. there are just there to do the bare minimum and/or screw you over....


Most of the people I've talked to that make these blanket statements typically have both collision and comprehensive, as well as more than the mandatory minimum of third party liability. If you really feel that it's a rip off then you can just get the basics for much cheaper. Your risk, your call.

02 civic - 2152 a yr w/ full coverage @ 25% discount..

.

[Mancini]

fuck ICBC

seirously no joke, my family has been fucked over by them TWICE now. wasting my fucking time going to court for some absolutely Bullshit non at fault reason is seriously a fucking waste of time.


fuck u ICBC, no seriously fuck u
ppl run redlight and i could be at fight, go fucking figure.


:2finger::2finger::2finger:

lol selling the car without the owner's consent....ICBC u guys are great :thumbsup:

this is the time i wish US laws kick in, so ppl can sue the fuck out of ICBC when they get raped in the ass


30% discount, gonna be 35% discount later this year

$3000 a year

$250 a month

3 mill coverage

500 deductible

05 RSX S

.

[Shun Izaki]

They do this because they know people don't spend a lot of time or money on it.

Where as I'm totally suing ICBC for the next however long it takes.

[!Yaminashi]

Damn thats harsh!

We can't count on our government for anything, and we cant even count on ICBC to pull through..
Who can we count on these days?

[Mugen EvOlutioN]

The Dark Knight - vancouver needs a hero

[Blinky]

When my MX6 got written off, I submitted an entire stack of receipts, ranging from new Toyo Proxes tires (literally installed the day before the car burnt down) to a ton of engine work I had done over the past month. My adjuster took all the work I had done on modifying the engine into account and increased her offer quite substantially. They even offered 90% of the retail value of the tires on top of the offer. And while I wasn't given the amount that I put into the car, they offered so close a number that I wasn't going to complain. So no, they don't have to pay out for any work on the car, but if you state your case and have a nice adjuster, you can get paid back for a good chunk of work you've put into the car.

That said, ICBC also sold a car out from under a friend's nose after it was in an accident. He never signed the salvage waiver because he wanted to get the car back for parts. A week later he found out that it was sold to a salvage yard. Of course in this case he was offered a substantial amount for the "troubles" he was given, and not shown the run-around as it appears this other family is.

Thanks for posting your experience, Lomac.

Of course, the TENS of THOUSANDS of efficiently handled claims never make the news. Just like the TENS of THOUSANDS of good police actions that go on. All these negative stories just feed the entitled and self-righteous.

With this in consideration, the family in the newsarticle probably is right in seeking additional compensation -- but not nearly what the family is thinking that they're entitled to.

[!Yaminashi]

The Dark Knight - vancouver needs a hero

Cant count on christian bale either, he'll just flip out at anyone who gets in his way and threaten to smash their lights

[J-Wangsta]

i wonder what kind of insurance package the dark knight's bat-tank-mobile has.... lol

[some_punk]

i wonder what kind of insurance package the dark knight's bat-tank-mobile has.... lol

Well according to top gear that car is street legal. And it also has a corvette engine in it so i would assume it cost the same as any other kit car out there with a LS1.

[MegaMx]

MegaMx, i think you're missing the point...

SOundy hit the nail on the head. because mistake or not, they sold a vehicle they did not own. it's not their decision what to do with someone else's property. $3000 or $30,000....what a ridiculous mistake to be making

You're definitely right, all I was saying is the family is being unreasonable and thinks because ICBC made a mistake they can ask now for whatever amount they want without taking into consideration what the implications are.

[ericthehalfbee]

Of course, the TENS of THOUSANDS of efficiently handled claims never make the news. Just like the TENS of THOUSANDS of good police actions that go on. All these negative stories just feed the entitled and self-righteous.

With this in consideration, the family in the newsarticle probably is right in seeking additional compensation -- but not nearly what the family is thinking that they're entitled to.

You're definitely right, all I was saying is the family is being unreasonable and thinks because ICBC made a mistake they can ask now for whatever amount they want without taking into consideration what the implications are.
Exactly. ICBC made a $3,000 mistake. And ICBC is going to pay them back for it. But these assholes somehow think they've won the lottery and are entitled to much more.

You wanna know why your insurance rates are so high? Because of people like this who think their fucking POS car is somehow worth more than twice the market value. Boo fucking hoo.

Tell you what, let's have ICBC pay out everyone twice the amount they should be getting. Then we'll see everyone on here bitching next year about the 100% increase in their premiums, now that ICBC is paying out double on every claim. :rolleyes:

[Meowjin]

sue icbc, fuck

[Meowjin]

Exactly. ICBC made a $3,000 mistake. And ICBC is going to pay them back for it. But these assholes somehow think they've won the lottery and are entitled to much more.

You wanna know why your insurance rates are so high? Because of people like this who think their fucking POS car is somehow worth more than twice the market value. Boo fucking hoo.

Tell you what, let's have ICBC pay out everyone twice the amount they should be getting. Then we'll see everyone on here bitching next year about the 100% increase in their premiums, now that ICBC is paying out double on every claim. :rolleyes:

BECAUSE HE WANTS HIS CAR BACK AND NEVER SIGNED TO GET SALVAGED

abc

[Marco911]

^^They owe him the market value of the vehicle and that's what they're trying to pay him. No court is going to award the family with greater than market value. Time for the family to suck it up.

[CanadaGoose]

I think everyones got the right idea...icbc effed up, but at the same time the family is almost trying to milk it or something, but i can still sympathize. none of this would've happened if icbc just followed thier OWN damn rules

to be honest i've never been screwed over by icbc, they've been good to me (when i was insured with them), but with all the horror stories i hear about, and friends getting ripped off....i'd be suprised if anyone here honestly felt like they were in good hands. insurance shouldn't be a game of russian roulette, and being assigned 50/50 liability shouldn't feel like 100/100.

[you]

icbc bunch of fucking tools

[hotjoint]

i hate icbc

[Mancini]

i hate icbc

No you don't.

02 celica
$1900 a year
roadstar discount
Immobolizer discount
10 years worth of driving experience in the house discount (noone under 10 years of driving can drive my car but thats only my brother and he can't drive). This saved me an extra $300 :)

With a maximum discount, $1900/yr buys you a considerable amount of coverage. You voted with your wallet. You love ICBC.

[death_blossom]

fuck icbc
+1

time for that family to get a lawyer.

[ericthehalfbee]

to be honest i've never been screwed over by icbc, they've been good to me (when i was insured with them), but with all the horror stories i hear about, and friends getting ripped off....i'd be suprised if anyone here honestly felt like they were in good hands. insurance shouldn't be a game of russian roulette, and being assigned 50/50 liability shouldn't feel like 100/100.I handle claims for customers at work and have done probably over 100 over the years. Not one single customer of ours has ever been "screwed over" by ICBC. Neither have I or any friends/family I know. In fact, most of them have gotten more than what they really should.

Again, it's always the fucking whiners that complain while leaving out details of what really happened. I bet hard cash that the people who whine have one of the following: driving their parents car without proper insurance, driving their car but insured under parents to save money, told ICBC the car was for recreational use when they in fact drive it to work everyday, modded their car like crazy and didn't buy additional coverage and so on.



Here's one example I just finished. Classic car had a minor fire. Needs some interior work, new wiring and some dash repairs. Fire extinguisher chemicals make a real mess of things, and they did far more damage then the fire. All the metal on the engine is pitted/etched from the extinguisher. ICBC says the customer is entitled to have the car in the same condition it was before the fire. So in addition to the fire repairs, the customer is getting:

- All engine bay parts cleaned and plated (and there are a shitload of them).
- New head gaskets (heads can't be cleaned while on the engine), which also includes all the other work that goes along with doing a head job).
- Valve covers being send out for cleaning and anodizing.
- Carbs getting rebuilt, cleaned and anodized/plated.
- Ohter misc stuff.

Total cost of this work is around $11,000 over and above what the actual fire damage was. ICBC signed off on the work right away.


To you fuckers that complain about being screwed, I'm calling you out. I guarantee you're leaving out details cuz if you told the truth then everyone will tell you you got what you deserved.

[ericthehalfbee]

+1

time for that family to get a lawyer.A lawyer for a fucking POS Integra? Are you kidding me?

ICBC should go out and buy the exact same car in the same condition with the same wheels/tires and give that to them. That'll shut them up. I bet ICBC could get one in excellent condition for half of what the whining family is asking for ($3K vs $6K). The family wants cash since they see this as an opportunity to come out way ahead.

Fuck them, I don't need my insurance rates going up to support fuckers like these.

[Soundy]

To you fuckers that complain about being screwed, I'm calling you out. I guarantee you're leaving out details cuz if you told the truth then everyone will tell you you got what you deserved.

First accident I was ever in, I was making a left turn into a corner-store parking lot and was creamed by a speeding delivery van who decided he was going to pass me on the left despite there being a double-yellow line and oncoming traffic. He admitted to me at the time that he'd had "over 20 accidents before". ICBC decided that I was 100% at fault... because, they said, I was making an "illegal U-turn".

When I asked the adjuster how he'd determined this, he asked me, "were you going to go back in the direction you were coming from?", I said, "Yeah, eventually..." (you know, after PARKING, and GETTING OUT, and SHOPPING for a while). He said, "Well that's a U-turn."

Explain how that works.

Explain to me too, how when I rear-ended (read: NUDGED) a POS Tempo at a stop sign with my POS Accord, her adjuster determined there was "over $600 damage and possibly a bent frame" when my estimator, after a careful inspection of my Accord's front end, said there was NO sign it had ever hit ANYTHING.

[hk20000]

^ HAHAHAHA you suck at explaining situations to the adjuster.

I got hit by random blind left turn jumper and I got my JDM import repaired without being dissed by how much the local one is worth peanuts. I <3 ICBC.

[Mugen EvOlutioN]

WHAT THE FUCK. $11,000 worth of damage filled with chemicals, fuck that i rather have my car written off and get a new one


U wonna defend ICBC??
Will explain how i was fully motherfucking stopped at a red light waiting at intersection for it to turn green. Start slowly going intersection after the light turns green, BANG mothefucking idiotic psycho bitch cant drive shit runs red light at 100km T-boned me except luckily i was going slow so she hit me around my front bumper area (which still cost me $3000 to fix because of frame damage) now if i wasnt accelerating like a turtle my passenger would have been killed since the bitch would totally t-bone me from the side. Had 2 10 years old witness they saw the bitch ran red light (after the accident she decided to run , but after 200m she made a u-turn and came back to the gas station beside. bitch admited her fault but didnt have driver license on her. She made a phone call to her husband so he can bring her the driver license (go figure) we reported to ICBC. Bitch told ICBC i ran redlight which long story short ICBC made it 50/50. I had to go to court 3 fucking times just to clear this shit up. ICBC said ohhhh 2 10 years old doesnt count as witness. they have 2 pairs of eyes, it doesnt take a genius to figure whats red and whats green.


my mom was driving our van with my sis in the car, when she was passing the intersection the light turn yellow so way too late to stop so she had to cross, an old lady with a truck was waiting to turn left on the other side of the road. She started turning and hit my mom's van. Long story short, ICBC first said it was old lady's fault. Later the old lady hired some witness (put up signs saying WITNESS needed and will be rewarded with money) since when was it ok to bribe witness with cash?) so because now she has a bullshit witness ICBC said my mom was at fault. WTF, ok so obviously we gonnat take it to court, after serveral arguments with ICBC which was abolutely fucking bs 2 years later still hasn been resolved. Go figure. I guess the person with more moeny wins for this case i guess? one person offers $100 for witness, the next person bribes $1000 for each witness? is this how it works? WTF

the person who is fucking turning left at an intersection has to WAIT until it is safe to go. If not fuck i can make a left turn at any intersection at any given time i would like and can get away with with hitting any cars that have the right of way? BS Whether it was yellow light or not, the person turning left has to make the judgement whether the person can stop in time or not. It aint like the person going straight ran a red light than that would be different.

absolutely a fucking waste of time


all in all, fuck icbc

[hk20000]

WHAT THE FUCK. $11,000 worth of damage filled with chemicals, fuck that i rather have my car written off and get a new one


U wonna defend ICBC??
Will explain how i was fully motherfucking stopped at a red light waiting at intersection for it to turn green. Start slowly going intersection after the light turns green, BANG mothefucking idiotic psycho bitch cant drive shit runs red light at 100km T-boned me except luckily i was going slow so she hit me around my front bumper area (which still cost me $3000 to fix because of frame damage) now if i wasnt accelerating like a turtle my passenger would have been killed since the bitch would totally t-bone me from the side. Had 2 10 years old witness they saw the bitch ran red light (after the accident she decided to run , but after 200m she made a u-turn and came back to the gas station beside. bitch admited her fault but didnt have driver license so borrowed the cell phone so her husband can bring her driver license (go figure) we reported to ICBC. Bitch told ICBC i ran redlight which long story short ICBC made it 50/50. I had to go to court 3 fucking times just to clear this shit up. ICBC said ohhhh 2 10 years old doesnt count as witness. they have 2 pairs of eyes, it doesnt take a genius to figure whats red and whats green.


my mom was driving our van with my sis in the car, when she was passing the intersection the light turn yellow so way too late to stop so she had to cross, an old lady with a truck was waiting to turn left on the other side of the road. She started turning and hit my mom's van. Long story short, ICBC first said it was old lady's fault. Later the old lady hired some witness (put up signs saying WITNESS needed and will be rewarded with money) since when was it ok to bribe witness with cash?) so because now she has a bullshi witness ICBC said my mom was at fault. WTF, ok so obviously we gonnat take it to court, after serveral argument with ICBC which was abolutely fucking bs 2 years later still hasn been resolved. Go figure

the person who is fucking turning left at an intersection has to WAIT until it is safe to go. If not fuck i can make a left turn at any intersection at any given time i would like and can get away with with hitting any cars that have the right of way? BS Whether it was yellow light or not, the person turning left has to make the judgement whether the person can stop in time or not. It aint like the person going straight ran a red light than that would be different


all in all, fuck icbc
1. 2 10 years old really cannot be evidence. They can be bribed into saying anything with what a box of chocolates? They can't provide evidence in court either because of limited attention span, observation and articulation skills. It will stand in court but if that is all there is for evidence but once something is contradiction the 10 y.o. evidence is probably the first thing that's thrown out.
2. You suck for not getting a witness yourself at the scene.

And no the classic car is worth a lot more than 11000 so stfu.

[hk20000]

A lawyer for a fucking POS Integra? Are you kidding me?

ICBC should go out and buy the exact same car in the same condition with the same wheels/tires and give that to them. That'll shut them up. I bet ICBC could get one in excellent condition for half of what the whining family is asking for ($3K vs $6K). The family wants cash since they see this as an opportunity to come out way ahead.

Fuck them, I don't need my insurance rates going up to support fuckers like these.
I was saying too this is probably most money saving and reasonable way to deal with this. :thumbsup:

[Mancini]

WHAT THE FUCK. $11,000 worth of damage filled with chemicals, fuck that i rather have my car written off and get a new one


U wonna defend ICBC??
Will explain how i was fully motherfucking stopped at a red light waiting at intersection for it to turn green. Start slowly going intersection after the light turns green, BANG mothefucking idiotic psycho bitch cant drive shit runs red light at 100km T-boned me except luckily i was going slow so she hit me around my front bumper area (which still cost me $3000 to fix because of frame damage) now if i wasnt accelerating like a turtle my passenger would have been killed since the bitch would totally t-bone me from the side. Had 2 10 years old witness they saw the bitch ran red light (after the accident she decided to run , but after 200m she made a u-turn and came back to the gas station beside. bitch admited her fault but didnt have driver license on her. She made a phone call to her husband so he can bring her the driver license (go figure) we reported to ICBC. Bitch told ICBC i ran redlight which long story short ICBC made it 50/50. I had to go to court 3 fucking times just to clear this shit up. ICBC said ohhhh 2 10 years old doesnt count as witness. they have 2 pairs of eyes, it doesnt take a genius to figure whats red and whats green.


my mom was driving our van with my sis in the car, when she was passing the intersection the light turn yellow so way too late to stop so she had to cross, an old lady with a truck was waiting to turn left on the other side of the road. She started turning and hit my mom's van. Long story short, ICBC first said it was old lady's fault. Later the old lady hired some witness (put up signs saying WITNESS needed and will be rewarded with money) since when was it ok to bribe witness with cash?) so because now she has a bullshit witness ICBC said my mom was at fault. WTF, ok so obviously we gonnat take it to court, after serveral arguments with ICBC which was abolutely fucking bs 2 years later still hasn been resolved. Go figure. I guess the person with more moeny wins for this case i guess? one person offers $100 for witness, the next person bribes $1000 for each witness? is this how it works? WTF

the person who is fucking turning left at an intersection has to WAIT until it is safe to go. If not fuck i can make a left turn at any intersection at any given time i would like and can get away with with hitting any cars that have the right of way? BS Whether it was yellow light or not, the person turning left has to make the judgement whether the person can stop in time or not. It aint like the person going straight ran a red light than that would be different.

absolutely a fucking waste of time


all in all, fuck icbc

Do you insure (beyond basic Autoplan) with ICBC or a private insurer?

[Mugen EvOlutioN]

the first accident i only bought basic insurance with ICBC and the rest private. Later on i learned it was much harder to deal when u have an accident. Wasnt worth it so switched to full ICBC after



if i own a $80,000 g for example, sorry i wouldnt want my cabinet all filled with chemicals and shit, OEM vs work being done after is just never the same

NEVER

[silk]

i see lots of hate and anger in this thread... we live in BC, we gotta deal with it ....
icbc are assholes, and you know what ? its ran by government.

[Lomac]

the first accident i only bought basic insurance with ICBC and the rest private. Later on i learned it was much harder to deal when u have an accident. Wasnt worth it so switched to full ICBC after



if i own a $80,000 g for example, sorry i wouldnt want my cabinet all filled with chemicals and shit, OEM vs work being done after is just never the same

NEVER

Like it or not, children's testimonies are often sketchy at best. It's not surprising ICBC didn't keep them as witnesses.

Oh, and you've never owned a classic car, have you? If you had and you've dumped money and time into rebuilding it, there's no way you'd say you wouldn't want that car back. I guarantee it.

[Lomac]

Explain to me too, how when I rear-ended (read: NUDGED) a POS Tempo at a stop sign with my POS Accord, her adjuster determined there was "over $600 damage and possibly a bent frame" when my estimator, after a careful inspection of my Accord's front end, said there was NO sign it had ever hit ANYTHING.

A buddy of mine rear ended me while on a car cruise. The front of his car was smashed up pretty badly (hood destroyed, radiator and support busted, sub-frame bent, bumper supports popped), yet my rear bumper barely looks like it was tapped. There's a few scratches where the paint is starting to chip off but absolutely nothing else. You'd never be able to tell that the damage caused to my buddy's car was inflicted from hitting mine.

Appearances aren't always everything.

[2damaxmr2]

"ran by government" socialism at its finest @_@

[Ruus]

I've had my own personal dealings with ICBC when i got hit by a truck while he was passing me in the shoulder so it was 100% his fault. Unfortunately no witnesses stopped to give any details so when we reported it to icbc the Truck driver said i pulled into his lane and hit him.

I disputed the decision to the very top and had meetings with ICBC and even the investigator agreed that I wasn't at fault but there wasn't anything she could do. so i was screwed again...

Long story short ICBC is a government backed agency and they don't give 2 shits about anybody. But selling a kids car before he signs the waiver , if that really was the case, is a crime and the kid should be compensated for that, not the fact that he dropped 3g's into the car the day before.

[death_blossom]

A lawyer for a fucking POS Integra? Are you kidding me?

ICBC should go out and buy the exact same car in the same condition with the same wheels/tires and give that to them. That'll shut them up. I bet ICBC could get one in excellent condition for half of what the whining family is asking for ($3K vs $6K). The family wants cash since they see this as an opportunity to come out way ahead.

Fuck them, I don't need my insurance rates going up to support fuckers like these.

In the article posted, it seems like ICBC has not been helpful in resolving this issue. It would be common sense for them to buy back or possibly nullify the sale of the wrecked car from the wrecker. Or yes, at the very least buy the family a replacement car. But nowhere in the article did I read any action of ICBC being helpful. It might have been the way the article was written that made ICBC look like the bad guy. But ICBC might have also been non-helpful as the article indicated. We won't know the whole story.

I understand you work for ICBC, there's no need to take anything personally man. I can side with you on the fact that ICBC will always pay for damages that are done in an accident. However, in the cases of vehicles being totaled there are a lot of incidents where the value of the car is never properly assessed. For example, anytime an AE86 is written off, ICBC never ever pays out the market value of those cars. Yes, the blue book value is peanuts, however the market value of these little (semi) classic cars is a lot higher than ICBC ever pays out on them.

[16v of E30]

You know what ICBC stands for right? IDIOTS CONTROLLING BRITISH COLUMBIA.

did anyone take note that ICBC profitted millions of dollars last year? And the fact that they have been busted for fraud? ICBC is the biggest joke around. Fuck them.

[Mugen EvOlutioN]

well apparently we got a fanboy in here defending them


go figure

:rolleyes:

i thought there was an article bitching that ICBC didnt make enough last year compare to couple years back or some bullcrap like that therefore they gonna raise the insurance so the profit margin will open up even more , as if millions wasnt enough

[ericthehalfbee]

I don't work for ICBC. I work for an independent shop that deals with ICBC on claims for our customers. We nevr have problems with ICBC because.....

- Our customers have the proper insurance. They don't drive cars owned/insured by their parents and they didn't lie to ICBC about the intended use of the vehicle.
- We have a good relationship with ICBC. We don't try to fuck people over or take advantage of ICBC like countless crooked shops in The Lower Mainland do. Beleive me, ICBC knows what shops are really doing with their claims. If you're having a hard time in getting ICBC to pay to fix something, maybe you need to look at who you wnet to for the work.



As the the AE86 example given above, if your car is a "classic" and worth more than blue book, then maybe you should have bought extra insurance to reflect the real value of the car.

Do you think you can pay the same rates as the next guy for a car from the same year, but when yours gets wrecked you deserve more because it's a "classic"?

[Lomac]

well apparently we got a fanboy in here defending them


go figure

:rolleyes:

i thought there was an article bitching that ICBC didnt make enough last year compare to couple years back or some bullcrap like that therefore they gonna raise the insurance so the profit margin will open up even more , as if millions wasnt enough

Where do you expect ICBC to get the money they use to pay off insurance claims and lawsuits?

[Soundy]

As the the AE86 example given above, if your car is a "classic" and worth more than blue book, then maybe you should have bought extra insurance to reflect the real value of the car.

I think the point was more that "blue book" value isn't always in line with "market value", not that an AE86 is anything particularly "special".

[Mancini]

I think the point was more that "blue book" value isn't always in line with "market value", not that an AE86 is anything particularly "special".

I think that was his point, too.

You can pay standard rates and get book value. The actuarial calculations for standard premium would be based on this. Or, you can insure according to the actual value of the vehicle and expect to pay more accordingly.

[death_blossom]

As the the AE86 example given above, if your car is a "classic" and worth more than blue book, then maybe you should have bought extra insurance to reflect the real value of the car.

Do you think you can pay the same rates as the next guy for a car from the same year, but when yours gets wrecked you deserve more because it's a "classic"?

I'm not saying an owner deserves more for the car they have, but they are supposed to get paid out enough to buy a replacement. in the example I gave, I was just trying to say that ICBC never pays out the fair market value of these particular cars.

say I have a stock AE86 and it is totaled. ICBC offers me $800, but to buy another AE86 in similar condition I'd have to pay $3-4000 dollars for one. would you not agree that this situation is unfair?