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06-04-2009, 08:30 AM
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#1 | | Chinese Guy, Swedish Rides
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| Six-Four: 20 Years Today (June 4th Movement, Tiananmen Square)
No thread yet or am I blind? I still remember this, watching it on TV in Hong Kong and not really understanding, then later on the VHS recordings my folks made of the news. Call it surreal, call it naive, call it irresponsible, whatever, those students made an impact on history that will not soon be forgotten. http://lens.blogs.nytimes.com/2009/0...le-on-history/ Quote: |
Never before published. Terril Jones's view of Changan Avenue on Jun. 5, 1989, shows "tank man," in the distance at left, framed by two tree trunks, on the verge of his confrontation with the tanks in the distance at right.
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06-04-2009, 08:38 AM
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#2 | | Banned By Establishment
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CHINA IS THE BEST COUNTRY ON EARTH. WE ARE BETTER THAN EVERYTHING THAT EVER HAPPENS HERE.
LONG LIVE THE COMMUNIST GOVERNMENT
LONG LIVE CORRUPTION AS LONG AS IT BENEFITS ME
[/ddgauge]
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06-04-2009, 08:47 AM
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#3 | | Zombie Mod
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Wow.... has it been 20 years already? That is a great photo in the OP.
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06-04-2009, 09:33 AM
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#4 | | Banned (ABWS)
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06-04-2009, 09:47 AM
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#5 | | 14 dolla balla aint got nothing on me!
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06-04-2009, 10:03 AM
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#6 | | Banned By Establishment
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i was there, went at 4 in the afternoon. There was an insane amount of police presence. "Undercover" police with badges were out in even greater number. You could NOT look around 20 meters at any point within the square and not see a government drone.
They carried umbrellas, at first we thought they were for the overcast conditions which could turn to slight rain. Then my friend say a woman kneel and possibly prey, she was surrounded by security who then opened their umbrella's to shield her from view.
She was taken away by an awaiting police van. China has come a long way in 20 years, but not in this regard. Also met a German girl that was apparently speaking to reporters around the square as journalists/reporters were denied access to the square. Security she said smacked her around and told her to mind her own countries business.
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06-04-2009, 10:22 AM
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#7 | | HELP ME PLS!!!
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I've done a research paper on media censorship in China and this really pissed me off. The Chinese government is "brainwashing" their citizens ever since they're young by only teaching them a part of the history, making them think their government is superior and great. They don't teach you the Six-Four incident in school. It's sad that people from all around the world knows about this incident and you may not even know in your own country.
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06-04-2009, 10:35 AM
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#8 | | Even when im right, revscene.net is still right!
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u dont think the developed countries do the same thing?
in highschool we learn communism is bad, we read books about how bad they are, "1984?? or is it 86??" and whenever media mention about china, it says the communist China...so its like indirectly saying the China is bad..
with that much population, it's even harder to control if the gov't does not censor the media.. China has been going astonishingly for the past decade, ethically, it might not be a good thing, but overall it's doing alright. Its GNI increase 113% since 2000.
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---------- Quote: Originally posted by Ulic Qel-Droma
I let one rip once, and i pulled the covers over the girl, it was funny. she stopped moving, and when i lifted the covers i had to send her to the hospital. | http://www.revscene.net/forums/showt...hreadid=462576 | |
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06-04-2009, 11:00 AM
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#9 | | Banned By Establishment
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^^ 
Every person should have right to freedom of information and general freedom in general.
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06-04-2009, 11:00 AM
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#10 | | HELP ME PLS!!!
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Originally Posted by Yc  u dont think the developed countries do the same thing?
in highschool we learn communism is bad, we read books about how bad they are, "1984?? or is it 86??" and whenever media mention about china, it says the communist China...so its like indirectly saying the China is bad..
with that much population, it's even harder to control if the gov't does not censor the media.. China has been going astonishingly for the past decade, ethically, it might not be a good thing, but overall it's doing alright. Its GNI increase 113% since 2000. | It is an inevitable fact that there are more media censorship in China than here, in Canada. Yes, economical and social stability is what they want. However, doing so only benefits the state and not the citizens. I guess there are no better ways to contain such a large population without sacrificing some freedom...
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06-04-2009, 11:01 AM
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#11 | | Ready to be Man handled by RS!
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Originally Posted by Yc China has been going astonishingly for the past decade, ethically, it might not be a good thing, but overall it's doing alright. Its GNI increase 113% since 2000. | This is exactly what is wrong with China, money above all else. Screw human rights, screw the environment. They put on a front like everything is ok just so other countries will trade with them.
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06-04-2009, 11:02 AM
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#12 | | Banned (ABWS)
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is wikipedia still banned there?
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06-04-2009, 11:35 AM
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#13 | | Ubereem Mod
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Originally Posted by crummy This is exactly what is wrong with China, money above all else. Screw human rights, screw the environment. They put on a front like everything is ok just so other countries will trade with them. | hate to say it - Industrial Revolution was the same type of deal.
With the information we have now, plus the MASSIVE population, china'sjust going to burn itself out.
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Originally Posted by Culture_Vulture sometimes I like to use kindergarten art class scissors to cut my pubes | | |
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06-04-2009, 11:59 AM
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#14 | | HELP ME PLS!!!
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Originally Posted by crummy This is exactly what is wrong with China, money above all else. Screw human rights, screw the environment. They put on a front like everything is ok just so other countries will trade with them. | Don't forget military too  | |
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06-04-2009, 12:58 PM
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#15 | | I answer every Emotion with an emoticon
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RIP to the students. But I think sometimes you cannot have everything. There needs to be a balance between freedom & control. You cannot truly have freedom if u dunno where the boundaries are. Every governement is struggling to find that balance. No one knows what is the ideal trade-off between freedom & control. But at least the Chinese ppl r getting more freedom than 20 years ago. Nothing can or should happen overnight. Radical changes are detrimental to any society. U can't just go from very limited rights to complete freedom, it'll cause the entire society to breakdown. Just give it some time
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Ignorance is bliss
How I wish I can remain ignorant, why do I know so much?
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06-04-2009, 01:27 PM
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#16 | | Captain Happy Bubble is my Homeboy
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I was too young to understand anything. After some studying about it, I am starting to feel upset for those who died. RIP
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06-04-2009, 02:49 PM
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#17 | | Even when im right, revscene.net is still right!
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| Quote:
Originally Posted by MajinHurricane ^^
Every person should have right to freedom of information and general freedom in general. | sometimes having these freedom will lead to circumstances that put harm into sth that delay the growth of a country.
people are easily influenced by what others are saying..so it might not be the best thing..
i believe what China have done might not be the best solution, but given what we have at the time.. it's probably the best thing to do..
Everything country should have its own gov't policies, and what we have definitely would not work in China, as you have seen some other developing countries have tried that (RUSSIA)..
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---------- Quote: Originally posted by Ulic Qel-Droma
I let one rip once, and i pulled the covers over the girl, it was funny. she stopped moving, and when i lifted the covers i had to send her to the hospital. | http://www.revscene.net/forums/showt...hreadid=462576 | |
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06-04-2009, 04:11 PM
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#18 | | 14 dolla balla aint got nothing on me!
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oh, i wonder how long before revscene gets behind the Great Firewall of China.
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06-04-2009, 04:20 PM
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#19 | | 14 dolla balla aint got nothing on me!
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Originally Posted by Yc u dont think the developed countries do the same thing?
in highschool we learn communism is bad, we read books about how bad they are, "1984?? or is it 86??" and whenever media mention about china, it says the communist China...so its like indirectly saying the China is bad..
with that much population, it's even harder to control if the gov't does not censor the media.. China has been going astonishingly for the past decade, ethically, it might not be a good thing, but overall it's doing alright. Its GNI increase 113% since 2000. | holy fuck i'm going to drop the F-bomb. of course we're taught communism is bad, because IT IS A FUCKIN SHIT FORM OF GOVERNMENT. holy fuckin shit i can't believe you can be this stupid and still type in english, what the fuck are you thinking? economic freedom =/= political freedom, yeah keep buying those LV bags and BMW's i'm sure you can buy your way into happiness you dumb fuck. geeze fuckin christ, you sir, are a fuckin genius. don't you fuckin dare try and give some bullshit reason to defend censorship.
China is better off NOW then before, but that's comparing shit to piss.
and, FUCK YOU.
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06-04-2009, 06:03 PM
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#20 | | The "You'd Know" Moderator
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Originally Posted by q0192837465 RIP to the students. But I think sometimes you cannot have everything. There needs to be a balance between freedom & control. You cannot truly have freedom if u dunno where the boundaries are. Every governement is struggling to find that balance. No one knows what is the ideal trade-off between freedom & control. But at least the Chinese ppl r getting more freedom than 20 years ago. Nothing can or should happen overnight. Radical changes are detrimental to any society. U can't just go from very limited rights to complete freedom, it'll cause the entire society to breakdown. Just give it some time | Er, it's not about freedom and control. What the fuck is "just give it some time?"
The June 4th movement started out as mourning for the death of Hu Yaobang, the previous leader for China who openly criticize government corruption and he was also forced to resign. After the social reform by Deng Xiaoping, people thought that the political environment (with only the communist party) was lagging behind.
The next leader Zhao Ziyang was anti-government corruption. He was very sympathetic with the students before, during and after the June 4th movement and he was also against the use of military against the students. However, Deng Xiaoping was the chairman of China's Central Military Commission at the time and Zhao Ziyang was only the vice chair. Deng, as the elder of the communist party, illegally forced the decision to "clean up" Tiananmen Square.
After June 4th, Zhao Ziyang showed up at Tiananmen Square to apologize to the students. Needless to say, he was fired by the Communist Party and was stripped of his power. Zhao was asked by his peers to admit that he was wrong in sympathizing with the students in order to retain some of his positions in the communisty party. He turned it down. He was criminalized and was placed under house arrest.
China had good leaders like Hu and Zhao; but they were all forced out of power. So don't give me the "oh just give it some time!"
Anyone who says "June 4th? That's 20 years ago and look at how prosperous China is now" or made the massacre the cause of the economic power China has today, is obviously a fucking retard.
FYI, Zhao was also responsible for the economic reform (to fix the fuckups by Deng) in the 80s.
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08 CBR600RR
03 IS300
Ezekiel 25:17. The path of the righteous man is beset on all sides by the inequities of the selfish and the tyranny of evil men. Blessed is he who, in the name of charity and good will, shepherds the weak through the valley of the darkness. For he is truly his brother's keeper and the finder of lost children. And I will strike down upon thee with great vengeance and furious anger those who attempt to poison and destroy my brothers. And you will know I am the Lord when I lay my vengeance upon you. | |
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06-04-2009, 06:21 PM
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#21 | | Even when im right, revscene.net is still right!
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Originally Posted by dna82 holy fuck i'm going to drop the F-bomb. of course we're taught communism is bad, because IT IS A FUCKIN SHIT FORM OF GOVERNMENT. holy fuckin shit i can't believe you can be this stupid and still type in english, what the fuck are you thinking? economic freedom =/= political freedom, yeah keep buying those LV bags and BMW's i'm sure you can buy your way into happiness you dumb fuck. geeze fuckin christ, you sir, are a fuckin genius. don't you fuckin dare try and give some bullshit reason to defend censorship.
China is better off NOW then before, but that's comparing shit to piss.
and, FUCK YOU. |
so communism is bad, how so? ..the theory behind it isn't bad, its just when it comes to reality, it turns bad..thats all..
if you had to choose btw economic freedom and political freedom, which one do u want??
censorship is needed, i am sure every country does it..but not to that greater extend
and individual vs whole, it's two different things, individual might suffer, but as a whole it's a win
__________________
---------- Quote: Originally posted by Ulic Qel-Droma
I let one rip once, and i pulled the covers over the girl, it was funny. she stopped moving, and when i lifted the covers i had to send her to the hospital. | http://www.revscene.net/forums/showt...hreadid=462576 | |
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06-04-2009, 06:29 PM
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#22 | | 14 dolla balla aint got nothing on me!
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Originally Posted by Yc so communism is bad, how so? ..the theory behind it isn't bad, its just when it comes to reality, it turns bad..thats all..
if you had to choose btw economic freedom and political freedom, which one do u want??
censorship is needed, i am sure every country does it..but not to that greater extend
and individual vs whole, it's two different things, individual might suffer, but as a whole it's a win | communism works REAL well, i mean look at all the thriving, great societies that communism creates.
fuck, god damn, read a book.
a state without individuals is NOTHING, an individual without a state is STILL A PERSON. fuck your zerg mentality.
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06-04-2009, 06:35 PM
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#23 | | The "You'd Know" Moderator
Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: Home
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Originally Posted by Yc so communism is bad, how so? ..the theory behind it isn't bad, its just when it comes to reality, it turns bad..thats all..
if you had to choose btw economic freedom and political freedom, which one do u want??
censorship is needed, i am sure every country does it..but not to that greater extend
and individual vs whole, it's two different things, individual might suffer, but as a whole it's a win | Welcome to Canada, where you can choose to have both kinds of freedom, where the government has a responsibility for its people, and where you can have (a) freedom of conscience and religion; (b) freedom of thought, belief, opinion and expression, including freedom of the press and other media of communication; (c) freedom of peaceful assembly; and (d) freedom of association, guaranteed by the Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms without the RCMP or CSIS knocking on your door as you replied to this thread.
__________________
08 CBR600RR
03 IS300
Ezekiel 25:17. The path of the righteous man is beset on all sides by the inequities of the selfish and the tyranny of evil men. Blessed is he who, in the name of charity and good will, shepherds the weak through the valley of the darkness. For he is truly his brother's keeper and the finder of lost children. And I will strike down upon thee with great vengeance and furious anger those who attempt to poison and destroy my brothers. And you will know I am the Lord when I lay my vengeance upon you. | |
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06-04-2009, 06:50 PM
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#24 | | Hacked RS to become a mod
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Yc has set a new new low for Revscene.
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06-04-2009, 06:55 PM
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#25 | | Even when im right, revscene.net is still right!
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Originally Posted by impactX Welcome to Canada, where you can choose to have both kinds of freedom, where the government has a responsibility for its people, and where you can have (a) freedom of conscience and religion; (b) freedom of thought, belief, opinion and expression, including freedom of the press and other media of communication; (c) freedom of peaceful assembly; and (d) freedom of association, guaranteed by the Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms without the RCMP or CSIS knocking on your door as you replied to this thread. | yes what u said is right..
and a few threads down, i see ppl complaining how justice system in canada is fucked up
how slow it is..etc..
both system have its bad and good..
there is no real absolute answer, rather the relative of it....
i am not saying which system is good or bad..
i am saying there isn't a absolute system..u guys think how the system in canada can be applied to everywhere in the world just b/c it works so well in canada
__________________
---------- Quote: Originally posted by Ulic Qel-Droma
I let one rip once, and i pulled the covers over the girl, it was funny. she stopped moving, and when i lifted the covers i had to send her to the hospital. | http://www.revscene.net/forums/showt...hreadid=462576 | |
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