[SpuGen]

So for the past few months I've been having a problem with my tenant.

He moved in on June 2nd.
Paid his first month's rent.

Disappeared mid-june.

Comes back Today (August 3rd)

Says he lost his job and does not have my money.
He's moving out as I type.

Now:
I got him to sign the Contract RTB-1 today. It's dated for June 2nd since he disappeared and I never had the chance to get him to sign the damn thing.

I did NOT force him to move out or anything. He came back like 2 hours ago and started moving stuff into his car. I ask him for rent, he says he doesn't have it and will find a way to give it to me when he gets a job (not likely) All I have on him is his first and last name, his signature, and phone number (all on contract). I also took pictures of his car +plates. He says he's moving back home, but I recall that I'm not allowed to get his new address or something.

I've never had to deal with a tenant not paying rent...and the RTO office is closed so I can't call them and ask.

I gave him the benefit of the doubt, and figured that he would come back and pay for rent, since he said his mother was at VGH and he was always there taking care of her. He did not step foot into his suite since he disappeared, until today. He had all his stuff there until 2 hours ago.

Should I get him to sign a written agreement saying that he has a month to pay me back or I go through Small Claims?
If I do this... what should the agreement include?
Name, Amount, Date, Signature, Witness?

He actually just left before I could go get him a copy of the contract.

What now?

[maxxxboost]

Take my opinion with a grain of salt. Take this as a learning experience and let it go.

It's not worth the time. You're lucky he's not being a dick cause the RTO usually sides with the renters.

GL

[Senna4ever]

Why aren't you allowed to get his new address? Sounds kinda fishy... Did you ask to see his driver's license? The car may not be his.

[JesseBlue]

learn from this experience and think of it as charity (if indeed what he mentioned about his mom being in the hospital is true)...

[obselete]

not worth the hassel... even if you can get it back

[DiiCii]

kind of the same thing for my aunts tenants D= they haven't been paying rent for a few months and everytime my aunt went down there to ask them, they'd tell her to fuck off and also threatened to get her arrested for "entering their property" :rofl: cops didn't do anything.. so my cousin set up a moving day for them, rented a truck for them, got a new place to stay for them. so eventually they left with holes all over the walls, and a broken oven with shattered glass all over the floor..:swear:

[AWDTurboLuvr]

Yeah, just walkaway from it. This is one of the bigger risks of renting out your place...dirtbag tenants. The Tenancy Act allows them to do some pretty stupid things.

[LiquidTurbo]

Did you try calmly bluffing saying perhaps if he doesn't pay, you'll take him to small claims?

Wish I could be more help. Do keep us posted. If the money's not worth a lot to you, it might not be worth the trouble. It's a shame this stuff happens.

[LUUUUUUUU]

go bradford chow on his ass

[kokanee_vtec]

Your rent money is gone,,take this as a lesson and scan you tenants properly.

[BlacknJean]

dont be a dick. hes already moving out without you telling him to.

[flawless]

dont be a dick. hes already moving out without you telling him to.

How's he being a dick? The tenant didn't pay his rent.

[Timewav3zer0]

my parents usually ask for at least a couple months rent at the beginning to make sure that doesn't happen

[//RacingSpirit>>]

It could be worse.....they could have trashed the place before leaving. My parents have experienced more than a few bad tenants. Be glad you don't have to do all the paperwork for arbitration, calling in the bailiff, etc., then deal with renovations to get the place ready for rent again. You should have the first month's rent and damage deposit (half a months rent) right? If so, then it's a small loss and a good lesson learned.

[orange7]

increase the rent for the next renters to recover the lost.

problem solved.

[hirevtuner]

hire a property management co to deal future obligations (assuming it is a rental property)

[syee]

What I would have done: Posted notice by leaving a notice on the door and given him 2 weeks to get his shit together. After that, I'm changing the locks and putting his shit on Craigslist to recoup my losses.

However, I'm sure the Tenancy act doesn't let me do stuff like that. From talking to my bro, it seems that the Tenancy Act protects the renter more than it protects the landlord.

Like the others said, it's probably not worth pursuing. If he pays you, great. I'd spend more effort getting the place rented out again so you can start getting income from it again.

[1exotic]

he can't just live in your house and not pay you money, that's just the way shit works. fuck this mother fucker and get your chedder son.

[c_loke]

I just dealt with a situation very similar to this. Had a tenant who was back 2 months and kept saying he was going to get the rent to me. Gave him the benefit of the doubt but he never did. I just asked him to move out of my place. He moved out, left a little bit of a mess but that was it so I was happy.

The best thing to do is just walk away from it unless he has done any damage to the place. You have his deposit, so at least you get something.

Sometimes the month of rent that you lose is not worth the trouble they can cause.

[Gridlock]

I just ate some crow today on this. I had the same attitude with the RTB-they always side with tenants.

We won today. They don't always side with the shits. They gave them their money, and then gave us what we asked for, which conveniently cancelled each other out. Not a crushing victory, but we kind of fucked up too.

Here's how, and what to avoid:

Go and register to keep the securiy deposit. It's not just yours to keep because he left, and he can come back to claim against you.

Be glad that he cleared shit out of the unit. If the value is over $500 in reasonable opinion(fuck, I do hate that that the entire act is written in terms of reasonable, acceptable and so on-could you tell me how many people are too many in an apartment, how many months you are late before I can evict and so on? Anyway, thats a little rant), then you need to store it for 3 months I think? Before you can liquidate to recoup.

Do you have a signed lease? If you don't, you are officially fucked. Sorry.

My advice to anyone is never let it go beyond a week. If you listen to their sob story, and let the rent build up, they are more inclined to do a midnight run. Think about it, if $1000 is going to be an issue now, what makes you think $2000 is going to be easier in 30 days?

Bounce the fucks.

[dinosaur]

Alight...

Did he sign a lease? How long was it for? 1 year? Month-to-month?

Did he give you a security deposit? As Gridlock said, IF he gave you one and you would like to retain it in lieu of non-payment of rent, you MUST file with the RTB. Also, he must give you his forwarding address as per your RT Agreement so that you can give him his deposit back (even if you are not going to return it).

Now regards to you guys not having an RTA at the beginning of the tenancy:

Is it dated for June 2nd? The whole thing, including the final page where he signed? The only thing that he needs to sign/fill out is technically the last page. Which says that he is agreeing to the terms of the previous 5 pages. This is a binding legal contract. It is the fault of him not to read what he is signing.

Now...if you want to get your money for loss rental revenue, you can....but you are going to have to be sneaky. Claim that he had singed on June 2nd as it was dated. Go to the RTB tomorrow and file a claim against him for failure to pay rent (at the same time you file to retain his deposit). It will cost you $50, but as per you agreement, he is obligated and responsible for the rent of July and August (yes, August even though it is only the 3rd)....HOWEVER, this is dependent on when you can re-rent your place. You can not "double-dip". If you find renters for Aug 15 he is only responsible until then . You also need to show an effort in attempting to re-rent (ie. CL ads, newspaper ads, etc.) this makes your case look good.

If you do not want to claim that these papers were signed on June 2nd and were actually signed today, your fucked.

People shit all over the RTB saying that they are just for the tenant, etc...but this is not true as they are bound to the laws and guidelines set forth by the Residential Tenancy Act.

If you want to go down this path with your "June 2nd" contact and claim that is was signed on June 2nd, you are entitled to the loss of rental revenue for a non-payment of rent and any future loss of rental revenue until you can re-rent the unit up until 31 days after he leaves (if he has a lease for like a year or something, he is obligated to all losses of rental revenue until the end of the lease which would be VERY costly to him).

As Grid said, we have just gone through this WHOLE thing with our tenants in our townhouse.....we are also managers of 2 rental buildings and are well-verse in the RTA.

What you must do ASAP: Get is forwarding address. Even if you have to trick him into doing it. Tell him you will send him his mail, or you need him to sign a "leaving agreement" or some BS like that. If he paid with a cheque, see if his address is on that. You NEED his address!

Keep it all friendly and shit, then slap him with an arbitration case. These assholes need to learn a lesson....trust me.

If you have any other questions, dont hesitate to ask....nothing pisses me off more than shit like this.

[Gridlock]

Now, the part that sucks...and it occured to me when I was looking at the paperwork from the RTA concerning collecting owed funds.

They do nothing in terms of collection. They give you a piece of paper that says your tenant owes you $xx...go to small claims and collect. Now, I just spent $50 to file with the RTA which they sometimes award you when you win...you have to be completely right, and them completely wrong.

Next, I go on down to the court house and file what, another $50 to start the small claims process, then take another day off work to go and deal with it in another month that it takes to go through the system.

And unfortunately, that is where the tenant wins. A landlord in good standing will pay what they owe to maintain their name. A tenant that walks will keep on walking.

[dinosaur]

To me, $50 is worth it. It is cheaper than filing a small-claims case against them.

Plus, if the tenant "keeps walking", a small claims case for unpaid for an RTA issue can go on your credit/record which will inhibit them from being able to rent again if the new potential landlord does a credit and background check on them.

This is why reputable apt building, etc require them. They're not just checking for late credit card payments.

[Leparto]

unless ur desperate for cash and u absolutely need the 2 months hes been occupying it for than go make a claim, if not just let it slide and learn from experience

plus, something is obviously up in his life
i mean he wasnt there for a whole month so hes not being a complete douche bag and just living there without paying

and as u said his mothers in the hospital

i mean if it was me and im not tight on cash id let it slide i mean he sounds like hes having a pretty tough time

[SpuGen]

I actually never recieved the Damage deposit.

I asked for it 3 times within the week or so that he lived in there. He kept postponing it because he was getting it from his boss.

He never had his mail forwarded here. AFAIK, his mail still went to his brothers house, which is where he's moving back to apparently.

Now, if I go do that $50 thing, and he says that he signed it on a different day, do I get fucked with a fine? or does it just go void and I lose $50 +2 Months of rent and time?

Funny thing about the Rent increase. We actually bumped it by $50 just to recoup the losses from the last tenant, whose girlfriend hiked up the ultilities cost for a year. But goddamn was she hot.

[orange7]

Funny thing about the Rent increase. We actually bumped it by $50 just to recoup the losses from the last tenant, whose girlfriend hiked up the ultilities cost for a year. But goddamn was she hot.

lol.. she got facebook? :haha:


yup.. probably bump it up for another $50 to slowly make up the loss? Plus everything is costing more now a day, and so should rent.

I dunno why I got fails even though the OP admitted using this idea previously.

haters gonna hate

[Meowjin]

where is your place? pm me with details.

[TouringTeg]

Some interesting info in here. Clearly your tenant owes you for July and August or at least until you find a new tenant. I am not sure it will be worth your time and energy to recoup the rent but that is up to you.

I am quite new to being a landlord (6 months) so I am still learning. I didn't know you had to file with the RTB to keep a tenant's security deposit. I had my tenant sign an RTA and received a 50% of the rent deposit prior to allowing them to move in. It also contains the requirements to receive the deposit back. It is a month to month lease which can be terminated any time with one month notice.

They have been 3-4 days late the last 3 months so I have to constantly remind him the rent is due. It is quite frustrating but I don't think there is a lot I can do. I had a previous landlord do a 6 month lease with post 6 post dated cheques. I think that was a great strategy to ensure that rent is paid on time. So long as the tenant has the money in their account!

[BlackZRoadster]

pics of the last tenants gf??

[gdoh]

is there any dmg to the place? i say just learn from it and always be cautious of who you rent to and make them sign a contract before moving in

+pics of gf =]

[Gridlock]

OK-OP, what exactly do you have for paperwork? Because as I read it, you don't have a signed lease, and you don't have a security deposit, which means he wasn't a tenant, he was a squatter. Am I wrong? If you were to go to the RTA, do you have anything indisputable that he lived there, and has a financial obligation to you?

AME_VIP-yeah, we learned that the hard way with our townhouse. If, when you are doing the walkthrough and there is damage and its not clean, and they agree that yeah, we owe you money, and sign off, then its not a problem. When they don't agree, you MUST go to the Tenancy branch within 15 days, pay $50 to file and submit to keep the deposit. The Branch then sends them a letter stating your intentions and gives them an option to dispute, and then off you go, you are going to have a hearing.

My advice is to avoid it at all costs. Use your knowledge against them. Let's say you have a deposit of $400 on the place, and you want $200 to cover damage and cleaning. Tell them you can get $200 in 2 weeks, or possibly $300 after dispute resolution in 2 months, but that you will go for keeping the whole thing. Most are going to get pissed off, but go with it.

My advice to anyone in the rental game, especially with just one or 2 investment props is don't set it and forget it!

Fuck, I have seen people get burned, been burned and heard of people being burned. It's a business, get off your ass and handle it that way. Be around. You are allowed to do monthly inspections. It's annoying, but if you are at all worried whats happening in the unit, then do it. We've all had to rent to a less preferred tenant to make sure the payments continue. Keep an eye on them.

The first thing it does is remind them that they are being watched. The thing the shitty tenants want the most is to be left alone. Trust me, they'll move and you'll be left with $500 damage instead of $2500 after a couple years.

Be a prick! If there are damages, tell them straight to their face that this is unacceptable. That's a personal lesson. It's really uncomfortable to do, but you can't let it slide. It's your house! They are trashing your house.

Don't let money back up. Look at the situations in this thread...back rent is due, and no security deposits. Why do you think he put off paying the deposit...he knew that was part 1 of 2, and if you aren't going to pay rent, it doesn't make sense to pay a deposit. First indicator.

Here are the rules I work with, and they have done me well.

Security deposit when they say they want to take the place, and sign the lease. Done. Pet deposit at that time if applicable. By this point, I have already done references and credit check. They are as clean as I can tell. A note on this, I don't like when they have a roll of cash when they are looking at the apartment. They will tell you, I will sign right now. That locks them in. If you take that money and say sweet, rented! Then do a credit check and of course its horrible-its too late, they are with you for a year, or more.

Rent due when they move in.

Late Rent:

It's due on the first. On the second, I slide a friendly, but firm reminder under their door that rent is past due.

On the third, they get an RTA 30-the 10 day pay to stay notice. I think it says you have 5 days to pay, or out in 10. That pisses people off like you wouldn't believe. But, while they are pissed off, they have their rent in hand.

I don't chase people down, and I don't go knocking on doors. I'm too busy. Everyone has a calendar and knows how the system works.

Holy, I went way further than expected, but I hate hearing about people getting screwed through renting.

Hope this helps.

[darkfroggy]

Not worth it. Be lucky he didn't trash the place.

[penner2k]

One piece of advice for next time.
Until you get the damage deposit you keep showing the place to other people. Once you get the damage deposit then you get them to sign the paperwork.
AFTER all of this is done you collect first months rent and hand them the keys.

[dinosaur]

If he claims that he did not actually sign it on June 2nd, it is your word against his.

HE did sign it with it being dated June 2nd. So in all honestly, you can lie and say it was sign on June 2nd. You will not get fined or anything, you will just lose the 50 bucks and the amount you are "suing" him for if the branch rules in his failure.

This does go without saying, but dude...in the future, you need to get the security deposit prior to him moving in. Always. It is the only thing you have to validate the tenant. This needs to be like a business. Forms signed, deposit, condition report, first months rent, etc...all your ducks need to be in a row before they get the keys. Don't get emotionally involved...tenants like this can smell ya out. I bet the previous tenant knew you thought she was "hot" and therefor, knew she could get away with it.

Same with this guy...he can give you whatever song and dance he wants (sick mother), but at the end of the day you need to decide whether you want to be taken atvantage of or not. It is not your fault or problem that his mom is sick. Much like it was not my problem when tenants come to me and tell me they lost their job, are sick, etc...Everyone is responsible for their obligations. End of story!

Shit happens in all of our lives, but at the end of the day you have people who use it to their advantage or act responsibly.

What I would do: Try you hardest to get his address or bro's address. Call his work, brother, google him, telus reverse phone look-up, etc. Get your RTA. Fill it all out. Write "pending" in the security deposit section. Make sure he has signed where he needs to....and make sure it is all dated for June 2nd. Go to the RTB and file a non-paying renter arbitration case against him. Claim that he signed it on June 2nd. He can say he didn't all he want, but the fact is, he signed it. Lie through your teeth dude.

When you get to the branch to do thee paper work, they will have you meet with an info clerk. Tell them your story. Tell them you met, he signed, said he was going to give you the deposit, didn't. Paid the first months rent, and the was MIA. Tell them you attempted contact with him but you couldn't find him. He shows up, you ask for money, he says he doesn't have it and proceeds to move his shit out on Aug 3rd.

Monetary claim:
-Security deposit.
-July Rent
-August Rent
-$50 filing fee.

They will give you are form that they will help you fill out. You must send it registered mail to him or if can be physically served to him (like at work or something...or even as he is coming out of the hospital after visiting his mom).

He can file back if he wants (he doesnt have a case)

You will receive a date for your arbitration hearing (teleconference).
You must submit your evidence 10 business days prior to the hearing date. Submit your RTA and proof that he was served as evidence. If you have any emails or voice mails where he says he will pay or acknowledges that he hasn't paid, submit those as well.

During the hearing, claimed he signed on the 2nd, paid June rent, and never paid anything else. Also, claim that he did not give one-month notice to vacate and therefor is responsible for August rent as well.

BEST CASE:
You win. You get July rent, August rent, and your 50$ filing fee, rent it for Sept 1, go on your merry way.

WORST CASE:
You lose. You lose you $50 filing fee and are out the rent and he walks away- attempt to rent for Aug 15 so you are only out 6 weeks of rent. Expensive lesson to learn, but be fucking hitler next time you rent to someone. Play by all the rules so when they fuck you, you fuck them harder.

Honestly, I think you have a good case if you claim he signed on the 2nd. You have proof...he doesn't. Whatever he says, deny deny deny. June 2nd it was. His character already looks poor b/c he didn't pay rent. At the hearing, keep it simple....he came, he signed, he didnt pay, he left. He will get emotion and use excuses and bury himself.

Like I said before, if it was me...I'd take it all the way. You are already out the rent as of right now....what another $50 to lose.

[dinosaur]

Some interesting info in here. Clearly your tenant owes you for July and August or at least until you find a new tenant. I am not sure it will be worth your time and energy to recoup the rent but that is up to you.

I am quite new to being a landlord (6 months) so I am still learning. I didn't know you had to file with the RTB to keep a tenant's security deposit. I had my tenant sign an RTA and received a 50% of the rent deposit prior to allowing them to move in. It also contains the requirements to receive the deposit back. It is a month to month lease which can be terminated any time with one month notice.

They have been 3-4 days late the last 3 months so I have to constantly remind him the rent is due. It is quite frustrating but I don't think there is a lot I can do. I had a previous landlord do a 6 month lease with post 6 post dated cheques. I think that was a great strategy to ensure that rent is paid on time. So long as the tenant has the money in their account!

If a tenant has been late 3 or more times with in a reasonable time period (on year), you can issue a 30-day eviction notice based on late payment of rent. No questions asked.

However, I would recommend doing to 10-day pay to stay notices OR at least, have three warning letters stating that if they are late another ___ times or whatever, they will be issued a 30-day eviction notice without warning.

I guarantee that they will magically being paying rent on time next month.

The 1st comes the same time every month people!

[TouringTeg]

Great info thanks Dinosaur! I have a lot to learn still. 10-day pay to stay would be best because beside late payment he is an excellent tenant.

[dinosaur]

Great info thanks Dinosaur! I have a lot to learn still. 10-day pay to stay would be best because beside late payment he is an excellent tenant.

Yeah....sounds like he just needs a kick in the ass. As Gridlock said above...we came down hard on a few tenants and have not had a problem since.

The saying "give an inch, they'll take a mile" has never applied so much in my life until I started dealing with tenants.

[Kim Jong Un]

Tell him you'll make him a deal, keep his girlfriend and let the rent slide.

[cunninglinguist]

As some others as stated, chalk this up as a life lesson and be glad they are gone with minimum fuss. I don't think its worth the stress to collect.

[Mr.HappySilp]

Had something like that happen to me in the begging of this year. Rented out my apartment and everything went well for the first month.

2nd month the cheque bonuce so I call her up. Her phone always goes to Voice Mail, so I call her office and they said she no longer works there.

Went to the apartment and lock on the doors several times a day for a few days. Then what I did is call the police explain to them what happen and let them know The renter haven't shown up for work at all, Phone went to Voice mail and it seems she is never home at all. Let the police know she might be in danger or something might happen to her. So I went to the apartment with the police, they knock on the doors a few times with no one to answer sot they tole me to open the apartment which I did. BAM she was in there the whole time.

Anyways, after that she move out peacefully the next week. I lost 2 months of rent but hey at least nothing is damage. So I guess if the tentate is playing this cat and mouse game where they never pick up their phone and when ever u go to their house no one asnwer and lights are off all thet ime you might be able to get the police to pay them a visit. The police won't deal with this stuff be at least they know you are onto them and you will use your rescourse to get them out of your property.

Also I believe there is a new form out in Jan which does help landlord to push tentates out of the unit faster(I think it shortens the process to one to two weeks).

But yea there is always a risk to rent.

[Death2Theft]

IIRC if a tenant doesn't notify you and you dont see them for 3 days you are allowed to box up all their belongings put it in storage and file abandonment.

[The7even]

One piece of advice for next time.
Until you get the damage deposit you keep showing the place to other people. Once you get the damage deposit then you get them to sign the paperwork.
AFTER all of this is done you collect first months rent and hand them the keys.

one question, is that you in that avatar?

[ws6ta]

i have to deal with RTO a lot. if you can avoid dealing with them and just come to some type of understanding with tenant it is your best bet. they tend to favor tenants.

threatening tenants is also a bad idea!! they will mess up your house. trying to sue them is a pain in the ass, and trying to get paid after winning the settlement isn't any easier!

[Great68]

IIRC if a tenant doesn't notify you and you dont see them for 3 days you are allowed to box up all their belongings put it in storage and file abandonment.

Incorrect:

Abandonment of personal property
24 (1) A landlord may consider that a tenant has abandoned personal property if

(a) the tenant leaves the personal property on residential property that he or she has vacated after the tenancy agreement has ended, or

(b) subject to subsection (2), the tenant leaves the personal property on residential property

(i) that, for a continuous period of one month, the tenant has not ordinarily occupied and for which he or she has not paid rent, or


3 Days would make absolutely no sense, especially if the rent is paid.

[SpuGen]

Do I have a time limit to file for the thing to get my money back?

Mom's feeling nice.. wants to give him 2 weeks in case he decides to get mad and trashes the property.

I want to do it asap.

[Great68]

I thought you said he moved all his stuff out...

He has abandoned the tenancy, you don't have to let him back in, so I don't know why you'd be worried about him trashing the property...

[SpuGen]

I thought you said he moved all his stuff out...

He has abandoned the tenancy, you don't have to let him back in, so I don't know why you'd be worried about him trashing the property...

I'm not worried about the suite.
Locks have been changed.

It's the rest of the house shes worried about.
Windows/Cars/etc.

[GrapeDrink]

yeah since I read that you pretty much don't really have any paperwork on him, I'm going to agree with what most people here have been saying and take this as a life lesson, This happened to my parents before too but our tenant was even more horror story, not only did he not pay the last months rent, he wanted his deposit back. I got pissed off and made a couple threats to him afterward and he just ended up fucking up some of the furniture and a window and leaving in the middle of the night lol. So ya don't make the same mistake as me

[dinosaur]

there is no official time limit, but the sooner the better.

it will take a while for the hearing to happen and in a all reality, if he pays by then, you can withdraw you case.

i say file now while it is all still fresh in your mind. if he damages anything, you can just add it to the case and he'll really be fucked.