[epicbeardman]

I have a Civic Ep3 (2002) that I really enjoy driving. It's peppy, fun, handles well and great on gas. Out of curiosity I checked craigslist and I saw a few Preludes going for under 8grand. I wanted to get a prelude back in high school, but it was out of my budget. But now they're at a price I can afford. If you were me, would you switch the Ep3 for a Prelude? This would be in a few months time. The models I am looking at are the Vtec ones (SE/SH) around 98-01 with a 5spd manual. *note: I have never driven a Prelude so I don't know how they feel. The other option is to keep my Ep3 and save up for a K20A2 (1500 more to go :( ).

[TypeRNammer]

If I were you I would just keep the car.

It's already a big hassle if you're trying to sell the ep3 to get a prelude.

EDIT:

If you do sell your car, don't be like this dumbass who completely copied the Mugen Concept EP3 specs LOL

http://vancouver.en.craigslist.ca/nvn/cto/2315700118.html

[spoon.ek9]

there's actually a guy looking to buy an EP3 on VCC (rather desperately). the prelude would give you a lot more torque and better handling (if you get type SH) but would be a heavier chassis to deal with. same creature comforts with power options and i believe many came with leather interior and heated seats. just depends what you want out of the car. gas mileage will not be good compared to the EP3 of course.

[Eros250]

I own rsx and ep3, they are both very good handling cars. Only thing the ep3 is lacking is little power which you are planning to upgrade. I have driven my buddies prelude wasn't that impressed. They are sluggish. I 'd say keep it and upgrade the performance and get some decent suspension work and your set.

[civic_rice]

Keep the minivan.... i like them and it has a k already....

[jpark]

both nice cars, but prelude seems to have quite a bit of cosmetic problems,

experience from my buddy's old car a 99 prelude,
headlight condensing extremly common, burnt alot of oil, window motor died quickly etc.

[jjson]

^jpark knows what he's talking about :)

[FN-2199]

Sell the EP3. Get a hybrid :troll:

[Peturbo]

Keep the minivan.... i like them and it has a k already....

K20A2
Found in:
2002-2004 RSX Type-S (USDM)
2002-2004 Honda Integra Type R (Australia)
2002-2005 Honda Civic Type R (EP3, European)
Displacement: 1,998 cc (121.9 cu in)
Compression: 11.0:1
Power: 200 hp @ 7800 rpm
Torque: 142 ft·lbf (196N·m) @ 5600 rpm
Rev limit: 8100 rpm (USDM RSX-S, U.K Civic-R )
Redline: 7900 rpm
i-VTEC engagement: 5800 rpm

K20A3
Found In
2002-2005 Honda Civic Si (EP3)
2002-2005 Honda Civic SiR (EP3)(Canadian version of US Civic Si)
2002-2006 Acura RSX
Displacement: 1,998 cc (121.9 cu in)
Compression: 9.8:1
Power: 160 hp(120 kW) @ 6500 rpm(SAE net J1349 Rev 8/04)
Torque: 140 lb·ft (190 N·m)* (191 N·m) @ 5000 rpm(SAE net J1349 Rev 8/04)
Redline: 6700 rpm
i-VTEC Engagement Window: 2200 rpm

[TOS'd]

If you do sell your car, don't be like this dumbass who completely copied the Mugen Concept EP3 specs LOL

http://vancouver.en.craigslist.ca/nvn/cto/2315700118.html

Dash-mounted (European) stick shift (rare)
lol

[Groot]

Keep the ep3 and do the k20a2 swap!
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[Fobman]

keep the ep3

[J-Chow]

keep the civic.

[dinamix]

Obvious answer is obvious
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[epicbeardman]

Keep the minivan.... i like them and it has a k already....

Yes, but the K series in my car is weak sauce. I am just wondering whether it would be worth it to spend extra money on a k20a2, when I can just get a Prelude for the price of my Civic.

I guess the consensus is to keep the civic.

[TypeRNammer]

Even if it's weaksauce, how often do you do spirited driving?

[RabidRat]

The prelude feels slow. Slower than the EP3 with 40 less hp. Handles like a boat too while the EP3 is anything but. Honestly it's a downgrade, you should really keep what you have.

Anyway the only way you'll really be convinced is if you go and try one for yourself. I suspect you'll come to the same conclusion.

[doma]

The prelude feels slow. Slower than the EP3 with 40 less hp. Handles like a boat too while the EP3 is anything but. Honestly it's a downgrade, you should really keep what you have.

Anyway the only way you'll really be convinced is if you go and try one for yourself. I suspect you'll come to the same conclusion.

Handles like a boat? I dont know what you were driving, but it wasnt a prelude.
http://www.caranddriver.com/features/archive/1998_10best_cars-10best_cars/1998_honda_prelude_page_8

[JAYWALKER]

i'd rather get a prelude srv then the new SE/SH. and if i were you, i'd keep the EP3.

but then its your choice, not others

[oldsnail]

i have an ep3 and prelude now..
the ep3 is better. prelude isnt great on fuel, more expensive to maintain. but it is a good cruiser and i use it as my beater.. .. i 've owned 2x bb4 and a bb6 lude and prefer the older ones...

[Cillu]

Try test driving a prelude and see how it feels.

[death_blossom]

Try test driving a prelude and see how it feels.
THIS.

I can't believe no one has suggested that yet.

I agree with the consensus, the Civic is probably your better choice. more nimble and I wouldn't dog the k20a3. even though it only has 160hp, it still has iVTEC and more technology built into the engine. so you'll probably get more low-mid range punch compared to the H22A.

[smoothie.]

I always wanted a prelude.

I never test drove a 5spd one until about 2 weeks ago while looking for another car. What a let down... It didnt feel very fast, and hitting high revs to get power doesn't cut it for me anymore.

Keep your civic...saves $$ on gas for the motor swap.

[chucki]

The prelude feels slow. Slower than the EP3 with 40 less hp. Handles like a boat too while the EP3 is anything but. Honestly it's a downgrade, you should really keep what you have.

Anyway the only way you'll really be convinced is if you go and try one for yourself. I suspect you'll come to the same conclusion.

Say what!? I used to own a Prelude (5th gen) and I gave you a ride in it back in the day when I used to do autocross! Remember the red one? Yellow fogs? It was when you still had the Mazda 3. It wasn't a bad ride was it? Although I had aftermarket suspension installed at the time, I can honestly say the car handled very well even with the stock suspension.

I have an Ep3 now (FOR SALE btw), and I can tell you I miss my Prelude more than I will be missing this. Its not that the Civic is not a great handling car, but the engine of the two vehicles are so fundamentally different, it is hard to compare. When Vtec kicks in for the ep3 (if it qualifies as Vtec) at 2200rpm, it is NOT noticeable at all. It is only on the intake cam, and there is no special high-rpm profiles at all. The prelude however, when Vtec kicked in, you KNOW its working. Its a full vtec system with intake and exhaust timing and it feels completely different. The sound too, makes the experience two very different thing.

HOWEVER, given a choice back then, I think I will still stick with the ep3 because it is much MUCH better on gas, (burns less and only 87 vs 91 for prelude) and there is a noticeable difference in more low end torque on the ep3, which suits my everyday driving needs.

Go with the k20a2, you won't regret it.

[oldsnail]

The prelude feels slow. Slower than the EP3 with 40 less hp. Handles like a boat too while the EP3 is anything but. Honestly it's a downgrade, you should really keep what you have.

Anyway the only way you'll really be convinced is if you go and try one for yourself. I suspect you'll come to the same conclusion.


i have both of them right now.. the civic is better built and better overall.. but i find power wise.. prelude has much more power band than the civic making it a great hwy cruiser for passing etc.

[MindBomber]

Yes, but the K series in my car is weak sauce. I am just wondering whether it would be worth it to spend extra money on a k20a2, when I can just get a Prelude for the price of my Civic.

I guess the consensus is to keep the civic.

The cost of k-series swaps has come down significantly, if you took the time to search and wait for a good deal I'd be willing to bet that you can get a k20a2 swap for under $2000. Plus, you still have the k20a3 and you can probably sell that for $500.

[TypeRNammer]

The cost of k-series swaps has come down significantly, if you took the time to search and wait for a good deal I'd be willing to bet that you can get a k20a2 swap for under $2000. Plus, you still have the k20a3 and you can probably sell that for $500.

Really? The transmission alone is over a grand, unless I'm not looking hard enough.
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[MindBomber]

Really? The transmission alone is over a grand, unless I'm not looking hard enough.
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I've seen a couple swaps in that range locally, but I seem to have pretty good luck with finding cheap used parts.

[RabidRat]

Say what!? I used to own a Prelude (5th gen) and I gave you a ride in it back in the day when I used to do autocross! Remember the red one? Yellow fogs? It was when you still had the Mazda 3. It wasn't a bad ride was it? Although I had aftermarket suspension installed at the time, I can honestly say the car handled very well even with the stock suspension.

I have an Ep3 now (FOR SALE btw), and I can tell you I miss my Prelude more than I will be missing this. Its not that the Civic is not a great handling car, but the engine of the two vehicles are so fundamentally different, it is hard to compare. When Vtec kicks in for the ep3 (if it qualifies as Vtec) at 2200rpm, it is NOT noticeable at all. It is only on the intake cam, and there is no special high-rpm profiles at all. The prelude however, when Vtec kicked in, you KNOW its working. Its a full vtec system with intake and exhaust timing and it feels completely different. The sound too, makes the experience two very different thing.

HOWEVER, given a choice back then, I think I will still stick with the ep3 because it is much MUCH better on gas, (burns less and only 87 vs 91 for prelude) and there is a noticeable difference in more low end torque on the ep3, which suits my everyday driving needs.

Go with the k20a2, you won't regret it.

Oh crap I should've known you're on here too hahahaha.

You're right though, that was pretty good =). I guess my other friend's isn't in as good condition then, because when I drove an EP3 shortly after, it was a big difference to me.

[twitchyzero]

i thought k20a swaps are usually over 10k...how come you can get k20a2's for a few thousand? it's not that much different, no?

[epicbeardman]

The cost of k-series swaps has come down significantly, if you took the time to search and wait for a good deal I'd be willing to bet that you can get a k20a2 swap for under $2000. Plus, you still have the k20a3 and you can probably sell that for $500.

The cheapest I have ever found a K20a2 was for 2800 that was engine and trans and I didn't have the funds at the time so I couldn't get it. Where are you finding these cheap K20s??? haha

I guess I'll keep the Civic. I'm also thinking of a K24A2 instead of the K20. Any opinions on what would be better for the Civic?

[death_blossom]

i thought k20a swaps are usually over 10k...how come you can get k20a2's for a few thousand? it's not that much different, no?

k20a swap is over 10k for an EG or EK series civic. lot more labour and parts involved with a swap like that. for an EP3, it's easier since the mounts will line up perfectly and other stuff. heck, I'm sure you can re-use the stock 5spd if you really wanted to.

[TypeRNammer]

Either way, even if you swap in another motor, don't you need a k-pro to run the motor?

Second best option would be the k24a2. A bunch of people on ep hatch favor this motor.
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[RabidRat]

Either way, even if you swap in another motor, don't you need a k-pro to run the motor?

Second best option would be the k24a2. A bunch of people on ep hatch favor this motor.
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Is the VTEC changeover noticeable on the K24 paired to a manual? I felt nothing driving a loaner TSX in 5AT haha.

[MindBomber]

The cheapest I have ever found a K20a2 was for 2800 that was engine and trans and I didn't have the funds at the time so I couldn't get it. Where are you finding these cheap K20s??? haha

I guess I'll keep the Civic. I'm also thinking of a K24A2 instead of the K20. Any opinions on what would be better for the Civic?

I guess I'm just lucky :fullofwin:

But seriously, I've seen a complete k20a2 swap for $1700 and another K20a2 w/ a 6 speed for $2500 recently. The deals are out there, you just need to find someone who was to cheap to pay for collision :whistle:

[spoon.ek9]

OP, you should consider keeping your current engine and doing the type r head conversion. the biggest flaw in your engine is the head. you'll need other parts (ie k-pro) to make it work but it has been done many times before.

i thought k20a swaps are usually over 10k...how come you can get k20a2's for a few thousand? it's not that much different, no?

k20a swap is over 10k for an EG or EK series civic. lot more labour and parts involved with a swap like that. for an EP3, it's easier since the mounts will line up perfectly and other stuff. heck, I'm sure you can re-use the stock 5spd if you really wanted to.

^ truth! if you put a k-series into any EF/EG/EK/DC, it will easily surpass $10,000

[death_blossom]

Either way, even if you swap in another motor, don't you need a k-pro to run the motor?

why can't you just re-wire the harness a little and run the stock k20a2 ECU?

[MindBomber]

why can't you just re-wire the harness a little and run the stock k20a2 ECU?

You can run the stock ECU on a K-series swap, but if you go that route you need to have the car towed to a dealership to reflash the ECU so that it will start with the new key.

[TypeRNammer]

Is the VTEC changeover noticeable on the K24 paired to a manual? I felt nothing driving a loaner TSX in 5AT haha.

Don't expect anything noticeable on the TSX, I think the engagement point is at 6000rpm.
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[death_blossom]

You can run the stock ECU on a K-series swap, but if you go that route you need to have the car towed to a dealership to reflash the ECU so that it will start with the new key.

ohhhh, gotcha!

[snowball]

Keep the EP3, even though the prelude might offer slightly more fun in power for spirited drives, in the end you will always want some practicality to lean back on which the prelude doesn't have, the back seats are stupidly cramped and the trunk is tiny. EP3, more refined, better mileage, more practical and still fun.

[TypeRNammer]

If you guys see any 6 speed transmissions kicking around, LMK :troll:

[cheapskate]

The Prelude feels slow and bloated. The driving position is really bad also since you sit really low (like a celica) while the nose is really long so your view is really bad and it takes quite some time to adjust to that. I love Honda's and even with that bias I think the Prelude is subpar at best.

Your EP3 is a much much better car. It feels lighter, more peppy, the proportions are better (smaller = better handling), more modern design, and a hatch to boot.

[jack3d]

prelude because it looks sexy

[epicbeardman]

thnx for the responses. I will pass on the Prelude for now. Thinking of another car now: something RWD to learn to drift in. Call it a pipe dream or whatever, but I'd like to learn the mechanics of going sideways.
if you guys had an ep3 would any of you guys trade it for say, a 240sx with an SR20/ae86/soarer/old supra, etc etc? If i sell my ep3 , i can probably get 6-7gs for it, plus the money I saved up for a k20 get go towards a busted ass 240 and an sr20. Looking at the long term, it's going to take tons more money to get an ep3 to put out as much power as an s13/14/supra/etc.

[death_blossom]

if you are serious about learning how to drift, like really REALLY serious then buy a cheap 240sx. that way you can smash it up and stuff. cuz if you want to drift good, you're gonna be hitting stuff and breaking mechanical components fairly often.

[Shorn]

if you are serious about learning how to drift, like really REALLY serious then buy a cheap 240sx. that way you can smash it up and stuff. cuz if you want to drift good, you're gonna be hitting stuff and breaking mechanical components fairly often.

i have one that i'm trying to sell cause i got a new car :whistle:
asking 1000 cause its rusty + speedo is not working. other than that good to go. manual of course. and red!! if i don't sell it to this guy who's been asking for a while i'll sell it to you!

[annamaaae]

If you're trying to sell your EP3, i'll gladly buy it off you. I've been looking around for one.