[Jas29]

Hey one of my friends rented out there basement to someone that smokes he wasn't supposed to smoke inside the house but he is. There is no contract or anything how would you go about evicting him.

They have told him to stop smoking inside and he said okay but continued to do it.

Afterwards they offered him his rent back and for him to find a new place and he agree'd but doesn't look like hes going to leave anytime soon

[CRS]

Is this a legal suite/rental?

[Soundy]

Put all his shit in garbage bags, stick it out on the lawn, and change the locks.

[Manic!]

Put all his shit in garbage bags, stick it out on the lawn, and change the locks.

Yep, with no contract he is just an unwanted guest.

[Spidey]

Yep, with no contract he is just an unwanted guest.

Not true. Although a landlord/tenancy agreement must be a written contract, the fact that the landlord went ahead and rented out a suite to a tenant, albeit illegally, can still come back to bite him in the ass.

http://www.rto.gov.bc.ca/documents/GL20.pdf

[broken_arrow]

Here is my concern. Contract may be implied from conduct/actions of the parties, i. e. implied contract. For a valid contract, all you need is:

1) Intention (to form a contract between two parties),
2) Consideration from both sides (advancement of money for instance), and usually but not always, each party has to experience some sort of...
3) Detriment/benefit

There was an implied intention between your friend and the tenant. The tenant has paid rent hence consideration was advanced by him to your friend, similarly your friend has advanced his basement as consideration from his side. Your friend has suffered a detriment by renting out his place, but incurred a benefit by accepting rent moneys; the tenant has incurred a detriment by parting with his money, but similarly received a benefit in a sense that he got a place to live in...

Throwing out the tenant's stuff and locking him out will for sure lead to litigation...

[Spidey]

Here is my concern. Contract may be implied from conduct/actions of the parties, i. e. implied contract. For a valid contract, all you need is:

1)Intention (to form a contract between two parties),
2) Consideration from both sides (advancement of money for instance), and usually but not always, each party has to experience some sort of...
3) Detriment/benefit

There was an implied intention between your friend and the tenant. The tenant has paid rent hence consideration was advanced by him to your friend, similarly your friend has advanced his basement as consideration from his side. Your friend has suffered a detriment by renting out his place, but incurred a benefit by accepting rent moneys; the tenant has incurred a detriment by parting with his money, but similarly received a benefit in a sense that he got a place to live in...

Throwing out the tenant's stuff and locking him out will for sure lead to litigation...

Yup! In another words, I hope your friend has a good lawyer. A lot of "landlords" think they have the upper hand by accepting cash, and entering into a "verbal" agreement, but the Residential Tenancy Act protects the tenant. period. The best thing for your friend to do is contact the RT branch and look at what his options are. In the end he could get in trouble for entering into an illegal contract.

[Jas29]

its a legal suite

hmm i'll try calling them and see what they say

[Spidey]

its a legal suite

hmm i'll try calling them and see what they say

I am not talking about the suite, when I said illegal. The fact that your friend is renting out his space to a tenant, without any type of written contract/agreement makes what he is doing, illegal.

[Mr.HappySilp]

If yoru friend told the renter he needs to move in the beginning of the month (beginning of Feb) then the renter only have a few days left.

If he doens't move put an fire alarm in the besement suite and lock it up so if he smokes it will keep going off. Don't disable it. That will force him to move.

[Jas29]

If yoru friend told the renter he needs to move in the beginning of the month (beginning of Feb) then the renter only have a few days left.

If he doens't move put an fire alarm in the besement suite and lock it up so if he smokes it will keep going off. Don't disable it. That will force him to move.

That sounds like a good idea

[Spidey]

If yoru friend told the renter he needs to move in the beginning of the month (beginning of Feb) then the renter only have a few days left.

If he doens't move put an fire alarm in the besement suite and lock it up so if he smokes it will keep going off. Don't disable it. That will force him to move.

so the fact that his friend "verbally" told him he had to leave, makes it legit? You may want to think about that. You guys need look at the RT Act, and its respective website informing both landlords and tenants of their own rights.

[melloman]

^^ But the alarm would probably be so loud it would annoy your friend too. :pokerface:

[Glove]

when the guy is out, change the locks, take all his shit, dump it at nearest salvation army.

You never seen this guy before in your life

[Soundy]

I am not talking about the suite, when I said illegal. The fact that your friend is renting out his space to a tenant, without any type of written contract/agreement makes what he is doing, illegal.
How is a verbal agreement not legal? It may be stupid, but in general, stupidity is not a crime.

If he doens't move put an fire alarm in the besement suite and lock it up so if he smokes it will keep going off. Don't disable it. That will force him to move.
Better yet, have the smoke detector set off a sprinkler. POINT MADE.

[bcedhk]

+1 on the fire alarm idea. hardwire it so he can't disable it. In fact, put one on the bedroom one in the living room and in the washroom and sync them so they go on at the same :)

[MindBomber]

Cigarette smoke will not set off a fire alarm, generally.

Even in a small room, he would need to chain smoke for hours.

[Spidey]

How is a verbal agreement not legal? It may be stupid, but in general, stupidity is not a crime.


Better yet, have the smoke detector set off a sprinkler. POINT MADE.

I should rephrase. Verbal agreements aren't illegal, but you will have a fun time proving one was made.

[Soundy]

I should rephrase. Verbal agreements aren't illegal, but you will have a fun time proving one was made.

True.

Then again, so will the renter. OP could claim the guy's been squatting.

[Gridlock]

This is devolving into bad information.

Getting rid of a shitty tenant is not a new problem. No you can't play games, dump their shit on the lawn or any of the other multitude of suggestions here. It does NOT matter if you have a lease or not when it comes to the POV of the tenant as there is a standard defacto lease in place by nature of trading living quarters for cash.

So when I yell and scream and swear on here, "use a lease" and "make an addendum with reasonable policies and financial considerations"...I'm not wasting my breath. You are going to have a lease anyway...shouldn't it be yours?

What do you want on your addendum? Is having it rented for a year important to you? Then you want a financial consideration if they want to move early.

Is smoking inside important to you? Then you want it documented that smoking is outside, and this is what will occur if you smoke inside.

And then when you go to deal with the bureaucrats at the branch who we've decided to give power to in these scenarios..you aren't picking your ass when they ask to see your paperwork. :)

That said(for the 15th time LOL): Your situation.

Getting rid of a shitty tenant.

Document everything. If you are going to have a verbal conversation, have a written letter that describes the talking points, signed and dated that you leave a copy of, and keep a copy of.

Make notes of verbal conversations if they catch you off guard.

You need to show that: there is a quantifiable problem. That problem needs to be reasonable. You tried to solve said problem. Problem not solved, and the only way to end it now is they move out.

You need to remember that: These people hear from every idiot tenant and landlord in the city and are not going to accept whatever bullshit you create and say, "gee, ok...that guy has to move."

On smoking: Good luck. You can make a health and safety issue(ie. smoke is permeating others living quarters..asthma...cancer....smell blah blah blah) You can make a damage issue(ie. The walls are stained, and drapes are fucked) Unfortunately, you won't succeed with "they WILL be damaged" the damage has to occur. Not much, but its what you can prove, not what you know.

And you prepare it all, file at the branch and enter the big ole crapshoot that is: getting the branch to agree to terminate for a reason other than money. It's the spaghetti approach...throw it against the wall.

In the meantime, you make life difficult. Raise rent if you can, say no to unusual requests...DO NOT BE A DICK ABOUT THIS, remember, you need to look pretty for the "judge". If they are loud, ask them to quiet down and so on.

[Jas29]

I usually use this form http://www.rto.gov.bc.ca/documents/RTB-1.pdf and add whatever i need to on the back and get them to sign the back of the paper too if I need to add anything

but this isn't my basement that is rented

thanks everyone for the help

[Spidey]

True.

Then again, so will the renter. OP could claim the guy's been squatting.

true. good ol civil litigations!

[6793026]

when the guy is out, change the locks, take all his shit, dump it at nearest salvation army.

You never seen this guy before in your life

if you do this, they will sue your assssssssss and you're so going to get ass raped. I have heard someone do this during the winter and the penalities were bad.

[Glove]

^ you get someone else to move in the next day and sign a lease thats backdated 6 months

[Manic!]

if you do this, they will sue your assssssssss and you're so going to get ass raped. I have heard someone do this during the winter and the penalities were bad.

Guy can't pay rent, you think he has money for a lawyer?

[Spidey]

Guy can't pay rent, you think he has money for a lawyer?

can'y pay , or won't pay. different things

[Manic!]

can'y pay , or won't pay. different things

If he won't pay his rent you think he would pay a lawyer? and whats the lawyer going to do?


The Police will not do anything because this is a landlord tenant issue. He could file a claim with the RTB but that will cost him $50 and the hearing could be months away. The first thing they are going to ask for is a rental agreement.

Change the locks leave his stuff in there. The cops can't do anything. He can file with the RTB but that will mean he is without his stuff for at least a month. If he want's his stuff sooner tell him to bring a moving truck.

[Mr.HappySilp]

Why not say a relative is moving in or family member is moving. Have it viedo recorded and make him an agreement stating that.

I beleive when you have a relative moving in then they have to move unless there is a contract sign.

[Gridlock]

He does not need a lawyer to get compensation.

I have said it before and I'll say it again: Lawyers do not get involved in tenancy law.

Whether or not you think you have a rental contact with this tenant, you do. If you accept money for a space you are 'renting' without a tenancy agreement it is called for Use and Occupancy.

Same rules and guidelines apply. Your friend can not 'evict' for smoking....or change the locks...or throw his shit out...or even go into the tenants place without proper notice.

Your friend is going to have to suck it up. He dun fucked up. Now, he has to pay the consequence.

If your friend fucks up at all (changes locks, touches the tenant's shit, etc) all the tenant needs to do is go to the RTB and file a dispute resolution. He can be fined up to $5000. What happens if your friend chooses not to pay? All the tenant needs to do is go to small claims...pay $120. A judge will look at the case, see he has already won, and order your friends' wages to be garnished.

[Mr.HappySilp]

He does not need a lawyer to get compensation.

I have said it before and I'll say it again: Lawyers do not get involved in tenancy law.

Whether or not you think you have a rental contact with this tenant, you do. If you accept money for a space you are 'renting' without a tenancy agreement it is called for Use and Occupancy.

Same rules and guidelines apply. Your friend can not 'evict' for smoking....or change the locks...or throw his shit out...or even go into the tenants place without proper notice.

Your friend is going to have to suck it up. He dun fucked up. Now, he has to pay the consequence.

If your friend fucks up at all (changes locks, touches the tenant's shit, etc) all the tenant needs to do is go to the RTB and file a dispute resolution. He can be fined up to $5000. What happens if your friend chooses not to pay? All the tenant needs to do is go to small claims...pay $120. A judge will look at the case, see he has already won, and order your friends' wages to be garnished.

What if his friend said a fmaily member is moving downstaris. I beleive that is allow even if the tenant don't want to move. The tenant have to move if that's case right?

[Spidey]

What if his friend said a fmaily member is moving downstaris. I beleive that is allow even if the tenant don't want to move. The tenant have to move if that's case right?

google residential tenancy branch

[Gridlock]

What if his friend said a fmaily member is moving downstaris. I beleive that is allow even if the tenant don't want to move. The tenant have to move if that's case right?

Then your friend would have to give the tenant a 2-month eviction notice for "landlord's use of property".

The tenant can choose to leave after 1 month and receive the equivalent on one month's rent in compensation or stay the full 2 months with the last month being free.

The tenant CAN fight the eviction notice and your friend will need to prove that family, is in fact, moving to the rental unit.

Your friend will also need to give the notice properly (BEFORE the end of the month, not on the first)...this means that, at the earliest, the tenant will be asked to move by May 31st.

[Manic!]

Then your friend would have to give the tenant a 2-month eviction notice for "landlord's use of property".

The tenant can choose to leave after 1 month and receive the equivalent on one month's rent in compensation or stay the full 2 months with the last month being free.

The tenant CAN fight the eviction notice and your friend will need to prove that family, is in fact, moving to the rental unit.

Your friend will also need to give the notice properly (BEFORE the end of the month, not on the first)...this means that, at the earliest, the tenant will be asked to move by May 31st.

Even with the notice he still may not leave.

[Soundy]

I think OP's friend would be happy if the guy just stopped smoking in the house...

[dinosaur]

Here are your friend's options:

1.) Use a 2-month eviction notice and move family into the suite. He may take it and move....he may fight it. If your friend can prove family is moving in...he will have to move.

2.) Give him a 30-day eviction notice for reason: Threatening the health and Safety of neighbours (second-hand smoke). This is a crap-shoot...your friend may win....he may not. He may not even get past filling out the paperwork before being laughed out of the tenancy branch.

3.) Hope he fucks up. Stay on top of him for every thing....late on rent? 10-day order. Late on rent 3 times within 12 months? Evict. Loud? Letter. Damage? Letter. Start doing monthly inspections. Basically, collapse his existence. Make is uncomfortable...eventually he will leave.

4.) Suck it up. Your friend and his family will have a daily reminder that they made a terrible, uneducated decision. Use their time ACTUALLY reading the RTA and using it to their advantage when the tenant fucks up. They can also spend this time to practice filling out a tenancy agreement for their next tenant.

Never ever forget.....the shitty tenants always know the RTA like the back of their hand. They know their rights and will use them to fuck you.

[DarkVerses]

If there is no contract then it is assumed to be a month to month basis and your friend can serve him with a 1 month eviction notice. The form can be found online. You can NOT throw his stuff out. You can NOT lock him out. It HAS to be one month notice.

[dinosaur]

If there is no contract then it is assumed to be a month to month basis and your friend can serve him with a 1 month eviction notice. The form can be found online. You can NOT throw his stuff out. You can NOT lock him out. It HAS to be one month notice.

Regardless if a tenant is on a fix-term term or month to month lease, you still need to have reason to evict.

A landlord can NOT evict a tenant without reason.

[Graeme S]

No better place than this thread for advice from y'alls, I suppose.

If one were to sign a one-year lease stipulating "lease may be renewed at the sole behest of the lessor", would you be able to force the tenant out at the end of the year? It's one of those things that's always mildly confused me. I mean, I know that one-year leases once they lapse and if there's no new lease signed turn into month-to-month, but what happens if you only want a suite or space occupied for a year and not longer? Can you use the lease to say "ok, you had your year, now get out."?

[GLOW]

Regardless if a tenant is on a fix-term term or month to month lease, you still need to have reason to evict.

A landlord can NOT evict a tenant without reason.

but letting a lease run out and choosing not to renew (thereby having the tenant to move out) does not constitute as eviction correct? b/c if i'm not mistaken the RTA has 1 line that states at end of the term if both parties agree you can

a) go to month to month
b) resign for another term

[dinosaur]

Yes. You can have a fixed-term lease that terminates at the end of the lease period.

This is what the section of our lease agreements look like:

16009

[Gridlock]

No better place than this thread for advice from y'alls, I suppose.

If one were to sign a one-year lease stipulating "lease may be renewed at the sole behest of the lessor", would you be able to force the tenant out at the end of the year? It's one of those things that's always mildly confused me. I mean, I know that one-year leases once they lapse and if there's no new lease signed turn into month-to-month, but what happens if you only want a suite or space occupied for a year and not longer? Can you use the lease to say "ok, you had your year, now get out."?

Yes, you can put a term in play, and rent it for a year and a year only. You need to do that at the start, and on the tenancy branch lease, you have to initial that everyone understands the terms of the lease. You can't sneak it through.

I used it once. We liked her, and had doubts on the room mate, so I told them straight up, I'll go month to month after the year if everything works, but if not, I won't renew the lease.

At the end of that term, you don't need to buy them out, or compensate them. They move, you take your place back and you are done.

[dinosaur]

but letting a lease run out and choosing not to renew (thereby having the tenant to move out) does not constitute as eviction correct? b/c if i'm not mistaken the RTA has 1 line that states at end of the term if both parties agree you can

a) go to month to month
b) resign for another term

If it is stated in the tenancy agreement that after a specific term, the tenant must move out, its fine. But, if it has not been previously discussed, documented, and signed on the lease is automatically considered a 'month-to-month' agreement by the branch and therefore, you can not evict without reason.

All these terms MUST be discussed upon signing and MUST be on the lease. As you can see from the attached above, there are really only two options.