[Ferra]

what are the pros and cons if I am looking for a car that's going to be driven 60,000km+ per year?

Assuming 60-70% highway driving and 30-40% city.
Hoping to keep the car for at least 4+ years (250,000km+)
Small compact car with excellent mileage and plenty of trunk storage space

I am leaning more toward diesel since I've always heard diesel engine are built to last for very high mileage (correct me if I am wrong)
Diesel is also better for highway driving, but the diff in fuel cost is probably not much

The only problem is there isn't much choice for diesel...The only two I know of are the Audi A3 TDI, and VW Golf/Wagon (Not looking for SUV, full-size sedan or 335d..etc).
On the other hand, there seems to be a dozen of hybrid vehicles in the market..

Any recommendations or comments?

[Gridlock]

Diesel hands down.

Nice, reliable tech for one. I like hybrids, but I don't love them. Let's not maintain one engine, let's maintain 2. Also, hybrids are efficient in the wrong range for your driving. It's city driving where they excel.

I think at the rate you are adding mileage, resale isn't going to be a primary consideration, but after 4 years and 250k kms, you'll do better selling a diesel than a hybrid. And of course, leasing is not an option-well, it may be, but the payment for those kms is going to be killer.

[dinamix]

Get a prius v. They are pretty reliable. Ive seen a couple prius cabs that have 300, 000 + km .
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[Zedbra]

I run a diesel TDI and it is perfect for highway kilometers. The torque is perfect for city driving (pulling out in front of cars), they can be tuned various ways (speed vs economy), VW parts are cheap and everywhere, plus the resale is high - 250k is nothing. I have 220k on mine and I still love droving it.

[604STIG]

Get a prius v. They are pretty reliable. Ive seen a couple prius cabs that have 300, 000 + km .
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I was in one that had +5000,000Kms:fuuuuu:

[Lomac]

Diesel hands down.

Nice, reliable tech for one. I like hybrids, but I don't love them. Let's not maintain one engine, let's maintain 2. Also, hybrids are efficient in the wrong range for your driving. It's city driving where they excel.

I think at the rate you are adding mileage, resale isn't going to be a primary consideration, but after 4 years and 250k kms, you'll do better selling a diesel than a hybrid. And of course, leasing is not an option-well, it may be, but the payment for those kms is going to be killer.

x2. A diesel will be your best option if you're doing mostly highway driving.

[Ferra]

Thanks!

Definitely leaning more toward diesel ...
But is there any other choices beside the A3 TDI and VW Golf/Wagon?
I can't seem to find other diesel vehicle in this particular class

[roastpuff]

Thanks!

Definitely leaning more toward diesel ...
But is there any other choices beside the A3 TDI and VW Golf/Wagon?
I can't seem to find other diesel vehicle in this particular class
I would say diesel as well, for your needs. I would love to have a diesel car too!

There are a few more coming this year:

Cruze Diesel - GM Press Release (http://media.gm.ca/media/ca/en/gm/news.detail.html/content/Pages/news/ca/en/2013/Mar/0321_CruzeTurboDiesel.html)

Mazda6 Diesel - 2014 Mazda6 Skyactiv-D Clean Diesel takes aim at Passat TDI during Toronto Auto Show debut (http://ca.autoblog.com/2013/02/22/2014-mazda6-skyactiv-d-clean-diesel-takes-aim-at-passat-tdi-duri/)

[Mancini]

I'm hoping Subaru brings their boxer diesel to North America.

[LP700-4]

Thanks!

Definitely leaning more toward diesel ...
But is there any other choices beside the A3 TDI and VW Golf/Wagon?
I can't seem to find other diesel vehicle in this particular class

Theres always the Mercedes Bluetec lineup :badpokerface: but probably not what you're looking for.

Heard also there might be a BMW 328d wagon coming soon.

Other than those theres not much more. I wouldn't get a hybrid cause cvt + torqueless motors wont be a good combo for highway driving.

[CP.AR]

VIN DIESEL

[vitaminG]

dunno if your looking for brand new, or what your price range is

if this is still for sale you should buy it

BMW 530D DIESEL Loaded,Navi/Steptronic,Common Rail DIESEL not BMW 530i (http://vancouver.en.craigslist.ca/rds/cto/3679770613.html)

also mercedes diesels, smart car, JDM vans

[Timpo]

Mazda 6 Skyactiv D

[Timpo]

VIN DIESEL

http://25.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m6l5h6b4IN1qcvu5so1_1280.jpg
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_uUBIkPIHajk/ScO_-EyxxxI/AAAAAAAAAG8/bK3D622u0fA/s400/Vin%2BDiesel%2BFast%2Band%2BFurious%2BMovie.jpg

[GabAlmighty]

Get a diesel, VW tdi is all you need/want.

[ShyGuy]

Is canada getting the GTD?

[Timpo]

Get a diesel, VW tdi is all you need/want.

vw's reliability is shit though

[Zedbra]

vw's reliability is shit though

relative to what brand? how much experience have you had with a newer VW diesel?

[PJ]

I'd go for the diesel too.

Hybrids are good for the environment, but not as great as most people think for your wallet... Higher up front cost, higher cost for maintenance, and then there's the whole battery replacement that costs a few grand every x number of years.

In the end, there's not much difference in owning a hybrid vs a gasoline-sipper. (Financially speaking)

If you want another Diesel option...
http://vancouver.en.craigslist.ca/rds/ctd/3737360984.html :troll:

[bloodmack]

Get diesel! Hybrids SUCK, overpriced and they only last a few years. They are here for the short term and I feel sorry for those who buy them.

[GabAlmighty]

vw's reliability is shit though

Just stop talking

[heleu]

Get diesel! Hybrids SUCK, overpriced and they only last a few years. They are here for the short term and I feel sorry for those who buy them.

I loved the turbodiesel Peugeot 3008 I rented in Italy 2 years ago.

However, there must be a reason most cabs these days are hybrid Toyota Prius - they obviously last more than "a few years".

[fliptuner]

I currently own 3 diesel vehicles and will usually recommend them, provided your driving habits can maximize their benefits.

As Lomac suggested, if you're on the freeway a lot and it gets up to operating temp. for a prolonged time, you're going to get the most bang for your buck.

Short errands around town are terrible for diesels.

Make sure you factor in the premium you pay for a diesel vehicle vs. it's gas counterpart. The difference might make it more practical to buy a gas car since it takes xx years to make up the savings in mpg.

[godwin]

I saw an ad for Mercedes GLK 250 Diese in this week's Maclaans.. 43k start price is not bad. I think for entry level cars, I think the next diesel car coming up is the Cruze (26k) and the Mazda6 about the same price. Also BMW 328d but it will be 40k range, for value GLK sounds better.

[VRYALT3R3D]

Car and Driver: Tested : 2013 Ford Fusion Hybrid - Review - CAR and DRIVER - YouTube

[heleu]

I saw an ad for Mercedes GLK 250 Diese in this week's Maclaans.. 43k start price is not bad. I think for entry level cars, I think the next diesel car coming up is the Cruze (26k) and the Mazda6 about the same price. Also BMW 328d but it will be 40k range, for value GLK sounds better.

What?! The Cruze better not be $26K!! That's almost double the base MSRP of that car!

[roastpuff]

What?! The Cruze better not be $26K!! That's almost double the base MSRP of that car!

If you read my post on the Cruze and the Mazda6, the press release says that it starts at "$24,945 (before a $1,550 destination charge) and will come standard with an Aero Performance Package, leather seating and the brand's MyLink infotainment system. " So at least it's got some features in there already, it's like a LTZ model.

I would say diesel as well, for your needs. I would love to have a diesel car too!

There are a few more coming this year:

Cruze Diesel - GM Press Release (http://media.gm.ca/media/ca/en/gm/news.detail.html/content/Pages/news/ca/en/2013/Mar/0321_CruzeTurboDiesel.html)

Mazda6 Diesel - 2014 Mazda6 Skyactiv-D Clean Diesel takes aim at Passat TDI during Toronto Auto Show debut (http://ca.autoblog.com/2013/02/22/2014-mazda6-skyactiv-d-clean-diesel-takes-aim-at-passat-tdi-duri/)

[Zedbra]

I don't know if I would want a first generation GM diesel motor. I do know that Mazda has been testing their diesel motor for years, and I am quite looking forward to seeing it in the marketplace with a little working history behind it.

[godwin]

In terms of maturity.. actually the Mazda engine is the newer one and Mazda has way less engineering resources than GM (since Skyactiv is no longer a Ford coproduced product). The engine that will be in Cruze is made in Germany and used by Opel/Astra

I don't know if I would want a first generation GM diesel motor. I do know that Mazda has been testing their diesel motor for years, and I am quite looking forward to seeing it in the marketplace with a little working history behind it.

[Zedbra]

In terms of maturity.. actually the Mazda engine is the newer one and Mazda has way less engineering resources than GM (since Skyactiv is no longer a Ford coproduced product). The engine that will be in Cruze is made in Germany and used by Opel/Astra


And no doubt tuned down then add on all the smog control devices to have a sub-performing motor that only ticks along well in Europe. Yup, should be interesting.

[too_slow]

The base pricing on a Mazda 6 Diesel here is the same as an Accord Euro Sports Luxury (TSX with Tech) here. I highly doubt the 6 with the diesel would be affordable.. :(

You're probably better off financing a MK6 Golf TDI. They should be getting rid of them for close to 0%, and they don't depreciate AT ALL. Most of the 2nd hand ones are really high in milleage without any price advantages. Also to note, the Golf is on a newer chasis than the A3 TDI, though the 'same' engine on the A3 has a unique counter balance to help reduce drivetrain vibrations (I still thought the golf was quieter)

[Phil@rise]

VW TDI

[oldsnail]

i had a insight for 100k.. pretty reliable. i had a diesel truck as well. not every gas station has diesel.. i brought my truck to salt spring island, and only one gas station had diseal. kinda not hinder-some when you are actually looking for gas

[godwin]

They don't need smog control here because they put it in a "lighter" vehicle by classification. The US particulate law right now is less stringent than the current Euro Bin rules.. though the Euro one Bin6 will be harder. Their US engine is not sub performing, Euro diesel is just cleaner (theirs come from the Middle East, while ours usually come from tar sands).

And no doubt tuned down then add on all the smog control devices to have a sub-performing motor that only ticks along well in Europe. Yup, should be interesting.

[1990TSI]

the cruze diesel engine is designed in italy and built in germany (or backwards from that) and installed in lordstown USA.

If they are sold at 26k after destination they will sell well, the competition is much more expensive.

With my experiences with the cruze (car been in the shop for 7 weeks out of the last 8) i can't recommend it, but all of my troubles are directly related to the 1.4t (I got a new engine at 34k kms which had cam issues out of the box and they still havn't fixed my coolant smell in the cabin after 2 months, but those are both 1.4t specific problems)

but the 2.0td should be a much better engine.
Most people with the 1.4t love it, I can get 4.5L per 100kms anywhere between hastings and hope on highway 1. but as fuel effiecient as it is, it has almost as many problems as a VW would.

[bloodmack]

I loved the turbodiesel Peugeot 3008 I rented in Italy 2 years ago.

However, there must be a reason most cabs these days are hybrid Toyota Prius - they obviously last more than "a few years".

.... really? So then why do taxis use crown vics? please enlighten me.

[sdubfid]

Are you looking for new car op? If not I would recommend 99.5-03 vw alh tdi. It's the small block Chevy of tdis with roots back to the 70's and lots of parts availability. One issue on a newer common rail tdi could wipe your mileage savings out pretty quick. Tdiclub.com is the site if you want to research yourself. Do some number crunching. My diesel saves me $2000 a year in fuel over my civic.
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[Presto]

Hybrids are good for the environment, but not as great as most people think for your wallet... Higher up front cost, higher cost for maintenance, and then there's the whole battery replacement that costs a few grand every x number of years.

I disagree with a few of your points, as your info seems to come from sources that haven't actually owned a hybrid. The cost is a bit higher upfront, but higher maintenance cost? No way. I'm just about to being year 9 on my Prius, and I've only had to do the scheduled maintenance: fluids, oil changes, filters, etc... Also, compared to traditional vehicles, there's less wear on various parts, like brakes and the engine. I'm at 230k, and I'm still on my original drums. Front brakes were changed at 150k. Brake dust is non-existent. Batteries hold up well. First gen Priuses are 10+ years old, now, and there haven't been many battery pack replacements. Mine is still going strong. I wouldn't say a Prius is good for the environment, but it's not as bad as other vehicles out there.

[Presto]

.... really? So then why do taxis use crown vics? please enlighten me.

Because they're already using them, and/or they think that maintaining a gas-chugging vehicle is cheaper than purchasing a hybrid. I haven't seen any new Crown Vics. A cab driver would be absolutely foolish to not drive a Prius. They're the ones that can quickly realize the savings.

[vitaminG]

.

[heleu]

.... really? So then why do taxis use crown vics? please enlighten me.

Seriously? I guess gas really is a lot cheaper out in abbotsford if they are still driving crown vics there..

[fliptuner]

Are you looking for new car op? If not I would recommend 99.5-03 vw alh tdi. It's the small block Chevy of tdis with roots back to the 70's and lots of parts availability. One issue on a newer common rail tdi could wipe your mileage savings out pretty quick. Tdiclub.com is the site if you want to research yourself. Do some number crunching. My diesel saves me $2000 a year in fuel over my civic.
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Agreed.

OP mentioned keeping it for 4+ years, so I'd recommend a mk4 TDI also. They still command a premium for being diesel but if they're in good shape and 5spd, should last you a long time and be relatively cheap to maintain.

[Shorn]

lol when is the last time anybody saw a crown vic taxi in vancouver? the majority of cabs are priuses or some other hybrid.

there are other cities in the world besides vancouver.

last time i was in vegas there was probably 10 taxi crown vics for every prius i saw.

but yes back on topic, diesel.

[VRYALT3R3D]

Because they're already using them, and/or they think that maintaining a gas-chugging vehicle is cheaper than purchasing a hybrid. I haven't seen any new Crown Vics. A cab driver would be absolutely foolish to not drive a Prius. They're the ones that can quickly realize the savings.

They stopped producing them in 2011. The CNG Crown Victorias got around 30MPG~ I asked a couple of taxi drivers what they got, and I was surprised.

Reasons they used them include:
Huge Trunk(21 cu.ft)
Huge Interior Volume
Parts are cheap(A 1998 fender fits a 2011)
Great visibility
Ultra reliable and durable
Numerous safety awards
HUGE FLEET DISCOUNTS(10K+ OFF MSRP)

I am guessing the reason you don't see them is they have been phased out and the remaining fleet is super high mileage and on its way out.

My dad used to buy brand new Town Cars(same platform) every two years, and had over 6 of them. None had any issues, and they were driven to almost 100,000 kilometers before it was traded in. When he went to the S-Class, it wasn't as reliable but had far more features.

[roastpuff]

Update on the Cruze TD: 46mpg

2014 Chevrolet Cruze Diesel gets 46 mpg (http://www.autoblog.com/2013/04/18/2014-chevrolet-cruze-diesel-gets-46-mpg/)