[Inaii]

I'm having trouble finding this info on the ICBC website or the MVA website and just wanted confirmation. If you're caught excessively speeding (3pts) you also receive a suspension correct? If so, how long is the suspension? I found a thread that dealt with this, but it was from 2011 and I'm not certain whether the rules have changed or not (I've had my class 5 for almost 2 years now, so I don't pay attention to N rules anymore).

Guy from my other club was caught excessively speeding and was asking if he would receive a suspension. People are telling him he won't because you need 6pts on an N to be suspended, but iirc, excessive falls under different rules? Can anyone help me out with this info?

[320icar]

You only need 3 points on an N to get suspended *i believe*. I had one speeding ticket in 2009 when I had my N. Clocked at 61 in a 50, and my license was suspended after that. Clean record otherwise.

[Inaii]

That's what I thought too, but ICBC took down the page that stated how many points you could have as an N/5 before being suspended.

[nma]

dispute ticket on 29th day, pass class 5 test, pay ticket, problem solved.

[Inaii]

Not quite the information I was asking for, but thank you.

[zilley]

he will get suspended.

[l2_narain]

http://www.pssg.gov.bc.ca/osmv/shareddocs/driver-improvement-policies-guidelines.pdf

Page 13

Also, excessive speeding will get your car impounded for 7 days on the first offense

Excessive Speeding and Careless Driving - Road Safety Rules and Consequences of Unsafe Driving - RoadSafetyBC (http://www.pssg.gov.bc.ca/osmv/road-safety/speed.htm)

[|<e|_]

You should need 4points to get suspended if rules haven't changed. Got a speeding back when I was N 9years ago and wasn't suspended. But an offence like excessive speeding or dui might be a suspension regardless of points.

[Traum]

You only need 3 points on an N to get suspended *i believe*. I had one speeding ticket in 2009 when I had my N. Clocked at 61 in a 50, and my license was suspended after that. Clean record otherwise.
Gee... 61 in a 50 zone while you are still an N-driver, and you fxxking get suspended?! WTF is this shxt, man...

Last time I got ripped off coming down Knight, and was literally cruising down at just a hair over 60 (quite literally, probably 61 since needle was just hovering above the 60 line mark), and the cop nailed me. Granted, it was my own stupid fault for not seeing him on the bridge. But this one strike and you're out business is just plain bullshxt, esp when it is something as bullshxt as doing 61 in a 50 zone.

[BoostedBB6]

dispute ticket on 29th day, pass class 5 test, pay ticket, problem solved.

From what I understand, if you are found guilty even after you get your Class 5 they still impose the suspension still.

I read that on here, apparently someone had done this and it did not pan out how they had planned :P

[underscore]

Previously IIRC you needed 4 points to get suspended on an N, speeding was 3 and excessive was 6 or something. Now both are 3 points but I'm not sure what the limit is for an N driver before a suspension.

Fines & points for B.C. traffic offences (http://www.icbc.com/driver-licensing/tickets/Pages/fines-points-offences.aspx)

Here's a breakdown of the points associated with each ticket.

[rriggi]

From what I understand, if you are found guilty even after you get your Class 5 they still impose the suspension still.

I read that on here, apparently someone had done this and it did not pan out how they had planned :P

If that was the case, me and many other people I know would have been suspended by now. Depends really I guess, its a work around for a system put in place in the interest of public safety

[Inaii]

Previously IIRC you needed 4 points to get suspended on an N, speeding was 3 and excessive was 6 or something. Now both are 3 points but I'm not sure what the limit is for an N driver before a suspension.

Fines & points for B.C. traffic offences (http://www.icbc.com/driver-licensing/tickets/Pages/fines-points-offences.aspx)

Here's a breakdown of the points associated with each ticket.

Thanks, I knew what the points were for the offence, but wasn't sure about how many you need for a suspension. Either way, maybe he'll learn not to be an idiot now (probably not). Thanks for the information guys, it's much appreciated :)

[320icar]

Gee... 61 in a 50 zone while you are still an N-driver, and you fxxking get suspended?! WTF is this shxt, man...

Last time I got ripped off coming down Knight, and was literally cruising down at just a hair over 60 (quite literally, probably 61 since needle was just hovering above the 60 line mark), and the cop nailed me. Granted, it was my own stupid fault for not seeing him on the bridge. But this one strike and you're out business is just plain bullshxt, esp when it is something as bullshxt as doing 61 in a 50 zone.

Yeah it was pretty bullshit. Just another reason why I hate icbc. But at the time I lived right on a bus route and it was easy and cheaper to just hop on the bus to work. Live and learn

[kkthind]

How many points on class 5 before that gets suspended

[Inaii]

How many points on class 5 before that gets suspended

I've heard 9 and I've heard 15... so I'm guessing somewhere between :lol

[Traum]

How many points on class 5 before that gets suspended
At any rate, I think it is 4 points and you start paying insurance premiums. Especially when it comes to speeding offences, the current point system is ridiculous since the posted speed limits are unrealistically and unnecessarily slow in far too many places.

[nma]

From what I understand, if you are found guilty even after you get your Class 5 they still impose the suspension still.

I read that on here, apparently someone had done this and it did not pan out how they had planned :P

False

Source: I did it..

[bossha]

I was given a 3 point ticket and was only issued a warning through the mail.(had my N at the time)

However.. For excessive I think it's a 3 month suspension, and you restart your 2 years to be eligible for your class 5.

[Soundy]

Yeah it was pretty bullshit. Just another reason why I hate icbc.
You do understand that it's not ICBC's fault you broke the law, right? And it's not ICBC who suspends you, it's the Superintendent of Motor Vehicles?

By all means though, do carry on displaying your ignorance....

[underscore]

I've heard 9 and I've heard 15... so I'm guessing somewhere between :lol

Well according to the ICBC site (I can't find the page again though) there's listings for the cost of having up to 50 points. How the hell you could rack up 50 is beyond me, but the cutoff for suspension definitely isn't higher than that :lol

[Nlkko]

4 points of any combination to get a suspension under N. But suspension and restart N is the least you have to worry about.

After suspension, you pay couple hundreds just to get your license reinstated. 30 bucks for your license. You also pay driver penalty point premium based on points unless you surrender your license for a period (1 year?) then that is waived.

Speeding I get it. Dick cops are out to get you. Excessive speed, you brought it upon yourself.

[R&R]

I've heard 9 and I've heard 15... so I'm guessing somewhere between :lol

i got 9 then suspended 2013

[nma]

4 points of any combination to get a suspension under N. But suspension and restart N is the least you have to worry about.

After suspension, you pay couple hundreds just to get your license reinstated. 30 bucks for your license. You also pay driver penalty point premium based on points unless you surrender your license for a period (1 year?) then that is waived.

Speeding I get it. Dick cops are out to get you. Excessive speed, you brought it upon yourself.

I believe it's ON the 4th point though, like as soon as you go over 3 it's automatic suspension.. Not exactly sure because I've had my full license for a while.. Things do change.

[Tone Loc]

If you have your N still, the points threshold is 4, but for things like Excessive Speed you are pretty much guaranteed a suspension. I was suspended for 4 months with Excessive Speed as my one offence. It was a stupid thing to do, and the 4 months I spent taking the bus everywhere again and losing my then-GF because she didn't want to date someone with no car (good riddance) taught me a very good lesson. Live and learn lol

[nma]

If you have your N still, the points threshold is 4, but for things like Excessive Speed you are pretty much guaranteed a suspension. I was suspended for 4 months with Excessive Speed as my one offence. It was a stupid thing to do, and the 4 months I spent taking the bus everywhere again and losing my then-GF because she didn't want to date someone with no car (good riddance) taught me a very good lesson. Live and learn lol

sounds like you got away easy with the girl.. lol

[320icar]

You do understand that it's not ICBC's fault you broke the law, right? And it's not ICBC who suspends you, it's the Superintendent of Motor Vehicles?

By all means though, do carry on displaying your ignorance....



looool beta phaggot. You've never gone 10 km over the speed limit? Go back to your mommas tit m8

[Spidey]

looool beta phaggot. You've never gone 10 km over the speed limit? Go back to your mommas tit m8

last time i checked going 10 over the limit didn't constitute losing your car for 7 days, "m8"

[underscore]

looool beta phaggot. You've never gone 10 km over the speed limit? Go back to your mommas tit m8

I drive over the limit, and I'm sure Soundy does too, but the difference is I've got the balls to admit I'm at fault when I get a legitimate speeding ticket.

[320icar]

last time i checked going 10 over the limit didn't constitute losing your car for 7 days, "m8"

I never said I had my car impounded you cheeky cunt. I said I was given a suspension a few weeks later in the mail.

M8

[DragonChi]

"Excessive speeding is defined in the Motor Vehicle Act as driving at a speed greater than 40 km/h over the speed limit."

Excessive Speeding and Careless Driving - Road Safety Rules and Consequences of Unsafe Driving - RoadSafetyBC (http://www.pssg.gov.bc.ca/osmv/road-safety/speed.htm#fines)

I don't get how going 10 over the limit is excessive speeding.

This is from 2008, but might be relevant. Gist is that probation starts at 4-6 points, then you gotta be careful for a year. Suspension means you can't drive. Probation means you're on thin ice. Thought I'd clearify that, at 3 am, I thought prohibition meant suspension... derp.

edit:forgot the link
http://drivesmartbc.ca/young-drivers/other-young-driver-issues/will-they-take-my-licence-away
http://www.pssg.gov.bc.ca/osmv/shareddocs/driver-improvement-policies-guidelines.pdf

[Spidey]

I never said I had my car impounded you cheeky cunt. I said I was given a suspension a few weeks later in the mail.

M8

strong BB.com language. Wrong site. I am also sure people get their licence's suspended for going 60 in a 50 zone all day errday!

Then again everyone always THINKS they are going 60.... even when hardly anyone does... it's interesting how that works. "I wouldn't be stopping you for going 80+, if you were going 60".

[Soundy]

looool beta phaggot. You've never gone 10 km over the speed limit? Go back to your mommas tit m8
LOLWUT?

I drive over the limit, and I'm sure Soundy does too, but the difference is I've got the balls to admit I'm at fault when I get a legitimate speeding ticket.
Oh yeah, all the time... I've had a few tickets in my day, although it's been many many years since I got a speeding ticket. Only other ones I can think of are a red light ticket downtown once, and the most recent which was a seatbelt ticket. And yeah, I paid them all.

[Traum]

Then again everyone always THINKS they are going 60.... even when hardly anyone does... it's interesting how that works. "I wouldn't be stopping you for going 80+, if you were going 60".
I wish that was so. The bs ticket that I got was precisely because I was going literally 61 down Knight. When the officer came back to me, he told me he was only booking me for doing 51 in 50 zone because "I had a good record".

Yes, I am still fxxking pissed. It was a blatant ripoff, plain and simple. Even the officer knew it was utter bs.

[zulutango]

So you admit to breaking the "limit"..ie...the maximum speed you are permitted to go by law...was a blatant ropoff, plain & simple? By you, who chose to break the law...or by the Cop who caught you and gave you a VT? You got the minimun fine permitted for speeding so why are you upset at the Cop?

[dared3vil0]

Interesting question... If he wrote you for 51 in a 50, don't radar units have an allowed margin of 2km/h?

[Traum]

So you admit to breaking the "limit"..ie...the maximum speed you are permitted to go by law...was a blatant ropoff, plain & simple? By you, who chose to break the law...or by the Cop who caught you and gave you a VT? You got the minimun fine permitted for speeding so why are you upset at the Cop?
I am not upset at the officer. Yes, I think it was pointless for him to nap me. But he was a nice guy, and did what he can to give me a break. Rather, I'm upset at the system because it is dysfunctional and against common sense. 50 kph southbound at the approach of Knight Bridge simply makes no sense. You're at the bottom of the hill, you're about to enter a freeway, but there is still a big long stretch of 50kph between 63rd and the Marine on-ramp?

Officer Zulutango, I know you are trained to follow orders from your superiors and the law. But just because they are orders and the law doesn't necessarily make them sensible. That's why you are also asked to use your discretion when you are enforcing the law.

[Tone Loc]

sounds like you got away easy with the girl.. lol

Agreed. Off topic, but losing my car (and subsequently her) was the key to me getting my entire life together....

[underscore]

I am not upset at the officer. Yes, I think it was pointless for him to nap me. But he was a nice guy, and did what he can to give me a break. Rather, I'm upset at the system because it is dysfunctional and against common sense. 50 kph southbound at the approach of Knight Bridge simply makes no sense. You're at the bottom of the hill, you're about to enter a freeway, but there is still a big long stretch of 50kph between 63rd and the Marine on-ramp?

Officer Zulutango, I know you are trained to follow orders from your superiors and the law. But just because they are orders and the law doesn't necessarily make them sensible. That's why you are also asked to use your discretion when you are enforcing the law.

Just because you may disagree with a law doesn't mean you don't have to follow it. Not all speed limits make sense but most people also aren't qualified to analyze a roadway and determine a speed limit.

[zulutango]

I am not upset at the officer. Yes, I think it was pointless for him to nap me. But he was a nice guy, and did what he can to give me a break. Rather, I'm upset at the system because it is dysfunctional and against common sense. 50 kph southbound at the approach of Knight Bridge simply makes no sense. You're at the bottom of the hill, you're about to enter a freeway, but there is still a big long stretch of 50kph between 63rd and the Marine on-ramp?

Officer Zulutango, I know you are trained to follow orders from your superiors and the law. But just because they are orders and the law doesn't necessarily make them sensible. That's why you are also asked to use your discretion when you are enforcing the law.


Although, under "normal" circumstances, personally I would not issue a VT for 11k over the limit, but photo radar used to issue them at that level. The limit is just that...the idea that you could break the limit by 10kmh started when the Govt said photo radar tickets would be issued for 11kmh and more over the limit. Drivers took this to mean that they were permitted to speed as long as it was not above 10kmh over the limit and that 1-10k was not speeding. The law says 1k or more over the limit is speeding.

You might be interested to know that in New Zealand limits are enforced with tickets being issued at 4k over the limit and impaired driving charges starting at .05 mg%. Lots of whining from drivers but big drops in crashes and fatals there. I don't know what actual speed you were caught doing but often a higher speed is actually recorded before the driver sees the Cop, brakes and then looks at the speedo showing a lower speed. We were trained that traffic law enforcement is to be used to change driving behaviour and reduce the risk and crashes. The discretion is to be used to achieve this goal and sometimes it means enforcing the laws as they are written. The statement concerning "1 kmh over the limit" may be what you took from the conversation about the fact that you only have to be proved to be doing 1k over to be convicted, not that you actually were only doing 1k over.

[Spidey]

I wish that was so. The bs ticket that I got was precisely because I was going literally 61 down Knight. When the officer came back to me, he told me he was only booking me for doing 51 in 50 zone because "I had a good record".

Yes, I am still fxxking pissed. It was a blatant ripoff, plain and simple. Even the officer knew it was utter bs.

That makes no sense because the fine for going 51 or 61 in a 50 zone is the same. "Booking" you for 51 in a 50 rather than 61 changes nothing.:suspicious:

Side note (not directly pointing at you Traum) :

The argument that going with the flow with traffic to defend yourself is very flawed. Heck, there really is not excuse in my opinion, except if you are rushing someone to the hospital. There are reasons, but very rarely an "Excuse". Going with the flow of traffic is like saying you are breaking the law because everyone else is doing it. If everyone looted a store, does that make it okay? aka rioting..... I guess in the minds of all those people in 2011... it is okay.. So I guess the reality is, there are a lot of people who were never taught about being accountable, while growing up.

[Traum]

That makes no sense because the fine for going 51 or 61 in a 50 zone. "Booking" you for 51 in a 50 rather than 61 changes nothing.:suspicious:
Damn... are you telling me I got jipped there too?

:facepalm:

[Spidey]

Damn... are you telling me I got jipped there too?

:facepalm:

I am assuming you either were clocked going 71. or you heard wrong. Because going 71 in a 50 would constitute being charged the second tier which is 196 for speeding.

[Traum]

I am assuming you either were clocked going 71. or you heard wrong. Because going 71 in a 50 would constitute being charged the second tier which is 196 for speeding.
Nope, I was nowhere near 70. I was cruising down Knight while holding gear -- no gas, no brakes, just a straight cruise at 60 and the engine revs kept me from going fast. I very lightly got back on gas around where southbound Knight exits out to Marine westbound only to keep pace because that's roughly where the downward slope ends and a slight incline begins before the bridge comes. I know the 60 zone doesn't start until the on-ramp from Marine merges with the bridge, but I didn't see the speed trap, and I thought just being 10 over would not be a problem because generally it isn't. When the officer jump out to pull me over, I cursed myself and look at the speedometer right away -- low and behold, my speedometer needle was on the faster side of 60, but still touching that 60kph line. I was doing 60 the whole damn time. That's why I am pissed.

I am not disputing that I was faster than 50. I am not making that claim now; I did not make that claim then, and I did not dispute anything with the cop at the time. Plain and simple, I got ripped off. I 100% think it is a dick move to nab someone doing 60 or 61 in a 50 zone, and judging by Spidey and Zulutango comments, I am now thinking that the cop wasn't actually being nice at all -- the entire scenario could easily be interpreted as the cop pulling a dick move to nab me, and then he did what he could to make sure that the charge (of being 1kph over) would stick. To top it off, he even acted like he was doing me a favour by "only" charging me for being 1kph over. If that were the case, this officer totally excels in his job -- I gotta commend him for that. It would also make him a dick in my eyes though.

Still, I am going to thank Spidey and Zulu for pointing things out because I can now view the entire incident under a new light.

[zulutango]

When the officer jump out to pull me over, I cursed myself and look at the speedometer right away --

As Spidey said, the readings were taken before he "jumped out" and they may have been different from when you looked at your speedo after seeing him.

[ancient_510]

the entire scenario could easily be interpreted as the cop pulling a dick move to nab me, and then he did what he could to make sure that the charge (of being 1kph over) would stick. To top it off, he even acted like he was doing me a favour by "only" charging me for being 1kph over.

I'd be really interested in something here. The officer may have snookered himself by charging you at 51 km/h.
1. Dispute the ticket
2. Request disclosure including a photocopy of the charging officer's notebook, a transcription of the notes, and definitions of any abbreviations used.
3. Make and model of the speed measurement instrument.

For example, the accuracy of an UltraLyte LR B (http://speed.g-zona.hr/manuals/UltraLyte%20LR%20B.2.pdf) (pp 51) is ±2 km/h.

The procedure generally is for police to make a visual estimate on speed, then use the instrument to corroborate their estimate. Depending on what kind of notes were kept, it can be inferred that driving at an alleged 51 km/h may actually only have been 49 km/h based on the accuracy of the instrument.

If he kept full notes on how he lowered your speed as a courtesy, pay the fine and move along.

[zulutango]

There is no provision on a VT to record the actual speed the target was doing, in fact you might not want it shown, because it will become part of the official court record if it is. If you were doing 23k over the limit and that was written on the face of the VT, but you were issued a VT for $138 instead of $196, then you would likely have to pay the higher fine if convicted. I don't believe that 51 in a 50 zone was written on the face of your VT. A fine of $138 would be the appropriate fine for evey speed between 51 and 70k in a 50 k zone.

[Spidey]

As Zulu said, Traum, you don't know which point you were actually clocked at. Regardless of what really happened and how fast he got you at, at the end of the day it does suck to be dinged for going 61 in a 50. I see how you can feel being ripped off as others around you every day travel at that speed without any repercussion, but drivers don't dictate the speed limit, the signs do.

Also, the fact he said he was going to charge you for 51 (which I strongly believe he meant or said 1+over 50) as he did clock you at 71+. Did he actually tell you how fast he clocked you at, or did you say 61 as that's what you believed you were going at.

[Traum]

The incident actually happened quite a few months ago, and at the time, I just sucked it up and paid off the fine since I think the fine goes up after a certain period.

I don't remember the exact words the officer used, nor the charge that was written on the ticket, but I do remember understanding / interpreting it to be 51 in 50 zone. I was too upset at the time to remember the details of the dialog we had, but the part that I clearly remembered is something along the lines of "I could have charged you for something faster, but because you had a good driving record, I am only going to charge you for..."

Nowadays, when I need to cross the Knight Bridge, I either take a detour and use the on-ramp from Marine, or I will make it a point to coast down the entire hill on Knight in 2nd gear at 50kph to piss every other driver off. When I am not in a rush, it is actually quite amusing to go dead slow (aka 50) this way and watch what the other drivers do. :concentrate:

[steveo1115]

Nowadays, when I need to cross the Knight Bridge, I either take a detour and use the on-ramp from Marine, or I will make it a point to coast down the entire hill on Knight in 2nd gear at 50kph to piss every other driver off. When I am not in a rush, it is actually quite amusing to go dead slow (aka 50) this way and watch what the other drivers do. :concentrate:

Everytime I see a cop in my rear-view I purposely drive 5 under the speed limit. they get the maddest I cant count how many times I've had the cops light me up just to pass me.

[wing_woo]

Nowadays, when I need to cross the Knight Bridge, I either take a detour and use the on-ramp from Marine, or I will make it a point to coast down the entire hill on Knight in 2nd gear at 50kph to piss every other driver off. When I am not in a rush, it is actually quite amusing to go dead slow (aka 50) this way and watch what the other drivers do. :concentrate:

I drove to work going at 50km/h for a week just to see what happens. I go down Kerr. It's amazing how many people will still pass me event though it's one lane each direction only on that street.

Then on Marine Way, I went 50 and everyone would pass me and some would cut back in closer than they need to, probably to make a point to me.

Now, I just go with the flow as long as it's between 50 and 60.