China loses Trillions in Stock Market Crash, NYSE Suspended due to Glitch [Archive]

NKC ONE

07-08-2015, 01:42 PM

I'll put in my perspective on this. When market crashes like this, a lot of investors will need cash and a lot of cash to cover their margin positions. They will look for the places where their other invested money (ie HK/Vancouver RE) and cash out since they've got a healthy profit.

Problems is, you have to look at A LOT of people trying to cash out. Supply increases and the other ones originally looking to buy (from China) are going to stop looking also. If they were willing to invest in Vancouver RE, you can bet that they were gambling big on the stock markets also when money came in much easier for the past couple months. Increase supply, decrease demand. What's scary is when they really really need to cash out asap and will be willing to sell even with $100k+ discount or whatever depending on location. It's like watching the stock market crash and trying to sell. No place in the world is immune and we're talking about Vancouver here.

For the first couple months, you'll see buyers. These are the local ones that are living and trying to buy a place here, not foreign investors. They might be able to buy at a 10% discount but that's still nothing compared to how low it can get. I'm guessing 50% with a low economic local support. It could be the biggest shit storm for Vancouver RE in the longest time and will take quite some time to recover. Then you got all these horny buyers thinking they finally bought a place with maybe a 10% discount and be stuck with negative equity for the rest of their life.

Of course, China could recover in a week and all is forgotten but I really doubt it. If you still think China doesn't affect the RE market here, then you really have no clue what drove the prices up in the first place.

Harvey Specter

07-08-2015, 02:28 PM

Food for thought...

China’s consumer spending power

Chinese consumers have become the world’s powerhouse when it comes to spending on luxury goods, tourism, property, and international schooling.

It is impossible to know how much of this spending has been fueled by stock market gains, rising incomes, proceeds from corruption, or property market windfalls—and the market really only started rising in recent months. Some were even delaying buying new cars to put money into the stock market, as the Wall Street Journal reported last month.

But investors said recently that stock windfalls helped them fund overseas travel, property purchases, and car buying. Because trillions of yuan of stock-buying was done with so-called margin finance, or loans used to buy stock, so investors who are losing money are going to need to curb spending even further to pay these loans back.

Tourism: Chinese tourists spent more than those from any other country on overseas travel last year—a massive $165 billion, up 28% from the year before. And their impact on major cities is massive.
Tourists from Beijing alone spent $1.4 billion in New York City last year, as Quartz previously reported, and those from Shanghai spent nearly $900 million in Los Angeles. In London, they accounted for one-fifth of all spending in the West End and in Thailand they’re much-maligned but still expected to bring in $5.6 billion this year.

Luxury goods: Chinese also buy 12% of the world’s luxury goods, with most of that shopping done overseas, where they accounted for 40% of France’s luxury good sales last year.

US, Canadian, and Aussie schools: Nearly half a million Chinese students studied abroad last year, up 11% from 2013, and 92% of those paid their own way, rather then relying on financial aid or scholarships. These students have been a windfall for universities and private secondary schools, particularly in the US, Canada, and Australia, the top destinations.

Property: Property markets from New Zealand to Los Angeles have been boosted by billions of dollars in Chinese investment in recent years. These buyers have snapped up suburban homes and penthouse apartments, often paying cash.

These households most likely to be spending on overseas property, education, and travel are the ones that dabble in the market.

China’s stock market are the “plaything” of a limited number of households in China, financial services company GaveKal said in a recent report. “The pain of the crash is affecting probably no more than 20mn to 30mn Chinese households, most of which range from upper middle class to very wealthy.”

The global fallout from China?s stock market crash may be coming your way - Quartz (http://qz.com/445344/is-turmoil-from-chinas-stock-market-downturn-headed-your-way/)

blkgsr

07-08-2015, 02:29 PM

so we're expecting the canadian dollar to continue to shit itself for the next year?

current buy for USD is like 1.28 or more

jackmeister

07-08-2015, 02:52 PM

NKC ONE

07-08-2015, 03:22 PM

If they have the money to buy a 2m+ house in Vancouver, I'm pretty sure cashing out of RE in Vancouver to cover losses is like a drop of water in a cup. It's unreasonable to assume China people move their main asset base to Canada if they continued to live/work in China. Sure there are affects to our RE when the mainland folks "understand what diversifying your investments" meant, which is why we see the continued rise in our RE. However, I doubt these same people would cash out of RE here, repatriate their money, and cover their asses there.

And then, when the shit really hits the fan, money comes out even more rapidly to buy more assets, before all the underground transfer joints get all shut down.

You're assuming that they are only holding 1 property and they bought with straight cash. Drop in the bucket it may be for the ultra rich but not for the regular rich coming from the mainland (the majority with less than $10M net worth). A lot of home buyers from China in Vancouver are speculating investors. They buy for $1m and try to sell it couple months down the road for $1.2m. They may even hold a year, rent it out and see what happens.

When they need the cash to cover their highly leveraged positions, they'll sell the shirt of their backs to make sure they don't go bankrupt or even worse, harassed by loan sharks that will genuinely threaten their family's life. This happens quite often with the ultra rich too. When the party is over, its really over no matter how rich you are.

Mr. Market gives and Mr. Market takes. What kind of bubble do you live in to think Vancouver will not see some sort of correction some day? You're thinking, yeah but its been steadily growing for the past couple months. For me, its been exactly the same price since my money is in USD/HKD. To me a $1.2m property today is more or less the same as a $1m property 1 year ago just due to exchange rates. You may look at that 20% gain as something but to foreign investors, its a loss.

willystyle

07-08-2015, 03:24 PM

multicartual

07-08-2015, 03:30 PM

They buy for $1m and try to sell it couple months down the road for $1.2m.

All over the Dunbar / Southlands area there are sooooooo many empty houses that have been empty for 1+ year(s).

My ex-girlfriend sold a property 7 years ago in Southlands for just around 1 million I think, now properties on the same +/- 1-2 blocks with the same approximate lots are selling for near 3 million!

6203 DUNBAR ST, Vancouver, British Columbia V6N1X3 - V1122994 | Realtor.ca (http://www.realtor.ca/Residential/Single-Family/15683685/6203-DUNBAR-ST-Vancouver-British-Columbia-V6N1X3)

I can't believe how many 4-5 million dollar properties there near Dunbar. Damn!

NKC ONE

07-08-2015, 03:43 PM

All over the Dunbar / Southlands area there are sooooooo many empty houses that have been empty for 1+ year(s).

My ex-girlfriend sold a property 7 years ago in Southlands for just around 1 million I think, now properties on the same +/- 1-2 blocks with the same approximate lots are selling for near 3 million!

6203 DUNBAR ST, Vancouver, British Columbia $ V6N1X3 - V1122994 | Realtor.ca (http://www.realtor.ca/Residential/Single-Family/15683685/6203-DUNBAR-ST-Vancouver-British-Columbia-V6N1X3)

I can't believe how many 4-5 million dollar properties there near Dunbar. Damn!

That's the problem. Its fine when they are throwing new money at each other and everyone around is happy but what happens when they stop throwing even more new money around and are suddenly strapped for cash? You guys gotta remember that this is basically the first time China (not HK) has seen this type of crash in the stock market. Money has been growing out of trees for the past 20-30 year there and they'll throw majority of their money/or max leverage their position when it seems even easier to make in the stock market. People are greedy by nature. They want more and will find the easiest way to make even more because most of their success came naturally with China's growth over the years.

But what do I know...

noclue

07-08-2015, 03:50 PM

multicartual

07-08-2015, 03:54 PM

NKC ONE thanks for your posts, very enlightening! Revscene is awesome for this.

NKC ONE

07-08-2015, 04:19 PM

NKC ONE knows what's up with business in China. Are people panicking in China? Have you purchased property in YVR yet?

Keep in mind that approximately 30% of the investors in the Chinese stock market are illiterate... so they are buying stocks based on whatever their friends say.

I won't claim to know all the ins and outs of doing business in China but I have business there and I know a lot of people who do. When you're in Asia, business usually isn't the main source of income. You find every opportunity to use your leverage and exponentially grow your wealth. Works great when the timing is right but greed usually takes over before its too late.

I'm actually in YVR right now so I don't physically know if they're panicking there. From experience, I just know a lot of people are going to either kill themselves or go completely broke. Whether China discloses this info is for another thread by CIC. I was one of them back in the 2008 crash in HK. Big noob I was back then. Same noob this time around lol. I pulled out the majority of my position 6 months ago to prepare for a house purchase. Left a bit in the market to gamble on extremely volatile stocks based purely on tips. In 6 months i made about a 75% return on paper. Fun times until couple days ago where I sold it all for roughly a 15% loss on my original investment. There goes my GT3 money. I actually feel quite relieved because I would've been down roughly 60-70% today.

I have to also comment on paper gains. A lot of these China investors see their paper gains as real gains. They leverage even more with their gains or recklessly buy a whole bunch of reckless shit. Most of their gains on paper are probably spent and now they have to pick up the bill for what they owe on margin.

jackmeister

07-08-2015, 04:32 PM

You're assuming that they are only holding 1 property and they bought with straight cash. Drop in the bucket it may be for the ultra rich but not for the regular rich coming from the mainland (the majority with less than $10M net worth). A lot of home buyers from China in Vancouver are speculating investors. They buy for $1m and try to sell it couple months down the road for $1.2m. They may even hold a year, rent it out and see what happens.

When they need the cash to cover their highly leveraged positions, they'll sell the shirt of their backs to make sure they don't go bankrupt or even worse, harassed by loan sharks that will genuinely threaten their family's life. This happens quite often with the ultra rich too. When the party is over, its really over no matter how rich you are.

Mr. Market gives and Mr. Market takes. What kind of bubble do you live in to think Vancouver will not see some sort of correction some day? You're thinking, yeah but its been steadily growing for the past couple months. For me, its been exactly the same price since my money is in USD/HKD. To me a $1.2m property today is more or less the same as a $1m property 1 year ago just due to exchange rates. You may look at that 20% gain as something but to foreign investors, its a loss.

It's mostly straight cash for them to buy because they're not really able to get a mortgage here due to lack of credit history and excessive amounts of cash.

You have to keep into consideration the RE run-up is a consequence of a capital drain in China. The main reason is the rich folks/officials moving their money OUT of china, through underground brokers and other shady methods, trying to keep the money as far away from the Communist Party as possible. The intent is to ensure there is enough money for "forced retirement" for themselves & family in the event shit hits the fan (getting busted for corruption or other things) That money is either money they don't need, or bribes they have collected.

Holding cash in a bank account is a mentally unsafe thing to do because there is this minute fear that the Canadian government will freeze their bank accounts or take their money. I think we all know Chinese people love RE like fat kids in a candy store, so they look at Vancouver RE and see "for 10m RMB I'm buying a nice 2000sq apartment or a nice landed house in Vancouver". Then they end up buying the property under a family member or a close relative's name.

Having said that, there might be the oddball that would repatriate their ill-gotten gains by selling their house. However, I doubt that's a majority. I would tend to think RE prices stabilize (don't grow) for a while and transaction volume drops, but I don't see the higher end of the market selling at discount because they're willing to "ride it out". There's also real estate developers willing to pay extra 30% to buy the block, and then there are people outgrowing their condo/townhouse, kids moving out etc.

Timpo

07-08-2015, 05:02 PM

Money isn't just lost.
Where da fuq did it go?

Money never existed.
Do your research, this is called "fiat currency"

Money you're talking about is nothing physical. They never existed. It's all data in your bank's computer.

Timpo

07-08-2015, 05:03 PM

Anyways, that was quick. Selling knock offs will only get you so far.

Special K

07-08-2015, 05:27 PM

I really hope this comes true... It's sad when I have to now look at 2 bedrooms CONDO in Vancouver selling for $1m.

I'll put in my perspective on this...

Of course, China could recover in a week and all is forgotten but I really doubt it. If you still think China doesn't affect the RE market here, then you really have no clue what drove the prices up in the first place.

Timpo

07-08-2015, 05:55 PM

If money is handed over to someone who is uncapable, it will be a recipe for disaster. It's just a matter of time.
Big money should only be handled by someone who knows how to use it properly.

This is exactly why majority of lottery winners get in shit after becoming a multi-millionaire all the sudden.
Normally, they will just end up where they came from, or end up even worse.

Ulic Qel-Droma

07-08-2015, 06:58 PM

shanghai ordered just buy back, the index jumped just now. let's see if it will continue.

i don't play china shit. USA is enough for me.

anyway, what goes up must come down. it's just a natural cycle.

http://www.macrobusiness.com.au/wp-content/uploads/2011/03/bubblesandmanias.gif

you guys are all hoping china crash will somehow make our real estate cheaper.

trust me, if our real estate is cheaper, it means we're also crashing. and you're still not gonna be able to afford it cuz you lost your job LOL.

who knows, when the stars align, that's when crashes happen.

bubbles...
chinese local govt debt
chinese real estate
chinese everything.

if they all crash, and greece is fucked and leaves the EU. it could trigger a global recession again.

remember prices are dictated by human action. if everyone just sat at home with their hands up their asses, the markets would be flat.

people have to put up bids/asks, and people have to fill those bids/asks for the market to move.

you have to ask yourself who are those people filling those bid/asks as the market goes down. and why they are doing it.
they all have their own insane reasons to buy or sell at a certain price.

it's only when the majority of people all coincidentally sell at the same time for different reasons does the market crash.

reasons don't matter. that's a historical fact that will be pegged on afterwards. there will be a billion reasons. reasons are lagging indicators.

if you wanna make money, reasons don't matter. just act as it's happening and follow the strength. direction strength is easy to see. but the reasons behind it... leave that up to the economists and nerds to write in the history books.

like surfing, you don't try to predict how far the wave will go. you just ride it out and if its a bunk wave, you ditch it and wait for the next one.
trying to predict where the wave will go is impossible. that's not a game you play if you're trying to make money. just ride it for what it's worth. it's a handout, you take what it gives u then you leave.

noclue

07-08-2015, 11:13 PM

Chinese investors pay in cash but a lot of them take out a small mortgage to build credit in Canada. They put 50-80% downpayment.

Anyway the market reversed, so who knows if it was a blip or a dead cat bounce. But Im sure it scared a lot of Chinese investors and gave them a taste of capitalism.

Slightly off topic but there was this one thing you have to watch out for if you are buying a home from a foreign investor... something to do with taxes and the CRA. If they have numerous properties it's ok but if it's their only property you have to make sure they have a reserve for some kind of tax.

NKC ONE

07-08-2015, 11:30 PM

you guys are all hoping china crash will somehow make our real estate cheaper.

trust me, if our real estate is cheaper, it means we're also crashing. and you're still not gonna be able to afford it cuz you lost your job LOL.

who knows, when the stars align, that's when crashes happen.

bubbles...
chinese local govt debt
chinese real estate
chinese everything.

if they all crash, and greece is fucked and leaves the EU. it could trigger a global recession again.

remember prices are dictated by human action. if everyone just sat at home with their hands up their asses, the markets would be flat.

people have to put up bids/asks, and people have to fill those bids/asks for the market to move.

you have to ask yourself who are those people filling those bid/asks as the market goes down. and why they are doing it.
they all have their own insane reasons to buy or sell at a certain price.

it's only when the majority of people all coincidentally sell at the same time for different reasons does the market crash.

reasons don't matter. that's a historical fact that will be pegged on afterwards. there will be a billion reasons. reasons are lagging indicators.

if you wanna make money, reasons don't matter. just act as it's happening and follow the strength. direction strength is easy to see. but the reasons behind it... leave that up to the economists and nerds to write in the history books.

like surfing, you don't try to predict how far the wave will go. you just ride it out and if its a bunk wave, you ditch it and wait for the next one.
trying to predict where the wave will go is impossible. that's not a game you play if you're trying to make money. just ride it for what it's worth. it's a handout, you take what it gives u then you leave.

Can't agree more, especially with the statement about crashing and losing jobs. Like anything in the world, it's only desirable when its not affordable. If anyone could afford housing, prices would be quite flat and low for the longest time.

I'm closer to HK so I'll give my POV about how people will suddenly not be able to afford housing even if it crashed 50%. Let's say you're looking to buy but can't really afford it. You got money saved up but month after month, the price continues to rise. You're a smart logical person that knows markets are cyclical, what goes up must come down. Eventually, you'll be able to afford something that you want just as long as you keep working hard. So what do you do with the money that's sitting around? You don't just let millions (hkd) sit in the bank right? How can you when everything pays shit interest these days. So like every middle aged women, grandmother and their maid, you invest in the stock market because easy money right? Everyone is talking about making money and you look like a fool sitting on the sidelines with bundles of cash sitting in the bank. You could hit the right tips and make 10%-50% a day. On paper, you start making good money. Good enough to even say fuck it to the 9-5. Then one day, bam, Mr. Market wants his money back. You've spent some of that paper gain and bought a car, a nice watch, rented a better place, started wearing brand name shit and the list goes on. Let's say you didnt buy all that crap and continued to snowball that money to make more money. Let's even go as far as leveraging your cash/stock position with a 100%+ margin account and start maxing that out.

So the RE crashes with all the stars aligned and Mr. Got It All Figured Out is broke, has amassed new debt, and can't even hold his job anymore but yet he was right all along about the RE market crashing. He saw it, waited for it but couldn't take advantage of it. At the same time, no one else is interested in buying anymore because it could drop more or are in a similar situation. So at the end of the day, he still can't get a place and is close to broke. This shit happens about once every 10 years in HK, its ridiculous how short people's memories are and fall back into the same trap. I was one of those suckers this time around too but I held myself back on how much to play.

We've been hammered with the idea of making our money work for us and grow more money by itself. What we kind of forget is that opportunity has its risks to achieve those returns. People are always going to be greedy and chase more. Instead of that $1m house, I want that $3m house. I can get a couple supercars and live the dream. YOLO right?

I can tell you that the majority of Vancouverites will not be able to afford housing no matter what happens, unless mommy and daddy pays for the downpayment and serves as guarantor. Income is low here and the chill factor basically breeds laziness. Business opportunities suck and taxes are high. I know a lot of you guys are frustrated as hell watching your beloved city get bought out piece by piece, I am too. I knew straight out of college that I couldn't make my dreams happen if I stayed and worked here. I left, made some good money and I'm one of the A-holes coming here to buy things up, once again I'm sorry for that. I took my risk working and eventually building a business elsewhere and if I failed, I don't see how my position would be different than if I stayed and worked here.

Sorry for the long post.

EmperorIS

07-08-2015, 11:37 PM

So do I buy now or later in Vancouver?

NKC ONE

07-08-2015, 11:51 PM

So do I buy now or later in Vancouver?

The heart wants what the heart wants. If you can afford it now and is comfortable with the chance of market fluctuations then go for it.

On another note, I just glanced at one of my more heavily invested stock that I sold couple days ago go from $0.40 to $0.78 today. I'm a pretty big dumbass when it comes to this shit and probably most shit too. This just ain't my game.:okay:

I'm still skeptical that the China market will continue its glory. Seems like a try hard to recover with tremendous government force.

ae101

07-08-2015, 11:53 PM

^
dont buy now & dont buy later, build a time machine & go back in time to buy :troll:

im hoping this market crash can help me make a bit of money on this side of the pound

twitchyzero

07-09-2015, 12:11 AM

http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o100/EMPulse_of_KC/threaddelivers.jpg

wstce92

07-09-2015, 06:38 AM

...
No one's losing their shit anywhere in China.
Other than arm-chair "business men" (closet "fu-er dai") and chumps.
This "crash" is meaningless.

The Chinese market has a free-float value of about 33% GDP... Most developed economies are over 100% GDP.
Less than 15% of household income is in the market.
China is very far from reliant on the stock market, unlike other developed nations.
Increases in share value do little to increase consumption in China, and decreases in share value do even less to decrease consumption.

So not only does this have little to no effect over in China, it sure as hell isn't going to change anything in Vancouver.

And side-bar, one point that a lot of people tend to glance over in terms of Vancouver RE, is that while Chinese people (arguably) may have driven up prices. It's locals who keep them high. For every 1 Chinese guy I've heard buy property in Vancouver, I've heard of 9 locals buy property in Vancouver (under the insanely wrong notion that "If we don't buy NOW, we'll never be able to buy"). This fear that they'll be priced out of their hometown is what's driving people to spend obscene amounts of money on a condo or house. This fear is nothing but fear, and when the market crashes; the Chinese guy is gonna be fine, but the locals are going to be fucked.

willystyle

07-09-2015, 08:33 AM

Read more about it since yesterday.

China's stock market has gained 110% in value this year, lost 30% in the last couple of days, then the western mainstream media calls it a crash. Lol

westopher

07-09-2015, 08:37 AM

...
For every 1 Chinese guy I've heard buy property in Vancouver, I've heard of 9 locals buy property in Vancouver (under the insanely wrong notion that "If we don't buy NOW, we'll never be able to buy"). This fear that they'll be priced out of their hometown is what's driving people to spend obscene amounts of money on a condo or house. This fear is nothing but fear, and when the market crashes; the Chinese guy is gonna be fine, but the locals are going to be fucked.
I wish the media would publish what you just said instead of "foreign investors drive up market" to trick people into keeping our real estate driven economy flying out of control. Its fucking propaganda, and its making people racist. Horribly irresponsible journalism.

nma

07-09-2015, 08:40 AM

I wish the media would publish what you just said instead of "foreign investors drive up market" to trick people into keeping our real estate driven economy flying out of control. Its fucking propaganda, and its making people racist. Horribly irresponsible journalism.

I think people mistaken/confuse foreign investment with actual Chinese-Canadian residents who buy property lol

It's true the price is driven up, but that's due to demand and supply... and rich people all over the place (not all of them chinese)

Sid Vicious

07-09-2015, 08:43 AM

shanghai ordered just buy back, the index jumped just now. let's see if it will continue.

i don't play china shit. USA is enough for me.

anyway, what goes up must come down. it's just a natural cycle.

you guys are all hoping china crash will somehow make our real estate cheaper.

trust me, if our real estate is cheaper, it means we're also crashing. and you're still not gonna be able to afford it cuz you lost your job LOL.

who knows, when the stars align, that's when crashes happen.

bubbles...
chinese local govt debt
chinese real estate
chinese everything.

if they all crash, and greece is fucked and leaves the EU. it could trigger a global recession again.

remember prices are dictated by human action. if everyone just sat at home with their hands up their asses, the markets would be flat.

people have to put up bids/asks, and people have to fill those bids/asks for the market to move.

you have to ask yourself who are those people filling those bid/asks as the market goes down. and why they are doing it.
they all have their own insane reasons to buy or sell at a certain price.

it's only when the majority of people all coincidentally sell at the same time for different reasons does the market crash.

reasons don't matter. that's a historical fact that will be pegged on afterwards. there will be a billion reasons. reasons are lagging indicators.

if you wanna make money, reasons don't matter. just act as it's happening and follow the strength. direction strength is easy to see. but the reasons behind it... leave that up to the economists and nerds to write in the history books.

like surfing, you don't try to predict how far the wave will go. you just ride it out and if its a bunk wave, you ditch it and wait for the next one.
trying to predict where the wave will go is impossible. that's not a game you play if you're trying to make money. just ride it for what it's worth. it's a handout, you take what it gives u then you leave.

lol so true
If you're in an industry that revolves around manufactured goods in some way...lol

originalhypa

07-09-2015, 08:44 AM

Money never existed.
Do your research, this is called "fiat currency"

Money you're talking about is nothing physical. They never existed. It's all data in your bank's computer.

Like this?

House prices driving sales of luxury cars

Growth in household wealth has been a key driver of luxury car sales, said Gomes.

Data from Statistics Canada indicate that household wealth in B.C. is more than 30% above the Canadian average, with homes accounting for most of that wealth.

"In B.C., we're probably seeing a double-digit gain [in house prices] over the past year. That's despite some fear mongering out there that prices may be overvalued," Gomes said.

People leveraging their debt based on the value of their home, and using that to buy a luxury car. It's absolutely insane!

source:Luxury car sales in B.C. nearly 50 per cent above the national average - British Columbia - CBC News (http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-columbia/luxury-car-sales-in-b-c-nearly-50-per-cent-above-the-national-average-1.3136527)

SkinnyPupp

07-09-2015, 08:47 AM

Read more about it since yesterday.

China's stock market has gained 110% in value this year, lost 30% in the last couple of days, then the western mainstream media calls it a crash. Lol
It doesn't matter how much it went up, it's still a crash. That's not what "western media" calls it, it's what it literally is. FailFish

SumAznGuy

07-09-2015, 08:49 AM

People leveraging their debt based on the value of their home, and using that to buy a luxury car. It's absolutely insane!

Prior to the 2007 US crash, I heard lots of stories of people in the US were doing that.
Bought a $200K house in Riverside, CA. Value shoots up to $400K so they get a second mortgage and buy a Hummer, fancy furniture, holidays.... :heckno:

willystyle

07-09-2015, 08:52 AM

It doesn't matter how much it went up, it's still a crash. That's not what "western media" calls it, it's what it literally is. FailFish
Then we better see a recession or depression as days follows as that's normally what a real crash is.

This is more of a correction than a crash to me.

SkinnyPupp

07-09-2015, 08:56 AM

Then we better see a recession or depression as days follows as that's normally what a real crash is.

This is more of a correction than a crash to me.
Whatever you want to call it I guess... Media here is covering it the same way as there. Don't look for reasons to be mad where there are none is all I meant to say.

willystyle

07-09-2015, 08:57 AM

Whatever you want to call it I guess... Media here is covering it the same way as there. Don't look for reasons to be mad where there are none is all I meant to say.
The mainstream media here is bias as hell as always pertaining anything to Russia and China.

SkinnyPupp

07-09-2015, 09:01 AM

The mainstream media here is bias as hell as always pertaining anything to Russia and China.
How do you think that news is covered in Russia and China? Keeping in mind that there is no free press in either of those countries - media is all state run. No bias there I'm sure!

willystyle

07-09-2015, 09:03 AM

How do you think that news is covered in Russia and China? Keeping in mind that there is no free press in either of those countries - media is all state run. No bias there I'm sure!
I read propaganda from both to form my own opinion. Your average joe don't.

SkinnyPupp

07-09-2015, 09:12 AM

I read propaganda from both to form my own opinion. Your average joe don't.
Propaganda only comes from one side... The other may or may not have a bias, it depends on the source.

The only reason to read state run media is for the comedy, IMO.

Gululu

07-09-2015, 09:32 AM

this is good news for current home owners in vancouver. we can expect home values to only remain steady rise in the coming years. vancouver RE is like the ideal substitute good to holding stocks

hchang

07-09-2015, 10:06 AM

D

People leveraging their debt based on the value of their home, and using that to buy a luxury car. It's absolutely insane!

source:Luxury car sales in B.C. nearly 50 per cent above the national average - British Columbia - CBC News (http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-columbia/luxury-car-sales-in-b-c-nearly-50-per-cent-above-the-national-average-1.3136527)

Nothing in the article talks specifically about people putting up loans on their homes for luxury cars.

While I don't doubt that this is happening since us North Americans are dumb with our money but I don't think its a key player in why BC is up 50%. I believe it's mainly because of the influx of mainlanders and mainlanders kids with mommy and daddy money, others because BC has the best weather for super cars, and also the Canadian dollar being low which also boosts some sales from US customers from the west coast

originalhypa

07-09-2015, 11:39 AM

D

Nothing in the article talks specifically about people putting up loans on their homes for luxury cars.

While that is true, one has to wonder where is the money coming from?
If my house goes up, which it has over the last few years, I'm actually poorer for it based on higher property taxes. If my house goes up on paper, I'm not earning any more than I was prior to the bump.

Unless you take into account the one thing that paper value will give you, and that is higher leverage for borrowing.

http://www.capitaldirect.ca/images/homepage/CD_Bill_home-YourMoney-515x410.jpg

Hello, Capital Direct? I need a loan based on my home going up in value so I can buy a Porsche.

:troll:

While I don't doubt that this is happening since us North Americans are dumb with our money but I don't think its a key player in why BC is up 50%. I believe it's mainly because of the influx of mainlanders and mainlanders kids with mommy and daddy money, others because BC has the best weather for super cars, and also the Canadian dollar being low which also boosts some sales from US customers from the west coast

The Globe and Mail article on the subject is a lot more in depth than the CBC article and it goes into detail about the factors.

Several factors account for the trend:

*The international flavour of high-income people flocking to British Columbia and the Lower Mainland.

*A “business-friendly” provincial government that has residents feeling flush, willing to spend money on strong automotive brands.

*British Columbians are leveraging equity on their homes to help finance new cars. Residents are accustomed to dealing with a high cost of living, so why not throw a premium car into the game?

It comes down to consumer confidence being very high, just like it was in the US in 2007, a year prior to their major crash.

British Columbia?s luxury car boom is in full swing - The Globe and Mail (http://www.theglobeandmail.com/globe-drive/news/industry-news/british-columbias-luxury-car-boom-is-in-full-swing/article23631985/)

multicartual

07-09-2015, 11:49 AM

Prior to the 2007 US crash, I heard lots of stories of people in the US were doing that.
Bought a $200K house in Riverside, CA. Value shoots up to $400K so they get a second mortgage and buy a Hummer, fancy furniture, holidays.... :heckno:

I bought a GMC Typhoon(Mistake, they are money pits to the extreme!!!) off a guy who rode the real estate boom up. He had one house that tripled in value in like 3 years, then mortgaged it to the tits to buy like 5 properties and build 5 houses or something on it, an entire cul-de-sac

Then the crash started early in Colorado and he had to sell all the toys to survive, I think he even lost his original house...

multicartual

07-09-2015, 11:51 AM

this is good news for current home owners in vancouver. we can expect home values to only remain steady rise in the coming years. vancouver RE is like the ideal substitute good to holding stocks

Yeah but it destroys the social fabric of your city, people cannot afford to have children so many people drown themselves in liquor, drugs and hookup sex!

dat_steve

07-09-2015, 12:28 PM

Yeah but it destroys the social fabric of your city, people cannot afford to have children so many people drown themselves in liquor, drugs and hookup sex!

that just sounds like a normal friday night at the Roxy, bud

subordinate

07-09-2015, 01:04 PM

Yeah but it destroys the social fabric of your city, people cannot afford to have children so many people drown themselves in liquor, drugs and hookup sex!

Just over 7 billion people on this earth,

I don't think we need more kids.

Ulic Qel-Droma

07-09-2015, 01:26 PM

Just over 7 billion people on this earth,

I don't think we need more kids.

we need more kids.

to create more real problems.

so we can solve those real problems, therefore become more advanced.

imagine the technology needed to sustain like 18 billion people on this planet or something.

SumAznGuy

07-09-2015, 02:36 PM

I bought a GMC Typhoon(Mistake, they are money pits to the extreme!!!) off a guy who rode the real estate boom up. He had one house that tripled in value in like 3 years, then mortgaged it to the tits to buy like 5 properties and build 5 houses or something on it, an entire cul-de-sac

Then the crash started early in Colorado and he had to sell all the toys to survive, I think he even lost his original house...

To think, Colorado is in a housing boom right now.
Colorado home prices rising at fastest rate in country - The Denver Post (http://www.denverpost.com/business/ci_27867166/colorado-home-prices-rising-at-fastest-rate-country)

willystyle

07-09-2015, 02:42 PM

We don't need any more people. This planet is already over-populated. For the rest of the world to have our living standards here in Canada. We need a population of 3 billion.

ilovebacon

07-09-2015, 04:18 PM

should we all be concern about china having a crashed with the market? If I dont have any money invested with china I shouldnt care right?

HKSR

07-09-2015, 05:03 PM

Face it, us poor folks in Vancouver are just HOPING this 'crash' helps our real estate problem. Reality is (and deep down you know it too), this 'crash' is unlikely to change anything in this overpriced city.

EmperorIS

07-09-2015, 08:47 PM

should we all be concern about china having a crashed with the market? If I dont have any money invested with china I shouldnt care right?

You may not have any money invested in China, but your employer, your clients, city, friends might have. So yes you should care.

multicartual

07-09-2015, 09:22 PM

We don't need any more people. This planet is already over-populated. For the rest of the world to have our living standards here in Canada. We need a population of 3 billion.

I want someone to carry on my traditions, way of life, and care for me when I'm too old to chirp 2nd...

...

Who am I kidding I'll never be too old to chirp 2nd :hat:

tiger_handheld

07-09-2015, 09:39 PM

buy low
sell high

Harvey Specter

07-09-2015, 10:29 PM

Supposedly a good time to find some deals on the Hang Seng.

willystyle

07-09-2015, 11:15 PM

should we all be concern about china having a crashed with the market? If I dont have any money invested with china I shouldnt care right?

That's like saying if I don't have money invested in NASDAQ (US stock market), and it crashes. It shouldn't affect me.

It did and it will.

China is too intertwined with the world economy. If China's economy crashes, it will take everybody else along with it, just like the US back in '08.

Face it, us poor folks in Vancouver are just HOPING this 'crash' helps our real estate problem. Reality is (and deep down you know it too), this 'crash' is unlikely to change anything in this overpriced city.
When and if China crashes, it will affect more than just real estate in Canada. it will affect our cost and standard of living.

4444

07-10-2015, 12:19 AM

Patiently waiting for 4444 to respond to this thread.

:Popcorn

ok, here's how i chime in - though it's kinda creepy that you need me to comment:

- stop looking at 'lost value' - the market just had a STUPID bubble run up and is up about 85% on the year. this isn't lost value, it's giving back some of the stupidly gained value. It will fall further as valuations are not right.

- anyone who couldn't see this coming should not be invested. chinese capital markets are not mature, those involved at the beginning are fine, but the people who got involved in the run up and who will lose their shirt are not going to be the wealthy, but will be the middle class, the working people (office or otherwise) of china. chinese stock market volatility is really high compared to N.A. and Western European markets.

- this will have little effect on vancouver, the run up was recent, this downturn will not affect the small number of very wealthy people that could afford to buy the high end of real estate around the world - the people buying 'average' places in vancouver are, factually, residents and citizens of canada, mostly using mortgage debt (this is why i say factually, if you buy with a mortgage, you're not a rich chinese off shore person).

sorry i don't have any controversial to say. i don't invest directly in china and would advise anyone that doesn't like things like this to follow that same advice. you can get plenty of exposure to the chinese economy (not stock market) through the S&P500 as this includes the world's biggest companies that operate worldwide.

there's really nothing to see here, the actual chinese economy (which is WAY more important) is ticking along at some number the chinese government says, which is less than it was a year ago, and is more than it will be next year - again, no surprise. the stock market just had an overzealous run up and now is going back to it's mean...

one controversial thing i will say - take this as a lesson for all asset classes, when prices go away from value, you will revert back to mean, and quickly (with an overshoot)... i'm sure you are all reading what i'm saying, right?

Timpo

07-10-2015, 09:52 AM

Hehe

07-10-2015, 11:09 AM

China stock market crisis could lead to more real estate investment in B.C.

China stock market crisis could lead to more real estate investment in B.C. - British Columbia - CBC News (http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-columbia/china-stock-market-crisis-could-lead-to-more-real-estate-investment-in-b-c-1.3144146)

It's actually the opposite. It would force Chinese investors to sell to cover their positions in China.

Either way, the rise from last 2 days is painfully to watch. China basically made it impossible for big players to sell and the regular folks account for very little (relatively speaking) volume. So the only possibility is to buy, not to mention the 120billion yuan the central bank has mandated to spur into the stock market.

Mark my word, when it start dropping again, it would break through 3000 points in no time.

willystyle

07-10-2015, 11:49 AM

mr_chin

07-10-2015, 02:32 PM

It's actually the opposite. It would force Chinese investors to sell to cover their positions in China.

Either way, the rise from last 2 days is painfully to watch. China basically made it impossible for big players to sell and the regular folks account for very little (relatively speaking) volume. So the only possibility is to buy, not to mention the 120billion yuan the central bank has mandated to spur into the stock market.

Mark my word, when it start dropping again, it would break through 3000 points in no time.

This is exactly what was thinking too but is there really position to cover after such a loss?

I'm no expert in the stock market, but if it's loss, it's loss, even if you sell your assets and investments, you're not gonna get it back right? If so, wouldn't it be wise to keep your real estate investments in B.C?

Traum

07-10-2015, 02:38 PM

This is exactly what was thinking too but is there really position to cover after such a loss?

I'm no expert in the stock market, but if it's loss, it's loss, even if you sell your assets and investments, you're not gonna get it back right? If so, wouldn't it be wise to keep your real estate investments in B.C?
Buddy, you are still thinking with your Canadian mindset. You need to put on a Chinese Mainlander hat and consider what they are doing and how much they have borrowed to leverage.

When you are borrowing from other people in China, you better damn well pay them back.

That is all I am going to say.

SumAznGuy

07-10-2015, 03:10 PM

When you are borrowing from other people in China, you better damn well pay them back.

That is all I am going to say.

That or change your name to The Thompsons and move to Terror Lake.

multicartual

07-10-2015, 03:12 PM

When you are borrowing from other people in China, you better damn well pay them back.

That is all I am going to say.

If you borrow money or camp with the awp in China, you could get fucked anytime

EmperorIS

07-10-2015, 04:25 PM

There's already China investors in the Hong Kong real estate giving up on their unit pre purchase and ditching their deposit because of the recent market crash in China.

Its hard to say that will be the case in Vancouver though as the on average Chinese foreign investors are somewhat better off than the ones investing in Hong Kong. The ones that invested in Vancouver invested way before the huge spike in the Chinese Market in the last 6 months and decline in the last month would probably not force them to sell off their Vancouver homes just yet.

multicartual

07-10-2015, 04:35 PM

I recently met an asian older woman who is a real estate agent, what is the most polite way to ask if she's single?

Got me some yellow fever :)

EmperorIS

07-10-2015, 04:39 PM

I recently met an asian older woman who is a real estate agent, what is the most polite way to ask if she's single?

Got me some yellow fever :)

You will not get her pussy wet by telling her you rent.

mr_chin

07-10-2015, 05:11 PM

If you borrow money or camp with the awp in China, you could get fucked anytime

Yeah, chase after the guy with the knife.

Ulic Qel-Droma

07-10-2015, 06:43 PM

I recently met an asian older woman who is a real estate agent, what is the most polite way to ask if she's single?

Got me some yellow fever :)

asking if someone is single is the worst idea ever.

if they are not single, and they tell you, or hesitate to tell you, then it becomes awkward and you just closed a door on yourself.

if they are into you, you just see where it goes.

is she mainlander? if she's mainlander, being single or married doesn't matter. relationships in china... everyone's fucking everyone else behind everyone's backs. LOL.

everyone is promiscuous. just try. that's the only thing you have to do.

you could become another one of her boy toys. if she's into that. maybe her favourite one. it will come with a lot of benefits LOL.

rich women, are exactly like rich men. they frolic through fields of options, doing a small dance with each one that passes.

GLOW

07-10-2015, 06:56 PM

multi's getting schooled by ulic on how to work game
http://img.pandawhale.com/post-29949-Clay-Davis-SHIT-gif-Imgur-eTgm.gif

SkinnyPupp

07-10-2015, 07:41 PM

This has been widely reported outside of North America, but very few here. I wonder why..

China?s stock market bounces back, after govt steps in to stop huge slide ? RT Business (http://rt.com/business/272551-china-shareholders-sell-ban/)
Maybe because you're not looking?

China stocks rebound: Is the worst over? - Jul. 9, 2015 (http://money.cnn.com/2015/07/09/investing/china-stocks-shanghai/index.html)

China stocks bounce back after days of panic selling among investors | Business | The Guardian (http://www.theguardian.com/business/2015/jul/09/china-stocks-bounce-back-after-days-panic-selling-)

China bounce snaps five-day equity sell-off | Reuters (http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/07/09/us-markets-global-idUSKCN0PJ00W20150709)

Why China stock market will bounce back--commentary (http://www.cnbc.com/2015/07/09/why-china-stock-market-will-bounce-back-commentary.html)

Sorry it seems like I am picking on you, but seriously man you are looking for a fight for no reason. The "western media" isn't trying to make people hate China. You don't have to trust state run media to get "the truth".

Marshall Placid

07-10-2015, 09:12 PM

or camp with the awp

LOL!

Camp with the awp!

I used to play CS and CSS and I would only use the knife and... sneak up behind the campers, and knife those campers in the back, 1 hit kill LOL - 50:50 kill/death ratio with the knife only

multicartual

07-10-2015, 10:22 PM

is she mainlander? if she's mainlander, being single or married doesn't matter. relationships in china... everyone's fucking everyone else behind everyone's backs. LOL.

She was not born here. I have never hit on a mainlander before!

I was thinking I would send a "thank you" envelope to her office, thanking her for the house tour and asking her out for dinner at a nice Kits restaurant that I'm sure she would enjoy. Just leaving my number and signing it, putting the ball into her court.

Flirting like that is my style, putting the feelers out there and if they're interested, they'll bite. Assuming, of course, that mainlander women are like the typical Canadian woman who will nibble whenever you dangle a worm in their direction!

multicartual

07-10-2015, 10:29 PM

You will not get her pussy wet by telling her you rent.

Younger, dispossessed women care more about the things you own and how your level of status makes them more important,
Older, established women care more about how you make them feel, and the functional ability of the property between your legs.

willystyle

07-10-2015, 11:05 PM

Maybe because you're not looking?

China stocks rebound: Is the worst over? - Jul. 9, 2015 (http://money.cnn.com/2015/07/09/investing/china-stocks-shanghai/index.html)

China stocks bounce back after days of panic selling among investors | Business | The Guardian (http://www.theguardian.com/business/2015/jul/09/china-stocks-bounce-back-after-days-panic-selling-)

China bounce snaps five-day equity sell-off | Reuters (http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/07/09/us-markets-global-idUSKCN0PJ00W20150709)

Why China stock market will bounce back--commentary (http://www.cnbc.com/2015/07/09/why-china-stock-market-will-bounce-back-commentary.html)

Sorry it seems like I am picking on you, but seriously man you are looking for a fight for no reason. The "western media" isn't trying to make people hate China. You don't have to trust state run media to get "the truth".
Who said anything about getting information from state media to find the truth?

All I said was propaganda, it doesn't need to come from state media to be propaganda news. All news media sources are bias (if it's bias/manipulative enough, it's propaganda), just depends on which side of the spectrum the owner wishes to lean on.

My original comment was about North American media sources, you got 2/4 right, Guardian and Reuter are from Europe. Most North American news sources did not report that. I stand corrected.

and I feel that you're nitpicking to try to pick a fight.

Timpo

07-11-2015, 01:10 AM

ok so will China still be the leader of global economy or what? Like everybody used say?

4444

07-11-2015, 01:43 AM

ok so will China still be the leader of global economy or what? Like everybody used say?
Timpo, ur such an idiot!

Stock market bubbles and underlying economy are not related. The economy will move as it does (especially a planned economy like china).

The only variable here is if enough people lose confidence and stop buying, this is unlikely here given the low percentage of people that invest in the stock market, especially in China

SkinnyPupp

07-11-2015, 02:19 AM

Most North American news sources did not report that..

They all did. I thought you were still on the "western mainstream media tries to make China look bad" idea. Now it's just "North American mainstream media". I'll keep that in mind from now on.

I could look up every single North American media source and find that same story you think never got written. It would be a waste of time though, just rest assured that you're wrong and it did.

Some may have a bias, but that doesn't make it propaganda. Some papers are left leaning, some are right, some try to be neutral. People tend to read the papers that support their own opinions. That doesn't mean it's propaganda, it just means it's from a different perspective. Facts are still facts though, and that's what gets reported, unless the source is completely shady and untrustworthy (look at any link CiC posts for this).

The same can not be said for state run media. That is pure propaganda plain and simple.

Like I said I don't mean to pick on you. I am just trying to convince you that your feeling that there is this anti china sentiment in all western (or now, north american) media is just wrong. Maybe some assholes have that feeling and it comes through in their writing, but there's no conspiracy to try to make a country look bad. I'm not trying to start a fight, I'm just letting you know...

MG1

07-11-2015, 07:22 AM

Assuming, of course, that mainlander women are like the typical Canadian woman who will nibble whenever you dangle an anaconda in their direction!

Fixt.............

worm? :seriously: hee hee

westopher

07-11-2015, 11:56 AM

Maybe some assholes have that feeling and it comes through in their writing, but there's no conspiracy to try to make a country look bad. I'm not trying to start a fight, I'm just letting you know...
China (among many countries including Canada) doesn't need any help making themselves look bad from the media. Their government corruption, greed, and lack of respect for their citizens can do that for them quite well.

willystyle

07-11-2015, 12:18 PM

I am just trying to convince you that your feeling that there is this anti china sentiment in all western (or now, north american) media is just wrong.

I disagree! I believe there is an anti-china sentiment among major western mainstream media. It doesn't take much digging to know. For every 10 news stories posted about China, 9 of them are negative from the west. Many of the positive news stories that happen in China rarely ever get printed. You can go all day listing reasons why. I believe the news media is standing behind the stance of our governments and that is to paint Russia and China to be part of this evil cult. Unfortunately, many fall for it, and chooses to believe it. This is my opinion, and I don't expect everyone to agree.

westopher

07-11-2015, 12:33 PM

Traum

07-11-2015, 01:00 PM

I disagree! I believe there is an anti-china sentiment among major western mainstream media. It doesn't take much digging to know. For every 10 news stories posted about China, 9 of them are negative from the west. Many of the positive news stories that happen in China rarely ever get printed. You can go all day listing reasons why. I believe the news media is standing behind the stance of our governments and that is to paint Russia and China to be part of this evil cult. Unfortunately, many fall for it, and chooses to believe it. This is my opinion, and I don't expect everyone to agree.
Dude, I think you need to ask yourself what the role of news media is in this world. Are they supposed to only just report on the good or neutral news?

I'd say 90% of the stuff that gets published in a proper mainstream newspaper is supposed to be factual, with the remaining 10% being editorial / columns, etc. With that in mind, the next thing you need to ask is, out of those 90%'s worth of factual content, what would make them newsworthy?

Big events certainly deserve at least some attention. However, most of the time, the news-worthy items are problems in society. The news media is known as the Fourth Estate / the Fourth Power precisely for this reason. They need to report on the problems so that the public can exert pressure on the government to get these problems fixed. Any good news media outlet / publication builds its reputation on their in-depth investigation on problems that are happening all around us, and they do this most of the time. Reuters, NY Times, BBC News, even the lowly Vancouver Sun are spending most of the time digging into problems at the local, provincial, and national level for their own respective countries.

Now flash forward to China -- are you trying to tell me that China has less shxt happening than Canada on a daily basis? Have you actually lived in China? If you haven't, I suggest you to try living in Shenzhen, Dongguan, Guangzhou, Shanghai, Beijing, or any of the 2nd tier cities for a month like a regular local citizen. If you can come back and honestly tell me that you experience less shxt than you do here in Canada, I will shut up and never talk down on China again.

Traum

07-11-2015, 01:04 PM

90% of media stories are negative. Watch the first 10 minutes of any news cast and tell me how many positive stories you hear. Negativity gets viewers. Canadian media has just as high of a percentage of negative media stories pertaining to its own country. There isn't some hidden anti China agenda. The media likes to stir the shit pot regardless of background. Controversy gets people talking, talking gets ratings, ratings get money. All that matters is money when it comes to media.
Following up on Westopher's note, the only news channels I know of that are generally spreading good news about its own city or state are government mouthpieces, and overwhelmingly, they are found in authoritarian / semi-democratic places. Even CCTV (China Central Television) delivers a good amount of coverage on negative news regarding China's own problems. Generally, the stuff they talk about only concerns regular daily living issues, but as soon as it creeps anywhere close to political issues, they would just shut up and follow the party line.

SkinnyPupp

07-11-2015, 06:45 PM

I disagree! I believe there is an anti-china sentiment among major western mainstream media.
So are we talking about western media again? Or still north american?
For every 10 news stories posted about China, 9 of them are negative from the west..

Anyway... for every 10 stories posted about anything, 9 of them are negative. That's just how the news is man.

willystyle

07-11-2015, 08:59 PM

Dude, I think you need to ask yourself what the role of news media is in this world. Are they supposed to only just report on the good or neutral news?

They need to maintain a balance of good, neutral and bad news reporting. Unfortunately from what I see, it's mostly bad from what they report about China.

I'd say 90% of the stuff that gets published in a proper mainstream newspaper is supposed to be factual, with the remaining 10% being editorial / columns, etc. With that in mind, the next thing you need to ask is, out of those 90%'s worth of factual content, what would make them newsworthy?
What is fact? It depends on which side you stand. Each side has their own "facts". Based on western history, "official" facts always come from the side of the winners. If you ask the Germans or the Japanese how WWII went down. Pretty sure they will give you a different side of their "facts".

90%.... you're being too generous.

Now flash forward to China -- are you trying to tell me that China has less shxt happening than Canada on a daily basis?

I'm trying to tell you that there's just as much bad shit, if not more shit happening in China, at the same time, there's a lot of good things that happen in China as well. As a role of the media, you should be impartial and report on both, if not a 50%/50% ratio, at least be 60/40, heck I be content with 70/30 (bad/good news). Unfortunately I feel like it's more of a 90/10, filled with astronomical amount of hypocrisy. I feel like their coverage is to target most if not, only all of the bad stuff that happens in China (this is my opinion and I could careless if you agree with me or not). If you don't think that our media is a mouthpiece of our western government then you really need to give your head a shake. There's only a handful of people that owns most of the media outlets in North America, and they are all buddy buddies with our governments (this is fact).

Anyway... for every 10 stories posted about anything, 9 of them are negative. That's just how the news is man.

As a whole, that's fine if they treat everyone equally like that (reporting on 9 negative news out of 10), but if you're doing that only to specific countries, in which case I feel that's how North American media portrays China and Russia. I have a problem with that, as that's discrimination.

multicartual

07-11-2015, 09:39 PM

The mainstream media is about social control and programming.

Carl Johnson

07-11-2015, 11:14 PM

The big question is what will this do to the Vancouver housing market? Talk about a lot of lost cash.

China's rich seek shelter from stock market storm in foreign property | Reuters (http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/07/12/us-china-markets-property-idUSKCN0PM01620150712?feedType=RSS&feedName=businessNews)

ae101

07-11-2015, 11:24 PM

i know its too late now, but im still wait hyde to come in here & telling us how hes making millions off of this stock market crash :troll:

rcoccultwar

07-12-2015, 12:27 AM

Negative news can be seen as positive. Positive news can be seen as negative. Some people are able to handle this way of approaching the concept of problem solving.

Old news but I'm not sure why it wasn't disclosed in the "western" media.

Apparently China stocks gained the most a few days ago since 2009, after police threatened to arrest "malicious" short sellers.

This can be seen either way if true. Can this even cross the minds of the authorities here in the West? Every transaction/trade is pretty much recorded nowadays to sound like Captain Obvious.

I could see future arrests for some of the sleaze-ball, weirdo short sellers, albeit, I don't blame for jumping off the ship. Maybe by then, kids will be more impressed by drag queens, opposed to drag races. Or even worse.

Timpo

07-12-2015, 01:01 AM

China's rich seek shelter from stock market storm in foreign property

Australia, Britain and Canada brace for surge in interest after signs Chinese buyers are seeking safe-haven property markets in wake of stock market volatility

China's rich seek shelter from stock market storm in foreign property | Business | The Guardian (http://www.theguardian.com/business/2015/jul/12/chinas-rich-seek-shelter-from-stock-market-storm-in-foreign-property)

Real estate agents in Australia, Britain and Canada are bracing for a surge of new interest in their already hot property markets, with early signs that wealthy Chinese investors are seeking a safe haven from the turmoil in Shanghai’s stock markets.

Sydney agent Michael Pallier said in the past week alone he has sold two new apartments and shown a A$13.8m (US$10.3m) house in the harbourside city to Chinese buyers looking for an alternative to stocks.

China’s stock market crash is a problem for the whole world
Isabel Hilton
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“A lot of high-net-worth individuals had already taken money out of the stock market because it was getting just too hot,” Pallier, the principal of Sydney Sotheby’s International Realty, said. “There’s a huge amount of cash sitting in China and I think you’ll find a lot of that comes to the Australian property market.”

Around 20% has been knocked off the value of Chinese shares since mid-June, although attempts by authorities to stem the bleeding are having some effect.

Many wealthy Chinese investors had already cashed out. Major shareholders sold 360bn yuan (US$58bn) in the first five months of 2015 alone, compared with 190bn yuan in all of 2014 and an average of 100bn yuan in prior years, according to Bank of America Merrill Lynch.

While much of that money may initially be parked in more liquid assets like US Treasury bonds and safe-haven currencies such as the Swiss franc, there is growing evidence that foreign property sales may receive a boost.

“There is anecdotal evidence that Chinese buyers have intensified their interest in safe-haven global property markets, including London, as a result of the recent stock market volatility,” said Tom Bill, head of London residential research at Knight Frank.

Ed Mead, executive director of realtor Douglas & Gordon in London, said his firm had seen two buyers from China looking to buy whole blocks of flats.

“It is unusual to see the Chinese block buying, it implies that this is a capital movement rather than just individuals looking to park money.“

Since 2000, China has had the world’s largest outflow of high-net-worth individuals. Around 91,000 wealthy Chinese sought second citizenship between 2000 and 2014, according to a report by residence investment broker Lion Global, a factor that is fuelling demand to buy foreign property.

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Most of these individuals, defined as those with net assets of US$1m or more excluding their primary residences, are moving to the US, Hong Kong, Singapore and Britain.

Brian Ward, president of capital markets and investment services for the Americas at commercial property company Colliers International, said Chinese investors had already sunk around US$5bn into US real estate in the first six months of 2015, more than the US$4bn they invested in the whole of 2014.

In London, Alex Newall, managing director of super prime residential realtor Hanover Private Office estate agents said he had seen an increase in interest from Chinese investors at the top of the market, although no transactions yet.

“They’re wanting to try and park large sums of money – I’m talking from £25m [US$38.5m] to £150m,” Newell said. “They’re looking to park that capital into London homes.”

Australia and Canada are also increasing in popularity, gaining an edge from their weakening currencies.

“Property prices are still cheap in RMB [yuan] terms,” said Timothy Cheung, a principal of Morphic Asset Management in Sydney.

The rush by Chinese investors into foreign property has not been without criticism, with some in London, Sydney and Vancouver blaming them for pushing up already spiralling prices.

The Australian government has moved to look tough on the issue, introducing new fees and jail terms for those found flouting foreign investment rules. The Chinese owner of a A$39m Sydney mansion was forced to sell up earlier this year after it was revealed the property had been bought illegally through a string of shell companies.

Others are concerned that Chinese investors who didn’t bail out of stocks quickly enough will be a drag on international property markets, particularly after Beijing on Thursday banned shareholders with large stakes in listed firms from selling for six months.

In London, Naomi Heaton, the chief executive of London Central Portfolio, said she had heard of investors pulling out of new-build purchases because they no longer had the capital.

It was a similar story for Vancouver real estate agent Andrew Hasman, who focuses on the city’s affluent westside area.

“I had a call last week from another agent wanting to know if a seller of a transaction we just did would allow the buyer to back out, because they had just recently lost a huge amount of money in the Chinese stock market correction,” Hasman said.

Traum

07-12-2015, 11:40 AM

I'm trying to tell you that there's just as much bad shit, if not more shit happening in China, at the same time, there's a lot of good things that happen in China as well.
Sigh... Willy, I am not sure whether I should call you optimistic or naive. To dispel your bias against western / N.American media on China, I'd recommend you to look into something called "Chinese citizen journalist" (中國公民記者). These are Chinese citizens that, for whatever reason, choose to embark on the uphill battle against wealthy corporations and well-backed political figures in the name of a stubborn sense of justice. I would also recommend you to consider the risks and harsh treatments that they receive when their findings stand in the way of powerful bosses' wealth and clash directly with party directives.

And while I'm at it, please consider any of the Mainland Chinese activists that have been jailed or otherwise treated harshly. I will only list a couple of the more well known ones, since there are just far too many to list:

趙連海 Zhao Lianhai - A Chinese dissident and former food safety worker who became an activist for parents of children harmed during the 2008 Chinese milk scandal. In 2010 he was sentenced to 2½ years imprisonment for 'disturbing social order'.

高耀潔 Gao Yaojie - A Chinese gynecologist, academic, and AIDS activist in Zhengzhou, Henan province, China. Gao has been honored for her work by the United Nations and Western organizations, and had spent time under house arrest. Her split with the Chinese authority on the transmission and the seriousness of the AIDS epidemic in China hinders her further activities and resulted in her leaving for the United States in 2009.

高瑜 Gao Yu - A Chinese journalist and dissident who has been repeatedly imprisoned for her outspoken nature against China's political systems. Her latest (and current) imprisonment is purportedly tied to leaking state secrets when those very same pieces of news have been publicly made available by Chinese universities.

劉曉波 Liu Xiaobo - A Chinese literary critic, writer, professor, human rights activist, and 2010 Nobel Peace Prize winner who called for political reforms and the end of communist single-party rule. He is currently incarcerated as a political prisoner in Jinzhou, Liaoning.

Do any of these people have a bias against China? If anything, all they've got is a pure and stubborn sense of patriotism for China and nothing else. And what do they get in return from their beloved country's government?

There are very good reasons why the media just won't let go of the blatant atrocities that the CCP commit on a daily basis. Contrary to what you might want to believe, it is not out of spite or bias.

willystyle

07-12-2015, 11:46 AM

Sigh... Willy, I am not sure whether I should call you optimistic or naive. To dispel your bias against western / N.American media on China, I'd recommend you to look into something called "Chinese citizen journalist" (中國公民記者). These are Chinese citizens that, for whatever reason, choose to embark on the uphill battle against wealthy corporations and well-backed political figures in the name of a stubborn sense of justice. I would also recommend you to consider the risks and harsh treatments that they receive when their findings stand in the way of powerful bosses' wealth and clash directly with party directives.

And while I'm at it, please consider any of the Mainland Chinese activists that have been jailed or otherwise treated harshly. I will only list a couple of the more well known ones, since there are just far too many to list:

趙連海 Zhao Lianhai - A Chinese dissident and former food safety worker who became an activist for parents of children harmed during the 2008 Chinese milk scandal. In 2010 he was sentenced to 2½ years imprisonment for 'disturbing social order'.

高耀潔 Gao Yaojie - A Chinese gynecologist, academic, and AIDS activist in Zhengzhou, Henan province, China. Gao has been honored for her work by the United Nations and Western organizations, and had spent time under house arrest. Her split with the Chinese authority on the transmission and the seriousness of the AIDS epidemic in China hinders her further activities and resulted in her leaving for the United States in 2009.

高瑜 Gao Yu - A Chinese journalist and dissident who has been repeatedly imprisoned for her outspoken nature against China's political systems. Her latest (and current) imprisonment is purportedly tied to leaking state secrets when those very same pieces of news have been publicly made available by Chinese universities.

劉曉波 Liu Xiaobo - A Chinese literary critic, writer, professor, human rights activist, and 2010 Nobel Peace Prize winner who called for political reforms and the end of communist single-party rule. He is currently incarcerated as a political prisoner in Jinzhou, Liaoning.

Do any of these people have a bias against China? If anything, all they've got is a pure and stubborn sense of patriotism for China and nothing else. And what do they get in return from their beloved country's government?

There are very good reasons why the media just won't let go of the blatant atrocities that the CCP commit on a daily basis. Contrary to what you might want to believe, it is not out of spite or bias.
Because I seek for fair reporting thus makes me a Chinese Mainland activist, and possess a pure and stubborn sense of patriotism for China?

Oh boy! LOL!

Your response reminds me of George W. Bush's famous quote, "You're either with us, or against us".

westopher

07-12-2015, 12:29 PM

Your idea of fair reporting isn't exactly what anyone with objectivity would expect to be honest.

willystyle

07-12-2015, 12:32 PM

Your idea of fair reporting isn't exactly what anyone with objectivity would expect to be honest.
I disagree, but to each their own.

Traum

07-12-2015, 12:55 PM

Because I seek for fair reporting thus makes me a Chinese Mainland activist, and possess a pure and stubborn sense of patriotism for China?

Oh boy! LOL!

Your response reminds me of George W. Bush's famous quote, "You're either with us, or against us".
Dude, do you have an understanding or reading comprehension problem? When did I ever even implied that you are a Mainland Chinese activist or have any sense of patriotism for China?

Since you have obviously completely missed my point in the above post, I will explicitly spell it out for you. The point I'm trying to get across is, western media in general does not have a bias against China. China's very own citizens are doing exactly the same thing because there are shxtloads of problems overflowing in that country. News media, regardless of whether they are western based, Chinese based, corporate-based or citizen-based, are all reporting on the shxtloads of problems in China because those problems are there.

Gesh... now I understand why you think western media are not objective... FailFish

Hehe

07-12-2015, 01:15 PM

I think Willy just wants to see in the news that China is all mighty and taking over the world. :fuckthatshit:

Seriously though, mainland Chinese media is probably the most biased news report out there. For CCTV, China is always doing great while all western civilizations are in chaos or evil to take over someone else.

I'm not saying that western media is 100% bias-free, but relative to the Chinese media, they are saint.

jing

07-12-2015, 01:20 PM

willystyle = Gululu?

willystyle

07-12-2015, 01:49 PM

When did I ever even implied that you are a Mainland Chinese activist or have any sense of patriotism for China?

Because you compared me to a list of jailed Chinese activists; otherwise I don't see the point of you making that list. But to be frank, I just scanned over your post, didn't read all of it.

Anyways, I'm going to leave it as this. Everyone has their own opinions, I don't expect to change yours, and you shouldn't expect to change mine.

SkinnyPupp

07-12-2015, 09:40 PM

Dude, do you have an understanding or reading comprehension problem? When did I ever even implied that you are a Mainland Chinese activist or have any sense of patriotism for China?

Since you have obviously completely missed my point in the above post, I will explicitly spell it out for you. The point I'm trying to get across is, western media in general does not have a bias against China. China's very own citizens are doing exactly the same thing because there are shxtloads of problems overflowing in that country. News media, regardless of whether they are western based, Chinese based, corporate-based or citizen-based, are all reporting on the shxtloads of problems in China because those problems are there.

Gesh... now I understand why you think western media are not objective... FailFish
For some reason it's hard to get across to people that when you point out problems in a certain country, you're not against that country. You're against the problems.

When people complain about mainlanders shitting and pissing in the streets, or greedy selfish spoiled cunts driving around like idiots in ferraris, they aren't against their race - they're against those people. Other, normal middle class mainlanders hate those people too.

But no, if you bring up any problems with China or Russia or anywhere else, you are just an evil westerner who has a preconceived bias against these countries for some reason.

I'll tell you now, you're wasting your time with willystyle. Many people have tried to open his eyes, but he would rather keep them shut, stick his fingers in his ears, and go "lalalallalalala" and keep all the hatred and negativity that has been instilled into him.

willystyle

07-12-2015, 10:39 PM

LOL

This discussion is like arguing between left and right-wing politics. In the end, there really is no right or wrong answer, however, if you really feel that you need to come out of this discussion as a winner. I applaud you. Here's a candy as a reward.

hchang

07-12-2015, 11:29 PM

While that is true, one has to wonder where is the money coming from?
If my house goes up, which it has over the last few years, I'm actually poorer for it based on higher property taxes. If my house goes up on paper, I'm not earning any more than I was prior to the bump.

Unless you take into account the one thing that paper value will give you, and that is higher leverage for borrowing.

The Globe and Mail article on the subject is a lot more in depth than the CBC article and it goes into detail about the factors.

It comes down to consumer confidence being very high, just like it was in the US in 2007, a year prior to their major crash.

British Columbia?s luxury car boom is in full swing - The Globe and Mail (http://www.theglobeandmail.com/globe-drive/news/industry-news/british-columbias-luxury-car-boom-is-in-full-swing/article23631985/)

The globe and Mail article not only backs up your claim, but mine as well.

I still believe the MAIN contributing factor is overseas money, again not doubting that there are some dumb ones out there that put up loans against their house.

I'd be interested in seeing some numbers with population growth across BC and numbers of new cars hitting the road