[Timpo]

I don't know how this works but looks cool...seems much faster than self-checkout.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NrmMk1Myrxc

[68style]

I understand efficiency and the speed of it... but why are we creating this world where you never have to interact with any other humans? I've enjoyed countless banter or being told about offers or cool products with cashiers at a variety of stores or places. Sure most of them are just in and out and they hate their life but those gems here and there make it worth it in my opinion.

Nevermind it's yet another basic job being eliminated, what's anyone supposed to do for work in the future?

[SkinnyPupp]

I understand efficiency and the speed of it... but why are we creating this world where you never have to interact with any other humans? I've enjoyed countless banter or being told about offers or cool products with cashiers at a variety of stores or places. Sure most of them are just in and out and they hate their life but those gems here and there make it worth it in my opinion.

Nevermind it's yet another basic job being eliminated, what's anyone supposed to do for work in the future?
All these 'basic jobs' need to be eliminated in order for us to move onto better things.

We need to replace practically every service with robots, give everyone a guaranteed wage, and set humanity free to do things other than banter about offers and cool products. ;)

Artisanal services would still exist, only it will be people who really want to do them (because they'd be getting paid anyway) so service would be so much better in every way. And you'd still get that human interaction - again with people who actually want to live that kind of lifestyle (and there are plenty that do)

[Mr.HappySilp]

The issue with AI is that is not still not smart enough to try to do all things human can do. Is smart but not there yet.

IE when my parents go to McDonald's to get their breakfast they perfer the cashier rather than the self server computer. Since they can't really read English really well.

I sometimes perfer to talk to a human when calling in for service (mainly to complain and try to get a credit). Talking to a human is much easier to get a credit.

Same with tech support. I am sure if tech support were to go all AI it will piss off a lot of ppl. Even talking to them sometimes is so confusing to see what they are having issue with.

[SkinnyPupp]

The issue with AI is that is not still not smart enough to try to do all things human can do. Is smart but not there yet.

IE when my parents go to McDonald's to get their breakfast they perfer the cashier rather than the self server computer. Since they can't really read English really well.

I sometimes perfer to talk to a human when calling in for service (mainly to complain and try to get a credit). Talking to a human is much easier to get a credit.

Same with tech support. I am sure if tech support were to go all AI it will piss off a lot of ppl. Even talking to them sometimes is so confusing to see what they are having issue with.
We're not remotely close of course, but we're working on getting there. Especially when it comes to actual AI. Things like complaining about bad service ideally won't happen, because there will be no such thing as bad service.

And tech support, I never once spoke to tech support that wasn't some fucking idiot following a step by step guide that was given to them to follow. In this case, a properly coded AI would be MUCH better.

Funny how talking to people to get a credit is the first thing that comes up... Revscene never changes EleGiggle

[bcuzracecarz]

Agreed, McDonald's is the perfect example, but not only just for the customer. Something like 1/6 people have worked at McDonald's in north america, it's how people learn (usually at a younger age) how to interact with all types or people, count money, simple interaction. These new machines cut out a key component in the introduction to work life. What are you going to learn if you never have to deal with an angry customer or complaint by sitting in the back fulfilling orders or flipping burgers.

[Jmac]

There'll be no/fewer cashiers, but more stockers, tech jobs (for system maintenance, etc.), security, and floor managers.

[Hondaracer]

I dunno if the self checkout and customer service in places like Home Depot was eliminated with even a half intelligent AI I'd be pretty happy

Idiots populate these places and frankly I'm sick of dealing with incompetence.

"Hey do you have any of these in the back? I've already checked all your stock as well as the inventory above the shelves"

HD employee: "okayyy im just gonna check every box you've already checked as well as waste 10 minutes with my head up in the air looking at the same inventory you just spent 5 searching, wait a minute, what exactly are you trying to do again?"

:@ :@ :@

[Infiniti]

All these 'basic jobs' need to be eliminated in order for us to move onto better things.

Further to your point, the general public should become more cognizant of the veil that surrounds employment statistics, and the politicians that rely on them them to depict a narrative whereby they are "creating jobs," and as a result, are jumpstarting the economy. In reality, if people were more discerning they would realize that employment statistics are heavily inflated by "unskilled" labour. I.e: more (insert: low wage, low skill job here, burger flipping, bagging groceries, cashier jobs...) jobs were added, but its those same jobs that are the first to disappear during economic downturns.

I suppose my overarching point is, automation will replace a lot of these unskilled jobs, and as the automation technology matures and becomes more advanced, higher skilled trade jobs that have traditionally been safe from such technological advances will also go by the way of the Dodo. Food for though: maybe those liberal arts degrees that a lot of people like to shit aren't as useless as they make them out to be after all. Then again, its like anything else in life - Its what you make of it!

[CivicBlues]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Pq-S557XQU

[68style]

We need to replace practically every service with robots, give everyone a guaranteed wage, and set humanity free to do things other than banter about offers and cool products. ;)


Do you honestly think that's what's going to happen though? It's a very utopian view, I can only wish that's the direction this is eventually headed in and I personally have voice my opinion before on how the capitalist system we live in is, by and large, utter bullshit... but I think it's going to be much more of a dystopia with only a few people controlling everything in the world and an underground revolution of sorts starting up. I don't really think anyone actually in a position of power envisions anything even remotely hippy with any of this nor do they want to see humanity freed up to do other things... If anything we are looking at the starting points of the eventual elimination of large sects of the human population.

Some might argue it's also a portion of a process of separating us from each other, take away interaction and no one communicates directly anymore and it's much harder to organize against things you don't like or realize that others feel the same way you do.

[GLOW]

from watching that video...i'm picturing people pretending to just "GO" and walking out with a shit ton of stolen stuff :badpokerface:

[Manic!]

There'll be no/fewer cashiers, but more stockers, tech jobs (for system maintenance, etc.), security, and floor managers.

That will not cover the amount of jobs lost. Down the road there will have to be a living wage where everyone gets a base pay from the government.

[Verdasco]

lol @ being tested with amazon employees only, they aren't going to steal shit

put this in public and you will see shoplifters


the only way this works is that you get a key fob or a fingerprint scanner to get in

[Bouncing Bettys]

Companies will probably start to consider a guaranteed wage for society once they find all those unemployed/working poor are unable to buy their products. Capitalism has many faults, but it can still work. I would hope a modern French Revolution complete with Guillotines, would not be necessary to make that change.

[underscore]

I understand efficiency and the speed of it... but why are we creating this world where you never have to interact with any other humans? I've enjoyed countless banter or being told about offers or cool products with cashiers at a variety of stores or places. Sure most of them are just in and out and they hate their life but those gems here and there make it worth it in my opinion.

Because a lot of people hate that crap?

[godwin]

It is a problem with self check out stalls already (shop lifting is actually up because of it (https://goo.gl/mtzfzn)), but it comes down to cost / profit ratio.

For those interested check out Bloomberg's article on Crime at Walmarts around America (https://www.bloomberg.com/features/2016-walmart-crime/)... Honestly I think the Amazon is a publicity stunt / disruption.. Amazon Prime Now already more or less produce the end same result (too bad not available in Vancouver).

from watching that video...i'm picturing people pretending to just "GO" and walking out with a shit ton of stolen stuff :badpokerface:

[godwin]

In this case, they do.. it is via one's cell phone.

lol @ being tested with amazon employees only, they aren't going to steal shit

put this in public and you will see shoplifters


the only way this works is that you get a key fob or a fingerprint scanner to get in

[SpartanAir]

So long as I can avoid one more Self Checkout at Canadian Tire...because I swear the next human interaction I have with someone after using one will be extremely violent.

http://big.assets.huffingtonpost.com/1120officespace.gif

[CivicBlues]

With our generation's luck everyone's job - skilled or otherwise- will be automated before our retirement age and we'll have to eke out an existence on Universal Basic Income (UBI). That or we'll fight each other for scraps in a post-work post-apocalyptic hellscape while the elites move to Mars.

[godwin]

Well Jeff Bezos did offer Donald Trump a ticket to Mars.. I really hope he take him up on his offer. I am pretty confident I won't see people traveling back and forth between Earth and Mars for pleasure in my life time.

I do notice a change, when I started decades ago, it was work in the garage mentality. You just create a product by yourself someone will buy it. But now things are so complicated you need teams. To build teams you need good social skills not just engineering and math skills to excel. You still need them "eventually", but it also means people who BS can sneak in. So it hurts guys more since social skills is not a strong suit for typical males. Currently GDP in the western world can't support UBI, I know Switzerland is trailing, but I don't expect post Trump Western countries would dare to do it.

With our generation's luck everyone's job - skilled or otherwise- will be automated before our retirement age and we'll have to eke out an existence on Universal Basic Income (UBI). That or we'll fight each other for scraps in a post-work post-apocalyptic hellscape while the elites move to Mars.

[GS8]

There'll be no/fewer cashiers, but more stockers, tech jobs (for system maintenance, etc.), security, and floor managers.

Still be thinning the heard of employable people though. There's still people out there who work the jobs no one else will (immigrants, developmentally disabled) but there's also the college students. The ones who are in between leaving high school and having a career. With tuition always going up, where will they work to help pay for their living standards? They're not yet qualified for career work so what happens in that scenario? Will they all just compete for the remaining jobs even though so many are extinct?

Population always rising, schools getting more filled, debt going up, all these things do is create bottlenecks within our institutions. Obviously this can't be addressed in a single night or even a decade but it's a reality of a civilization that's moving very fast, technologically. There's so many hurdles in the long term but everyone's so focused on the short term.

*The above is what I always think about when it comes to Automation / Robotics / AI. Not just limited to this Amazon Go'.

[Hehe]

Amazon Go shows that our technology is led by the ever-growing laziness of humanity. :fuckthatshit:

Nevertheless, I don't think this is the ultimate revolution as far as retail goes, but rather, cease the need to go into the store all together. This just puts us one step closer.

[Great68]

Nevertheless, I don't think this is the ultimate revolution as far as retail goes, but rather, cease the need to go into the store all together. This just puts us one step closer.

Thrifty Foods, Save-On-Foods and others offer online shopping with delivery for groceries.

I still much prefer going to the store in person.

[Manic!]

lol @ being tested with amazon employees only, they aren't going to steal shit

put this in public and you will see shoplifters


the only way this works is that you get a key fob or a fingerprint scanner to get in


The way the system works you can't shoplift. You have to log on to your Amazon account to get in and as soon as you pick an item off the shelf it charges your account.

[ForbiddenX]

Nevertheless, I don't think this is the ultimate revolution as far as retail goes, but rather, cease the need to go into the store all together. This just puts us one step closer.

Amazon's same day delivery in SF is actually really amazing. I can order something and it shows up even before I have to leave work.

I haven't tried Echo yet but from what my friends tell me all they do is say "Hey Alexa order me ...."

[iwantaskyline]

VR/AR (augmented reality) will change retail within the next two decades.

The future will be that you can test any product you shop online as if it was right next to you in a AR/VR environment.

Not sure if those jeans you wanna buy online fit? No problem, try them on with your AR/VR world.

[The_AK]

I understand efficiency and the speed of it... but why are we creating this world where you never have to interact with any other humans? I've enjoyed countless banter or being told about offers or cool products with cashiers at a variety of stores or places. Sure most of them are just in and out and they hate their life but those gems here and there make it worth it in my opinion.

Nevermind it's yet another basic job being eliminated, what's anyone supposed to do for work in the future?

Depends on types of purchases. Many times I prefer the interpersonal "in-store" experience since there are some things that a computer just cant replicate. I think good, knowledgeable and friendly staff will many times overtake ecommerce except in instances where main priority is price or convenience. Question is how do you fulfill/replicate those other needs?

Thrifty Foods, Save-On-Foods and others offer online shopping with delivery for groceries.

I still much prefer going to the store in person.

I tried this and it was awkward... I had to find someone to "release" the groceries for me. Once we found my order everything was reviewed in the shopping cart and the person (who from what it appeared like was hitting on me) was insisting on helping me bring it to my car which I had to refuse several times "Nah I'm good, no thanks I got it, its ok I'm good". But they're still perfecting it so I only see it getting better with time. I'm sure the delivery to your home feature is great.

[Great68]

Depends on types of purchases. Many times I prefer the interpersonal "in-store" experience since there are some things that a computer just cant replicate. I think good, knowledgeable and friendly staff will many times overtake ecommerce except in instances where main priority is price or convenience. Question is how do you fulfill/replicate those other needs?

I tried this and it was awkward... I had to find someone to "release" the groceries for me. Once we found my order everything was reviewed in the shopping cart and the person (who from what it appeared like was hitting on me) was insisting on helping me bring it to my car which I had to refuse several times "Nah I'm good, no thanks I got it, its ok I'm good". But they're still perfecting it so I only see it getting better with time. I'm sure the delivery to your home feature is great.

For me I'd rather cruise down aisles stocked with product than mindlessly clicking through shit in front of a computer screen. The grocery store is directly on my drive home and I get my stuff immediately.

I save my mindlessly clicking through shit time for work and Revscene.

[Hehe]

For me I'd rather cruise down aisles stocked with product than mindlessly clicking through shit in front of a computer screen. The grocery store is directly on my drive home and I get my stuff immediately.

I save my mindlessly clicking through shit time for work and Revscene.

Wait until you have kids. That 1+hr you spend in the supermarket where you have to constantly put stuff your kids grab back and the goddamn evil candies by the cashier that make your kids cry if you don't let them have one, is... let's just say not a part I enjoy about parenthood. :pokerface:

Not to mention that the same shopping trip can be done within 20min if I was without kids.
As for walking the isle discovering stuff, VR would actually solve this problem. All that store browsing experience in the comfort of home in undies.

[Digitalis]

Least no more cunts asking me for donations and making me feel guilty.:noyoudidnt::noyoudidnt::noyoudidnt:

[68style]

Wait until you have kids. That 1+hr you spend in the supermarket where you have to constantly put stuff your kids grab back and the goddamn evil candies by the cashier that make your kids cry if you don't let them have one, is... let's just say not a part I enjoy about parenthood. :pokerface:

Not to mention that the same shopping trip can be done within 20min if I was without kids.
As for walking the isle discovering stuff, VR would actually solve this problem. All that store browsing experience in the comfort of home in undies.


Your kids learn life experience and get socialized in these situations, they don't learn anything about society sitting at home while you online order everything.

[SkinnyPupp]

Do you honestly think that's what's going to happen though? It's a very utopian view, I can only wish that's the direction this is eventually headed in and I personally have voice my opinion before on how the capitalist system we live in is, by and large, utter bullshit... but I think it's going to be much more of a dystopia with only a few people controlling everything in the world and an underground revolution of sorts starting up. I don't really think anyone actually in a position of power envisions anything even remotely hippy with any of this nor do they want to see humanity freed up to do other things... If anything we are looking at the starting points of the eventual elimination of large sects of the human population.

Some might argue it's also a portion of a process of separating us from each other, take away interaction and no one communicates directly anymore and it's much harder to organize against things you don't like or realize that others feel the same way you do.
Do I think we'll get there? Eventually, for sure. We pretty much HAVE to, IMO. If we get more Elon Musks in the world, we'll head towards my "utopian" Star Trek future. More Hilary Clintons though, and we'll be in Mad Max eventually :fuckthatshit: (or maybe The Matrix LUL )

The thing about a universal income is that rich people can still get fucking rich if they want. People will still "want things" and having guaranteed income doesn't necessarily mean everyone will just sit around playing call of duty and smoking weed all day. Only the ones that are already doing that, who don't give a shit about money one way or another.

[Lomac]

I work for a major retail chain and, based on interactions over the years, I'm not sure this sort of application would work until there's a major shift in how consumers act. It may be a generation or a racial thing (or perhaps a mixture of both) but cash is still king for a lot of people. Hell, I still use cash myself for many purchases because my debit card wears out quickly and I have a habit of leaving my phone at home or the hotel.

Consumers also have a terrible habit of not putting products back where they found them. In Amazon's pilot store, I'm sure things work more or less fine. But it's not just kids who pick up random items, decide later they don't want them, and then drop them where ever they happen to be standing. Adults are notorious for this. Go into any store and I'm sure you'll find random shit dropped along the selves. This sort of system wont detect these kind of item drops and you can bet your ass there will be a million complaints about people being charged for items they didn't take home with them.

The biggest thing I have, though, is the cost of implementation. I currently run projects for my company (new store openings, relocations and renovations) and the budgets for those are already pretty tight. Anywhere from $500,000 for a small store renovation up to $5 Million for a full sized new store opening. These costs include major things like trades people, millwork, fixtures, temporary stocking crews, and the like. For a small boutique store, incorporating all of these new sensors and cameras to cover shelves is likely already going to be a major portion of an expense. Translating that into a large store with over 10,000 separate skus like the ones I normally deal with would be astronomical. And then converting that into the over 300 locations in Canada alone? Goodbye profits for the next decade.

Also, I encounter customers all over the place who still don't know how their chip card works, despite it being in wide use for many years now. I would have no hope at all for those people if companies started shifting into this sort of selling practice.

[godwin]

We will eventually get there but not if 99% of the wealth is owned by 2% or less of the population. Having a UBI in this state of affairs is as likely as "trickle down" economy or promising everyone will eventually live in a mansion in Malibu.

You talk about utopian Star Trek future.. but in their canon basically the period we are living in got wiped out (ST First Contact) before they came to the senses.. my money is that will have to happen first. In that case, having a few Elon Musks won't matter.

Do I think we'll get there? Eventually, for sure. We pretty much HAVE to, IMO. If we get more Elon Musks in the world, we'll head towards my "utopian" Star Trek future. More Hilary Clintons though, and we'll be in Mad Max eventually :fuckthatshit: (or maybe The Matrix LUL )

The thing about a universal income is that rich people can still get fucking rich if they want. People will still "want things" and having guaranteed income doesn't necessarily mean everyone will just sit around playing call of duty and smoking weed all day. Only the ones that are already doing that, who don't give a shit about money one way or another.

[godwin]

I think the point is they will learn socializing in some other manner.. school, after school programs, free range parenting etc.

The trend is for online shopping to increase. heck Amazon is complaining they can't find large enough warehouse in lower mainland for their facilities.. The size they want for 1 warehouse is more than double of what we have available.

Your kids learn life experience and get socialized in these situations, they don't learn anything about society sitting at home while you online order everything.

[Verdasco]

10cm of snow friday...... uho h....


edit: wrong thread lol

[Sid Vicious]

shit is scary mang. lets look at this graph

https://i.kinja-img.com/gawker-media/image/upload/s--fTiTJyPU--/c_scale,fl_progressive,q_80,w_800/emps6yhmftk67yiwlffl.png

alot of those bottom 50% earners have jobs that are easily automated so they'll be potentially be even poorer in the future.

can't help but think we're heading into a classic dystopian nightmarish future with just a huge underclass

[Bouncing Bettys]

I am curious to see how infrastructures have been rated over that same period and where the funding was coming from.

[mikemhg]

I think that's the #1 thing that drove me nuts about this last election cycle, coming from an IT background.

I haven't heard a single legitimate politician even speak about technology and its role in removing jobs in the near future. Technology is slowly going to remove more Service industry related jobs, next it will move to transportation (which I may add employs something like a third of Americans), eventually it will also move to us office folks in our jobs as well, it is inevitable.

What is our plan here? You hear some folks say "Oh ya, well people will be educated to service and fix the machines". Do you really think so? I doubt it. The education system is FAR too behind to educate the lower class for these types of jobs, and let's be real here, these automated machines will need a fraction of human bodies to service and keep them running anyways.

So what's our plan? I'm a big proponent of the guaranteed wage idea, but given how Socialism has become such a dirty word in America, I don't ever see that passing.

[Verdasco]

I think that's the #1 thing that drove me nuts about this last election cycle, coming from an IT background.

I haven't heard a single legitimate politician even speak about technology and its role in removing jobs in the near future. Technology is slowly going to remove more Service industry related jobs, next it will move to transportation (which I may add employs something like a third of Americans), eventually it will also move to us office folks in our jobs as well, it is inevitable.

What is our plan here? You hear some folks say "Oh ya, well people will be educated to service and fix the machines". Do you really think so? I doubt it. The education system is FAR too behind to educate the lower class for these types of jobs, and let's be real here, these automated machines will need a fraction of human bodies to service and keep them running anyways.

So what's our plan? I'm a big proponent of the guaranteed wage idea, but given how Socialism has become such a dirty word in America, I don't ever see that passing.

they were focused more about the pipelines and bringing back jobs to Alberta , seems like they were trying to fix what was broken, rather than advancing what is growing in the tech industry.

edit: meaning... they will get more votes talking about bringing jobs back etc etc.

[Timpo]

You guys keep talking about "low class" or "entry level" jobs that are in danger, but legitimate occupations like Flight Engineer or even Web Designers are becoming obsolete. You don't need Flight Engineer to fly a 747 anymore, and people can just use WIX instead of hiring a web designer.

Same as in medical industry, I heard X-Ray Technician(or something?) is becoming obsolete due to improved technology.

[Timpo]

As for the argument of how the numbers of jobs won't change because they will just hire maintenance technician for those automated machines, but there's no guarantee that maintenance technicians can't be automated too.

[Mr.HappySilp]

Have you guys seen the new show on Netflix call 3%. Seems like this might happen. The poor will stay on earth where they are to suffer/die of disease and basically barely surive. They have no luxury items IE cell phones, tablets, TVs, computers, cars.

The top 3% gets to live in utopia where they don't have to worry about life, there are no suffering no disease. But to make it there you have to be really smart or rich or have power.

Maybe this happen to us in the future? Poor are made to suffer and no chance to get out of the cycle while rich have everything. Since the army will all be robots control by the rich the poor will never win in war to take life better for them.

[godwin]

Not X Ray tech but Radiologists, ie MDs who specialise in looking / analyzing images for their colleagues.. that field / need just disappeared after 2005. X ray machines / MRI scanners are just getting simplier to use and no need for training.. also with apps like Watson who can see things better than humans can.




Same as in medical industry, I heard X-Ray Technician(or something?) is becoming obsolete due to improved technology.

[godwin]

Depends on installation.. that's why the most "future proof" jobs are always clergy and plumbers because houses especially in Western world are still mostly custom. One of the places I often stay in Europe is 300+ years old... It has just been updated / redone every few decades. Robots for the foreseeable future needs to have their environment "defined" for them.

Here is an interesting read Open Letter from Terry Gou to Trump here. (https://www.bloomberg.com/gadfly/articles/2016-12-07/dear-mr-trump-about-those-u-s-iphones) Terry Gou is the owner of Foxconn also Sharp.

I can deploy more robots in the U.S., sure, but it can take months to train them whereas humans can be taught in a few hours.

As for the argument of how the numbers of jobs won't change because they will just hire maintenance technician for those automated machines, but there's no guarantee that maintenance technicians can't be automated too.

[Timpo]

CBC did an interesting review on automation:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l0CtmrMtGu4

[abishek28592]

i saw this video in facebook as a add yeah it looks cool but don know how long it will take to be in place

[asian_XL]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b-RXDCEErWQ

[SkinnyPupp]

All these 'basic jobs' need to be eliminated in order for us to move onto better things.

We need to replace practically every service with robots, give everyone a guaranteed wage, and set humanity free to do things other than banter about offers and cool products. ;)

Artisanal services would still exist, only it will be people who really want to do them (because they'd be getting paid anyway) so service would be so much better in every way. And you'd still get that human interaction - again with people who actually want to live that kind of lifestyle (and there are plenty that do)
Someone agrees with me SeemsGood

https://www.geek.com/tech-science-3/elon-musk-automation-will-force-universal-basic-income-1701217/

[Ulic Qel-Droma]

it won't be a problem because we'll just become the robots.