[The_AK]

Came across this in the news today which seems like an interesting situation:
Landlord using loophole to request rent hikes of up to 43% | CTV Vancouver News (http://bc.ctvnews.ca/landlord-using-loophole-to-request-rent-hikes-of-up-to-43-1.3323112)

cliffs:
- tenants living in building periodically see rent increase 2% per year
- year over year particular building sees an increased assessment up by almost $1mil to $4.91 million (approx 25%)
- landlord uses loophole on some tenants to increase rent by more than 2% (some folks seeing 43% increase)
- people mad they can no longer afford to rent in west end

Who do you deem to be correct in this situation? Whats your stance?

In one case we see landlord wanting to increase their revenue + pay property tax that comes with such a high assessment. People who have lived their for years have only seen a 2% increase of rent which probably hasn't equated to increase in all other costs. On the flip we have the moral high ground where people now cannot live here because of such a significant increase.

[Presto]

Does the increase make it significantly more expensive than other similar rental properties? If it just brings it up to current pricing, then I'm okay with that. It's not cheap to live downtown, and it's not getting any cheaper. It's not like it's low-income housing or anything. The area looks pretty nice, and less than 2 blocks to the beach.

[604dragon]

I think that this is just gentrification happening in some of the nicer parts of Vancouver and that all comes with a cost. Although this seems to happen in the more middle to higher class neighbourhoods, im not saying that this doesn't happen everywhere. With rising housing costs in vancouver, with being one of the most livable cities in Canada, I expect this just to keep on continuing unless we set laws or guidelines to protect the exploitation or constant change of rapidly increasing housing costs like this.

[godwin]

Who do you deem to be correct in this situation? Whats your stance?


Easy.. let the Tenancy branch's dispute resolution do its job and wait for the outcome. Rules are rules..

Dispute Resolution - Province of British Columbia (http://www2.gov.bc.ca/gov/content/housing-tenancy/residential-tenancies/solving-problems/dispute-resolution)

[Great68]

Get one thing straight with this story.

The landlords are only applying to increase rents. Nothing has been implemented yet.

It's not a loophole. There are special ways per the RTA that rent increases beyond the standard amounts. To do this, it has to be approved by the Tenancy Board first.

[godwin]

Exactly.. the tenants should have thought strategically.. I won't be surprised that now the relationship between the landlord and tenants have soured that they get reno-victed etc in the near future.

Bringing in the press before the process had ran its course has pretty much sealed their fate.

Get one thing straight with this story.

The landlords are only applying to increase rents. Nothing has been implemented yet.

It's not a loophole. There are special ways per the RTA that rent increases beyond the standard amounts. To do this, it has to be approved by the Tenancy Board first.

[godwin]

Oh I would bet the original owners of the holding company had passed on and the next generation who are more financial savvy did the math and went for the increase.

[ScizzMoney]

For my rentals I just get the tenants to sign a lease every year so I can set the price every year for whatever I want. How bow dah

[CRS]

For my rentals I just get the tenants to sign a lease every year so I can set the price every year for whatever I want. How bow dah

Can you elaborate on this?

[Hondaracer]

Can you elaborate on this?

If you have a fixed term lease with the lease ending in evacuation of the suite or whatever the terminology is, you can renegotiate with the current tenant as you would someone new who you advertise for as their lease is up.

At least that's how I think it works

[blkgsr]

yup 1 year term, must leave after 1 year period is up....if they choose to rent again at a higher rate then that's up to them

don't do year to year because then you can only up it 2% or same on multi year rentals

[RRxtar]

on a tenancy agreement with a 1 year term you can select at the end of the term it automatically switches over to month to month, or you can select tenant must move out. which you can obviously renew prior to the end of the term.

its also a great way to boot out shit tenants. you might be stuck with them for a year, but you can at least get rid of them.

infact, if you follow proper procedures during the rental process, you can cover yourself fairly well to have the law in your favor not the tenant

[604STIG]

Does the increase make it significantly more expensive than other similar rental properties? If it just brings it up to current pricing, then I'm okay with that. It's not cheap to live downtown, and it's not getting any cheaper. It's not like it's low-income housing or anything. The area looks pretty nice, and less than 2 blocks to the beach.

From what i've heard the increase will bring the rental rates up to par with the rest of the area (I haven't seen any docs or anything, just what i've heard) If that's the case I don't have a problem with it.

[RRxtar]

From what i've heard the increase will bring the rental rates up to par with the rest of the area (I haven't seen any docs or anything, just what i've heard) If that's the case I don't have a problem with it.
its a fairly simple process to goto arbitration to increase above the the standard allowable rent increase (for 2017 is 3.7%. it fluctuates between about 2 and 4.5% per year). you can bring up the rent to market average, or increase based on your costs going up (property taxes, utilities, etc)

[Mr.HappySilp]

If the rent is below market value because the ppl that live there have lived there for years and years I see justify why the landlord wants to increase to the market rate. I mean if the market rate for current rent is 30% higher than what the landlord is getting than yea increase it.

Can't afford to rent in Van. Move. Is as simple as that. The landlord owes you nothing they can increase the price all they want.

I am all in for free market in terms of renting. If the rent is too high then on one will rent it. if the price is too low than you got a deal.

RTA should have more protection for landlord. I mean when I rented out my apartment years ago. It took months to evict a tenant who didn't pay rent. Basically she paid one month rent and live there for a good 4 months. If she didn't pay I as a landlord should be able to legally remove her my place right away. The whole process sucks and while she is living there free loading off me I still have to pay for the cable/internet, utilities since I included them.

[Tapioca]

If you decide to become a lifelong renter, you better have a long term plan for your security. The majority of them are older. Barring any disabilities, they could have easily bought a condo at some point during their adult lives. This would have provided them with housing security.

Now, they are at the mercy of the RTB and the landlord. Thems the breaks in life.

[Mancini]

I'm usually in favour of landlord rights but this is a harsh group here.

[Ludepower]

For my rentals I just get the tenants to sign a lease every year so I can set the price every year for whatever I want. How bow dah

Sounds all fine and dandy until they string you along, destroy your property and squat until your court order and bailiff kicks them out.

They have so much excuses and rights rendering your contract useless. How bow dah.

[Mr.HappySilp]

Sounds all fine and dandy until they string you along, destroy your property and squat until your court order and bailiff kicks them out.

They have so much excuses and rights rendering your contract useless. How bow dah.

That's what happen to me. And from that point on I basically do credit checks and even stalk them on social media, search their name on google to see if I ran into any red flags.

[Hondaracer]

Sounds all fine and dandy until they string you along, destroy your property and squat until your court order and bailiff kicks them out.

They have so much excuses and rights rendering your contract useless. How bow dah.

If someone fucked me over hard enough on a rental property you'd better beleive they would be regretting it shortly after.

Not trying to be dat e-thug but people get hurt over a few hundred all the time, if someone cost me a few thousand plus I'd be going out of my way to destroy them.

[604STIG]

I'm usually in favour of landlord rights but this is a harsh group here.

I thinks it's just because too many people (ie. renters) feel entitled nowadays. If the owners has given you the benefit of low rent and property values have now sky rocketed, don't be but hurt when the rent increases along with his rising costs. (property taxes, garbage & sewer, hydro, etc...) If you can't afford the rent maybe you should look for an area where it's affordable relative to your income. No sympathy for someone living in the West end complaining about rent increases.

[Hondaracer]

That's what I don't really get about some people and their living situation

Some of the losers my fiances sister associates with live in east/south van paying $800-$1000 for basically a room in a house when you've got a school aged child

Go live somewhere where you can actually establish a half decent life not share a ducking bed with your child in a room in a house with 8 other people, it's gross.

[MarkyMark]

If someone fucked me over hard enough on a rental property you'd better beleive they would be regretting it shortly after.

Not trying to be dat e-thug but people get hurt over a few hundred all the time, if someone cost me a few thousand plus I'd be going out of my way to destroy them.

It's hard to win when dealing with trash that have nothing to lose. Yeah you could do something to them, but they know where you live and I'd personally be worried about my property getting fucked with after.

[Great68]

I thinks it's just because too many people (ie. renters) feel entitled nowadays. If the owners has given you the benefit of low rent and property values have now sky rocketed, don't be but hurt when the rent increases along with his rising costs. (property taxes, garbage & sewer, hydro, etc...) If you can't afford the rent maybe you should look for an area where it's affordable relative to your income. No sympathy for someone living in the West end complaining about rent increases.

Yeah if you want some stability , you gotta put on the big boy pants and buy something.

Of course then those are probably the same people that will push the whole "Renting gives me freedom, you're not tied down to an asset with as much risk if you lose your job, blah blah blah" etc...

I'm sorry renters, but you can't have your cake and eat it too.

Mind you, there's no guarantee to stable interest rates even if you buy something, so these people simply want to be exempt from the effects simple economics that everyone else faces.

[Tapioca]

The risks of long-term renting have not adequately been discussed in financial blogs and forums, while the risks of home ownership have been overblown.

Both choices come down to lifestyle. While renting is often touted as a lifestyle choice, the reality is that the majority of renters stay put and seek stability in their employment.

[The_AK]

Just curious for the people renting their places out there, is it standard for you guys to increase rent by 2% YoY to adjust for inflation? Or do you keep rent the same for "good residents"?

[Hondaracer]

2-3% on $1600 is like $40

Not even worth the increase for the most part even just for the point of straying from that round number.

Different story as a building owner when you're increasing the rent of 100+ units at 2% though

[originalhypa]

It's hard to win when dealing with trash that have nothing to lose. Yeah you could do something to them, but they know where you live and I'd personally be worried about my property getting fucked with after.

I was going to say the same thing. When you have an asset, you have something to lose. Your place, your relationships, your job, whatever. But when you're one of those scumbag renters that has nothing to lose, how can you compete?

It's like getting revenge on the losers in those awesome Chilliwack videos on youtube. You think it would be great to get a shot in, but those fuckers can honestly make your life hell. They truly have nothing to lose, and nothing else to keep them busy.

[Manic!]

I don't know why the article and the MLA keep staying it's 2%. The maximum amount you can increase the rent this year is 3.7%. That may not sound that much but over a year it adds up. Doing it every year is the key. Over 5 years it adds up to a lot.

[meme405]

2-3% on $1600 is like $40

Not even worth the increase for the most part even just for the point of straying from that round number.

Different story as a building owner when you're increasing the rent of 100+ units at 2% though

This is exactly it.

The problem is though, if you do leave it for a 3 years and don't increase it. When the third year rolls around you can't increase it by 5% (even though if you had incrementally done it YoY you would have gone up by over 6%).

So if you don't increase it every year you are basically shooting yourself in the foot. It's less problematic if your tenants change every few years, because during that change you can increase the rent appropriately. But if you keep tenants for 5+ years you are really loosing quite a bit of money.

EDIT: I like that a lot of people in here recognize the risk the landlord puts themselves at, there is a lot being done by the RTB to protect renters in terms of not being kicked out willy nilly, and rent spikes, etc.

But there isn't as much being done for the landlords when their million dollar+ asset gets fucking destroyed by some asshole tenant, or when the fuckers start to squat in our units and wont get the fuck out even though the court has ordered them out. Then it's the landlord that suffers having to hire a bailiff or getting the police who don't do fuck all to drag the motherfucker out of the unit. Why doesn't the RTB grow some balls in this aspect and put some of these shit eating renters in their place?

[Hondaracer]

kinda funny switch of sides here compared to some comments i made on facebook, as you said meme405, renters are taking on big time risk in renting their suites, homes, etc.

There was an article on facebook regarding Vancouver considering banning the practice of not allowing pets in rental units. I commented saying thats fine, but you sure as hell better believe that you're going to be paying that additional pet deposit + accepting any addendum's i make to the rental agreement regarding damages, noise, smells, etc.

Not to mention if i ask somone whether they are bringing a pet into the rental, they say no, and then they do, you think we're getting off on the right foot?

People attacked me from all angles saying things like fucking scumbag landlords, etc. etc. fucking "haters"

i said if i'm a hater for protecting assets in my possession and trying to position myself into being able to reclaim damages over value lost in those assets, then yea, i guess i'm a "hater" :sleepingzz:

[Great68]

kinda funny switch of sides here compared to some comments i made on facebook, as you said meme405, renters are taking on big time risk in renting their suites, homes, etc.

There was an article on facebook regarding Vancouver considering banning the practice of not allowing pets in rental units. I commented saying thats fine, but you sure as hell better believe that you're going to be paying that additional pet deposit + accepting any addendum's i make to the rental agreement regarding damages, noise, smells, etc.

Not to mention if i ask somone whether they are bringing a pet into the rental, they say no, and then they do, you think we're getting off on the right foot?

People attacked me from all angles saying things like fucking scumbag landlords, etc. etc. fucking "haters"

i said if i'm a hater for protecting assets in my possession and trying to position myself into being able to reclaim damages over value lost in those assets, then yea, i guess i'm a "hater" :sleepingzz:

You get that same reaction on Reddit too. It's a very lefty pro socialist forum.
I think this forum has an older & perhaps more wealthy demographic

[Manic!]

kinda funny switch of sides here compared to some comments i made on facebook, as you said meme405, renters are taking on big time risk in renting their suites, homes, etc.

There was an article on facebook regarding Vancouver considering banning the practice of not allowing pets in rental units. I commented saying thats fine, but you sure as hell better believe that you're going to be paying that additional pet deposit + accepting any addendum's i make to the rental agreement regarding damages, noise, smells, etc.

Not to mention if i ask somone whether they are bringing a pet into the rental, they say no, and then they do, you think we're getting off on the right foot?

People attacked me from all angles saying things like fucking scumbag landlords, etc. etc. fucking "haters"

i said if i'm a hater for protecting assets in my possession and trying to position myself into being able to reclaim damages over value lost in those assets, then yea, i guess i'm a "hater" :sleepingzz:

You can write all the contracts you want but it's impossible to get blood out of a stone. If you take a person to arbitration for damages you first have to file with the RTBO. The RTBO gives you documents that you have to serve your former tenant within 72 hours.

1st problem is finding the person. Had one person call me from Nepal telling me he had moved out and another had his daughter from England call. 2nd problem is even if you serve the person and win a judgement how are you going to collect if the person is broke?

[originalhypa]

I think this forum has an older & perhaps more wealthy demographic

I think it's common knowledge that everyone on RS drives Lambos and bangs supermodels.

:awwyeah:

[CivicBlues]

Posted this not too long ago.
pssh, I doubt anyone on RS can relate.

We all make over 100k living in million dollar townhouses drivin' the latest luxury cars while munchin' on all day McDicks' breakfast.

Try Reddit.

[RRxtar]

kinda funny switch of sides here compared to some comments i made on facebook, as you said meme405, renters are taking on big time risk in renting their suites, homes, etc.

There was an article on facebook regarding Vancouver considering banning the practice of not allowing pets in rental units. I commented saying thats fine, but you sure as hell better believe that you're going to be paying that additional pet deposit + accepting any addendum's i make to the rental agreement regarding damages, noise, smells, etc.

Not to mention if i ask somone whether they are bringing a pet into the rental, they say no, and then they do, you think we're getting off on the right foot?

People attacked me from all angles saying things like fucking scumbag landlords, etc. etc. fucking "haters"

i said if i'm a hater for protecting assets in my possession and trying to position myself into being able to reclaim damages over value lost in those assets, then yea, i guess i'm a "hater" :sleepingzz:
this discussion came up on my FB feed too from a local news outlets article. ended up several hundred posts in the discussion. seemed like a majority of the people were on the side of the landlords tho. and most of the people who were on the side of the pet-tenants were teenagers with a "my dog is a family member" mentality, and most of those posts got shot down pretty fast. it was refreshing to see some logic because im usually the one banging my head on my keyboard on these topics.

on that note, BC is one of the only provinces that have a maximum of 1 month rent for security and pet deposits. alberta is 1 month for both.

as for people moving in with secret pets, if you cover your ass with "no pets" as a material term in your tenancy agreement, the tenancy act gives landlords a 30 days notice to end tenancy.


there is seriously so much information easily available right Residential Tenancies - Province of British Columbia (http://www2.gov.bc.ca/gov/content/housing-tenancy/residential-tenancies)

[meme405]

this discussion came up on my FB feed too from a local news outlets article. ended up several hundred posts in the discussion. seemed like a majority of the people were on the side of the landlords tho. and most of the people who were on the side of the pet-tenants were teenagers with a "my dog is a family member" mentality, and most of those posts got shot down pretty fast. it was refreshing to see some logic because im usually the one banging my head on my keyboard on these topics.

on that note, BC is one of the only provinces that have a maximum of 1 month rent for security and pet deposits. alberta is 1 month for both.

as for people moving in with secret pets, if you cover your ass with "no pets" as a material term in your tenancy agreement, the tenancy act gives landlords a 30 days notice to end tenancy.


there is seriously so much information easily available right Residential Tenancies - Province of British Columbia (http://www2.gov.bc.ca/gov/content/housing-tenancy/residential-tenancies)

Well picking the pet example (but you can apply it to people just squatting and not paying their rent as well):

-You have to notify the tenant of the breach of the material term
-Then give them a reasonable timeframe to correct the problem (in one instance related to a pet the RTB said that 1 week not a reasonable timeframe to allow the family to re-house the pet). So what this reasonable timeframe is eludes me.
-If they don't correct the issue you then have to serve them with a one month notice of eviction
-after one month when they don't move out you have to file an order of possesion for cause (basically forcefully evict/remove them from the unit) - this can take upwards of 3 months.

And in all of these steps above if the landlord makes one mistake (doesn't serve the person properly, any mistakes in the forms, using the wrong forms, etc), the people just get to keep living there fucking up the place and laughing their asses off.

This is where the RTB collapses horribly.

[kr4l]

Just curious for the people renting their places out there, is it standard for you guys to increase rent by 2% YoY to adjust for inflation? Or do you keep rent the same for "good residents"?

I don't increase the rent on my properties because my tenants keep my places like new, and my mortgage and property tax are covered in the rent.

A great tenant is hard to find

[dark0821]

while reading the article...

The law allows landlords to seek higher-than-normal rent increases if tenants are paying below market rates. Normally, owners can only hike rents by two per cent plus inflation per year.
"I've introduced legislation three times now to delete the geographic area increase clause. It's an unfair clause which is just about gouging renters for more rent," Chandra Herbert said Sunday.

.... it just contradicts itself, so.... by bringing the unit to market value... the landlord is gouging renters? WTF... how does that even make sense.... the renters should be happy that they were given a good discount before. And the landlord is not breaking any laws raising it to market value... some nerve....

plus the article is about a place that is a block away from English Bay... no sympathy from me... obviously the renter will have plenty of choices left, don't even have to move to Surrey (lol sorry to all the surrey folks out there) to probably end up with a decent place of the same pricing they are paying right now...

[Hondaracer]

If $50/$100/$150 breaks you, you probably shouldn't be living there anyways.

[RRxtar]

Well picking the pet example (but you can apply it to people just squatting and not paying their rent as well):

-You have to notify the tenant of the breach of the material term
-Then give them a reasonable timeframe to correct the problem (in one instance related to a pet the RTB said that 1 week not a reasonable timeframe to allow the family to re-house the pet). So what this reasonable timeframe is eludes me.
-If they don't correct the issue you then have to serve them with a one month notice of eviction
-after one month when they don't move out you have to file an order of possesion for cause (basically forcefully evict/remove them from the unit) - this can take upwards of 3 months.

And in all of these steps above if the landlord makes one mistake (doesn't serve the person properly, any mistakes in the forms, using the wrong forms, etc), the people just get to keep living there fucking up the place and laughing their asses off.

This is where the RTB collapses horribly.
you are definitely right. it is still a lengthy process. i was just getting at that there is a route thru the process provided to landlords. all forms are available from the government, and all serving requirements are laid out plainly. the biggest issue for landlords is they usually try to give verbal warnings. everything has to be in writing, with copies kept, and a folder created.

we just evicted a tenant in december and while it was a process, it was fairly easy to navigate after a bit of reading. we served him a notice, he took us to arbitration. he was a fucking shit tenant who badly wanted to stay due to very low rent and a lot of benefits we shouldn't have given. but without a huge cause for eviction other than causing disturbance to other occupants in the house which is one of the hardest cases to argue. RTB gave us an order of possession for the next day. and he willingly moved out. some tenants may stay after the order is given, but not everything is worst case scenario.

also, all prior arbitration hearings are public record and easily searchable to use as reference in your hearing. we found an exact match to our case.

[ImportPsycho]

Reminds me of some other lady while ago, was crying to newspaper about how high rent is in Kits but doesn't want to move out to east....
Typical Vancouverites?

[MarkyMark]

If $50/$100/$150 breaks you, you probably shouldn't be living there anyways.

As opposed to all the home owners who cried about their $570 a year home owners grant disappearing when their house shot up past 1.2 million lol

[Hondaracer]

The worst are the older news stories they used to run about elderly people living in shaugnessy etc saying they can't afford the property taxes. Just die already

[Mr.HappySilp]

The worst are the older news stories they used to run about elderly people living in shaugnessy etc saying they can't afford the property taxes. Just die already

Just defer the tax! p;ay 1% of it and when you die and your house is sold the gov comes and collect the tax owe. Is not that hard.

[6o4__boi]

Reminds me of some other lady while ago, was crying to newspaper about how high rent is in Kits but doesn't want to move out to east....
Typical Vancouverites?


haha yeah...i remember that one article about a family who had a budget of $750k - $850k and couldn't find a 3BR condo in Kits for their growing family

:fulloffuck:
:facepalm:

[MarkyMark]

Just defer the tax! p;ay 1% of it and when you die and your house is sold the gov comes and collect the tax owe. Is not that hard.

It's easier to whine about it and get the government to up the threshold for them