[TypeRNammer]

https://youtu.be/vRhhS6BnLSY

Saudi Arabia highlights for today, very dramatic race.

Max Verstappen and Lewis Hamilton are now tied for top spot with one more race to go.

Thanks to Netflix and drive to survive, it has once again peak my interest in formula 1. And to top that off this has been one of the most dramatic seasons in my opinion.

[Koflach]

It's been one of the best seasons to watch in years. I can't wait to watch the netflix breakdown of the season.

[Oshiguru]

This whole week is going to be spicy. Definitely one of the better in terms of drama season endings.

Looking forward to this weekend

[StylinRed]

It's been crazy this year the drama is unbelievable, if they made a movie out of some the scenes you'd find it corny and unbelievable (like verstappen walking on the track after his qualifying crash and seeing his dad flipping out on the big screen)

Definitely entertaining, I was going to go to the last race but got told no(there were still tickets available two weeks ago)

https://streamable.com/srnf7x

Max walking back from crashed car, merc driving by, dad on the big screen raging... total corny dramatic movie sequence

[TypeRNammer]

It's been crazy this year the drama is unbelievable, if they made a movie out of some the scenes you'd find it corny and unbelievable (like verstappen walking on the track after his qualifying crash and seeing his dad flipping out on the big screen)

Definitely entertaining, I was going to go to the last race but got told no(there were still tickets available two weeks ago)

https://streamable.com/srnf7x

Max walking back from crashed car, merc driving by, dad on the big screen raging... total corny dramatic movie sequence

Or even Toto when he was raging about Max slowing down to let Lewis pass only for Lewis to hit him in the rear

https://youtu.be/63-a1ndGrQc

[nabs]

Gotta love a good Toto meltdown.. waited all season for it.

[nabs]

MTL tickets go on sale some time next week! Who's going?

[HonestTea]

What a crazy season! LETS GO LEWIS!

[twitchyzero]

was at cota during gp weekend

my 3rd one but i couldn't believe the popularity

[Hondaracer]

Can’t believe Max crashed on that final corner of qualifying.

I’m fully back into F1 and pumped for the 2022 overhaul. Smart money is on Lewis but it’s gonna be crazy either way

[Great68]

Seasons are so much better when they're down to the wire.

I don't really have a favourite driver or team, I typically root for the underdog. I'd like to see a Verstappen win just because it would be his first (just like I was rooting for Lewis in 2008), but if Lewis wins it'll definitely be hard fought and earned and fine with me.

I just don't want the title to be decided after the fact with penalties etc.

I can't stand all the bellyaching on the Reddit F1 sub about Max's driving in the last race. It's hard fucking racing, give your balls a tug people. Maybe they were just too used to Rosberg laying over for Hamilton back in those days.

[Hondaracer]

I think the Lewis nut huggers also forget some races Lewis has had in the past where his “defensive” driving was akin to Max’s pushing the boundaries as well

[Eff-1]

I'm cheering for Max because it's fun to cheer for the challenger. But credit to Lewis, he's a formidable challenge.

It's been a great season but I really can't wait for next year. New cars! Fresh start.

[TypeRNammer]

Can’t believe Max crashed on that final corner of qualifying.

I’m fully back into F1 and pumped for the 2022 overhaul. Smart money is on Lewis but it’s gonna be crazy either way

Can't blame Max for going absolutely full send, especially going purple for the first two sectors

And bad luck for Perez, now have to settle for 2nd place for constructors title.

[blkgsr]

I'm cheering for Max because it's fun to cheer for the challenger. But credit to Lewis, he's a formidable challenge.

It's been a great season but I really can't wait for next year. New cars! Fresh start.

agreed but fuck lewis. his interviews are painful to listen to, such an ass kiss

[TypeRNammer]

agreed but fuck lewis. his interviews are painful to listen to, such an ass kiss

I think it's just painful in general

On one hand, he always talks about kids watching formula 1 and trying to set an example.

On the other hand, gets P1, thanks the team and everyone at the factory, but if he gets P2, just dead silence on the radio.

[Eff-1]

I'm cheering for Max but my wife loves Lewis way more than Max. According to her he's humble and appreciative, while Max is arrogant and not personable at all. Haha we have domestic rivalry.

[StylinRed]

Ppl forget what a baby ham was like in the past, especially vs rosberg

I want max to win only cuz I don't want some with more wdc than Schumi :lol

As for Maxs driving, his style used to be praised, hell hams hero Senna drove even more dangerously

[Hondaracer]

I feel like the margins are so close now and drivers cut it so close like when Hamilton clipped his front wing and then is bitching on the radio it’s like fuck man you are using DRS right on his ass and then complaining about getting brake checked?

Or getting into these 3 wide packs and making contact and then the radios are just each driver trying to blame the other driver lol

[TypeRNammer]

Maybe someone is going to go bowling in the last race haha.

I mean Bottas did, knocked out Perez and Max drove with no barge board, essentially half a car.

[HonestTea]

I feel like the margins are so close now and drivers cut it so close like when Hamilton clipped his front wing and then is bitching on the radio it’s like fuck man you are using DRS right on his ass and then complaining about getting brake checked?

Or getting into these 3 wide packs and making contact and then the radios are just each driver trying to blame the other driver lol

LOL did you get into this sport cause of DtS? cause you're clearly talking outta your ass. Max clearly brake checked him from the official FIA documents "69 bars of pressure resulting in 2.4G of deceleration" and using DRS prior to the contact? DRS detection line was in front of them, there was no DRS during the contact.

[Koflach]

MTL tickets go on sale some time next week! Who's going?

i'd love to go see it live one day. bucket list event for me for sure.

[Hondaracer]

Been into F1 for 15+ years but casual at best for the last 6 or so. Sorry if I wasn’t referencing the FIA docs bro. When I was watching the recap on YouTube could have sworn they had Hamilton using DRS right before contact but I guess not

Doesn’t take away what I said though about everything being so tight. You want to get that close in an attempt to overtake? Better be aware of the potential for contact. Albeit 2.4G Of deceleration is a pretty nice brake check lol

[Koflach]

i'm all for hard fought racing but Max can't push someone off the track when they have the lead and not expect to be penalized.

[blackGS?]

The best result would be Kimi winning on his last GP.
Max P10
Lewis P11

[TypeRNammer]

The best result would be Kimi winning on his last GP.
Max P10
Lewis P11

But will Kimi have the drink? :lawl:

Anyways throwback to last year at Abu Dhabi when Alonso took a rip in a very nice museum piece on modern slicks

https://youtu.be/fpgv1iN9HR8

[anti-vip]

Aside from Max and Lewis battle, I just wanna see Mr. Saturday get into Q3

[HonestTea]

Aside from Max and Lewis battle, I just wanna see Mr. Saturday get into Q3

Don't worry, he'll get into Q3 more next year. 44 vs. 63 :eek5x:

[JD¹³]

... And to top that off this has been one of the most dramatic seasons in my opinion.
I might be on my own with this opinion but as a purest I feel like this season has taken F1 to a near all-time low. It's dramatic because they've turned the series in to a soap opera. The actual racing has been trash for the last few years, now it's all about drivers and team managers whinging like children over every millimeter they can get from the rules. Drivers are the most immature and unsportsmanlike that I can remember with their brake-checking, dangerous blocking attempts, outright smashing in to each other, etc. The announcers during the Saudi race even said it themselves that some drivers aren't afraid of just crashing in to other cars. That stuff has always been there but I don't think I've ever seen it this bad. Hamilton's pit-maneuver on Verstappen this year was disgusting and very dangerous. If someone had taken me out like that back in my racing days they'd have best left their helmet on back in the pits.

I've been following the season loosely because MotoGP provides infinitely better racing and parity, but I heard the hype over the Saudi race so I watched it last night. I didn't see high-quality talent racing hard, I saw two immature team managers and drivers playing chess with the rules. That wasn't racing, it was crap.

The hybrid cars are soulless and boring, no fuel at the pit stops makes them almost a non-factor. I miss the "V10 era", and was fortunate to see them at the Australian GP in 2004 and walk the track after the race. Those cars were absolute beasts to drive and a pleasure to watch. I wish they'd bring those engine rules back with modern slicks and aero.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1GAa2aen47Q

[Vancouver240sx]

What exactly makes a purist?

Rich

[Great68]

Statistically speaking, years with non-refueling pit stops has had significantly more on-track overtaking than years with refuelling:

https://i.redd.it/zis57kraza7y.jpg

[Hondaracer]

I don’t think any F1 fan would dispute missing the V10’s

All the videos I’ve watched regarding the changes for 2022 though make me optimistic as a fan returning to the sport

[Eff-1]

I might be on my own with this opinion but as a purest I feel like this season has taken F1 to a near all-time low. It's dramatic because they've turned the series in to a soap opera.

But that's what makes sports so GOOD. It IS a soap opera. Look at all sports, from NFL Films, to Canucks fans chanting Fire Benning. This is no different.

I've been watching F1 since the 90s. I love racing. But the best seasons are the ones that are soap operas.

Schumacher's antics, whether it's colliding into Jacques Villeneuve, or Ferrari team orders giving handing him the win.

The race where Michelin tires were defective and drivers refused to start.

Mark Webber vs Vettel. Or Hamilton vs Rosberg. And now we have Max vs Lewis. Heck even Toto vs Christian. It's SO good to watch.

Those were all good because they were DRAMATIC and the tension and soap opera built all season long.

Thanks to Netflix, they have brought the drama to the forefront and now millions more people care about F1 than before.

The only thing I agree with you on is the current specs of the cars makes hard racing less of a key element within the sport. But the governing bodies have acknowledged that and it will hopefully improve in 2022.

[JD¹³]

But that's what makes sports so GOOD.
All valid points in your post, and driver and team rivalries are a big part of the sport. That being said they need to get back to doing the winning and losing in the cars on the track. There is far too much crying on the radio and through the media to mommy and daddy at Race Direction these days. It's gotten obnoxious. Too often when I'm watching races I find myself thinking 'Just STFU and race! Stop whining and be faster!' This past Saudi round was a prime example. I tuned in to watch the best drivers in the world go as fast as possible to try and win, not have the rule book read to me half the broadcast because someone is complaining. The constant petty games and groaning detract from the sport.

Great68 - makes sense. Cars on track more = more passing. The pit stops have gone from about eight seconds to two. I'd be in favour of them retaining the larger fuel capacities and shortening the race distance - make the races flag to flag. 50 mins to an hour flat out, then it would get really intense in the later stages when fuel loads lighten and tires go off. The two second pit stops feel awkward and unnecessary.

Here's hoping the changes next season make the racing better SeemsGood

[Great68]

Great68 - makes sense. Cars on track more = more passing. The pit stops have gone from about eight seconds to two. I'd be in favour of them retaining the larger fuel capacities and shortening the race distance - make the races flag to flag. 50 mins to an hour flat out, then it would get really intense in the later stages when fuel loads lighten and tires go off. The two second pit stops feel awkward and unnecessary.


With the current cars what you're suggesting would make the race even more processional. You'd see even more tire management and slow driving than you see now, not the flat out flag to flag that you think you would get (this is basically what the Sprint is supposed to be, and so far those have been underwhelming).

Teams have had enough time with these Pirellis to have figured out the optimal lap times for best results in the race (this isn't 2011-2012 where you'd see the pronounced "tire performance cliff").

But totally agree with everything else you said about the whining on the radio and all the penalties (especially the post race ones). It's just too much these days.

[Eff-1]

All valid points in your post, and driver and team rivalries are a big part of the sport. That being said they need to get back to doing the winning and losing in the cars on the track. There is far too much crying on the radio and through the media to mommy and daddy at Race Direction these days. It's gotten obnoxious. Too often when I'm watching races I find myself thinking 'Just STFU and race! Stop whining and be faster!' This past Saudi round was a prime example. I tuned in to watch the best drivers in the world go as fast as possible to try and win, not have the rule book read to me half the broadcast because someone is complaining. The constant petty games and groaning detract from the sport.


I dunno, I would say there ALWAYS whining and crying in the past. The only difference now is they broadcast it to the viewers. This is the first year they broadcast radio between the Race Director and the teams, and I love it. This stuff is nothing new, it's just that now we get to hear it.

I have the F1TV subscription purely for the on demand radio access for every driver at all times (and no annoying TSN commercials). It makes watching even a practice section that much more entertaining. Imagine if we could watch any sport with players mic'd up during the game and could hear them talking to their coaches.

For years F1 was managed by Ecclestone and he was against any kind of transparency beyond the 'official' interviews. Now we have things like Netflix and look how many more people are interested.

When I first met my wife she complained why am I watching cars going around in circles and since Netflix came out, she'll watch races with me and is happy when I told her Albon is coming back next year :spamarama:

[Great68]

Yeah Liberty Media has definately made those changes for the better. And the Netflix phenomenon is real.

It's kind of hilarious having several co-workers who pretty much had no interest, all of a sudden strike up a conversation with the F1 guy in the office (me), reciting all the things they just watched on drive to survive. I'm like "I know, I watched it all live... 3 years ago"
I try my hardest not to be too condescending though, more fans is a good thing, and some of them actually started watching races.

My wife seemed to always like F1, I think mostly for the glamour, prestige surrounding it. She really got into it after we went to Montreal and actually watched it live.

[Koflach]

Mika is not happy with the shit that's going on with Max and Lewis. https://www.planetf1.com/news/mika-hakkinen-jeddah-p1-battle-dangerous/

[TypeRNammer]

https://youtu.be/RLJuhd2S_e8

Never heard Kimi talk so much in an interview, going to miss him in formula 1.

"I'm not here to please people" -Kimi

[nabs]

My friend just surprised me with an authentic 33 curved brim blue hat. So excited for this weekend!

[TypeRNammer]

https://youtu.be/yN7tTNecfJo

The finale trailer, feels like watching a movie!

[TypeRNammer]

My TikTok gas recently entered the Formula 1 algorithm, so much gold content :lawl:

https://vm.tiktok.com/ZM87Eubbd/

Captain America as Max Verstappen

https://vm.tiktok.com/ZM873dx8m/

Valtteri Bottas parody

https://vm.tiktok.com/ZM87EQPE1/

Lance Stroll is Formula 1's version of Rick Roll's

https://vm.tiktok.com/ZM87EbtUA/

Brazil Race featuring Simpsons

https://vm.tiktok.com/ZM87EHkUq/

Mexican GP, comedy central on the radio with Vettel and Perez

[TypeRNammer]

Waiting for the qualifying highlights to come out on YouTube

It's going to be a crazy race on Sunday.

[StylinRed]

Should be good

Was a pretty entertaining qualifying too

[nabs]

I'm pumped. I'm gonna be sure to watch live.

[StylinRed]

I missed the first half hr or so, joined with perez holding up Ham and Ver catching up

Looks like I missed a lot!

Especially Ham getting away with cutting an entire turn!

[SkinnyPupp]

Watching for the first time in years, this is pretty exciting! Safety car!

[SkinnyPupp]

OK this is fucked up

[SkinnyPupp]

FIA as corrupt as ever. Fucking bullshit man.

[StylinRed]

Woooooooooooooo that was fucking awesome!


Thought it was going to end with the fia screwing things up by not penalising Ham for getting an unfair advantage!

I wasn't even going to watch the end I went to do some tasks

Merc fans are going to be fuming!

Like Brundle was saying they don't have to let lapped cars lap around

[TypeRNammer]

Can't wait for the highlights to come out

Netflix drive to survive must be drooling out of their mind right now.

[mb_]

Holy fuck I can't believe that just happened!!!

[StylinRed]

I thought the only chance Max had was Hams tyres popping

Who could've imagined the last minute SC

Michael Masi the real hero :lol

[SkinnyPupp]

I can go back to not giving a shit about Formula 1.. FIA are an embarrassment to sport.

Will be curious to see what the explanation is... Lewis won that race, Lewis should be champion. They wanted meme boy to be the champ though

I can't believe how obvious this is!

[TypeRNammer]

What happened to Perez? Listed as DNF


EDIT: Could just imagine Toto smashing up another set of Bose headphones :lawl:

[SkinnyPupp]

Can't wait for the highlights to come out

Netflix drive to survive must be drooling out of their mind right now.
Gee, I wonder why they fucked with the finish to fit in a racing lap? :considered:

[StylinRed]

What happened to Perez? Listed as DNF


EDIT: Could just imagine Toto smashing up another set of Bose headphones :lawl:

They told him to pit right before/after the SC? And he was like "wtf really?" on the radio

Don't know why though

[Great68]

Mercedes could have pitted during the safety car, but they played it conservative.

Some insane bad luck for Lewis.

[StylinRed]

Gee, I wonder why they fucked with the finish to fit in a racing lap? :considered:

Like Brundle said they don't have to allow cars to unlap themselves, and Masi (the race director) wanted to let the season end with a race, so they had time to let some cars unlap themselves

And like he told Toto over the radio, it was to allow them to "motor race" as Toto had been bitching ab letting them race and not interfering

Toto even demanded no SC earlier when there was the VSC "for the race"

[SkinnyPupp]

Like Brundle said they don't have to allow cars to unlap themselves, and Masi (the race director) wanted to let the season end with a race, so they had time to let some cars unlap themselves

And like he told Toto over the radio, it was to allow them to "motor race" as Toto had been bitching ab letting them race and not interfering

Toto even demanded no SC earlier when there was the VSC "for the race"
They let SOME cars unlap.. Just enough to get Max and Lewis wheel to wheel. It was totally contrived. You can't support this if you believe in sport.. Yes some fucky stuff happens (like maybe Lewis cut a corner) but this is absolutely contrived nonsense.

Again congrats to Max, but this win has an asterisk beside it. He'll have to win it all again to be a true champion.

If you're a Max fan or Lewis hater, I get it... This was a fine finish, totally exciting last lap (but pretty much Max is going to win 100% of the time with new soft tires vs old hard tires). But I had absolutely no favourites in this, I just wanted to see the drama of a championship race. The finish was "exciting" but too contrived to get into, and it just pissed me off and made me remember why I stopped watching in the first place. Just too much politics and not enough real drama (I'm all for drama) or sport.

Maybe I'm in the minority here, I dunno

[StylinRed]

Skinny, could totally understand ppl being upset about it, but I don't see it as sinister as ppl are, it's just all part of the drama of F1 that makes it entertaining

Omg it's Rosberg, he loves the drama! His smug smile he couldn't wait to offer up his pov


Edit: button n rosberg offering some good insight

[SkinnyPupp]

Yeah I should take back about it being sinister, like they definitely wanted the meme guy to win, but it was definitely done for drama. But in sports you have to play by the rules, not fuck around to create drama. It's so phony, and makes your sport look like a farce. Also they did this knowing 100% (or maybe 99%) what the outcome would be.

[Great68]

I was actually thinking that they would Red flag the race. Lewis would have been able to change his tires but it would probably have been another standing start.

[StylinRed]

Yikes merc are protesting that max was about a mm ahead of Ham for a second during the SC around a turn (before the restart)

[TypeRNammer]

https://youtu.be/MTe12fH2xtQ

"NO MICHAEL NO IT WAS SO NOT RIGHT" -Toto

[Hondaracer]

Hahahahahaha what a fucked up race wow

[Hondaracer]

Yeah I should take back about it being sinister, like they definitely wanted the meme guy to win, but it was definitely done for drama. But in sports you have to play by the rules, not fuck around to create drama. It's so phony, and makes your sport look like a farce. Also they did this knowing 100% (or maybe 99%) what the outcome would be.

If you want to say the end was contrived, that first corner BS was just as bad. Typical F1 BS

I think merc was way faster than the red bull so it likely wouldn’t have mattered either way for the long run but I’m not entirely sure F1 conspired to let Max win, the drama was what they wanted but yea..I dunno..definitely a fucked up finish and I’m not sure there have been many races to reference in this scenario

The crash is what created the scenario

[RCubed]

Whatthefuck

[sonick]

Mercedes could have pitted during the safety car, but they played it conservative.

Some insane bad luck for Lewis.

This. Merc could've pitted then it was under the virtual safety car and they didn't. They got cocky.

Before the virtual SC they asked Hamilton which tires he preferred if they had an SC and he shrugged it off casually like whatever. Then when the virtual SC came up and they didn't tell him to pit, Hamilton even said if that was a good idea they didn't box.

Which led him vulnerable at the end when max got TWO fresh sets of tires.

Poor decisions by Merc and they rolled the dice, ultimately left the window of opportunity for Max to win it. Ending would've been a non issue (for Merc at least) if Ham had a fresh sets of tires.

[Hondaracer]

Side by side with those new soft tires, you knew what was gonna happen

[MarkyMark]

I only really watch the Netflix show but it sounds like I'm in for a treat next season lol. From what I'm reading they are less concerned about rules and more about entertainment so at least it'll make for some good drama.

Definitely sucks for anyone who watches it as an actual legit sport lol.

[Alpine]

Yeah I should take back about it being sinister, like they definitely wanted the meme guy to win, but it was definitely done for drama. But in sports you have to play by the rules, not fuck around to create drama. It's so phony, and makes your sport look like a farce. Also they did this knowing 100% (or maybe 99%) what the outcome would be.

To be fair, I feel like other leagues do this all the time too. Take a look at hockey. It might not be as egregious or obvious, but the winning team seems to end up taking far more penalties near the end of the game (eye test anyways) in an effort to bring the game closer. Given the $ being made in sports, the entertainment factor is just as important as the sportsmanship factor…

[Great68]

You gotta give credit to Honda, from "GP2 engine" when they re-entered the sport to the only other championship winning engine to date, in the modern hybrid era. Shame that they're leaving.

[Great68]

Both protests denied.

Here are the Stewards comments on the Safety car/unlapping incident:

https://i.imgur.com/9cxvehF.jpeg

Interesting line: "The Race Director also stated that it had long been agreed by all the Teams that where possible it was highly desirable for the race to end in a "green" condition (i.e. not under a Safety Car)"

[Eff-1]

No issues with the FIA's actions here.

1. It's obvious the FIA did everything they could to not have the race finish under SC. I am assuming they radio'd the marshals to clean up as fast as possible. And I am assuming the SC was told to slow down and stretch it out as much as he could. I heard Lewis on the radio telling his team several times the SC was going too slow on the straights and I'm not surprised if they were to buy more time for the marshals.

2. If you can move lapped cars out of the way, then why wouldn't you?? That's how it's ALWAYS been in F1, lapped cars move out of the way. (Admittedly I didn't know the rules over letting some or all lapped cars through, but apparently the rules allow the Race Director discretion there, so what's the problem?)

Mercedes shouldn't be surprised at all that FIA did what they did to get the race restarted. If the FIA didn't make these efforts, and Lewis was behind Max, then they'd be crying the opposite opinion yelling to get the race going.

I believe FIA did what they should have done. NOBODY ever wants racing to finish under a SC (except maybe the leader lol) in ANY motorsport. That's the one thing NASCAR does better, they have a green-white-checker rule, and I don't know why all motorsports doesn't do the same thing.

Great finish.

Disclaimer - I was cheering for Max but my points are not about favoring one driver over another, it's more about whether the race finished under SC or green flag, and that's what I think this came down to.

[TypeRNammer]

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1qlIxE-IjQ0YWLGU3LlDHB3Qp_dQgOz75/view

30 minute highlights of the final race that I picked off of Reddit

MODS PLEASE REMOVE POST IF IT VIOLATES ANY RULES

[HonestTea]

That FIA decision pretty much says race director can do anything they want. What makes it fair when the race director can clearly decide who wins? It's pretty unfair they let only the cars between Lewis and Max go, what about the other lapped cars?

One second it's lap cars can't overtake and next second, lap cars can overtake. This has been a pathetic and inconsistent showing by the FIA. I really don't know how the protest will go, CAS possibly? I'd be happy for Michael Masi to get fired and let's head into 2022.

I doubt Lewis wants to win WDC 8x like this and now Max has an * for his WDC. Pretty shit situation all around, FIA is a joke.

Edit: Once the cars unlap themselves, doesn't the rule state safety car will be in the following lap and not right away?

[MarkyMark]

Why not unlap the cars in front of the guy in 3rd spot as well and make it a 3 way battle? Doesn't giving a guy on fresh tires with no chance of anyone behind him being a concern not show a bit of bias? I would be a bit choked if I were the teams behind Max that didn't even get a chance

[HonestTea]

Why not unlap the cars in front of the guy in 3rd spot as well and make it a 3 way battle? Doesn't giving a guy on fresh tires with no chance of anyone behind him being a concern not show a bit of bias? I would be a bit choked if I were the teams behind Max that didn't even get a chance

Exactly...why not have Sainz send it down the inside on fresh tires?

[HKS PWR]

This whole season has been a clusterfuck of dubious, inconsistent and arbitrary decisions by the race director and stewards, and this race is no exception.
What unfolded in the last few laps were manufactured tv drama, not racing (it's not racing when the race director arbitrarily clears the traffic out of the way for Verstappen, who's running new soft tire while giving him a full lap to pass Hamilton, who's on hard tires that are over 40 laps old)

[Eff-1]

There's not enough time to move all the lapped cars out of the way and then restart.
So that leaves really only 3 options here.

1 - Finish the race under SC
2 - Restart with the the lapped cars in the way
3 - Move as many lapped cars as he could out of the way and then restart, giving the leaders clean air to the finish

If you were Masi in that high pressure situation, what would you have done? In the moment! Not after spending time online reading the steward's decision and rulebook word for word, and then debating online with strangers. In the moment!

I'd have picked 3 probably.

[HonestTea]

There's not enough time to move all the lapped cars out of the way and then restart.
So that leaves really only 3 options here.

1 - Finish the race under SC
2 - Restart with the the lapped cars in the way
3 - Move as many lapped cars as he could out of the way and then restart, giving the leaders clean air to the finish

If you were Masi in that high pressure situation, what would you have done? In the moment! Not after spending time online reading the steward's decision and rulebook word for word, and then debating online with strangers. In the moment!

I'd have picked 3 probably.

Red flag the situation. That's the easiest choice, give them 4 laps or so to fight on fresh tires.

[MarkyMark]

If the options were handing someone a win to make for good TV or keeping the integrity of the sport then that's their call I guess. Don't all these teams spend millions of dollars to do this? If it becomes less of a sport and more contrived to make things interesting then you're basically redefining what you're selling. Who wants to spend huge coin to compete in something that is orchestrated on a whim?

Like I said earlier this is more of a soap opera for me, even the wife likes DTS on Netflix. When it comes to real sports though the best drama is when it's natural and not someone pulling the strings behind the scenes.

[HKS PWR]

There's not enough time to move all the lapped cars out of the way and then restart.
So that leaves really only 3 options here.

1 - Finish the race under SC
2 - Restart with the the lapped cars in the way
3 - Move as many lapped cars as he could out of the way and then restart, giving the leaders clean air to the finish

If you were Masi in that high pressure situation, what would you have done? In the moment! Not after spending time online reading the steward's decision and rulebook word for word, and then debating online with strangers. In the moment!

I'd have picked 3 probably.

I would have picked option one, because it would have been the most consistent based on past safety car occurrances. This decision would have also guaranteed the win and championship for Hamilton, but he would have won anyways if Latifi didn't crash/cause the SC to be deployed.

Option three is basically Michael Masi gifting the win/championship to Verstappen. Mazespin in his Haas with new soft tires could have passed Hamilton at that stage of the race.

[StylinRed]

That FIA decision pretty much says race director can do anything they want. What makes it fair when the race director can clearly decide who wins? It's pretty unfair they let only the cars between Lewis and Max go, what about the other lapped cars?

One second it's lap cars can't overtake and next second, lap cars can overtake. This has been a pathetic and inconsistent showing by the FIA. I really don't know how the protest will go, CAS possibly? I'd be happy for Michael Masi to get fired and let's head into 2022.

I doubt Lewis wants to win WDC 8x like this and now Max has an * for his WDC. Pretty shit situation all around, FIA is a joke.

Edit: Once the cars unlap themselves, doesn't the rule state safety car will be in the following lap and not right away?


I read someone say that rule 48.12 or 48.13? Stipulated only the lapped cars that crossed the line when the SC came out needed to be unlapped, and those were the ones that were allowed to unlap themselves, not sure tho, that was just from reddit

[StylinRed]

Red flag the situation. That's the easiest choice, give them 4 laps or so to fight on fresh tires.

SC was the option they went with

All options would've resulted in ppl bitching n complaining n calling for Masi's head and accusing the FIA of shit, every situation

Masi decided as he did /shrug

[Great68]

SC was the option they went with

All options would've resulted in ppl bitching n complaining n calling for Masi's head and accusing the FIA of shit, every situation

Masi decided as he did /shrug

Yeah that's kind of where I'm at.

I believe that he would have done the same thing if the situation was reversed.

If there was a chance the track would be clear enough to allow a return to green, then he would have been obligated to go green or else that'd be unfair to Max. The only controversial thing was allowing the cars in front to unlap themselves, which I guess like they have ruled is up to the Race Director's discretion.

[supafamous]

That was a total farce of a finish. The inconsistency of the officiating throughout the year led us to this - the race director choosing whatever rule he wanted to follow and entirely inconsistently with prior precedent. Of all the different options he could have chosen he chose the one that gifted the win to Red Bull - the team that hadn't led a single lap in the race.

The red flag like they did in Baku would have been the one that caused the least tipping of the scales, alternately you finish under SC which has prior precedent and would have left the running order as it stood in a situation where Red Bull wasn't close to Mercedes anyways so no foul either.

I really wanted Honda to close out with a championship (and mostly wanted Verstappen to win this year until his unsportsmanlike driving just soured me so much) but this was an ugly way to win a championship.

[Eff-1]

c'mon guys, all of you complaining that Masi bends the rules, and then you choose RED FLAG?

Red flag is ONLY used for situations when track conditions are too dangerous to continue even under SC. If he waved the red flag, then it would a total OBVIOUS misapplication of the rules.

[MarkyMark]

If this was any other race they probably would have just ended it with the safety car no? Is it normal for them to change things and let certain cars unlap and then pull the safety car early for a last lap one on one showdown?

Not every Stanley Cup final or World Series is some game 7 nail biter right till the end. When you start going off script to fabricate something that shouldn't have been then you're blurring the lines between sport and entertainment.

[HonestTea]

c'mon guys, all of you complaining that Masi bends the rules, and then you choose RED FLAG?

Red flag is ONLY used for situations when track conditions are too dangerous to continue even under SC. If he waved the red flag, then it would a total OBVIOUS misapplication of the rules.

Masi's goal was to make it some grand finale to increase dramatics (hence not finishing under SC and letting only 4 car pass), wouldn't the red flag be at least "fair"? What happened was already an "OBVIOUS misapplication of the rules" lol

Letting Max on fresh soft tires attack Lewis's 40+ lap old hard tire seems like handing the WDC to Max on a silver platter.

[HKS PWR]

I'll be perfectly honest, I didn't think Michael Masi could stoop any lower than what happened at Spa. How wrong was I.
Any chance Masi will be replaced before next season starts? After all, he in did inherit the job after Charlie Whiting died. Not sure if he was promoted based on merit.

[Eff-1]

Masi's goal was to make it some grand finale to increase dramatics (hence not finishing under SC and letting only 4 car pass), wouldn't the red flag be at least "fair"?

No, Masi's goal was to make every effort to restart the race and not finish under SC. How is that different from any other race, in any other form of motorsport? Indycar, Nascar, etc. The goal is always the same: minimize caution periods and maximize racing, and especially avoid finishing under SC if you can avoid it. The wrinkle here was that he only unlapped a portion of the field, and there's no precedence for that.

What happened was already an "OBVIOUS misapplication of the rules" lol

Not a misapplication, and certainly not obvious. https://www.fia.com/sites/default/files/decision-document/2021%20Abu%20Dhabi%20Grand%20Prix%20-%20Decision%20-%20Mercedes%20Protest%20Art.%2048.12.pdf


Letting Max on fresh soft tires attack Lewis's 40+ lap old hard tire seems like handing the WDC to Max on a silver platter.

That's such a stretch. Red Bull gambled with the pitstop and it paid off, but it also could have backfired. Him having fresh tires has nothing to do with Masi.

[JD¹³]

My comments in this thread, that race, the championship, and the thread that's followed.....

https://media4.giphy.com/media/VM01S5yIaKCgqg1bSF/giphy.gif

[supafamous]

No, Masi's goal was to make every effort to restart the race and not finish under SC. How is that different from any other race, in any other form of motorsport? Indycar, Nascar, etc. The goal is always the same: minimize caution periods and maximize racing, and especially avoid finishing under SC if you can avoid it. The wrinkle here was that he only unlapped a portion of the field, and there's no precedence for that.

Not a misapplication, and certainly not obvious. https://www.fia.com/sites/default/files/decision-document/2021%20Abu%20Dhabi%20Grand%20Prix%20-%20Decision%20-%20Mercedes%20Protest%20Art.%2048.12.pdf

That's such a stretch. Red Bull gambled with the pitstop and it paid off, but it also could have backfired. Him having fresh tires has nothing to do with Masi.

I've been reading various interpretations of the rules on r/F1Technical and mostly it reads as two types of things:

1) The rules are inconsistent in what they say can and can't be done.
2) Some rules imply that the racing director can do whatever they please.

For example: https://www.reddit.com/r/F1Technical/comments/rf2clw/unpacking_153_of_the_2021_f1_sporting_regulations/

My argument for calling it a farce is the inconsistency of how they have applied the rules this year - from how Spa was run to the lack of penalties for Verstappen for driving people off track to even the use of the red flag in Baku. It's been a clown show by Masi and today he inserted himself into the result for two drivers who did nothing wrong to have their work muddied.

Verstappen's win will never been seen as a clean win and Hamilton will be considered by some to have had an 8th championship stolen from him.

Be consistent with the application of the rules so the drivers and teams know what the situation is - don't declare one set of rules (no cars to un-lap themselves) and then declare a new, unused one 6 turns before the start of racing.

For consistency it should have been one of the following:

1. All lapped cars unlapped and SC comes in the lap after. This could have been done a lap sooner so there was still 1 lap left, Masi just left it too late. Verstappen wins.
2. No lapped cars unlapped, SC comes in with 1-2 laps left. Hamilton wins.
3. Red flag with 4 laps to go. Either Hamilton/Verstappen wins. Fair fight.
4. Finish under the safety car. Hamilton wins.

All of these are reasonable applications of the rules with prior precedent (the red flag has the least precedent and one that is arguably questionable) and the winner gets to win fair and square. Instead a half pregnant rule is applied that only affects the top 2 runners and they are only notified 6 turns before racing resumes. How come Sainz in 3rd didn't get a chance to have a shot at Verstappen? Or maybe Sainz could have had a shot at Hamilton for 2nd in scenario #1.

It's total absolute bullshit - this was WWE racing.

Notably, the half pregnant action to allow Verstappen a shot at Hamilton was due partly to lobbying by Christian Horner to Masi - he was lobbying for all cars to be unlapped as soon as the safety car was out and Masi told him to bugger off as he was busy dealing with the crash. Masi ended up doing part of what Horner wanted and left it late enough that Mercedes was unprepared for it.

[SkunkWorks]

Questionable decisions both for and against Lewis and Max throughout the season. Steward decisions and race control have been inconsistent all season.

Happy to see a new WC. Don't mind the drama as it adds excitement to what was a pretty boring past few seasons. Just look at the amount of new F1 fans and ongoing discussions and memes entering the fray nowadays.

One thing is for certain - DTS season 4 is going to be epic.

Didn't catch this live but absolutely loved Albon being the first to scream at Max after he crosses the line:

https://youtu.be/BdDMHnHpZEM

[StylinRed]

If they red flagged it n restarted that would be gifting the race to Hamilton/Mercedes because it would give them a free tyre change when they put their bets on not changing the tires

And it would be a precedent too bcuz the track wasn't in a poor enough condition which required a red flag

Could you imagine all the people bitching then? It may or may not be you bitching, but there would still be a shit tonne of people bitching

Same if they ended the race under the safety car

[HonestTea]

No, Masi's goal was to make every effort to restart the race and not finish under SC. How is that different from any other race, in any other form of motorsport? Indycar, Nascar, etc. The goal is always the same: minimize caution periods and maximize racing, and especially avoid finishing under SC if you can avoid it. The wrinkle here was that he only unlapped a portion of the field, and there's no precedence for that.

Not a misapplication, and certainly not obvious. https://www.fia.com/sites/default/files/decision-document/2021%20Abu%20Dhabi%20Grand%20Prix%20-%20Decision%20-%20Mercedes%20Protest%20Art.%2048.12.pdf

That's such a stretch. Red Bull gambled with the pitstop and it paid off, but it also could have backfired. Him having fresh tires has nothing to do with Masi.

Why was that Masi's goal though? Whiting would've ended the race under SC, as he did numerous times before. That's the thing, he couldn't avoid it while following the rules, instead he made his own rule(s) up. That's the consistency aspect of things, he fucked up bad and the best outcome is having Masi fired and bring in someone more competent, and make the rules much more clear for 2022 and on wards.

[StylinRed]

Why was that Masi's goal though?

Because as Masi stated during the hearing, that's what Toto, Horner et al wanted (look back at Great68s post where he posted the transcript)

[SkinnyPupp]

Sometimes a race will end behind a SC, because an accident happens with a few laps left.

It doesn't mean you meddle with the race in order to get a "race finish".

Again, it all comes down to contrivance, and making the sport look like a farce. Which is fine if you accept that - coming from a pro wrestling fan, it can be really fun. But call it like it is if you do. Don't use a poorly written rule book that can be left to interpretation in order to say why you're right. Might as well argue about the Bible in that case.

Also yes this resulted in Max winning, and if the roles had been reversed, they likely would have done the same thing. Nobody is saying this was done to give Max the win (OK I said that when I was really mad, but I took it back). It's the meddling with the race that's an issue, not who got the win in the end.

Red Bull look like geniuses changing tires, not because they knew the stewards would fuck with the race in their favour, but they knew that it could happen, and were ready for it when it did. Mercedes took an approach as if the race would be run in a consistent way.. I guess you could argue that was a mistake in itself.

If that's the type of strategy you like, fine. All sports can be a bit fucky, and strategies come out in order to take advantage when they do. But meh... Just be consistent is all I'd ask for if you're talking about an actual sport.

[snowball]

It definitely wasn't a red flag situation and I feel the biggest problem with the decision was that it should've been done on lap 56 (the track was clear enough) and everyone would've been unlapped but would've led to the same result.

Sainz wouldn't attack 2nd, Red Bull won the tire gamble, and Mercedes lost the tire gamble. I foresee some kind of NASCAR style rule in the future where they'll extend the racing laps to ensure a green flag finish.

Some will say this victory is tainted because it was a half ass decision but on the list of champions, it will still say Verstappen. Rosberg didn't have the cleanest drive in 2016, he's still champion. Lewis's last lap "pass" on Glock controversy, he's still champion.

[Great68]

I hope there are changes to the rules in the future that makes these racing finished more codified and concrete.

I get that it was controversial in this case, but I liked the overall idea and want to see more of it.

[supafamous]

https://www.reddit.com/r/formula1/comments/rff8gk/f1talks_masi_after_the_2020_eifel_gp_regarding/

[@f1talks] Masi after the 2020 Eifel GP regarding the prolonged safety car on track: "There is a requirement in the sporting regulations to let ALL lapped cars through."

Says the man who waved through just enough cars so that the 2nd place car was right behind 1st place and then violated the rules by calling in the safety car on that same lap.

Consistently inconsistent.

[StylinRed]

https://www.twitter.com/F1/status/1470475861849640960
It's cool seeing the pits reaction alongside the lap

Also did u guys read that Ham actually yelled out that the race was a sham over the radio? They didn't air it during the race, but if you listened to his radio you'd have heard it (F1tv/app package)

https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/hamilton-mercedes-radio-exchange-abu-dhabi/6880648/

And Max is going to be using the #1 next season

https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/verstappen-will-use-1-for-2022-f1-title-defence/6881621/

[supafamous]

https://www.racefans.net/2021/12/14/analysis-the-four-minutes-that-changed-the-destiny-of-the-2021-world-championship/

Pretty good analysis of what happened at the end of the race. The decision to not allow cars to un-lap themselves and then the reversal didn't just hurt Hamilton but also Ricciardo who pitted for tires due to that call. It also shows Masi went against his own prior guidance and ignored standard convention about unlapping cars and the use of the safety car.

[HonestTea]

https://www.reddit.com/r/formula1/comments/rfvgn2/ricciardo_postrace_radio_im_glad_im_not_part_of/

Yep Danny, fucked up indeed.

[TypeRNammer]

https://youtu.be/wBWVt-KPlU8

Thought this was hilarious, too bad I didn't get a chance to see it myself before it got removed

Sergio Perez listed as Minister of Defence on Wiki :lawl:

[RCubed]

https://www.twitter.com/F1/status/1470475861849640960
It's cool seeing the pits reaction alongside the lap



https://streamable.com/8s7ox1

[TypeRNammer]

https://streamable.com/8s7ox1

Yup Toto definitely fuming about the lost, but clearly he was having a blast with Bottas in this video

https://youtu.be/C4tjgHvYEDQ

[StylinRed]

lmao didn't think he could loosen up like that

Did Ham celebrate with the team?

[Hondaracer]

Still a knob

[SkunkWorks]

Yup Toto definitely fuming about the lost, but clearly he was having a blast with Bottas in this video

https://youtu.be/C4tjgHvYEDQ

He's actually just celebrating the end of valtteri's contract.

[Y2K_o__o]

It definitely wasn't a red flag situation and I feel the biggest problem with the decision was that it should've been done on lap 56 (the track was clear enough) and everyone would've been unlapped but would've led to the same result.

Sainz wouldn't attack 2nd, Red Bull won the tire gamble, and Mercedes lost the tire gamble. I foresee some kind of NASCAR style rule in the future where they'll extend the racing laps to ensure a green flag finish.

Some will say this victory is tainted because it was a half ass decision but on the list of champions, it will still say Verstappen. Rosberg didn't have the cleanest drive in 2016, he's still champion. Lewis's last lap "pass" on Glock controversy, he's still champion.

They can't extend the race due to fuel capacity, but I agree, rules have to be changed, say

1. If there's safety car within the last -6 to -2 laps of the race, it should be red flagged or something to stop the counter so all drivers can have a few lap of clean race battle after the restart.

2. if within -2 laps, then result should stay as is since the race will end with lapping the safety car anyway...

Something like this...

[nabs]

https://youtu.be/wBWVt-KPlU8

Thought this was hilarious, too bad I didn't get a chance to see it myself before it got removed

Sergio Perez listed as Minister of Defence on Wiki :lawl:

https://www.reddit.com/r/formuladank/comments/rep5hh/defending_like_a_lion/?utm_medium=android_app&utm_source=share

[TypeRNammer]

https://www.reddit.com/r/formuladank/comments/rep5hh/defending_like_a_lion/?utm_medium=android_app&utm_source=share

The thread is hilarious, found this gem of a post

https://www.reddit.com/r/formuladank/comments/rf7zyu/gigacheco/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=mweb3x

GIGACHECO

[Gerbs]

What do y'all think about the major changes in 2022.

[anti-vip]

Excited for sure, new aero should encourage more passing, russell to mercedes and albon back should be interesting too

[Great68]

I'm cautiously optimistic we'll get closer racing, but also aware that historically after big rule changes like this one team usually nails the new formula and dominates for a while until the others catch up.

[TypeRNammer]

https://www.formula1.com/en/latest/article.leclerc-tests-positive-for-covid-19-after-return-from-post-season-abu-dhabi.2LwlGeXS0UVIfOvdqYDzEC.html

Leclerc tests positive for Covid after the post season

[StylinRed]

https://youtu.be/xjTWjOcWYFA


If anyone wants, goes live in 1min


The wdc wcc prize giving ceremony

[TypeRNammer]

Seeing Sabine Schmitz and Sir Frank Williams names on the FIA Tributes, right in the feels.

[StylinRed]

Seeing Prince Phillip made me go wtf?