[Manic!]

https://www.cbc.ca/news/world/texas-elementary-shooting-1.6464315

t least 15 people are dead after a shooting at a Texas elementary school, officials said Tuesday.

Texas Gov. Greg Abbott said 14 students and a teacher were killed in the shooting in Uvalde, about 135 kilometres west of San Antonio.

Abbott said the suspect, an 18-year-old man who lived in Uvalde, was also dead.

Hospital officials said earlier 13 children were taken by ambulance or bus to Uvalde Memorial Hospital.

The health of those children is unclear, as is whether they are now among those killed.

Another hospital, University Hospital in San Antonio, said earlier a 66-year-old woman was in critical condition.

Only if they had more guns in texas this would not have happened.

[StylinRed]

The USA has had like over 200 mass shootings since the start of the year, what the fuk

[68style]

Need more ggwg... good guys with guns... cuz you know, they're good guys forever... never have a bad day or get mentally ill and become bad guys with guns...... right?

:badpokerface:

[Great68]

Maybe THIS is the time the USA changes something surrounding their gun policies.

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LOL who am I fucking kidding. I think they've just resigned themselves to accepting mass shootings as a part of life down there instead.

[murd0c]

You have to admit the only good thing about Covid is it basically stopped most of the mass shootings. At one part there I swear there was one every couple of days.

[68style]

Now all the people who were holed up in mom's basement reading online diatribes and not communicating with other humans in real life are coming out shooting tho

[underscore]

Sandy Hook didn't change anything so I doubt this will either.

You have to admit the only good thing about Covid is it basically stopped most of the mass shootings. At one part there I swear there was one every couple of days.

The US has averaged more than 1 mass shooting per day for ages. Most just don't make the news.

[Hondaracer]

I remember when sandy hook happened people on my job site were legitamitely shook and angry, especially the parents

Now this is almost as bad and its second page news the second it happens lol fuck

[StylinRed]

Grade 2, 3, & 4 kids

[JDMDreams]

USA number 1 we gonna shoot the Russians out of Ukraine and China out of Taiwan :troll:

[320icar]

These things happen [sort of]. But what’s truly terrifying is that you even *hint* about trying to solve the issue and over half of America freaks out about their rights etc.

In the same way that I was happy to “give up my rights” during Covid (no travel, no borders, no Vancouver island, no parties, forced masks etc) you would think PEOPLE BEING SHOT TO DEATH ON A DAILY BASIS would be a concern big enough to make people also think about their rights vs privileges.

But no. Doesn’t matter how many corpses get washed up in their classrooms.

[StylinRed]

21 dead now (18 kids, 3 adults)

And 3 more in critical (news 1130)

[SkinnyPupp]

I wonder what the "gun rights" and "anti mask" and "anti vaccine" circles look like on a Venn diagram?

[Hondaracer]

You’ll never solve it.

The only way to solve it is to go so hard on enforcement and restrictions it starts a civil war, you eat that for years on end with many deaths in hopes that 25-35 years from now somthing changes.

I think it’s far more likely we get to the point of minority report type shit where you’re predicting these crimes happening, or schools just become a one entry point concrete bunker where everyone goes through metal detectors and pat downs.

There will -never- be a time when guns are taken away from people, or even asking people to turn them in frankly

125 guns for every 100 people in the states. If it’s not at a school it will be at a mall, stadium, concert, etc.

[PeanutButter]

culture is culture. Hard to change.

[Qmx323]

Gun control crowd yells at politicians, politicians then say its a mental health crisis, then everyone agrees, then... nothing happens.

All I know is a gun sitting in a gun locker ain't doing shit without a hand to hold it, eyes to aim it, then alls left is to pull the trigger.

Fucked all around.

[MG1]

The only thing you can do is identify these people (perps) early on and get them the help they need.

Easier said than done, but gotta start somewhere.

[320icar]

I wonder what the "gun rights" and "anti mask" and "anti vaccine" circles look like on a Venn diagram?

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/a/a0/Circle_-_black_simple.svg/800px-Circle_-_black_simple.svg.png

[Manic!]

You’ll never solve it.

The only way to solve it is to go so hard on enforcement and restrictions it starts a civil war, you eat that for years on end with many deaths in hopes that 25-35 years from now somthing changes.

I think it’s far more likely we get to the point of minority report type shit where you’re predicting these crimes happening, or schools just become a one entry point concrete bunker where everyone goes through metal detectors and pat downs.

There will -never- be a time when guns are taken away from people, or even asking people to turn them in frankly

125 guns for every 100 people in the states. If it’s not at a school it will be at a mall, stadium, concert, etc.

So just give up? and you want loser restrictions on guns in Canada.

[hud 91gt]

I wonder what the "gun rights" and "anti mask" and "anti vaccine" circles look like on a Venn diagram?

Oh the single circle diagram with a small shadow. Lol (edit didn’t scroll to see 320s post) haha

[Hondaracer]

So just give up? and you want loser restrictions on guns in Canada.

I’ve never said anything but increase restrictions and mandatory minimums as legal, law abiding owners don’t commit crimes. In Canada though we welcome violent crime with open arms. We just don’t have the amount of complete wack jobs the states do (yet)

You’ll never curb this violence, there is nothing you can do. Don’t notice a trend here? Thread after thread throwing up your arms saying what shall we do? And nothing ever changes? There’s no will, there’s no pressure.

No one’s ever cared about these shooting as much as say, the BLM matter movement etc. there is no driving force other than the parents of dead children. No one cares enough among the public to enact real change.

[westopher]

People do care enough among the public, unfortunately, the American systems and culture have created a group as large as those that want to enact change, that are a bunch of mouthbreathing, pig fuckers that are so goddamn stupid that they think you need to be able to buy a gun on every street corner to save the world from communism because some shit stained piece of paper from the 1700s told them so. These people are living in a goddamn Hollywood movie where they think that the good guy with the gun jumps out from behind a bunch of shipping containers and takes out a small army with a glock and hard work.
Now the interesting part. Will we find out these guns were legally purchased? If they were will everyone who sucks on the handle of their gun before they go to bed say “even if it was illegal he’d have just got them anyways.”
It’s always the same shit, and it’s always disgusting.

[Hondaracer]

People cared enough about trump to storm the capitol, a bunch of brain dead morons cared enough about somthing that was never ever going to happen that they shook democracy

Have yet to see anything even close to that over gun violence. The will isn’t there. It’s a tough one because who cares the most? Victims families?

If they tried to stop border crossings etc. they would get shut down in a minute by opposing protests

[westopher]

What really needs to happen if anyone wants change is they probably will need to start killing the politicians and lawmakers and their families that allow this to happen. That said, the people who want gun laws want those because they are anti violence. It’s easy to see how one side of the argument has the advantage of being willing to inflict damage for their cause while the other doesn’t.

[hud 91gt]

It’s tough to kill the corrupt family with climate change, unless
you reinvoke their A/C supply from Costco.


Pretty sad.

[whitev70r]

Regretfully, it's up to 19 children and 2 adults. Beyond tragic ...

[underscore]

The issue is pretty complex, everyone wants to point to a single cause because that's easier but either way nothing gets done about anything. They could very easily throw loads of money into mental health support and universal healthcare which would help America and Americans massively, including with this.

What really needs to happen if anyone wants change is they probably will need to start killing the politicians and lawmakers and their families that allow this to happen. That said, the people who want gun laws want those because they are anti violence. It’s easy to see how one side of the argument has the advantage of being willing to inflict damage for their cause while the other doesn’t.

I'm honestly amazed nobody snaps and retaliates. Or maybe they do and you just never hear about it because there are so many murders down there.

[Manic!]

People cared enough about trump to storm the capitol, a bunch of brain dead morons cared enough about somthing that was never ever going to happen that they shook democracy

Have yet to see anything even close to that over gun violence. The will isn’t there. It’s a tough one because who cares the most? Victims families?

If they tried to stop border crossings etc. they would get shut down in a minute by opposing protests

Maybe they are not stupid enough to break the law and go to jail.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sIWMvOlpkxM

[Mr.Money]

we bring up Sandy hook in times like this. its like we all forgot about Columbine.


really shows how everything is fucked up and everyone in america is covering their ears to change still.

[SkinnyPupp]

we bring up Sandy hook in times like this. its like we all forgot about Columbine.


really shows how everything is fucked up and everyone in america is covering their ears to change still.
I had a crazy/morbid thought today that all the Columbine survivors are in their late 30's and early 40's now, and could potentially have kids going to that school if they were in that state.

Nothing has changed since then, in fact it's gotten a lot worse

[Hondaracer]

Maybe they are not stupid enough to break the law and go to jail.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sIWMvOlpkxM

yea thats worked amazingly.. better not cause any waves after your 4 year old is gunned down.. better to just listen to rich, out of touch, basketball guy.

I actually had the exact same thought Westopher after my last post last night, eventually you have to take the law into your own hands. Most of these peoples lives are ruined after these events, maybe time to take matters into their own hands

[westopher]

How fast do you think things would change if someone shot up the classroom Greg Abbott’s kids, or McConnells grandkids or Ted Cruz’ kids or which ever of these dumbfucks who pander to the lowest common denominator. I’d bet it would be less than 300x since 2009 would be the number to enact some sort of meaningful legislation.

[68style]

Things are all out of balance.

Anti-gun people live in a world of grey. Every situation needs to be weighed and considered. We sometimes need guns (policing/army) but mostly don't. They can only fight with words and videos because they're anti-gun and, presumably, anti-violence... doing otherwise would simply prove the point of those they are against. Creating rules for society in this vein this takes an enormous amount of thinking, creating, deciding, rationalizing and still accepting you'll get stuff wrong and the pitchforks will come out saying "See!!! Told you it wouldn't work!!"

Gun advocates are black and white. Trespass my property? I don't care why I get to shoot you in the face. Steal from me? Well, you're also getting shot. They never think about weighing human life or circumstances... it's just "I've been wronged and you're in the wrong, therefore you're dead" and that extends to the laws. You try to take away their lawfully owned guns, they will shoot you.

It's like a big bully vs a wimpy kid. Even when the wimpy kid eventually lashes out they either get whooped... or everyone is shocked at what they did and starts feeling sympathetic for the bully "I was brought up in a bad home cry cry"... there's really no affecting change in a country set up the way the USA is. This issue extends to other social welfare projects too ie: medicare or welfare... the republican minded portions of the USA are all about this place where you shouldn't have to help random people out with their problems or have random people affect your life in any way. They will give you the shirt off their back if they WANT to, but you can't TELL them to. They have absolutely zero appetite for being told that some of their money will go to needy people or that they need to give anything up to make society safer. Zero. None.

No right wing politician will commit political suicide by going against guns... and no left wing one will risk his life and family life AND political career to do it.

I think like what was said above, nothing will change until someone very central to the issue has something bad happen to them.

I fear it might be too late though. I am unsure what happned/what point, say, the UK banned firearms and how they handled it (might be worth looking into) as I assume there was a point lots of people had guns at home and then they weren't allowed... how did they enact it? You might have been able to do something like that pre-internet and pre-social media... people didn't have the same ability to congregate and gather and link arms... just complain to their neighbour and their Great Aunt Mildred and then move on... but nowadays it would be an almost impossible task.

[Great68]

. better to just listen to rich, out of touch, basketball guy.


Not exactly out of touch, considering his father was shot dead.

[westopher]

Is he wrong because he’s a basketball coach?
Who should we be listening to? The policymakers that continue to allow this to happen because they know so well what to do?

[quasi]

we bring up Sandy hook in times like this. its like we all forgot about Columbine.


really shows how everything is fucked up and everyone in america is covering their ears to change still.

I think part of it is the age as well. Not that any kid dying or any school shooting isn't horrific but Sandy Hook was an elementary school as was the latest shooting, Columbine was a high school.

[68style]

Is he wrong because he’s a basketball coach?
Who should we be listening to? The policymakers that continue to allow this to happen because they know so well what to do?

I love conservative logic.

"He doesn't know what he's talking about he's a fucking basketball coach"

"Fuck that guy running our country, fucking drama teacher"


............. enter Joe Biden

"This guy isn't going to change anything, career politician, motherfucker is 80 years old and been in government for 60 years we need new ideas and change!"

:fulloffuck:

[Hondaracer]

Kerrs father was killed in Beirut by Islamic terrorists? Not exactly a comparable..

When I say out of touch, when you’re worth 10’s of millions of dollars, sure someone like him can be a voice because he has a platform. However it’s not like him or anyone else of his stature would ever have to send his kids to a school where something like this would happen

[68style]

Sandy Hook Elementary is in a district that had an average household income of $120,000 in 2007 (likely higher now) and is in the 6th wealthiest county in the entire USA.

If he's rich and doesn't need to worry about his kids, what reason does he even have to grandstand?

[Euro7r]

As much as we bitch about how expensive it is here, I would never trade it up for anywhere else to live but here. At least we don't see these kinds of mass shootings. The kids never got to live their lives, and just like that gone :(.

[sonick]

Thoughts and Prayers Thoughts and Prayers Thoughts and Prayers Thoughts and Prayers Thoughts and Prayers Thoughts and Prayers Thoughts and Prayers Thoughts and Prayers Thoughts and Prayers Thoughts and Prayers Thoughts and Prayers Thoughts and Prayers Thoughts and Prayers Thoughts and Prayers Thoughts and Prayers Thoughts and Prayers Thoughts and Prayers Thoughts and Prayers Thoughts and Prayers Thoughts and Prayers Thoughts and Prayers Thoughts and Prayers Thoughts and Prayers Thoughts and Prayers

[Hondaracer]

Sandy Hook Elementary is in a district that had an average household income of $120,000 in 2007 (likely higher now) and is in the 6th wealthiest county in the entire USA.

If he's rich and doesn't need to worry about his kids, what reason does he even have to grandstand?

Because in society today if you don’t have an opinion people automatically assume you don’t care or support the other side?

[68style]

What you got against Steve Kerr haha... he could have just gone up and done his pre-game and walked off and nobody would have said anything or assumed that.

But he didn't... and it's not the first time he's spoken out. I think he's genuine.

[Hondaracer]

I just think in general, on a personal level, don’t really care what celebrities or sports personalities have to say when they dabble into the political realm. Nothing against him just in general I find most people to be incredibly insincere

[Manic!]

I just think in general, on a personal level, don’t really care what celebrities or sports personalities have to say when they dabble into the political realm. Nothing against him just in general I find most people to be incredibly insincere

No one on the left is good enough for you. Either they are too smart too young or too rich for you.

[Tapioca]

This tragedy hit harder for me personally this time... it's likely because I now have children of my own who are in the elementary school system. I definitely agree that while places like Twitter and Reddit like to complain about Canada, Canadian society, and how expensive it is to live here, I do feel like I have won the lottery and I am very grateful to live in a place in the world where I do not have to arm myself and my children.

Quite frankly, I welcome the comments from celebrities and other famous people. Given the polarized environment in the States, they're putting their clout/reputation and money on the line.

[westopher]

This isn’t Leonardo dicaprio flying over the oil sands in a private jet talking about how climate change is catastrophic and we need to change our habits. There’s no hypocrisy in what Kerr is saying.

[Manic!]

It's only celebrates on the left they don't like.

https://s3.amazonaws.com/kulturehub-blob/uploads/2020/11/Untitled-design-2020-11-04T133711.912.jpg


Lil pump a maga supporter was kicked out of high school in grade 10. just the right IQ to be a trump supporter.

[Hondaracer]

No, it’s any celebrity. Frankly I think it would do the world a favour if the roof collapsed in on the Met Gala.

[JD¹³]

These shootings in the United States are a far more complex issue than simply gun lobbyists and left/right politics. They have major issues as a society that stem from an ingrained culture of violence, culture of ignorance, low education, mass proliferation of firearms, and an exponentially growing mental health crisis. To make matters worse there is outright bureaucratic negligence when it comes to Gov policy that allows dangerous individuals to continuously walk through Grand Canyon sized cracks in public safety.

All states have their own unique laws and in each state you have all the different branches of the military, individual state and municipal law enforcement, health authorities, and offices for the various alphabet agencies and organizations. Multiply that by 50 and know there's no way for them to all talk to each other and centrally flag all the people who shouldn't have access to firearms for criminal or health reasons... and then disseminate that information to ALL firearms dealers nationwide! The background checks are a joke in most US states (if they even have them) and are often easy to skirt. That's why almost all of these mass shooters were already "known to police" or "known to X authority" prior to them popping off but nothing was done to stop them. The fact that these revelations come out postmortem every time is fucking disgusting and that blood pools at the feet of all politicians on all sides of the isles both state and federal. They're up to their knees in it. They have been taught the lesson over and over and over and done NOTHING tangible since 1999.

What kind of 18 year old blows away his own grandmother then decides to go in to an elementary school and shoot random children? It's just fucking sick.

[underscore]

Kerrs father was killed in Beirut by Islamic terrorists? Not exactly a comparable..

Why is it not comparable to children killed by domestic terrorists?

When I say out of touch, when you’re worth 10’s of millions of dollars, sure someone like him can be a voice because he has a platform. However it’s not like him or anyone else of his stature would ever have to send his kids to a school where something like this would happen

"I don't know how to explain to you why you should care about other people."

Even ignoring that and if his kids are at some ultra secure school they still go to the grocery store and church like everyone else. Unless you live in a compound like in South Africa but who would want to live like that?

[68style]

GOP checklist:

Don't let kids learn about gays it hurts them
Don't let kids learn history it hurts them
Don't let kids learn about sex it hurts them

The class on what to do in an active shooter situation starts at 9am though!

[Great68]

These shootings in the United States are a far more complex issue than simply gun lobbyists and left/right politics. They have major issues as a society that stem from an ingrained culture of violence, culture of ignorance, low education, mass proliferation of firearms, and an exponentially growing mental health crisis. To make matters worse there is outright bureaucratic negligence when it comes to Gov policy that allows dangerous individuals to continuously walk through Grand Canyon sized cracks in public safety.

All states have their own unique laws and in each state you have all the different branches of the military, individual state and municipal law enforcement, health authorities, and offices for the various alphabet agencies and organizations. Multiply that by 50 and know there's no way for them to all talk to each other and centrally flag all the people who shouldn't have access to firearms for criminal or health reasons... and then disseminate that information to ALL firearms dealers nationwide! The background checks are a joke in most US states (if they even have them) and are often easy to skirt. That's why almost all of these mass shooters were already "known to police" or "known to X authority" prior to them popping off but nothing was done to stop them. The fact that these revelations come out postmortem every time is fucking disgusting and that blood pools at the feet of all politicians on all sides of the isles both state and federal. They're up to their knees in it. They have been taught the lesson over and over and over and done NOTHING tangible since 1999.

What kind of 18 year old blows away his own grandmother then decides to go in to an elementary school and shoot random children? It's just fucking sick.


Everything you have said is true, but at some point you need to start somewhere.

Right now the USA has shown that they're not even willing to make even the smallest of steps to tackle the problem. It's really sad.

[Manic!]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d5VzrDOrjPA

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VheQL9te6Sg

The fucking governor will be talking at a NRA convention being held in a few days. When trump speaks it will be a gun free zone.

https://accurateshooter.net/pix/nra22meet01.jpg

[PeanutButter]

I just think in general, on a personal level, don’t really care what celebrities or sports personalities have to say when they dabble into the political realm. Nothing against him just in general I find most people to be incredibly insincere

I get what you're saying, there are a lot of influencers that just want the clout, but Kerr seemed pretty genuine.

He was using his platform to plead his case. Seems like his messaged reached more people than most would.

Why would you not want a celebrity on your side to help push your agenda/ideas. Seems like that would be an advantage for any issue.

[68style]

It's a double-edged sword tho... I doubt Trump would have ever become President if it wasn't for the whole "celebrity" angle... same for Dr. Oz running in a state he doesn't even live in... and why people like The Rock are even in conversation about being a future one.............

[Hondaracer]

It’s all the same shit with celebs. Everyone loves the rock he’s the fun wrestling guy! Yet he posts pics working on Colabs with Bezos and other people that the general public consider pure trash.

Down deep every celebrity at the top steps over people and on people to get there. There are very few out there that can take the morale high ground on any issue without being considered a hypocrite. Kerr actually seems like he is one of the “ok” guys given his reputation as a coach and how he was portrayed in that Jordan doc etc. but for me, I don’t need to hear a Celebs opinion on anything, I’m good.

[westopher]

He has every right to speak his mind. As a father, as a citizen, and as someone who obviously cares about the violence in his country. Especially as someone who’s speaking without hypocrisy.

[320icar]

https://www.reddit.com/r/Damnthatsinteresting/comments/uy0jxw/over_the_24_hours_since_the_uvalde_massacre_fox/

Sorry I don’t know how to post a Reddit video. Fox News gives 50 suggestions in 24 hours, not one of them are gun control

https://i.ibb.co/2ZxQkZz/77-E7-EA1-E-688-A-46-A4-8-A5-D-865921443-E3-E.png (https://ibb.co/9Z6LrZx)

[whitev70r]

Another heartfelt plea ... Stupid US Senate ... so I heard this more than once. A bi-partisan bill was passed by the House for basic background check before gun purchase but stalled for over a year in the Senate. So lots of anger towards the Senators.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OF_GofUF_y4

[Special K]

Husband of the teacher victim had a heart attack this morning and passed away. They have 4 kids.

https://www.gofundme.com/f/joe-irma-garcia?utm_campaign=p_cf+share-flow-1&utm_medium=more&utm_source=customer

[westopher]

https://www.reddit.com/r/Damnthatsinteresting/comments/uy0jxw/over_the_24_hours_since_the_uvalde_massacre_fox/

Sorry I don’t know how to post a Reddit video. Fox News gives 50 suggestions in 24 hours, not one of them are gun control

https://i.ibb.co/2ZxQkZz/77-E7-EA1-E-688-A-46-A4-8-A5-D-865921443-E3-E.png (https://ibb.co/9Z6LrZx)

God
God
God
Don’t be triggered
Gunfight
Gunfight
Gunfight
Armour
Armour
Armour

Fucking scumbag piece of shit morons. I feel so bad for Americans that have an ounce of sense having to share a space with so many absolute garbage humans.

[tegra7]

Footage of cops arguing with parents while shots being fired.

https://www.reddit.com/r/PublicFreakout/comments/uy7552/more_footage_of_cops_doing_nothing_and_arguing/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3

https://www.reddit.com/r/PublicFreakout/comments/uyg4e4/uvalde_cop_single_handedly_got_a_student_killed/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3

Some cops were able to get their kids out.
https://www.reddit.com/r/PublicFreakout/comments/uybog7/police_officers_were_able_to_get_their_kids_out/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3

[Manic!]

Footage of cops arguing with parents while shots being fired.

https://www.reddit.com/r/PublicFreakout/comments/uy7552/more_footage_of_cops_doing_nothing_and_arguing/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3

https://www.reddit.com/r/PublicFreakout/comments/uyg4e4/uvalde_cop_single_handedly_got_a_student_killed/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3

Some cops were able to get their kids out.
https://www.reddit.com/r/PublicFreakout/comments/uybog7/police_officers_were_able_to_get_their_kids_out/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3

What do people expect from people making 60K a year with little training.

[Great68]

Jesus fucking christ, their cops are too incompetent to deal with a situation like this, and they want to arm Teachers?

[underscore]

They don't trust teachers to choose the right books, but they want to give them guns?

[StylinRed]

Probably been mentioned already

But the husband of one of the slain teachers died of a heart attack

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-61569655

The husband of one of the teachers slain in Tuesday's mass shooting in Uvalde, Texas has reportedly died of a heart attack just two days later.

Joe Garcia was the husband of Irma Garcia, who taught for 23 years at Robb Elementary School.

Mrs Garcia was one of the two teachers killed by a gunman that left 21 dead - including 19 children.

The couple - who were married for 24 years - is survived by four children.

On Twitter, a nephew of Mrs Garcia, John Martinez, said that Mr Garcia "passed away due to grief" in the wake of his wife's murder.

...

[MG1]

Grief can put people in a dark, dark place. Hard to get out of it without some sort of damage. What got me through the loss of my wife was something my daughter said to me. "I already lost one parent, you're all I have left. Please be there for me.................."


My wife died from cancer, this person lost his loved one due to some senseless murder. A choice someone made to end a life and affect those around each of those victims. No place in hell is good enough for the shooter. The shooter's family is probably going through some tough times. How did this guy get to where he is/was. What went wrong with his upbringing? Anyway, very tragic. How do you go about consoling these people?

Namo Amida Bustu / Rest in Peace.

[Special K]

Before having kids, I knew these were very sad events but couldn’t relate. Now that I have two children, these school shootings hit differently. Imagine dropping your kids off at school or daycare knowing that some random might decide to shoot everyone because he/she had a bad day.

Arming teachers make zero sense. Imagine dropping your kids off knowing every grown up carry a gun. Also, what would a pistol do when these shooters carry a rifle??

[SkinnyPupp]

Cops are just LARPers who are bullies instead of nerds

https://twitter.com/chadloder/status/1529670885770027008

[Alpine]

Another issue is protocols and procedures. As stupid as it might sound, you can't just run into a situation Rambo style. You are trained to follow all the protocols... set up a perimeter, call the big shots in, wait for intelligence, etc...

[RiceIntegraRS]

Jesus fucking christ, their cops are too incompetent to deal with a situation like this, and they want to arm Teachers?

The states are soo fucked up right now but "if" i was living down there and the only 2 options were for the teacher of my kids to armed or not. I would picked them to be armed. I already trust my kids to be taken care of and taught by teachers 8hrs a day 5 days a week. The teacher is the last line of defence for my kids staying safe. Thats if i was living in the US though. Thankgod i dont.

[Manic!]

The states are soo fucked up right now but "if" i was living down there and the only 2 options were for the teacher of my kids to armed or not. I would picked them to be armed. I already trust my kids to be taken care of and taught by teachers 8hrs a day 5 days a week. The teacher is the last line of defence for my kids staying safe. Thats if i was living in the US though. Thankgod i dont.

The police have a hard time dealing with an active shooter but you think a math teacher will be able to take down someone with ar 15?

The NRA is pushing arming staff because it means more gun sales and more money for the gun companies. Next, they will be wanting to arm students.

You also have the whole problem with storing guns at school. Only a matter of time before a student steals a gun from a teacher.

[TOS'd]

Just make being a NRA memeber a prerequisite for being a school teacher. /s :badpokerface:

[Great68]

Before having kids, I knew these were very sad events but couldn’t relate. Now that I have two children, these school shootings hit differently. Imagine dropping your kids off at school or daycare knowing that some random might decide to shoot everyone because he/she had a bad day.

Arming teachers make zero sense. Imagine dropping your kids off knowing every grown up carry a gun. Also, what would a pistol do when these shooters carry a rifle??

Holy shit. People need to stop watching action movies where some regular joe becomes some superhero marksman saving the day.

I mean fuck, the POLICE, who are trained and paid to do the job couldn't even get their shit together in this case.

Armed teachers are more to hurt an innocent person than ever "stop a bad guy"

[Hondaracer]

I dunno.. given the frequency of these events..say you have your classroom door barricaded and the shooter just walking class room to class room executing people. I think I’d rather have the teacher in my child’s classroom armed with something they can defend the classroom with or at lest provide a deterrent rather than have somone with a rifle just shooting at will with no deterrent at all.

Seeing cops just sitting outside like this without any sort of deterrent you’re badically just sitting in your classroom waiting to eat a bullet

[westopher]

More people shoot themselves with their own gun than ever win a gunfight with a bad guy 100 fold.
As said, this isn’t a fuckin movie.
Someone I sort of know lost their grandchild due to guns. The kid grabbed it off the nightstand and shot himself in the face. He was about 3.
Being from Texas, this guy started a charity where the money went to EDUCATING CHILDREN ABOUT GUNS. The kid was FUCKING THREE. Do you think that’s a reasonable expectation that he should have figured that out?!

[Hondaracer]

Well if you went that route I’d expect you wouldn’t just hand out guns. But given the states..they probably would

If you asked anyone though if a bad guy is coming to shoot you, do you want a gun or not, I think it’s a pretty easy answer

[underscore]

Another issue is protocols and procedures. As stupid as it might sound, you can't just run into a situation Rambo style. You are trained to follow all the protocols... set up a perimeter, call the big shots in, wait for intelligence, etc...

I dunno, that worked out pretty well in Ottawa in 2014. Sitting around waiting sounds more appropriate for a hostage situation than an active shooter. Per a CNN article:

"Since the Columbine school shooting of 1999, emergency responder protocol in such situations is to end the threat as quickly as possible because fatalities occur in seconds to minutes."

If you asked anyone though if a bad guy is coming to shoot you, do you want a gun or not, I think it’s a pretty easy answer

A lot of answers are easy when you massively oversimplify the question.

[MarkyMark]

Start arming teachers, how long before theres a news story about a teacher shooting a student in "self defence" because he was a threat to their safety (black).

[westopher]

Re: teachers with guns
I mean no teacher has ever had mental health issues, or victimized children sexually or anything like that, so what could go wrong if you have a bunch of teachers locked in their classes with a gun? How fucking stupid does this have to get. More guns keep happening and more events like this keep happening. Plain and simple, if your solution doesn’t involve removing access to guns, you’ve been proven wrong thousands of times.

[Hondaracer]

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2018/06/19/there-are-more-guns-than-people-in-the-united-states-according-to-a-new-study-of-global-firearm-ownership/

There are 400 million civilian owned firearms in the states.

I think “restricting access” is almost harder than any other solution.

400 million guns, fuck lol

[pastarocket]

I hate to say it but restricting access to firearms on a limited or permanent basis in the US is impossible.

If you go back in history, when Bill Clinton was POTUS, he was able to sign into law an assault weapons ban in 1994. That was a temporary ban because there was a sunset clause in the legislation for an assault weapons ban. The clause invoked the end of assault weapons ban in 2004.

Several attempts by Democrat senators were made in the ensuing years to get that assault weapons ban in effect again.

Biden is trying to get an assault weapons ban as legislation for review in the House of Representatives.

Good luck with that.

There is simply no political pressure from Republican voters to get Mitch McConnell and his GOP cronies in the Senate to even consider legislation on an assault weapons ban.

Absolutely nothing.

Then you have Ted Cruz joining fat Trump at a rally this week for the NRA.

AR15 rifles and other assault weapons are easier to buy legally now than baby formula in the US.

How insane is that even in America???? :facepalm:

[Hondaracer]

People love to get hung up on “assault weapons” however they aren’t really the issue. As we see in Canada our politicians don’t even understand basic function of firearms. They ban guns based on appearance. Virtually every semi automatic, magazine fed, firearm has the same potential.

The issue is really high capacity magazines. Which, if there are literally hundreds of millions of semi automatic firearms in the US, how many high capacity magazines are out there?

You don’t need a licence to buy a magazine. There are no checks to buy a magazine. I guarantee you even in Canada, you could go buy a perfectly legal SKS which is like the most rudimentary firearm from 50+ years ago and if you looked hard enough you’d find a handful of high capacity magazines that fit that gun.

Where there’s a will, there’s a way. You don’t need to be crazy Kyle in grandmas basement to commit these acts. If you just bide your time, slowly aquire what you need, and stay under the radar for a couple weeks, it’s the same result.

Without a complete and total overhaul of the entire system in the states, there is no answer. And this isn’t just me saying again “well ya can’t fix it so why try?” This is the reality, there is no answer.

[westopher]

At 400 million guns you have people saying
“We should have done this when there were 200 million it’s too late”
At 200 million guns
“We should have done this at 100 million it’s too late”
What do you think they will say when there’s 600 million?

[pastarocket]

People love to get hung up on “assault weapons” however they aren’t really the issue. As we see in Canada our politicians don’t even understand basic function of firearms. They ban guns based on appearance. Virtually every semi automatic, magazine fed, firearm has the same potential.

The issue is really high capacity magazines. Which, if there are literally hundreds of millions of semi automatic firearms in the US, how many high capacity magazines are out there?

You donÂ’t need a licence to buy a magazine. There are no checks to buy a magazine. I guarantee you even in Canada, you could go buy a perfectly legal SKS which is like the most rudimentary firearm from 50+ years ago and if you looked hard enough youÂ’d find a handful of high capacity magazines that fit that gun.

Where thereÂ’s a will, thereÂ’s a way. You donÂ’t need to be crazy Kyle in grandmas basement to commit these acts. If you just bide your time, slowly aquire what you need, and stay under the radar for a couple weeks, itÂ’s the same result.

Without a complete and total overhaul of the entire system in the states, there is no answer. And this isn’t just me saying again “well ya can’t fix it so why try?” This is the reality, there is no answer.

I disagree.

The issue is that the right to bear firearms is part of the US Constitution.

This is the Second Amendment:

A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.

You cannot just overhaul a "system". It's not about any system.

This is the US Constitution. The document that created the US government, establishes US laws, and guarantees basic rights for American citizens.

Good luck trying to change the U.S. Constitution.

[Hondaracer]

Prayers and Thoughts?

[MarkyMark]

They reality is make it harder and it will happen less frequently. With enough willpower you could be the next Tim McVeigh and cause more shit than a gun but people are stupid and lazy. Why do that when I can just walk into Walmart with some cash?

No law will make an immediate impact, and people are too stuck on that.

[Hondaracer]

Lol so this went completely under the radar:

https://www.cbc.ca/amp/1.6387565

In a country where assault style firearms are completely irrelevant, with a govt. that pretended to care about gun violence, even they could not put together a program that effectively controlled the “scary” assault style weapons they were so gung ho about.

In a country like Canada, where people would likely actually turn in those firearms if ordered.

And you think the states has any semblance of a chance of doing anything remotely similar? Good luck.

[Hondaracer]

They reality is make it harder and it will happen less frequently. With enough willpower you could be the next Tim McVeigh and cause more shit than a gun but people are stupid and lazy. Why do that when I can just walk into Walmart with some cash?

No law will make an immediate impact, and people are too stuck on that.

So im saying this in all seriousness, what are you “making harder” ?

Purchasing a semi auto assault rifle from Walmart? Ok so then I can just go to Joe American down the street selling the same gun out of his garage?

I think people are VASTLY underestimating the will to even enact laws that change how transactions are made.

[westopher]

I disagree.

The issue is that the right to bear firearms is part of the US Constitution.

This is the Second Amendment:

A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.

You cannot just overhaul a "system". It's not about any system.

This is the US Constitution. The document that created the US government, establishes US laws, and guarantees basic rights for American citizens.

Good luck trying to change the U.S. Constitution.
Pretty sure you can AMEND the constitution. Things have changed since 1776.

[MarkyMark]

So im saying this in all seriousness, what are you “making harder” ?

Purchasing a semi auto assault rifle from Walmart? Ok so then I can just go to Joe American down the street selling the same gun out of his garage?

I think people are VASTLY underestimating the will to even enact laws that change how transactions are made.

Sure, say anyone who sells a gun to someone illegally gets 10 years in prison and the price of that gun goes way up I'd imagine. Set up undercover stings to see who would do it and make a tv show about it. I'd watch some fat redneck go to jail for selling guns all day long.

Once again, it won't stop every shooting but it would stop some.

[pastarocket]

Yeah, like I posted earlier today.

Any temporary or permanent ban on assault weapons is impossible.

Background checks on all legal guns purchases in the US? Difficult.

Each US state can enact their own laws on background checks.

On a federal government level, it would be difficult for legislation to be passed in the House of Representatives and the Senate for mandatory background checks.


However, will any law reduce the incidence of bloody massacres, and mass shootings in the US? I doubt it.


Remember, there are always other avenues like the black market, underground economy in the US to purchase guns. Any type of gun.

I think it would be pretty easy for an American to buy hand guns or assault rifles from a seller in the hood in order to avoid a background check from legal purchases of a gun.

[Great68]

Ah I see we've come around to the old "it's too hard, so better to do nothing" argument.

[underscore]

Pretty sure you can AMEND the constitution. Things have changed since 1776.

Especially since the right to bear arms is an amendment lol.

Remember, there are always other avenues like the black market, underground economy in the US to purchase guns. Any type of gun.

I think it would be pretty easy for an American to buy hand guns or assault rifles from a seller in the hood in order to avoid a background check from legal purchases of a gun.

That's a weak argument, on that basis nothing should ever be illegal because you can get anything on the black market. Guns, drugs, animals, people, etc. It may still be easy right after a law comes in but over time it makes it harder and more expensive.

I'm pretty sure this comes up every time there's one of these threads but also there isn't a literal black market where you just stroll up and buy stuff like at Walmart. Especially since most of these shooters are mentally ill and social outcasts I'd bet half of them would get themselves killed in the process of trying to buy a gun from some dude in a gang.

[Manic!]

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2018/06/19/there-are-more-guns-than-people-in-the-united-states-according-to-a-new-study-of-global-firearm-ownership/

There are 400 million civilian owned firearms in the states.

I think “restricting access” is almost harder than any other solution.

400 million guns, fuck lol

The shooter only bought the guns a few days before the shooting maybe if he had to wait 7 days before he could get the guns and make it illegal for an 18 year old to buy an assault rifle things would have been different.


Here is an add from the maker of the gun used in the shooting.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FTxDAMnVIAEdHvi.jpg

[Great68]

Especially since most of these shooters are mentally ill and social outcasts I'd bet half of them would get themselves killed in the process of trying to buy a gun from some dude in a gang.

Lol,

https://youtu.be/a9UFyNy-rw4?t=346

[Hondaracer]

Ah I see we've come around to the old "it's too hard, so better to do nothing" argument.

Crazy that you guys offering the opposite opinion haven’t actually come up with any solutions that could implement change?

It’s a dream world to think there is going to be some magic solution given the culture in the states.

It’s farrrrrr more likely this is going to happen relatively soon in an even worse incident, then even the slightest effective change he enacted.

I don’t think anyone saying nothing is going to change is somehow on board with the idea that change is hard so don’t do anything. It’s just the reality of the situation.

[Hondaracer]

The shooter only bought the guns a few days before the shooting maybe if he had to wait 7 days before he could get the guns and make it illegal for an 18 year old to buy an assault rifle things would have been different.


Here is an add from the maker of the gun used in the shooting.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FTxDAMnVIAEdHvi.jpg

Oh yea, a guy who’s been brooding his whole miserable life and kills his grandma and 20 4 year olds is going to DEFINITELY be turned off by the idea of waiting 7 days. Hell, make him wait 90 days. The outcome is the same.

[Great68]

Crazy that you guys offering the opposite opinion haven’t actually come up with any solutions that could implement change?




What the fuck are you talking about?

There are many solutions which have already been proposed. You're the ones that are saying they won't work before they have even been implemented.


No one on "opposite opinion" side is expecting things to magically get better overnight (I think you're the ones projecting that's what should happen or not bother trying), but they have to fucking start SOMEWHERE

The fact is since the previous massacres they've done the complete opposite and REMOVED gun control legislation. It doesn't take a fucking genius that realize that's going to make the situation worse, not better.

[Manic!]

Oh yea, a guy who’s been brooding his whole miserable life and kills his grandma and 20 4 year olds is going to DEFINITELY be turned off by the idea of waiting 7 days. Hell, make him wait 90 days. The outcome is the same.

The legal drinking age in Texas is 21. The legal age to buy an AR 15 is 18. It should not be harder to buy a beer than a gun.

[320icar]

I disagree.

The issue is that the right to bear firearms is part of the US Constitution.

This is the Second Amendment:

A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.

You cannot just overhaul a "system". It's not about any system.

This is the US Constitution. The document that created the US government, establishes US laws, and guarantees basic rights for American citizens.

Good luck trying to change the U.S. Constitution.

Do you know what the definition of ‘amendment’ is?

[pastarocket]

Here are some solutions that Biden has come up with so far. What are your thoughts on his actions on guns in the US?

-would like to hear people's feedback on what the POTUS is doing about guns.


https://www.cnn.com/2022/05/27/politics/biden-guns-executive-actions/index.html

Here's what Biden has done on guns and what advocacy groups say he can still do without Congress

Action Biden has already taken on guns

Since taking office, the White House has unveiled several packages of executive actions to rein in so-called ghost guns, promote safe storage of firearms, bolster police forces and expand community violence intervention programs:

Ghost guns

Biden announced a new regulation to contain the use of so-called ghost guns, which are self-assembled firearms that do not have serial numbers and are difficult to track and regulate. Ghost gun kits can be bought online and the weapon can be assembled in as little as 30 minutes.

The rules require anyone purchasing a kit to undergo a background check and requires those selling the kits to mark components with a serial number. It also mandates firearm dealers add a serial number to ghost guns that have already been assembled.
Ghost guns make up a relatively small share of the guns recovered by law enforcement but officials say the weapons have become more common at crime scenes in recent years.

Promoting safe storage of firearms

Biden unveiled a new military and veteran suicide prevention strategy last year that includes promoting safe firearms storage and outlining best practices for firearm dealers.
The plan includes a federal focus on improving lethal means safety, which is a voluntary practice to reduce one's suicide risk by limiting access to objects that can be used to cause self-harm, including medications, firearms or sharp instruments.
The President directed the Department of Justice to announce a new rule clarifying the obligations firearm dealers have to make secure gun storage or safety devices available for purchase. Biden also directed the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives to issue a best practices guide to all federal firearm dealers to remind them about steps they are legally required to take to keep communities safe.

Other Justice Department actions

Last summer, the Justice Department launched an anti-gun trafficking initiative focused on Chicago, Los Angeles, New York, the San Francisco Bay Area and Washington, DC, which are known corridors in which illegal guns are being trafficked and used in deadly shootings and other crimes. The goal of the strike forces is to better coordinate law enforcement agencies across jurisdictions to disrupt trafficking networks.

The Justice Department proposed to clarify the restrictions on stabilizing braces that transform a pistol into a short-barreled rifle. The makeshift short-barreled rifles were used in two mass shootings in Boulder, Colorado, and in Dayton, Ohio.
Biden directed the Justice Department to publish model "red flag" laws for states that allow the temporary removal of guns from people deemed at high risk of harming themselves or others.


Bolstering law enforcement and community violence intervention programs
The $1.9 trillion Covid relief law, or the American Rescue Plan, allocated $350 billion to states, local governments, territories and tribes. The administration says that funding is available for law enforcement purposes as well as to expand community violence intervention programs.

The White House in July also established the White House Community Violence Intervention Collaborative, which is a group that includes mayors, law enforcement and community violence intervention experts. The group says it is examining how to best use American Rescue Plan funding and other public funding to increase investments in "community violence intervention infrastructure."

"It is a basic accountability issue," Josh Horwitz, the co-director of the Center for Gun Violence Solutions at Johns Hopkins, told CNN.

This is what Biden could do more of according to advocacy groups.

Enforcement of existing "red flag" laws

Horwitz said the Biden administration could also prioritize funding to support the enforcement of extreme risk protection orders, which are also known as "red flag" law. The orders allow the temporary removal of guns from people deemed at high risk of harming themselves or others. He noted the effectiveness of the orders to prevent acts of violence depends completely on implementation and enforcement

[pastarocket]

Do you know what the definition of ‘amendment’ is?

My bad. Read my latest post above.

Actual actions on guns from Biden.

It's a good read.

[JD¹³]

"High capacity magazines" make no difference to the root of the problem. That's a catch phrase for people who don't understand much, they are not the caveat. We have mag capacity in Canada and all they are is a rivet or pin in an existing 30 to make it 5. I have plenty of them. Criminals don't follow laws (duh) so all one would have to do is take a drill and 10 seconds later they have a 30 round mag. Even if you've never done it changing a mag takes five seconds to figure out. You don't have to be John Wick on the reloads to keep a high fire rate pinned mag or not. The Vegas shooter proved that a disturbed criminal mind will find a way regardless of the trivial restrictions you put on the tools (bump stocks, dozen+ weapons pre-setup, piles of mags, etc).

It all boils down to culture and the social issues the US has. Canada has almost all the same firearms available and millions of owners but our culture surrounding them is entirely different. Lawful firearms owners in this country commit effectively no violent crime with them. Any meaningful change on gun violence in the US will take generations to fix. They're so far down the rabbit hole they can't see daylight anymore.

There's a lot I want to say about the role of the police in this particular incident. I'm shocked and disgusted. It should end the 'good guy with a gun' or 'vets at schools' debates immediately. They're fucking stupid to begin with and have no basis in reality. Arming teachers is even dumber. I'll speak more on this later.

[Presto]

Good reasons for not arming teachers

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1o1l2LQGyP8

[westopher]

Crazy that you guys offering the opposite opinion haven’t actually come up with any solutions that could implement change?
Are you illiterate?

[Hondaracer]

The legal drinking age in Texas is 21. The legal age to buy an AR 15 is 18. It should not be harder to buy a beer than a gun.

According to most sites, the median age of school shooters is 16, so the age thing while seemingly a no brainer doesn’t stop it

https://www.politifact.com/factchecks/2022/may/25/chris-murphy/fact-checking-chris-murphy-ages-mass-shooters/

[MarkyMark]

The truth is you could write out a fool proof plan guaranteed to lower the chance of mass shootings while at the same guaranteeing responsible gun owners can still keep their favorite hobby of shooting beer cans off a barb wire fence and these "responsible" gun owners would never support it.

It will always be "this is just the first step in losing our guns" and that's the end of it. They won't give an inch in fear of losing a mile.

[westopher]

I mean the goal isn’t just to stop school shootings, it’s reduce all mass shootings, or individual shootings.
Remember earlier in the year the kid that shot up the school had the gun purchased legally by their parents.

[Hondaracer]

"High capacity magazines" make no difference to the root of the problem. That's a catch phrase for people who don't understand much, they are not the caveat. We have mag capacity in Canada and all they are is a rivet or pin in an existing 30 to make it 5. I have plenty of them. Criminals don't follow laws (duh) so all one would have to do is take a drill and 10 seconds later they have a 30 round mag. Even if you've never done it changing a mag takes five seconds to figure out. You don't have to be John Wick on the reloads to keep a high fire rate pinned mag or not. The Vegas shooter proved that a disturbed criminal mind will find a way regardless of the trivial restrictions you put on the tools (bump stocks, dozen+ weapons pre-setup, piles of mags, etc).

It all boils down to culture and the social issues the US has. Canada has almost all the same firearms available and millions of owners but our culture surrounding them is entirely different. Lawful firearms owners in this country commit effectively no violent crime with them. Any meaningful change on gun violence in the US will take generations to fix. They're so far down the rabbit hole they can't see daylight anymore.

There's a lot I want to say about the role of the police in this particular incident. I'm shocked and disgusted. It should end the 'good guy with a gun' or 'vets at schools' debates immediately. They're fucking stupid to begin with and have no basis in reality. Arming teachers is even dumber. I'll speak more on this later.


Ehhhh come on..in Canada it’s no where near the accessibility as the states. You’d be hard pressed to find those large capacity mags even pinned here. Not to say it’s impossible by any means but someone would have to actively search for them and put some effort into it

I’ve watched some videos of gun shows in the states where there are literal STACKS of 50+ round magazines at sellers tables, then you’ve got the 9mm drum mags and other ultra high capacity that can be used in guns that use a pistol mag like JR Carbine etc.

I’m not professing to be any sort of expert on the matter but I’ve been a hunter and firearm user for most of my life and have been to many gun shows etc. in Canada and it’s like going to a chuck e cheese compared to these US gun shows in terms of what’s available

You don’t think the ability to fire literally hundreds of rounds without changing the magazine has an impact on these shootings?

[320icar]

The truth is you could write out a fool proof plan guaranteed to lower the chance of mass shootings while at the same guaranteeing responsible gun owners can still keep their favorite hobby of shooting beer cans off a barb wire fence and these "responsible" gun owners would never support it.

It will always be "this is just the first step in losing our guns" and that's the end of it. They won't give an inch in fear of losing a mile.

And they’re willing to sell their children lives for that right

[westopher]

With that statement you clearly understand limiting access lowers the likelihood of these events happening.

[320icar]

Ehhhh come on..in Canada it’s no where near the accessibility as the states. You’d be hard pressed to find those large capacity mags even pinned here. Not to say it’s impossible by any means but someone would have to actively search for them and put some effort into it

I’ve watched some videos of gun shows in the states where there are literal STACKS of 50+ round magazines at sellers tables, then you’ve got the 9mm drum mags and other ultra high capacity that can be used in guns that use a pistol mag like JR Carbine etc.

I’m not professing to be any sort of expert on the matter but I’ve been a hunter and firearm user for most of my life and have been to many gun shows etc. in Canada and it’s like going to a chuck e cheese compared to these US gun shows in terms of what’s available

I feel like you’re proving our point dude. America needs firearm regulation.

[Great68]

doesn’t stop it


This is your problem, focusing on "stopping it".

A measure like that undisputedly makes it harder, in some amount, than it currently is. And that's where they need to be going with things.

[underscore]

16 year olds will have far more connections to 18 year olds than 21+ year olds though. You do understand that there's no single fix that will instantly stop all shootings right? The goal is to take many small steps to reduce the frequency of these incidents over time.

There's a lot I want to say about the role of the police in this particular incident. I'm shocked and disgusted. It should end the 'good guy with a gun' or 'vets at schools' debates immediately.

I hope you're not going to be too hard on the police. Do you have any idea how dangerous it is to try and stop someone from murdering children and teachers? They could be shot!

/sarcasm in case anyone doesn't get it.

[Hondaracer]

Again, not saying any of that won’t help. My point is, it won’t happen. I think as well like I’ve already mentioned the prevalence of these things makes it VERY hard to limit access to even if they did have the will to make meaningful change.

When I was in Vegas for my 30th bday some years back I went to battlefield Vegas. As part of the experience a guy picked us up in a military humvee. I got to talking to him as we weee cruising down the strip in a topless ex military humvee and he told me was a former marine etc.

I asked what’s it like living in Vegas, he’s like “I ducking hate Vegas, but where I grew up in California I couldn’t own the guns I wanted, so here I am”

Dat culture

[pastarocket]

What are your thoughts on Biden's proposed solutions to gun violence?

https://www.cnn.com/2022/05/27/polit...ons/index.html

Here's what Biden has done on guns and what advocacy groups say he can still do without Congress.

POTUS has the power of executive orders that do not need congressional approval.

[underscore]

Oh I know it won't happen, Sandy Hook made it very clear America will never do jack shit. Hell they can't even be bothered to require manufacturers to label their food properly to ensure it's safe for everyone to eat.

re: magazine sizes - yes you can just remove the pin from some of them, but it still limits what options you can legally get because I doubt every manufacturer will bother to make pinned versions to export to Canada. Having to change magazines is how a shooter in Canada was stopped so I can understand the source of that law too.

[westopher]

Link doesn’t work, but I’ll eat my hat if he does anything.

[pastarocket]

Link doesn’t work, but I’ll eat my hat if he does anything.

Try this CNN link:

https://www.cnn.com/2022/05/27/politics/biden-guns-executive-actions/index.html

Here's what Biden has done on guns and what advocacy groups say he can still do without Congress

[Great68]

1

I hope you're not going to be too hard on the police. Do you have any idea how dangerous it is to try and stop someone from murdering children and teachers? They could be shot!

/sarcasm in case anyone doesn't get it.

This isn't the first case of useless police in a school shooting either.

Remember Parkland and that armed campus sheriff who was actually on campus when the shooting started, and just stood outside like a coward during the whole thing?

[320icar]

When I was in Vegas for my 30th bday some years back I went to battlefield Vegas. As part of the experience a guy picked us up in a military humvee. I got to talking to him as we weee cruising down the strip in a topless ex military humvee and he told me was a former marine

We did the same about 10 years ago for my brothers bachelor. The big group of us spending a few hundred each, they threw in so many extras. For anyone who likes firearms but have never gone to an American shooting range, holy F you are missing out. It’s… incomparable to anything I’ve experienced.

Pm me if you want an old pic of me :QQ:

[Hondaracer]

Yea i spent about $700 there

FN SCAR, M60, M249, 50 Cal Barret, good times lol

$30 a round for that Barret, but everyone stops to watch you shoot it and it feels like a fucking car accident in those booths

[68style]

There was an actual retired cop (not just some security guard tourist) at the grocery store in Buffalo, no effect. It's crazy for these people to say that's what they need.

It's also kinda crazy that they need an armed retired cop at a grocery store... but I digress.

[68style]

There's a super obvious answer here... no it doesn't STOP it completely... nothing ever does... but reduction is the key.

You cannot argue with historical facts.

Australia had that big shooting, got rid of powerful guns/put in a registry under a conservative government (there were no LOBBIES... so they did what made sense not what their corporate sponsors told them to do).

https://www.vox.com/2015/8/27/9212725/australia-buyback

https://cdn.vox-cdn.com/thumbor/JXQD11VHbHd_VhN0nA5YQtVPSRw=/0x0:2500x1818/920x613/filters:focal(975x58:1375x458):format(webp)/cdn.vox-cdn.com/uploads/chorus_image/image/70909585/GettyImages-158581520.0.0.0.0.jpg

The results speak for themselves.

[Hondaracer]

It’s a completely different world today. Not gonna fly. Lol like legit in the current state of the world you think even the most liberal country is going to have citizens willingly turn in guns? I sure as hell wouldn’t.

Like I just posted, the liberal govt. here doesn’t know how to do it. They know people are just going to ignore it, hence the pushback of over a year of Trudeaus super duper gun buy back.

[RiceIntegraRS]

It seems like u guys are argueing different points and assume the other knows the obvious that things wont change in the states. But interpreting it as it wont work.

[68style]

We're not talking about 1850 vs 2022 here... 1996 wasn't a whole world ago.

New Zealand just did it in 2019.

Is that a different world?

If lobbyists didn't pay politicians in the USA (this is the primary problem in that country), they'd be working on getting this done... they wouldn't be saying inflammatory stuff about their stupid amendments for that crowd to slurp up and get all in a lather about their rights... they'd capitulate to reason like every other place in the world does eventually.

[Hondaracer]

1996.. a pre-911 world without widespread internet usage.. lol come on.

With media the way it is today and the prevalence of heinous violent crimes, no one is going to get on board with that.

I’d say NZ isn’t exactly a comparable to North America or even most of Europe. NZ almost has the sale total population of BC..

[winson604]

It’s a completely different world today. Not gonna fly. Lol like legit in the current state of the world you think even the most liberal country is going to have citizens willingly turn in guns? I sure as hell wouldn’t.

Like I just posted, the liberal govt. here doesn’t know how to do it. They know people are just going to ignore it, hence the pushback of over a year of Trudeaus super duper gun buy back.

Man don't even remind me of our now banned firearms lol I have them sitting in their cases in my closet and I get angry every time I go in the room and glance over haha. I know there's no turning back just get this stupid buy back rolling so I can be done with it so I can finally go into grieving mode.

[JD¹³]

Ehhhh come on..in Canada it’s no where near the accessibility as the states. You’d be hard pressed to find those large capacity mags even pinned here. Not to say it’s impossible by any means but someone would have to actively search for them and put some effort into it
False. Again, it's a culture thing. You don't see it in Canada because it's not prevalent. In a major city you can walk in to a store and buy as many mags and rounds as you want. Or you can go online and order it all in a matter of minutes and they'll ship it to your door registered mail anywhere in the country and it's yours in a week. There's no limit on how much someone can buy here you just don't see hoarding and marketing to hoarders like you do in the US. I agree their gun shows are nuts.
You don’t think the ability to fire literally hundreds of rounds without changing the magazine has an impact on these shootings?
No, because no one is literally firing hundreds of rounds without reloading even a belt fed machine gun can't do that. We're talking 30 vs 5 or 10 for common rifle magazines. Yes there are drum mags but they're relatively uncommon though to be fair to your point one of the Columbine shooters did use 'larger' capacity 9mm mags. Did it contribute? Maybe at a very micro level but the magazine size was not the macro cause. One kid had 13 10rnd mags the other had a 52, 32, and 28. Total semantics at that point. They were also too young and got all their stuff illegally.

The root causes of this are social issues, excessive ease of accessibility as a result of culture, and no/useless background checks. Basic licensing and comprehensive federal background check like we have here in Canada would be a great place to start down there, but it'll never happen. If those measures were in place the number of mass shooters in the US who wouldn't have been able to acquire a firearm legally would have been drastically cut off. I can't find the article now but I read one a while ago that stated something like 90% of the mass shooters from Columbine onward had been prescribed anti-depressants at some point in their past. That would have disqualified them from legal ownership if there were any actual rules in place. The US wants Wild West laws and then are surprised when Wild West happens.

[Hondaracer]

So let’s say that same buyback program in the Australia was able to achieve somthing similar. That article says it accounted for 20% of the guns in the country

20% of the guns in the USA is 80 million, compared to the 650,000 in Australia

Aus bought them back at “market rate”. So let’s say the average is $300, which these days you can’t buy the shittiest cheapest firearm for $300.

$300 x 80 million = 24 billion dollars

Not going to happen lol, sorry. To think the US govt. would approve a 24 billion dollar gun buy back program (which obviously it would be wayyyy more than that) I think We’ve got a better chance of the moon colliding with earth

[underscore]

https://i.imgur.com/nrh2JM5.png

[320icar]

So let’s say that same buyback program in the Australia was able to achieve somthing similar. That article says it accounted for 20% of the guns in the country

20% of the guns in the USA is 80 million, compared to the 650,000 in Australia

Aus bought them back at “market rate”. So let’s say the average is $300, which these days you can’t buy the shittiest cheapest firearm for $300.

$300 x 80 million = 24 billion dollars

Not going to happen lol, sorry. To think the US govt. would approve a 24 billion dollar gun buy back program (which obviously it would be wayyyy more than that) I think We’ve got a better chance of the moon colliding with earth

Or 3.09% of the annual us military budget. Assuming it would take 2-3 years then we’re talking <1% of the annual budget.

[Mr.Money]

American's have this odd fear a apocalypse might happen and every time a incident happens like this its always Buy more they "might take it away" moment.



Because Kyle Rittenhouse defended himself anyone else can if shit hits the fan.

[68style]

Took them a couple hours to agree to send $40 billion to Ukraine.

Why not $24 billion to buy back guns?

[Great68]

The other day in Sacremento police held a buy-back program for for $50 gas cards.

They had so many people drop off guns that program ran out of gas cards in 45 minutes, and people were still dropping them off after in exchange for nothing....


https://www.npr.org/2022/05/23/1100683314/sacramento-gas-for-guns-buyback

There are obviously a lot of people willing to give up their guns if incentivized to do so. If a $50 gas card can do it, imagine $200!

[westopher]

A lot of people seem to be forgetting the one thing Americans love more than guns. Money.

[winson604]

Also yea our mags are limited to 5 but the magazine you buy can still and often are 30 round mags with a pin in it which you can easily just remove and now you got 30 rounds if you so choose to.

[68style]

^ That's great, where there's a will there's a way.

But how many mass shootings do we have in Canada? Is it even 1% of the USA?

It's not because people COULD drill a pin out of a magazine if they felt inclined to. All that is, is people who are so-called experts sitting around being smug saying "They don't know what they're talking about, I could bypass that real easy" and feeling better about themselves. Yah nothing can stop the ultimate motivated person, we get it.

[Hondaracer]

I generally enjoy a good debate but I don’t really love arguing that more children are likely to die

[SkinnyPupp]

So let’s say that same buyback program in the Australia was able to achieve somthing similar. That article says it accounted for 20% of the guns in the country

20% of the guns in the USA is 80 million, compared to the 650,000 in Australia

Aus bought them back at “market rate”. So let’s say the average is $300, which these days you can’t buy the shittiest cheapest firearm for $300.

$300 x 80 million = 24 billion dollars

Not going to happen lol, sorry. To think the US govt. would approve a 24 billion dollar gun buy back program (which obviously it would be wayyyy more than that) I think We’ve got a better chance of the moon colliding with earth
Buy back the guns, send them to Ukraine, call it a military relief fund *taps forehead*

[PeanutButter]

https://i.imgur.com/nrh2JM5.png

can someone explain this?

[SkinnyPupp]

can someone explain this?
Police admitted that they didn't send anyone in while the guy was killing kids, because they were worried one of the cops "could have been shot (https://www.insider.com/texas-shooting-police-didnt-immediately-confront-gunman-lieutenant-explains-2022-5)"

So these kids basically sacrificed themselves for those pigs

[Mr.Money]

rumor is going on a cop saved his kid and ran out the place waiting for back-up.


and other police were fighting parents not to run in and try save their kids.

[RiceIntegraRS]

Well of course that happened. Theres no way in hell a cop that had a kid inside would wait for backup. Anyones whose a parent would risk their lives to save their kids. Yet god forbid the cops letting anyone else save their own kids..... Theres a video on twitter apparently of the sergeant already admitting that there was cops going against protocol to save there kids

Edit

https://mobile.twitter.com/sawyerhackett/status/1529808809719480320?s=21

A friend sent me this.

[PeanutButter]

Oh, I see. So people are calling the cops cowards...

These are my initial thoughts.

1. If I were a parent who was outside, I would have 100% ran in there to try and save my kid. No one would be able to prevent me from entering that building, whether I was armed or not. I'm not relying on anyone or any cop to get my child out of a situation like that. I'm not sitting on the sidelines while my child is in danger.

2. In regards to the cop who ran in and saved only their kid, I can understand potentially the train of thought, make sure my child is safe and get the hell out of there. I'm not going to risk my child's life trying to save other people, who knows what is going on or if there are multiple shooters etc.

3. If you're a cop, but also a mother or father, are you supposed to risk your life and put yourself in a potentially life-threatening position? Is it their duty to die for anyone?

I get that being a police officer comes with certain expectations, but I'm not sure if putting your life in danger is an automatic requirement just because you're a police officer.

[RiceIntegraRS]

The problem i see is that u have parents who are willing to put there lives on the line to save there kids(its not surprising). But the cops held them back cause im willing to bet they would have no problem shooting the parents if they tried to make there way in. Thats America logic for u

[westopher]

I get that being a police officer comes with certain expectations, but I'm not sure if putting your life in danger is an automatic requirement just because you're a police officer.
To protect and serve unless you're scared, it inconveniences you, or you just don't feel like it today is the long version I guess.

[Great68]

Oh, I see. So people are calling the cops cowards...

These are my initial thoughts.

1. If I were a parent who was outside, I would have 100% ran in there to try and save my kid. No one would be able to prevent me from entering that building, whether I was armed or not. I'm not relying on anyone or any cop to get my child out of a situation like that. I'm not sitting on the sidelines while my child is in danger.

2. In regards to the cop who ran in and saved only their kid, I can understand potentially the train of thought, make sure my child is safe and get the hell out of there. I'm not going to risk my child's life trying to save other people, who knows what is going on or if there are multiple shooters etc.

3. If you're a cop, but also a mother or father, are you supposed to risk your life and put yourself in a potentially life-threatening position? Is it their duty to die for anyone?

I get that being a police officer comes with certain expectations, but I'm not sure if putting your life in danger is an automatic requirement just because you're a police officer.

What the fuck am I reading?

Yes, Yes being a cop comes with the expectation that you may need to put your life in danger.

Otherwise, don't be a fucking cop!

[JDMDreams]

^^ sir have you seen vpd? Sport mode are terrorists :accepted:

[Badhobz]

im kinda numb to all these school shootings.

In that respects the NRA/republicans are winning... just keep having these shootings and sooner or later people become numb to the pain.

[underscore]

So these kids basically sacrificed themselves for those pigs

After they went into the school, the cops said for anyone who needed help to call out. A girl yelled help, the gunman went and shot her, and then the cops rushed into the room.

[PeanutButter]

What the fuck am I reading?

Yes, Yes being a cop comes with the expectation that you may need to put your life in danger.

Otherwise, don't be a fucking cop!

I think I understand how you feel about this topic, I just don't think it's that simple.

Just curious, do you have children?

[320icar]

3. If you're a cop, but also a mother or father, are you supposed to risk your life and put yourself in a potentially life-threatening position? Is it their duty to die for anyone?

I get that being a police officer comes with certain expectations, but I'm not sure if putting your life in danger is an automatic requirement just because you're a police officer.

Literally yes. TO PROTECT AND SERVE

[SkinnyPupp]

Peanutbutter you should read this:

https://twitter.com/ByMikeBaker/status/1530357140191186944

[MarkyMark]

I thought someone having a child would make them more likely to run in and protect a school full of innocent children knowing what's on the line, not the opposite. The fact that some cops ran in to save their own child while saying fuck the rest is some of the most cowardly shit I've ever heard a police officer do and I sincerely hope they handed in their badge or are ridiculed until they do.

[RiceIntegraRS]

I really need a break from this thread. Everytime i come back it just makes my blood boil

[Hondaracer]

I think back to manics original point. The high school bully turned cop making 60k doesn’t feel like charging into a hail of bullets when push comes to shove

[MarkyMark]

Honestly if you pay them 100k or 150k are they really going to grow a sack just because their paycheck is better? In a situation like that with kids being shot you're either the type of person that would run in there for free or you're going to run the other way, money means nothing in that moment.

Better training and weeding out the pussies would be a good start, and with more training you can argue paying them more but I wouldn't just bump up their pay with the expectation that they are willing to die for it.

[bcedhk]

I think most cops in small towns do not have the moral, will and determination to actually be a 'good' cop. They join because they can join with a high school or college diploma, they can find a job with good pay, a pension and pretty much next to impossible to get fired.

Most of the cops in the photo look like they won't be able to out run the gunman if they were to be on a foot chase.

[Manic!]

Honestly if you pay them 100k or 150k are they really going to grow a sack just because their paycheck is better? In a situation like that with kids being shot you're either the type of person that would run in there for free or you're going to run the other way, money means nothing in that moment.

Better training and weeding out the pussies would be a good start, and with more training you can argue paying them more but I wouldn't just bump up their pay with the expectation that they are willing to die for it.

You get what you pay for. I remember listing to Seattle radio and hearing an ad for Memphis PD. They where coming to Seattle on a recruitment drive. They had to travel around the US to find someone who would take the job. With low pay you literally scraping the bottom of the barrel.

It's also really hard to train someone to want to run towards gun fire. Canadian TV show 19-2 does a great job of showing what happens in a school shooting. Some cops just freeze.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LtxiokrYpxw

[mikemhg]

You’ll never solve it.

The only way to solve it is to go so hard on enforcement and restrictions it starts a civil war, you eat that for years on end with many deaths in hopes that 25-35 years from now somthing changes.

I think it’s far more likely we get to the point of minority report type shit where you’re predicting these crimes happening, or schools just become a one entry point concrete bunker where everyone goes through metal detectors and pat downs.

There will -never- be a time when guns are taken away from people, or even asking people to turn them in frankly

125 guns for every 100 people in the states. If it’s not at a school it will be at a mall, stadium, concert, etc.

Funny thing about this argument.

We hear all the time that "there's already too many guns out there, it's too late", however whenever these mass shooting occur, the guns utilized were purchased literally days before the shootings.

If we know that a large majority of mass shootings were conducted with firearms purchased within days or months prior to the actual shooting, it somewhat defeats that argument in terms of the guns being out there already.

https://www.usnews.com/news/politics/articles/2022-05-27/mass-shooters-exploited-gun-laws-loopholes-before-carnage

That gives credence to the fact that adding additional licensing/registration on a federal level on a go forward basis could alleviate some of these problems, at least to some capacity.

We can't make these arguments that it wouldn't work as the data isn't there, such measure hasn't been adopted before in the US. I could say a system similar to Canada's on a federal level in terms of course requirements, background checks, license fees would certainly be a start.

[mikemhg]

In terms of the police argument, those cops were cowards, most definitely.

In reality there are levels of those who get themselves involved in law enforcement. Some join as ideologues who want to do better for their community, some join for the power, some join to simply collect a cheque and have a job, especially in these smaller communities.

A lot of these places have issues even attracting and recruiting officers in the first place, so I think the idea of believing they'll be able to suddenly recruit these brave individuals to take a bullet is farcical.

America carries military bases all over the world, with a GDP allocated to military expenditure far outweighing any country in the world. Each state has its own national guard.

A country of such power can't figure out a way to allocate a quickly mobilized force of troops on a state/city basis to respond immediately to these types of shootings? That seems unbelievable to me.

[Hondaracer]

I don’t know if it’s irony or not, but I feel like the cop that has a hair trigger to shoot a black kid in the back, may also be the one that would actually run into a situation like this? Lol

Brainless automaton who thinks the law begins and ends with them

[N.V.M.]

every shooting you guys yip yap about it in a thread. so useful.

[westopher]

It’s a discussion forum. If you don’t want to discuss don’t fuckin bother logging in?

[Hondaracer]

every shooting you guys yip yap about it in a thread. so useful.

You’re a real prime contributor, your little blurbs about how hockey is for Pussies or tobacco is the devil is very much appreciated..

[underscore]

I don’t know if it’s irony or not, but I feel like the cop that has a hair trigger to shoot a black kid in the back, may also be the one that would actually run into a situation like this? Lol

Brainless automaton who thinks the law begins and ends with them

I would guess the opposite. Someone so terrified of a black person facing the other direction that they shoot them seems unlikely to willingly head towards danger.

[Mr.Money]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5_88c0S5xuE&ab_channel=CTVNews

yup, seems rumors are true. waiting outside one hour while shots are fired inside the building.

police then automatically assuming everything is over when it got quite.


Reason apparently Why a cop saved his kid only is cause she/he called him on a cellphone there was loud shots being fired while at a barbershop getting a hair cut, the off-duty police than borrowed a shotgun driving over there.



also a teacher fucked up when hearing the gun shots, she went outside in a car to grab her cellphone to call 911 while leaving every single door behind her unlocked....and a untold number of phone calls were already being made by the students inside.

that gave further access to the assailant

[westopher]

also a teacher fucked up when hearing the gun shots, she went outside in a car to grab her cellphone to call 911 while leaving every single door behind her unlocked....and a untold number of phone calls were already being made by the students inside.

that gave further access to the assailant
I've never spent a single day at school where the doors were locked, or known anyone that has. I'd say that's a pretty reasonable indicator something far greater than an unlocked door is wrong.

[Manic!]

Blaming the teacher now? The NRA will blame anyone anything to take the focus off guns.

https://i.postimg.cc/DwgTjFP6/RDT-20220528-1803246390653757504902931.png

The US needs to ban the sale of all assault rifles. Then make it a 15 year minimal jail term for the owner of any assault rifle used in a crime. No need to waste money on gun buy backs.

[StylinRed]

I've never spent a single day at school where the doors were locked, or known anyone that has. I'd say that's a pretty reasonable indicator something far greater than an unlocked door is wrong.

Schools in HK would lock the gate to prevent ppl from coming in late or skipping out

And here I've had a HS try to do the same, they'd lock all doors, you could exit but couldn't enter. At the main entrance only one door worked to enter, and a vice principal would sit there so they could catch late students

Later on they upgraded the inner hallway doors so they could lockdown the school with a switch of the button (magnetic lock iirc)

You would think security like that would be standard for all schools in the USA

[PeanutButter]

I completely understand the frustrations of so many of you and I think it's fair to call the officers cowards as that's exactly what they are.

It's just now that I'm a father, my perspective has changed.

I am no stranger to confrontation. I've been involved in multiple Patterson sky train station altercations, I've been stabbed multiple times, I'm not one to just sit on the sidelines. I was known to be quite cavalier.

The moment I had my baby, my risk tolerance changed completely. My sole priority is my child and my family. I have not used the horn in my car once since I had my child, I don't care to have any sort of altercation that could potentially cause harm to me that may negatively affect my family.

I would rather be labeled a coward and be alive to support my family than to be dead and a hero.


The points of being a police officer to serve and protect is a fair comment as well. You're completely right. Why are you a police officer if you aren't going to step up in the line of duty? That's absolutely fair. I guess the appropriate thing to do is to resign.

[westopher]

I totally understand a cop grabbing their kid and getting them out. But after that, you have to carry on. Thats the job, thats what you signed up to do, and if you can't, you never should have been paid for a day of it in your life.

[underscore]

I've never spent a single day at school where the doors were locked, or known anyone that has. I'd say that's a pretty reasonable indicator something far greater than an unlocked door is wrong.

While I agree, it seems weird as hell that for this teacher to be able to call 911 they'd have to leave their classroom unattended and go to their car to get their cell phone. That seems like the most needlessly complicated way to do it.

[danned]

https://i.chzbgr.com/full/3784602112/h4BCD27B6/elementary

[whitev70r]

When they put the timeline together, some teacher kept one of the doors jammed open (out of convenience) and that was the door the shooter went into the school through (#3 in diagram).

Man ... that's a lot of responsibility on her/him. Obviously, it is not all on this teacher but there are safety measures to prevent outsiders from entering and that one time out of convenience was a big factor in how things panned out.

https://i.dailymail.co.uk/1s/2022/05/27/04/58330991-10859495-New_information_reveals_the_shooter_was_not_confro nted_by_a_scho-a-23_1653621344097.jpg

[punkwax]

I work in the security industry and when I learn about these stories, it bothers me that anyone can easily walk into my kids’ (and yours) schools unlocked front doors. Maybe I’ve heard too much over the years but having access control on entry points makes so much sense. It’s not a lot of hassle for parents or late students to use a video intercom to be let in safely by office staff after the bell rings.

Sadly, proactive spend on security doesn’t happen too often in this relatively safe part of the world. I’ll use the unfortunate stabbing in that Abbotsford school as an example. It took that horrible event to happen for a school I’ve worked with to reactively find budget to keep students and staff safe.

I understand that budgets exist and I’m sure every school district around wished they had the best security available but it is a sincere shame that I’ve seen money suddenly become available after life has been lost.

TL;DR - when it comes to security, proactive > reactive.

[PeanutButter]

^ Having all of the school doors locked during school hours seems like a pretty good way to keep people out. It sounds super simple, but if they simply did this I suspect it would prevent a lot of unwanted people inside the school.

Definitely a major inconvenience, but that might be the easiest solution for now?

[BIC_BAWS]

I've never spent a single day at school where the doors were locked, or known anyone that has. I'd say that's a pretty reasonable indicator something far greater than an unlocked door is wrong.

Different era. I've been to two different high schools and three different elementary schools in Richmond. 3 of 5 of those, I've had some kind of lockdown and/or doors being locked after bell rings.

I barely remember elementary school. But I remember a lockdown happened 3x (nearby police activity, suspicious persons x2) at that school with lockdown drills especially around 2009/2010.

In high school at MacNeil, there was probably 3 drug/police activity lock downs every year. In Richmond High, there wasn't any that I really recall. One lockdown for police activity, but I skipped that day lol. Plenty of lockdown drills tho, at least once a year.

And then there's my brother's high school years, which is a different era too (later). There was actual lockdowns due to threats made on the school/students posted across social media and discord, like this one.

What a crazy world.

[Manic!]

I am pretty sure a person with a gun is not going to have a hard time getting thru a door or shooting a window out. Are you going to keep kids in during recess and lunch? If you make one place harder the shooter will just find another easier target.

The problem is guns end of story.

[Manic!]

Woman seeks into the NRA conformance via a side door.
https://mobile.twitter.com/lawindsor/status/1530603445736001536

[underscore]

Wouldn't it be easier to have emergency exit windows that the teacher can pop open and everyone can evacuate? They'd work for fires too.

[TOS'd]

https://twitter.com/TheGoodLiars/status/1531019935308304386

[SkinnyPupp]

https://twitter.com/TheGoodLiars/status/1531019935308304386
The idiots APPLAUDED HIM

[bcrdukes]

:neckbeard:

[GLOW]

^ Having all of the school doors locked during school hours seems like a pretty good way to keep people out. It sounds super simple, but if they simply did this I suspect it would prevent a lot of unwanted people inside the school.

Definitely a major inconvenience, but that might be the easiest solution for now?

iirc at my kids school when they had a lot of covid restrictions (only kids/staff allowed to enter building, no parents allowed), all doors were locked from the outside, but you could exit (egress). only door(s) open were the ones at the front that were closest to the front office. seemed to work to limit parent access in to the building (and if anyone wanted in, the receptionist was right there)

mind you not all school floorplans can do that, i know some school's reception is down a hallway from the nearest 'front door'.

[Mr.Money]

someone said "oh the window is a point too".... yes it is but at least it'll buy you more time to dial 911 and hold the person outside a little longer than a open doorway.


no way someone isn't getting cut crawling over a broken window

maybe teachers should hold non-lethal mace spray or have two hired armed security if these type of things are current.

[JD¹³]

It's mind-numbing and sad that this discussion, both here and in the US, goes to how to turn schools in to hardened bunkers. Good, fine, spend all the money to do that and guess what - you've made schools a hard target now the demented pieces of shit that perform these attacks will just find another soft one. A school wasn't the target in Vegas or Orlando. Hardening schools doesn't solve the core problem at all FailFish

The cowardice of the local PD is unfathomable. How none of those cops with their tac vests, carbines, training and numbers against a single gunmen didn't act is beyond shameful. How none of them thought "if not me, than who? If not us, than who?" and did their fucking job that they signed on the dotted line to do is inexcusable. The Uvalde PD / city will be litigated to death by the families, not that it matters or will bring their children back. This is America in 2022. We are now fully entrenched in the "soft men, hard times" section of the loop.

By the way, this is the hat of the off-duty BORTAC agent for anyone who hasn't seen it. From what I've sourced he and 2-3 other BORTAC agents showed up and after being frustrated with the local PD inaction they defied their orders and breached. These are some men with actual fortitude and sense of duty. Bravo to them.

https://i.imgur.com/JfkeC2A.jpg

[Manic!]

someone said "oh the window is a point too".... yes it is but at least it'll buy you more time to dial 911 and hold the person outside a little longer than a open doorway.


no way someone isn't getting cut crawling over a broken window

maybe teachers should hold non-lethal mace spray or have two hired armed security if these type of things are current.

Who is going to pay to have security guards at school. If they can't shoot up a school they will just shoot up a park or a chuck e cheese.

[Mr.Money]

https://globalnews.ca/news/8880287/florida-boy-arrested-mass-shooting-threat/

kids are dumb. in the news article above some 10 year old kid was making threating text to a school.



Who is going to pay to have security guards at school. If they can't shoot up a school they will just shoot up a park or a chuck e cheese.

the government, they have 40 billion dollars to donate to Ukraine with Biden signing off on it.

[68style]

I don't think that was Manic's point

[Manic!]

https://globalnews.ca/news/8880287/florida-boy-arrested-mass-shooting-threat/

kids are dumb. in the news article above some 10 year old kid was making threating text to a school.





the government, they have 40 billion dollars to donate to Ukraine with Biden signing off on it.

But republicans want lower taxes and smaller government. You have over 130 thousand schools in the US. You would need what? 2 guards per school plus spares. That's close to 300k people. How are you going to find and train 300K qualified people? Just having someone with a gun in school is not going to do much. They would just be the first targets. I don't thing a security guard with a few weeks training is going to be able to pull out there gun and shoot a person who already has their gun out. Also you have police abuse there power. What makes you think some school guard would not to the same.

After arming the school whats next shopping malls, sports fields, parking lots? Do you want to live in a place where every street corner has an armed guard making $12 a hour?

[westopher]

It’s the American way. Find the most complicated, unrealistic and expensive solution, that’s guaranteed not to work then throw your hands in the air when it doesn’t and say “see! Guns aren’t the problem here!” Even though it’s made it even clearer that they are.

[SkinnyPupp]

https://twitter.com/shannonrwatts/status/1532142237517107200

[RiceIntegraRS]

USA! USA! USA!

[AzNightmare]

https://twitter.com/shannonrwatts/status/1532142237517107200

It's pretty much an everyday thing now I guess.
Not just one a day, but multiple a day.

[JDMDreams]

USA: it's not guns that kills people, it's people who stand in front of moving bullets :accepted::fulloffuck:

[dark0821]

https://youtu.be/kWqLxTatndU

this camw up on my feed ... what to say, that's just unbelievable

[Manic!]

A 12-year-old robs a gas station with a handgun firing one shot into the ceiling. I can't remember the last time I heard a gas station ging robbed with a handgun in Canada. And people claim the US does not have a gun problem.

https://wwmt.com/news/local/robbery-harford-police-gas-station-surveillance-video-van-buren-county-armed-gun-violence-shooting-west-michigan-marathon

[T4RAWR]

A 12-year-old robs a gas station with a handgun firing one shot into the ceiling. I can't remember the last time I heard a gas station ging robbed with a handgun in Canada. And people claim the US does not have a gun problem.

https://wwmt.com/news/local/robbery-harford-police-gas-station-surveillance-video-van-buren-county-armed-gun-violence-shooting-west-michigan-marathon

It happens all the time in Canada. Most of the time with a replica although there are some cases where a real gun is used.

Knives, machetes and bear spray are a bit more common in the LMD though when it comes to robberies.

[Manic!]

It happens all the time in Canada. Most of the time with a replica although there are some cases where a real gun is used.

Knives, machetes and bear spray are a bit more common in the LMD though when it comes to robberies.

I can't remember the last time I heard a gas station being robbed with a real gun. If you can afford a gun why would you be robbing a gas station for $100. Most times gas stations are robbed by drug addicts needing money for a fix.

[T4RAWR]

I can't remember the last time I heard a gas station being robbed with a real gun. If you can afford a gun why would you be robbing a gas station for $100. Most times gas stations are robbed by drug addicts needing money for a fix.

You're assuming that they purchased the gun to commit the crime. Most of these guys who dabble in robberies also do BNEs and thefts from vehicles knowing firearms are present in homes.

Also, its not crazy expensive to buy a stolen 10/22 and cut down the stock and barrel to make it easy to conceal. Welfare Wednesday money is more than enough to buy a gun to go commit crimes with. Better yet, buy a bulk amount of dope so you can sell/trade off a few points for a gun.

Here's a recent robbery from the island using a firearm.

https://www.northislandgazette.com/news/port-mcneill-gas-station-robbed-at-gunpoint-by-man-in-yellow-rain-gear/

Here's one from the Okanagan.

https://globalnews.ca/news/8752478/teen-charged-tackled-gas-station-employee-dauphin/

Simple Google search shows results from across the country.

Also most people robbing the gas stations know that there isn't that much money in the till. They still take it cause they can but the target items typically end up being cartons of smokes and scratch tickets they can sell later.

I didn't disagree with you're point about the US having a gun problem, simply pointing out canada has one too.

[320icar]

But…. You know it’s not the same, right

[Hondaracer]

A 12 year old is robbing a gas station and the issue is the gun?…

[westopher]

Well it is actually 1 of the two issues.

[MarkyMark]

Well if a 12 year old tried robbing you on the street what would you have more of an issue with, him being 12 or the gun pointed at you?

[Manic!]

You're assuming that they purchased the gun to commit the crime. Most of these guys who dabble in robberies also do BNEs and thefts from vehicles knowing firearms are present in homes.

Also, its not crazy expensive to buy a stolen 10/22 and cut down the stock and barrel to make it easy to conceal. Welfare Wednesday money is more than enough to buy a gun to go commit crimes with. Better yet, buy a bulk amount of dope so you can sell/trade off a few points for a gun.

Here's a recent robbery from the island using a firearm.

https://www.northislandgazette.com/news/port-mcneill-gas-station-robbed-at-gunpoint-by-man-in-yellow-rain-gear/

Here's one from the Okanagan.


https://globalnews.ca/news/8752478/teen-charged-tackled-gas-station-employee-dauphin/

Simple Google search shows results from across the country.

Also most people robbing the gas stations know that there isn't that much money in the till. They still take it cause they can but the target items typically end up being cartons of smokes and scratch tickets they can sell later.

I didn't disagree with you're point about the US having a gun problem, simply pointing out canada has one too.

We have owned a gas station for decades and have not had a single armed robbery. I also know a number of gas stations owners and they have never had a armed robbery with a gun. Why would you risk gun charges when all you need is a knife. Corporate policies are just to give what every the robber wants and not resist. The problem with the US is guns are dirt cheap. You can get a new one for under $200.

What is the cost cost of a black market bun these days because if it's over a grand robbing a gas station is not worth it.

[Manic!]

Well if a 12 year old tried robbing you on the street what would you have more of an issue with, him being 12 or the gun pointed at you?

Guys like Honda want to normalize kids owning gun.

https://img.buzzfeed.com/buzzfeed-static/static/enhanced/webdr06/2013/5/3/10/enhanced-buzz-8883-1367592137-2.jpg?downsize=700%3A%2A&output-quality=auto&output-format=auto

https://thesportsmansshop.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/12/KSA-CRICKETT-G2-22LR-16-PINK-WSCOPE-SOFT-CASE.jpg

[320icar]

^^ that kids stance is garbage too :p

[!Aznboi128]

^^ that kids stance is garbage too :p
that 1st shot landing you on your ass is how you learn

[ImportPsycho]

:seriously::facepalm:

Canadian, 17, accused of threatening mass shooting at Florida Pride event (https://www.cbc.ca/player/play/2040621635822)

[pastarocket]

Actor Matthew McConaughey, a native of Uvalde Texas, gave a speech to implore US lawmakers to get something done on gun reform in order to protect American lives.

-quite a moving speech as he talks about his conversations with the some parents of the deceased children. -full of anger and sadness as he tries to hold back tears.

He said "We heard from families of the deceased, mothers, fathers, brothers, sisters, border patrol and responsible gun owners"

"Do you know what they said??"

They said "We want secure and safe schools and we want gun laws that won't make it easy for the bad guys to get these damn guns!"

It was pretty painful to hear McConaughey's speech. FeelsBadMan

https://youtu.be/OP27AXVNaeg


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Manic!]

So Americans can own RPG's.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v-qj2rqgChM

[ImportPsycho]

omg runway of oversize women modeling their holsters... murica...:facepalm:

[westopher]

Inb4 “ShUt Up HolY WOOd ElItEs” in regards to Matthew McConaughey’s plea.

[mikemhg]

I was blown away you can buy a bazooka in the US.

For some reason I figured grenades and RPGs were illegal to purchase down there. Guess not.

I suppose they come in handy when hunting? :lol

Stupid country.

[320icar]

https://youtu.be/v0aGGOK4kAM

Worth the watch

[320icar]

No response in over a week.

I guess that’s all it takes. America has moved on, this will happen again, people will shout from the roof top “how much longer will we let this happen!” And They’ll repeat the cycle of thoughts and prayers, no actions and peoples lives ending.

[JDMDreams]

Nothing like a good old American shooting to make it great again.

Mean while in Vancouver Killarney is currently in lock down cuz weapons reported:lawl:

[AzNightmare]

Nothing like a good old American shooting to make it great again.

Mean while in Vancouver Killarney is currently in lock down cuz weapons reported:lawl:

https://globalnews.ca/news/8925937/school-lock-down-vancouver-police-weapon-reported/

lol, it was just an axe, not a gun.
But they never found the suspect...
axe murderer on the loose.

[Manic!]

Full hallway footage.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I3poHE3nOb8

[SkinnyPupp]

So cops were there 2 or 3 minutes after the first shots were fired.. How did so many kids die?

(Edit; Rhetorical question)

[westopher]

Because the cops made the decision to not put themselves at risk to save children.

[SkinnyPupp]

Because the cops made the decision to not put themselves at risk to save children.
(edited my first post to make it more clear I was asking a rhetorical question ;) )

Dude checking his phone ACTUALLY HAS A BLUE LINE "PUNISHER" LOGO AS HIS PHONE BACKGROUND EleGiggle

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FXfpkkPXwAEa1vI.jpg

[westopher]

Ahhh I just legitimately thought being on the other side of the world you might have been missing part of the story, but I guess regardless of how media would have covered it there you’d know from the last 9 pages haha.

[SkinnyPupp]

https://twitter.com/digitalurn/status/1546985768006008832

[sdubfid]

Should correct that to “how that cop sees himself vs who he really is” Unless people think they are all the same in which case they should never dial 911.

[SkinnyPupp]

Should correct that to “how that cop sees himself vs who he really is” Unless people think they are all the same in which case they should never dial 911.
Do you realize how that is a legit thing for many people in the US?

[68style]

Should never generalize in blanket statements like that tho... takes away from his/her point entirely

[SkinnyPupp]

Kind of goes without saying though