[AstulzerRZD]

I am also job hunting - Upper management didn't approve my promotion so I'm on the hunt.

I'm in my late 20s, looking to work at a company where I genuinely care about the customers (currently just software developers).
I have promising inbound opportunities but need to focus on landing roles I truly want.

Goals:
1) Learn from inspiring Product Managers for a couple of years.
2) Explore side projects/startup ideas to prepare for a startup accelerator.
3) Network to find potential technical cofounders.

Concerns:
1) Burnout if I don't connect with coworkers or customers.
2) Securing the right opportunities, experiences, and mentorship.
3) Improving cross-organization collaboration and communication.

Similar to BIC_BAWS request:
What was your personal experience choosing between pay and passion?
How could you see the following 3 jobs working for me in late 20s/early 30s?

Option 1 (Recruiter contacted me)
- Fit for Experience: Exact fit
- Highlights: Reputable big company, internal developers
- Location: NYC in person
- Total Compensation: $350K , cash bonus
- Customer Base: software developers internal to the company

Option 2 (Have referral)
- Fit for Experience: Pretty good fit, with learning curve
- Highlights: Grindy startup culture, high hiring bar, well known web app
- Location: Remote with NYC office, SF HQ
- TC: $300K, RSUs, Acquisition got blocked
- Customer Base: Designers

Option 3
- Fit for Experience: Not an exact fit
- Highlights: Profitable & well-known consumer app
- Location: NY office, HQ in Pittsburgh
- TC: $250K (same as current)
- Customer Base: Consumer users - language learning/sports

[supafamous]

Copy and pasting from the other thread:

I am also job hunting - Upper management didn't approve my promotion so I'm on the hunt.

I'm in my late 20s, looking to work at a company where I genuinely care about the customers (currently just software developers).
I have promising inbound opportunities but need to focus on landing roles I truly want.

Goals:
1) Learn from inspiring Product Managers for a couple of years.
2) Explore side projects/startup ideas to prepare for a startup accelerator.
3) Network to find potential technical cofounders.

Concerns:
1) Burnout if I don't connect with coworkers or customers.
2) Securing the right opportunities, experiences, and mentorship.
3) Improving cross-organization collaboration and communication.

Similar to BIC_BAWS request:
What was your personal experience choosing between pay and passion?
How could you see the following 3 jobs working for me in late 20s/early 30s?

I never cared much about pay or passion - I just chose to work at places where I could learn a lot and where I thought I'd like the people. The thing with pay is that it's so much anyways that an extra $50k isn't meaningful and the thing with passion is that there's so much BS that happens at work that it can really extinguish the excitement you have for your passion. I also didn't care much about the industry either - it's so much of the same shit, different container.

For my last few jobs I had a list of things I cared about learning and I sought jobs that gave me those things. For example, 2 jobs ago I decided that I needed to get more hands-on as a product leader - I had been managing big teams (15 directs) and had become more of an administrator and my craft was rusty. I looked for a job where my team would be smaller and that I would get to do some hands-on work so I could "sharpen my knife". I was also sick and tired of reporting to the CEO (or c-suite) so I looked for something that kept me a couple degrees removed from the CEO.

That all said, the two things I tell early career tech workers when thinking about their whole career is:

1. Go work at a place with a really high bar so you know what the standard can be. When you work at small places the bar is always lower b/c you work with inexperienced people and the processes are missing. Go work at a place where the talent bar for people and process is really high for a few years. You'll probably meet a few people that become future mentors or who you will always look up to (I worked with a Director of Eng at Amazon that was so capable and intelligent that I aspired to be just 10% as good as him). Too many people end up not working with the people of the highest tier in their lives and then get upset that their career is not progressing - well the problem is they aren't setting a high enough bar for themselves.

2. Go work at a small, scrappy place where you have to wear many hats and get to learn the whole business. Learn the value of relationship building, understand company financials, know how the sausage gets made across a company.

[AstulzerRZD]

Too many people end up not working with the people of the highest tier in their lives and then get upset that their career is not progressing - well the problem is they aren't setting a high enough bar for themselves.

I'm hearing smaller team, crazy high craft, wide scope - that's really helpful.

I finally got an awesome manager this year and received craft feedback for the first time in my life.
Big tech is highly matrixed (my team especially), with variable standards and heavy communication needed for buy-in and execution.

[supafamous]

I'm hearing smaller team, crazy high craft, wide scope - that's really helpful.

I finally got an awesome manager this year and received craft feedback for the first time in my life.
Big tech is highly matrixed (my team especially), with variable standards and heavy communication needed for buy-in and execution.

Yeah, big tech is "political" - so many moving parts, so many dependencies etc that makes shipping really hard. You'll learn a bunch of things but they may not be things you truly want to learn (being a good politician means you'll end up in management and be hands-off but maybe you want to have big scope and high impact as an IC).

[BIC_BAWS]

Yeah starting a new thread for this would have been more appropriate I think. While it falls in line with my initial posts about success / careers / happiness, I feel like you'll get better traction and on topic answers here.

You've always been that great source of inspiration for me. You're the Richmond high school grad that made it. I know most of your initial story, but it would be great to hear more about your journey in your 20s.

I'm surprised you're thinking of jumping ship (and also I thought your TC was a lot higher, granted USD). I assumed the place that you're at is the place to be at, and from what I hear you are a critical member in the organization.

There's plenty of smart, rich and successful people on RS. It's always fascinating to me to see how you have all made it here.

Sent from my SM-G781W using Tapatalk

[Badhobz]

how old are you again bro? if you're under 25, go for the big money because you can still change and adapt. Even if shit hits the fan.

If you're inching closer to 30, Id say get something a bit more stable and see if you can increase total compensation from moving up. Building a good work/life relationship is important. Even more important the older you get.

$ per hour vs total actual hours worked is what you're really looking for.

[AstulzerRZD]

At 28, I’m privileged and very fortunate to have an ok nest egg saved up in equities (~250k retirement, 250k liquid USD).

I feel like I should still focus on growth because I feel there's a significant gap between my current skills and where high level operators and founders are.
Is it silly to prioritize this rather than work/life balance?

I have a fear of being a career employee, as I worry that eventually, you become a liability.
Is it silly to think that I'd have more stability/optionality by building enough craft and experience to found my own product if I want to?

A successful application to YC in the next couple years is a big goal of mine.

[CivicBlues]

Don't have much to say other than nice humblebrag BrO and I don't think you'll get much good actionable advice here as you're probably making more than 90% of an already high income demographic.

Who among us can say we're making close to CAD $500K on a single income? Jesus christ

But good on you for being in this position so early in your life and I'm sure you'll be fine with whatever you choose.

[Badhobz]

Well you are in tech.. that gravy train has ended since the pandemic. You probably need as many of those certificates as possible to keep you from being redundant (especially since AI is already here).

So yes, focus on growth but god damn you're gonna give up the prime years of your life doing all this schooling.


Who among us can say we're making close to CAD $500K on a single income? Jesus christ
doesn't hehaw give away 50k USD in a single red envelope ?!?

[AstulzerRZD]

Well you are in tech.. that gravy train has ended since the pandemic. You probably need as many of those certificates as possible to keep you from being redundant (especially since AI is already here).

So yes, focus on growth but god damn you're gonna give up the prime years of your life doing all this schooling.

doesn't hehaw give away 50k USD in a single red envelope ?!?

I'm pretty lucky to be an early AI PM with a few AI feature launches under my belt.
All of my inbound's been related to that work.

I think the question is more how I can develop other fundamentals (marketing, growth, etc) to round out my craft, secure my career, and be able to start something of my own

[Badhobz]

id go option 1. big companies are nice because you can hide away if you want to. Just turn into Milton from office space.

Small little startups are always finicky; the smaller the org, the more personalities drive your workplace happiness.

[bcrdukes]

Donate your life savings to BIC_BAWS

[radeonboy]

I'd also go with option 1 - cash is king at your age and I think it's best to milk it as long as you can. Continue growing your nest egg until you find yourself with a startup accelerator opportunity.

You mentioned wanting to grow by rounding out your craft - it's likely the large option 1 company will have the right people to mentor you. If not, you have a world-class talent pool in New York and I'm sure someone in your network can connect you if you want to get a head start on that.

[AstulzerRZD]

Option 1 is along the lines of Bloomberg CTO office/DataDog.
Established companies that have a need for AI strategy / execution.

Option 2 is something like Figma/Notion/Asana/Airtable
Crazy good product craft with senior openings for AI.
AI experience is the leg I'm standing on, passing these interviews is a stretch and the product bar is high.

Option 3 is stuff like Duolingo/Mindbody/Stitchfix/Strava.
I think they're dope.

[AstulzerRZD]

Don't have much to say other than nice humblebrag BrO and I don't think you'll get much good actionable advice here as you're probably making more than 90% of an already high income demographic.

Who among us can say we're making close to CAD $500K on a single income? Jesus christ

But good on you for being in this position so early in your life and I'm sure you'll be fine with whatever you choose.

bro i am actually so lost and unsure of myself here

y'all did such a great job creating space and guiding for BIC BAWS through his thoughts, I'm here cuz that was really dope.

It’s not about the money – it’s that y'all have got way more career experience and have had to make these tough decisions before.

[Traum]

I don't remember what your relationship situation is like, or what your goals might be on that front. But at late 20's / early 30's, it is something you should think about if you haven't already done so. And how big a portion of your time work would take up needs to be taken into consideration as well.

[EvoFire]

I think you need to figure out if you want to keep being hands on or become a manager/director/C suite.

I'm in a similar state and I actually PMed Supa awhile back looking for specific advice. I've actually sought out various ppl in my life for advice on what to do.

Some of the points that have stood out is.

Write down what you are looking for - figure out what attributes are valuable to you in a job, in a company, and ask about these in your interview.

Figure out what you want to do - is it hands on? Is it a technical leadership role? Is it a people leadership role? For my role in tech I have something like 2 and a half branches I can take.
Architect - technical IC, you make the call on how things are supposed to work, probably doesn't apply to you too much as you are in the PM space
Technical Lead - Fully immersed in your technical team, and being a part of day-to-day work while providing guidance
People Manager - Strictly dealing with people and growth, less technical hands on, or even none at all.

For a PM, do you want to be the one that's dictating overall product direction, or do you want to being involved with the details of individual functions? Do you just want to manage all the PMs? It's a question you need to answer and try to take the necessary steps to make your goal.

It sounds like you would be at a crossroad to choose a path soon, if not now.

I pushed it off for a long time as I tried to chase money in a small market in Vancouver. I didn't have a nest egg and I needed the money to make things happen in my life and I didn't care about the job title. The job title bit is biting me in the ass right now as the roles I want, I don't have the titles to even warrant a look, despite having done all the job descriptions and I have no problems doing any of the work.

[bcrdukes]

I'm going to leave this here. Good for you mid-career folk and high achievers.

https://designingyour.life/

[CivicBlues]

What about us mid-career low achievers?
Given how much RS threads are moving on a Friday morning I'm sure there's more than a few of us :troll:

[Hondaracer]

What about us mid-career low achievers?
Given how much RS threads are moving on a Friday morning I'm sure there's more than a few of us :troll:

The less work the better.

[donk.]

The real question, since this is an adventure thread, is why have you not purchased an old JDM car with some of that pocket change. Or even old american/german muscle car. Cobra, gtr, nsx, r8, porsché, whatever

[AstulzerRZD]

Car wise?
I drove for the formula team at uni so have had my fix.
Street car wise, an adventure to a Vegas track day killed R8/981/991 plans for me.
Would have to be a Performante/458.

Location wise?
Live in NYC where garage parking is 800/mo and so is insurance.
Probably more likely to join Manhattan Classic Car Club since it's less than that monthly.

I've got a couple S2k I can borrow in Queens if I really want.
Buddy races AER/86 cup and has a giant driveway full of random stuff ... he lent me the E63 in bio for a full month

[Badhobz]

I was 26 when i bought my gran turismo. i don't know how you can NOT buy a car at that age with that income. that's prime time to wanna buy insane cars for massive flexing and endless parade of skanks.

Now look at me... I'm geezerfied and drive hitlerboxes and corollas around.

you wanna be me!? hUH !?!? DO YOU!?!??! you want like fucking 3 strands of homer simpsons hair left and a belly full of fat/regret? HUH!?!?!

GO LIVE YOUR LIFE YOU YOUNG BUCK. go buy shit, go bang shit, go fuck up, and do it all over again until you've had your fill.

here's some career advice. which one of those out of 3 is the easiest job that you can fuck off and go snort coke off a hookers ass while you pretend to do work? that's the one you should choose.

[AstulzerRZD]

on spending, I think already do too much of it
rent is a fat 2.7k
went to brazil, peru, italy, and france this year
tried the whole equinox, rimowa, whatever BS
had my nightclub era before I collected enough besties so we got tables for free

on the car...
blew my mind - i pulled more in Europe with my shitty 63hp Fiat 500 hybrid rental in 3 days
than with s2k in 2 years

[Badhobz]

it'll amaze you how fast it goes. i remember it clearly.... one day I was your age and BLINK, here I am middle aged.

Trust me, try not to waste it chasing the career ladder. Have enough money that you can fuel your lifestyle and that's all you need man. Anything more wont really bring you exponential happiness.

Ive been through your shit. I've been a very poor man, I've been a rich man and I choose NOTHING.

Fuck both. just be yourself. I got money now... i still dont give a fuck, Kirkland 4 life baby. If I die tomorrow I have 0 regrets.

[AstulzerRZD]

feels like i'm always torn between having enough stability & living enough of my life before 35

[supafamous]

At 28, I’m privileged and very fortunate to have an ok nest egg saved up in equities (~250k retirement, 250k liquid USD).

Good for you man! It's crazy to think about late 20/early 30s tech workers who make crazy money. A guy I mentor from time to time is a 31 year old Eng Manager in Cupertino and he tells me he cleared $500k USD last year and will probably clear $600k USD this year. I know some Vancouver folks who work for SF located tech who clear $400k CAD that aren't even in management and who just passed 30y.o. You guys can be retired by 40.

I feel like I should still focus on growth because I feel there's a significant gap between my current skills and where high level operators and founders are.

Is it silly to prioritize this rather than work/life balance?

I have a fear of being a career employee, as I worry that eventually, you become a liability.
Is it silly to think that I'd have more stability/optionality by building enough craft and experience to found my own product if I want to?

A successful application to YC in the next couple years is a big goal of mine.

I think it'd be worthwhile to do a bit of a working backwards exercise for your life and career instead of looking at what's next. Pick a goal or point in time that's in the future - typically 5-10 years out and then work backwards from that in terms of what skills and knowledge you need to acquire to make that goal happen. Figure out what you'd need to do to get that skill or knowledge (and also have someone validate that list) then figure out the order in which you want to acquire them (including making a list of companies or people who can get you those skills/knowledge) and start checking off that list one by one.

Since we're in the same line of work I'm happy to chat offline if you like - my simple background: I've hired 38 PMs in my career and 17 of them have gotten into management, 12 of those at the Director/VP/C-suite level. A few have started their own companies as well.

[Badhobz]

probably cuz we chinese. its built into our DNA and socially reinforced.

[noclue]

Dont get tunnelvision by his compensation, his cost of living is a lot higher than vancouver. Plus he pays federal/state/NYC income tax.

If you wanna join YC you gotta move to norcal for opportunities no?

[AstulzerRZD]

If you wanna join YC you gotta move to norcal for opportunities no?

Yes, I'm open to spending a year+ in NorCal to see where that adventure takes me.

Dont get tunnelvision by his compensation, his cost of living is a lot higher than vancouver. Plus he pays federal/state/NYC income tax.


On comp, yep - expenses are high and most of my savings are from US equivalent of 401k matching and stock comp.
200-250k is middle class in NYC, 400k is when I think u start getting relaxed.

Y'all have lifestyle and ease of living so freaking good in Vancouver.
When I moved to Seattle, I was making 2X the Vancouver income but my quality of living was definitely worse.

[CivicBlues]

Oh boohoo, all I picture is:
https://media1.tenor.com/m/80zMDyE85hAAAAAC/money-crying.gif

If you only spent 150k on fixed expenses of your 250k salary you'd still be ahead of 90% of all Canadians.

[Hondaracer]

on spending, I think already do too much of it
rent is a fat 2.7k
went to brazil, peru, italy, and france this year
tried the whole equinox, rimowa, whatever BS
had my nightclub era before I collected enough besties so we got tables for free

on the car...
blew my mind - i pulled more in Europe with my shitty 63hp Fiat 500 hybrid rental in 3 days
than with s2k in 2 years

If your rent is 2.7k in New York where do the rest of the expenses come from? lol that’s a basement suite in east van.

[supafamous]

Oh boohoo, all I picture is:
https://media1.tenor.com/m/80zMDyE85hAAAAAC/money-crying.gif

Working in tech is like living in an alternate universe. You can become so entitled to things like you'll get upset because they got rid of the jalapeño cheddar bagels on bagel day and feel you have to ask the CEO about it at all hands (this really happened) or you get out the pitchforks when they swap out the free Coke products with Pepsi products (that was justified IMO, my body is a temple and I'm not putting Pepsi products in it).

I think at one point I noted that out of my 14 year career in tech that I had gotten free pop for 11 of those. What do you mean you have to PAY for pop? I worked at a place with 3 kinds of bourbon on top of all the other hard liquors (I was even told that if I had a whiskey I wanted that they'd get it in for me) - there were days I was drinking bourbon in the MORNING at work.

Things have toned done in the last few years b/c of all the layoffs (like we've cancelled DEI and LGBTQ+ entirely!) but I'm not sure which previous era was more nuts in my career - the 2003-2007 era before the financial crisis or the time just before COVID.

[noclue]

my uneducated not-in-industry vote is option 2.
It has the opportunities in-house for you to grow + it'll get you into the SF bay area and you can network or discover other opportunities.
Plus east coast north america sucks especially if you like cars and you cant beat norcal.

Are you able to pivot into PE? then maybe stick around NYC.

[lowside67]

Dont get tunnelvision by his compensation, his cost of living is a lot higher than vancouver. Plus he pays federal/state/NYC income tax.

If you wanna join YC you gotta move to norcal for opportunities no?
$300k of income in NY = $196k after taxes, marginal tax rate of 44.2% for the next dollar earned.

$300k of income in BC = $178k after taxes, marginal tax rate of 53.5% for the next dollar earned.

And I do not for a moment believe the cost of living is meaningfully higher in NYC over Vancouver.

-Mark

[CivicBlues]

It's not, but there is 1-3 higher tiers of shit you can blow your money on in NYC that you can't in even find Vancouver.

That's entirely what it is...lifestyle creep.

[Badhobz]

like what? name them!!!!

[noclue]

It's not, but there is 1-3 higher tiers of shit you can blow your money on in NYC that you can't in even find Vancouver.

That's entirely what it is...lifestyle creep.

Judging from his savings and cheaper rent it looks like he's a saver and didnt indulge too much into the nyc lifestyle.

[CivicBlues]

like what? name them!!!!

Heroin encrusted medium rare sliders?

Who knows?! I'm not in that tax bracket.

AstulzerRZD chime in here!!!

[Badhobz]

Psshhh you can get that here….

My cousins in NYC. He’s broke as shit for being an accountant and he pulls probably 300k usd if not more. He lives in this 100 year old trash loft, has an E bike to commute with and takes the subway for the rest of the time. He doesn’t even have a car cuz he’s a hipster.

[68style]

Interested to know what hipster douche NYC Hobz looks like

[CivicBlues]

Well no one drives in NYC because it's a pain in the ass. They just implemented congestion pricing making it even more a of a pain in the ass to own a car.

I'm sure if he just moved his ass over to some ex-urbs in Long Island or Jersey he'd be living an upper middle class lifestyle but he chooses to live in the city like that.

[Tapioca]

I've seen some stuff over the years and made mistakes.

You're obviously well-accomplished for your age and make good money. You have all of these material things and experiences, but you still come off as an NPC. Life isn't a video game where you make progress in a linear way.

Perhaps it's time to work on your people skills and your personal brand. At the end of the day, ask yourself "Who are you?" and "What do I want?". The people who have a combination of likeability and the ability to earn the respect of others go further in life and are less likely to be seen as just a number. Your likeability and ability to earn the respect of others come from within.

[RabidRat]

I can only speak generally to this unlike Supa and Evo, given my background is in hardware engineering (electrical design, architect IC).

I would extend Supa's work backwards exercise to the end of your life: when you're old and dying, when you look back at what you did, is this something you're going to be proud of committing the prime of your life to? For me, when I walk into a store and my product's on display, that I can point to it and say "I made that". For me that is a yes and makes it all worth it.

I also agree with Supa that at this level of compensation, 50k is negligible. I wouldn't let that sway your decision at all. Not just in a relativistic sense, but also that this figure will pale in comparison to the RSU refreshers and bonuses as you go - provided you've pivoted into an environment where you can really contribute vs expectation of the role. And I think you will, when you work somewhere that you feel especially challenged and energized. Somewhere that you are motivated and able to maximize learning, and immediately take those learnings and leverage for maximized value to the business. And obviously in the long run, your TC will only grow as you continue to deliver outsized value. Exponentially, year over year. You are paid what you are worth, and your worth scales with the opportunity you have to be exceptional in what/how you deliver.

Also agree that if what you're doing is meaningful to you and gives you a huge sense of purpose, maybe work/life balance doesn't have to be a major concern yet. Maybe just have a reasonable exit strategy for tying it all off in terms of your mentality. I.e. when it comes time that you want to settle down (mid 30s?), can you walk away from being all-in, and still be happy with yourself. I mean just personally, now that I'm in the 2nd half of my 30s there's no way I could keep going like that. And - not that you'd necessarily choose to have kids - kids have taken a huge toll on my energy and patience that I used to be able to put towards my work. It isn't even about having less time necessarily.

Sorry this wasn't super coherent: the newborn is not letting me sleep much these days :).

[bcrdukes]

What about us mid-career low achievers?
Given how much RS threads are moving on a Friday morning I'm sure there's more than a few of us :troll:

I know your post was meant as a joke, but there may also be a different angle to look at this. I had to think about how to reply.

I think it's hard to throw a blanket over the majority of active posters on RS and label them as low achievers. We must have done something to get to where we are. I think it's fair to say we've all done something we're proud of, or be able to enjoy, such as traveling, or dining out at nice restaurants, while others can only wish to do that.

Hondaracer mentioned his broke ass buddy who makes $65K a year. My counter argument to that is, "So what?" Yes, he may be broke. Yes, he may never own a home, but what if he is happy and content with where he is, and the direction he's going? I don't have a crystal ball or have access to an oracle to predict his friend's future, so we'll leave it to our own imaginations.

The link I shared is worth considering for anyone who has wondered about what to do next, low-achiever or not. :D I don't mean to steal AstulzerRZD's thunder, but I'm mid-career and trying to figure out what the next chapter in my life is. I made a decision in my early 30s to move to Toronto from Vancouver and when I reflect on it, it was a good decision. Had I stayed in Vancouver, I think I would have likely been Hondaracer's broke buddy.

If any of you guys are interested in the book from the link I shared, I can umm...let you borrow a copy (if you know what I mean.) It's an easy read and has been very insightful and relatable. Feel free to PM me. :inout:

[red kryptonite]

tldr the whole thing, but my vote goes to option 1. ride the money train until it runs out or at least for a couple years.

[westopher]

When it comes to that kind of money, pretty much all of those positions give you an exceptional lifestyle. Pick the one that gives you time to enjoy it. If none of them do, pick the highest paying one and hope you live long enough to retire early and enjoy it all.
My brother in law makes 3x what I make, but I do 3x as much fun shit as he does. We are both happy and have tons of respect for each others choices.
He's gonna be loving life at 50, I'm still gonna be working.
Right now I snowboard more in a good week than he does in a season.
It's kinda one of those things where you just gotta decide, and if you don't like it, change it.

[CivicBlues]

I know your post was meant as a joke, but there may also be a different angle to look at this. I had to think about how to reply.

I think it's hard to throw a blanket over the majority of active posters on RS and label them as low achievers. We must have done something to get to where we are. I think it's fair to say we've all done something we're proud of, or be able to enjoy, such as traveling, or dining out at nice restaurants, while others can only wish to do that.

Hondaracer mentioned his broke ass buddy who makes $65K a year. My counter argument to that is, "So what?" Yes, he may be broke. Yes, he may never own a home, but what if he is happy and content with where he is, and the direction he's going? I don't have a crystal ball or have access to an oracle to predict his friend's future, so we'll leave it to our own imaginations.

The link I shared is worth considering for anyone who has wondered about what to do next, low-achiever or not. :D I don't mean to steal AstulzerRZD's thunder, but I'm mid-career and trying to figure out what the next chapter in my life is. I made a decision in my early 30s to move to Toronto from Vancouver and when I reflect on it, it was a good decision. Had I stayed in Vancouver, I think I would have likely been Hondaracer's broke buddy.

If any of you guys are interested in the book from the link I shared, I can umm...let you borrow a copy (if you know what I mean.) It's an easy read and has been very insightful and relatable. Feel free to PM me. :inout:

You know what man? I was being a cynical jerk with that post (actually I've been a cynical jerk for as long as I can remember). I went back and looked at that link and didn't realize it was a book (I assumed it was some self-help guru hawking some courses). I'm going to go to my local VPL and check it out. I've been resolving to read more actual books this year and having just finished Atomic Habits I think I'll give this one a chance too.

Thanks dude. And If I haven't said this before good on you for going back to school to get your MBA, takes some real guts to make a change in your life at our age.

[underscore]

My counter argument to that is, "So what?" Yes, he may be broke. Yes, he may never own a home, but what if he is happy and content with where he is, and the direction he's going? I don't have a crystal ball or have access to an oracle to predict his friend's future, so we'll leave it to our own imaginations.

There's also something to be said about knowing the limitations of your own skills and avoiding the stress of being promoted to a level of incompetence.

[Badhobz]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xtxscxi83XA

This is pretty neat

[68style]

One thing I think isn't being addressed here and I'm unsure if I don't understand the weight of it or the situation itself didn't have enough details or whatever... but do you really just completely throw the towel in and say fuck you I'm going somewhere else because of one promotion being passed over?

Maybe I'm in an older generation thinking wise but like... if that happened to me, okay, I'd be miffed but as long as the process was run fairly and I can see the rationale, I just try harder next time or expand my knowledge base or maybe it's a "show me" moment... can't expect to always get handed upgrades?

Jobs at places the size of MS are pretty coveted in the industry and they pay you a lot of $$$ with what seems like quite a bit of free time to go on vacays.

[Hehe]

Everyone's life trajectory is different and my path might not fit yours.

But if I were to be back to late 20s/Early 30th, I'd take a bit of extra risk and try to make it big.

Looking back, I think if I took a bit more risk, even though success was not guaranteed, I had the opportunity to be in the next income bracket... heck, probably a few next brackets.

I kinda did that back in the day. I quit my well-paid but tiring sales job and did my own startup. After we got bought out, I made some money, but when people came to me asking for starting more businesses, I just decided to use that money and live a simple life.

I don't think I regret that decision. It was ok. But I think if I were back to that age again, I'd probably did a few more startups as I had a lot more experience running at the time. I knew well how to raise funds. Just coming off an ok successful startup meaning I had all the credits I needed. And I was in that zone where I was hungry and eager when it came to business.

So, if you are in the late 20s/early 30s with little financial burden on yourself, I'd take the path that maximize the payout while taking the most risk. Looking at your options, they all seem roughly the same industry or whatever you specialize in. Thus, even if the risky option goes sour, it wouldn't really leave a mark on your resume or anything like that.

Alternatively, if job or career development is in your mind, think if going into pro C-suite is something you have in mind... if so, maybe getting into an EMBA program or sort isn't a bad option. Many large (especially publicly traded companies) kinda have this prerequisite of MBA even though it's unspoken. But unless you are like founder from a highly technical startup, in order to get into professional management role, you need to have the credentials. Thus, getting a job in a place where it allows you time to do the MBA in, ideally a highly reputable institution, a nearby place isn't a bad option either.

[RabidRat]

One thing I think isn't being addressed here and I'm unsure if I don't understand the weight of it or the situation itself didn't have enough details or whatever... but do you really just completely throw the towel in and say fuck you I'm going somewhere else because of one promotion being passed over?

Maybe I'm in an older generation thinking wise but like... if that happened to me, okay, I'd be miffed but as long as the process was run fairly and I can see the rationale, I just try harder next time or expand my knowledge base or maybe it's a "show me" moment... can't expect to always get handed upgrades.

I think you're touching on something I meant to ask as well: what was the reason Astulzer's promotion was denied? I think that matters, although maybe not to answer his specific questions.

Budget or political reasons? Yeah definitely don't stay. There's just nothing you can do about that and it's out of your hands. Insufficient alignment of what you bring to the table, with what is needed in this org? Maybe it's time to move, maybe not: is what they're looking for something you can bring yourself to develop from where you are (this was my case and it hugely worked out: my manager and I continue to joke that I "sold my soul")? Plain "you're not ready yet"? If nothing was concrete about next-steps from them to get there, then maybe ya time to go as well.

[Badhobz]

He hasn’t replied ! That’s a good sign.

Maybe he went to the nearest beetle hut and bought a stupid over priced beetle. Hopefully porked the sales lady in the process. At least you get an interesting story for such a dull looking car. Ha !

[yray]

nah, he's in new York

https://youtu.be/9d_22U8OW2I?si=_Mdr3Xq1rJ0B4Hd3

[AstulzerRZD]

Sorry for late reply, been doing a bit of pondering and interview prep.
We're back to taking on a second job's worth of learning/work on top of day job/school.

On the Promotion
TL;DR: The org’s dynamics have shifted, and I feel it’s easier to grow, get promoted, and gain new perspectives by switching teams or employers.

- Changing Requirements: A new manager (3 levels up) raised the bar for promotions, focusing on broader team impact. My specialized role didn’t align with these new expectations.
- Reorg Challenges: Two years at my level, but multiple reorgs made it tough to create meaningful impact.
- Support: My manager and theirs advocated for my promotion, but it didn’t get enough higher-level backing.
- Feedback: I got clear, actionable feedback to improve.
- Team Dynamics: We’ve grown from a small, agile team to a massive, matrixed org of 400–600. The shift demands more buy-in and communication—areas I need to improve.

On aspirations
TLDR need to learn more.

- Role: I'd like to keep an AI related role to make a good case for a green card through the EB2 NIW program
- Team: I feel time is the one thing I can't get back and I feel behind in learning/skillset needed for successful YC application/found my own startup
- Startup Skills: Marketing, ads, raising funding
- Enterprise Skills: Communicating across a matrixed org and driving projects and findings to become the organization's zeitgeist and iterating deeply on my projects to drive even more impact

On progress
TLDR first steps done, interview is getting real, need to network.
Goal: Apply
- Redid my resume and passed phone screen with Bloomberg for an AI PM role.
- Done several mock interviews to make answers more concise and relatable.

Goal: Network
- Working on a portfolio deck/website with the designer on my team to explain the depth/challenge associated with my work
- Working on a series of Tweets to explain how we built a new AI feature

On Mentorship:
TLDR how do I go about this?

I miss having mentors like I had in school and want to improve here.
I feel mentors appreciate mentees who:
1. Show they’ve put in effort and taken first steps.
2. Present problems/deliverables in a clear, digestible way without being overwhelming.

Curious how others structure this relationship—open to tips!
Shoutout to RabitRat & Supafamous—you’ve made my week. Thanks for helping me feel cared for!

Y'all are fucking awesome,
-A

[AstulzerRZD]

It's not, but there is 1-3 higher tiers of shit you can blow your money on in NYC that you can't in even find Vancouver.

That's entirely what it is...lifestyle creep.

Man, this hits hard.

For me, I'm finding consistency and balancing the drive to do things with a curious mindset is a lot more difficult that the money part. When I’m chasing things out of fear or scarcity, it feels fake—like politician vibes.

I don’t make enough to afford this stuff outright, so I’ve found some back doors:

- Alps trip: $150 for accommodations because a buddy’s friend had a condo in Méribel. Flew standby thanks to a pilot friend I met at a bar. He looked a lil lonely that night so introduced myself and we had a great night bar hopping.

- Nightclubs: Used to pay $300 cover, but now I rally a few besties, take fun pics, and send them to promoters—free entry and sometimes a table. Met some DJs playing open decks too.

- Sports/golf: No hack yet. Coaching and lessons are crazy expensive. I need new golf buddies now that my PE friend moved to Miami.

- Dinners: Can’t avoid the cost, but standing reservations at good spots work as social currency—great for group dinners.

- Equinox Pool: I found 12 friends with AMEX Plats - bought their $300 equinox credit for $50-70 each.

- Hamptons summer: Still figuring this one out.

- Art galas/openings: Same—tickets are pricey, and I haven’t cracked it yet.

It's a big city and it feels a lot safer with company that you can trust. At the end of the day, we all want good vibes and company.

[EvoFire]

All that shit is out of my league. I gave my 2 cents on the first page but I really don't think I can help you much. Good luck with everything.

My world view is just smaller I guess. I'm happy in this "shithole" called Vancouver (re: Honda) and I got two kids. My life as you guys see it is kind of it. Maybe the most exciting thing for me would be to buy a Beetle.

EDIT: If anything.... I might need to come to you for referrals :nyan:

[Badhobz]

Your beetles a piece of shit !!!!

[68style]

Maybe it's because I'm old, but it makes me really tired to even think about every single thing I do coming from an outsourced hookup from a relationship I have to maintain... or strategically thinking about who I need to befriend based on what they might be able to offer me? I don't know which one comes first in these situations above tbh.

I do think one thing you need to consider for the future is a point probably coming very, very soon where you can't just expect 12 people to show up for dinner on a whim or 6 guys to go to Europe because it's cool... as soon as your friends start getting married or having families it's game over for random "bro let's go get dressed you got 5 minutes meet me out front" moments. All these transactional relationships won't be very useful or fulfilling at that point. It's also not conducive to having a meaningful relationship of your own.

[RabidRat]

^ to be fair, I don't think he isn't aware of that. His messaging seems pretty specifically "I've got until I'm 35 to live my life to the absolute most. And here's how I'm making it work in NYC on a limited budget."

"bro let's go get dressed you got 5 minutes meet me out front"

I miss those days. FeelsBadMan

Still sad I missed out on Hobz's impromptu Saturday breakfast cruise to Isetta. Geriatric Motoring Club is all I have to look forward to :lol

[AstulzerRZD]

Maybe it's because I'm old, but it makes me really tired to even think about every single thing I do coming from an outsourced hookup from a relationship I have to maintain... or strategically thinking about who I need to befriend based on what they might be able to offer me? I don't know which one comes first in these situations above tbh.

I do think one thing you need to consider for the future is a point probably coming very, very soon where you can't just expect 12 people to show up for dinner on a whim or 6 guys to go to Europe because it's cool... as soon as your friends start getting married or having families it's game over for random "bro let's go get dressed you got 5 minutes meet me out front" moments. All these transactional relationships won't be very useful or fulfilling at that point. It's also not conducive to having a meaningful relationship of your own.

I definitely felt this way in year 1 - shit I have nothing here how do I have things.
I can still put on the politician hat and introduce myself well in 3 minutes / suss someone out at a network event but it all feels kind of contrived.
It's a lot of pressure and stress that scares me after some time.

I feel like in year 3 I feel like it's more - how do I be real, be someone people feel comfortable and excited around, and create the kinds of meaningful bonds that we measure in decades.
Like it said earlier, I want it to come from a place of giving, consistency, and curiosity than a place of fear/need.
I feel rich because of the people I can talk to about my bad days and what scares me about my dreams.

[RabidRat]

All that shit is out of my league. I gave my 2 cents on the first page but I really don't think I can help you much. Good luck with everything.

My world view is just smaller I guess. I'm happy in this "shithole" called Vancouver (re: Honda) and I got two kids. My life as you guys see it is kind of it. Maybe the most exciting thing for me would be to buy a Beetle.

Just as a side comment: of course that's by choice. If you removed the constraint to be in Vancouver, you could experience a lot more (i.e. Astulzer's wild post re NYC) and have a lot more (e.g. 68style and his mind-blowing garage space none of us could even dream of, and apparently has even a god damn lift). But you choose to be in Vancouver because it's where you want to be.

On the other hand, the opposite isn't true. Tons of people want to move to and live in Vancouver but they can't find a way to make that work. I left in the first place because I couldn't get a job, at least not doing what I went to school for. Just saying :p.

[bcrdukes]

Geriatric Motoring Club is all I have to look forward to :lol

Wow, talk about a whole new meaning to GMC. :pokerface:

[bcrdukes]

Maybe it's because I'm old, but it makes me really tired to even think about every single thing I do coming from an outsourced hookup from a relationship I have to maintain... or strategically thinking about who I need to befriend based on what they might be able to offer me? I don't know which one comes first in these situations above tbh.

I do think one thing you need to consider for the future is a point probably coming very, very soon where you can't just expect 12 people to show up for dinner on a whim or 6 guys to go to Europe because it's cool... as soon as your friends start getting married or having families it's game over for random "bro let's go get dressed you got 5 minutes meet me out front" moments. All these transactional relationships won't be very useful or fulfilling at that point. It's also not conducive to having a meaningful relationship of your own.
Randomly bumping into you and BlackRCode in Venice was one of the most memorable moments ever. :alone:

[bcrdukes]

Just as a side comment: of course that's by choice. If you removed the constraint to be in Vancouver, you could experience a lot more (i.e. Astulzer's wild post re NYC) and have a lot more (e.g. 68style and his mind-blowing garage space none of us could even dream of, and apparently has even a god damn lift). But you choose to be in Vancouver because it's where you want to be.

On the other hand, the opposite isn't true. Tons of people want to move to and live in Vancouver but they can't find a way to make that work. I left in the first place because I couldn't get a job, at least not doing what I went to school for. Just saying :p.

I agree with this wholeheartedly.

A lot of these barriers are gravity problems or simply a matter of choice. We choose the lifestyle we want but it also comes with its own set of baggage.

Like RabidRat, I could not get a job doing what I wanted in Vancouver, so off I went to the centre of the universe.

I've met a lot of really good friends here on this forum and despite the fact that we've moved away or grown up or however you put it, we always make time to meet up in the most weirdest, and random places. Including random parking lots in the middle of the week.

[Badhobz]

Still sad I missed out on Hobz's impromptu Saturday breakfast cruise to Isetta. Geriatric Motoring Club is all I have to look forward to :lol

Geriatric Motoring Club is trademarked by me !!!

Somebody design me some stickers. I want this on ratrolla’s quarter window

Ideally with some really geriatric font too like…. Comic sans or papyrus or new times roman

[Gerbs]

feels like i'm always torn between having enough stability & living enough of my life before 35

I chose work/life balance instead of making more money. My income is probably on the lower end compared to my social circle. From 16-26, I maximized savings rate to create a nest egg so that when I figure out what I wanna do, I'll have the means to do it. Just turned 29, I have a fear of being underlived given that I have such a good start economically, socially, and opportunity to live a great life. I haven't figured out what "great" life for myself is yet.


The advice to Vancouver "high" earners $140-300K TC is to identify the lifestyle you want, build it out, then work backwards to the compensation you need to build that lifestyle + retirement goal.

After that, you're better off buying time instead of earning more.

[Gerbs]

I just got access to this stuff, sounds like you can afford all of this stuff, but it's maybe 2x the price in NY/VHCOL



- Alps trip: - $2.5K/year - 10/10 1-2 ski trips, 1-3 whistler passes, local passes, this is so fun hot tub and beers with the BOYZ

- Nightclubs + Bars + drinking + dating: - $2k/year - 2/10 Awful money to fun ratio, I only go if a friend is having a birthday, which is really rare at late 20's. Maybe it's fun to try to pull some mid-party girls, but I'm also going to Ultra Miami, which says a lot

- Sports/golf: - $3.5K/year -12/10 Best hobby of all time, replaced competitive gaming, met 10-15 good friends, and 30+ acquaintances that i rotate for tee times. I do 2 golf trips a year over 3-4 nights, play about 30-40 course a year, 1x a week range, 20-30 sim golf sessions, such a good time to connect with the boyz or build business connections.

- Dinners and eating out and dating: 5/10 - $4-5K/year - , strictly for keeping dating entertaining for myself, marginal utility caps after $70-120/meal

- Equinox Pool: Nice gyms are worth it meet people and baddies, extra perks if it's dead

- Hamptons summer: - $200-400/trip for 3-4 nights - 12/10, we do a domestic retreat trip at houses with 30-50 people accommodation every year, these trips are really good for creating memories, having deep talks and shrooms. We're going here 2 years in a row

https://604now.com/park-place-airbnb-chilliwack-bc/

- Art galas/openings: - Free flights + accomodation - 10/10, One of my favourite memories of NYC was going art gala hopping, collecting free wine with a attractive gorl, felt like I was in a movie.

[westopher]

How do you go to the hamptons for 200-400?! That's barely enough to cover the mushrooms!

[BIC_BAWS]

I think Gerbs is giving his cost-breakdown for a Vancouver equivalent lifestyle, high earning, almost 30.

[Gerbs]

How do you go to the hamptons for 200-400?! That's barely enough to cover the mushrooms!

Our local hamptons is like
- islands
- Kelowna
- Everett
- interior B.C.

Island is pretty sweet since a few friends live there and have empty homes.

Mushrooms are dummy cheap nowadays too $20-50?

[CivicBlues]

Everett??

Who TF goes to Everett?

[westopher]

4 day trip you need like an oz so even at cheap that's $100

[Gerbs]

Everett??

Who TF goes to Everett?

It's pretty lit, get a house that fits 20-30 people by warm beach! Anything along the coast before Seattle works.

Sunset paddleboarding.

4 day trip you need like an oz so even at cheap that's $100

I don't think shrooms work back to back but you can also pound a 60 pack of coronas in 4 days too lol

[Badhobz]

At my age none of that shit above sounds appealing.

Things I like

Take my convertible for a long drive somewhere SOLO

Eat at a nice quiet restaurant somewhere

Yell at kids both online and in person

Fight old ladies at t&t for discounted 1 claw crabs. That’s my crab you bitch !!!!!

Say as much racist / sexist shit and see if you can get away with it

Costco shopping and fighting people in the parking lot


I just noticed you don’t need basically any money to enjoy the shit above. So there you go kids, you can grind your ass off but if you become an old fart like me, you can save a lot by just toning down your expectations and lifestyle.

Oh somewhere up there is meeting up with friends to do something social but frankly it’s not that high on my list anymore.

[bcrdukes]

RIP Geriatric Motoring Club

The Club that achieves its objectives by not meeting.

[Badhobz]

YOU DIDNT CHANGE YOUR SIGNATURE TO COMIC SANS YOU NON CLOWN!!!!!!

HOW DARE YOU NOT have a geriatric FONT for our MOTORING CRUB!

I got T-shirts and a Club sign made already

https://i.postimg.cc/y896Pg2H/Whats-App-Image-2025-01-26-at-09-16-15.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

https://i.postimg.cc/15b5wcCB/Whats-App-Image-2025-01-26-at-09-16-25.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

[bcrdukes]

can i lern to comic zans plz?

[RabidRat]

https://i.postimg.cc/y896Pg2H/Whats-App-Image-2025-01-26-at-09-16-15.jpg

At first squint on my phone, I thought that was a hooked dick coming out of a pair of nuts. I had to kind of hold it away, and down at an angle to see. Jeebus what's happening to me.

[Badhobz]

It’s a one handed walker with those 4 stability legs. Usually geezers put tennis balls on those legs so they don’t squeak or something

[EvoFire]

At first squint on my phone, I thought that was a hooked dick coming out of a pair of nuts. I had to kind of hold it away, and down at an angle to see. Jeebus what's happening to me.

That's a sign of getting old, where you need to pull things farther to see it.

[Razor Ramon HG]

It’s a one handed walker with those 4 stability legs. Usually geezers put tennis balls on those legs so they don’t squeak or something

Lol, that's exactly what we did for my grandma

:lawl:

[donk.]

I just got access to this stuff, sounds like you can afford all of this stuff, but it's maybe 2x the price in NY/VHCOL



- Alps trip: - $2.5K/year - 10/10 1-2 ski trips, 1-3 whistler passes, local passes, this is so fun hot tub and beers with the BOYZ

- Nightclubs + Bars + drinking + dating: - $2k/year - 2/10 Awful money to fun ratio, I only go if a friend is having a birthday, which is really rare at late 20's. Maybe it's fun to try to pull some mid-party girls, but I'm also going to Ultra Miami, which says a lot

- Sports/golf: - $3.5K/year -12/10 Best hobby of all time, replaced competitive gaming, met 10-15 good friends, and 30+ acquaintances that i rotate for tee times. I do 2 golf trips a year over 3-4 nights, play about 30-40 course a year, 1x a week range, 20-30 sim golf sessions, such a good time to connect with the boyz or build business connections.

- Dinners and eating out and dating: 5/10 - $4-5K/year - , strictly for keeping dating entertaining for myself, marginal utility caps after $70-120/meal

- Equinox Pool: Nice gyms are worth it meet people and baddies, extra perks if it's dead

- Hamptons summer: - $200-400/trip for 3-4 nights - 12/10, we do a domestic retreat trip at houses with 30-50 people accommodation every year, these trips are really good for creating memories, having deep talks and shrooms. We're going here 2 years in a row

https://604now.com/park-place-airbnb-chilliwack-bc/

- Art galas/openings: - Free flights + accomodation - 10/10, One of my favourite memories of NYC was going art gala hopping, collecting free wine with a attractive gorl, felt like I was in a movie.



Whats it like having friends that actually want to do said above items

:okay:

[GS8]

RIP Geriatric Motoring Club

The Club that achieves its objectives by not meeting.

Now that the hostess with the mostest has entered chat, our first meet will be pretty simple:

First we go to local rave and serve the way less fortunate:

https://i.imgur.com/bEXipmx.jpeg

And then off to the park for exercise:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=37k-hWbtckc

[jing]

This is probably more accurate

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=eSjncK7KKbY

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=cSZ2AKvF2Kk

[68style]

Oh somewhere up there is meeting up with friends to do something social but frankly it’s not that high on my list anymore.

Words hurt :alone:

[Mikoyan]

It’s a one handed walker with those 4 stability legs. Usually geezers put tennis balls on those legs so they don’t squeak or something

GMC: Four on the floor.

[Badhobz]

Words hurt :alone:

i have to pretend to say that, because all you fuckers left vancouver.... sniff sniff.. im not crying, youre crying. :okay:


GMC: Four on the floor.

Thats epic !

[Gerbs]

At my age none of that shit above sounds appealing.


I think that's where me and AstulzerRZD's worries lie.

We wanna maximize life and enjoyment in the right pockets of time before our body is no longer able to do these activities or outgrow them and they're no longer enjoyable.

Y'all seniors be sending pictures of ABG's / Gym thotties, we're at the age where we are pulling them for the future spankbank





Whats it like having friends that actually want to do said above items

:okay:

Idk, me 3-4 years ago would've never dreamed of having all this social access to do all these fun things. I seem to be lucky in running into good people the last few years.

Yesterday, I subbed for a sports team, met a Honda fan and we ended up running some loud and gay street pulls in the Honda. Reminded me of being 21 again :lawl:
Ended up getting re-invited to be a permanent member for their team haha.

[CivicBlues]

Whats with you GenZs obsessed with Min-maxing every aspect of your life? Life isn't a game it's not about racking up stats and XP points on spreadsheets. Just do what you enjoy, spend time with those who you like/love and fuck the rest. Lemme tell you this, life doesn't end at 40 - you choose the life you live. Maybe trying to "front-load" everything into your 20s will burn you out but I still enjoy going out and having fun times at my age. Sounds to me you're the ones wasting your life chasing some nebulous FOMO.

[bcrdukes]

I think that's where me and AstulzerRZD's worries lie.

We wanna maximize life and enjoyment in the right pockets of time before our body is no longer able to do these activities or outgrow them and they're no longer enjoyable.

I am curious if there is a list or matrix that exists somewhere that defines the criteria you guys speak to, and what the consequences are if you don't meet them by age "X."

You both have a lifetime ahead of you and there are no hard rules to come back to enjoy these things. Guys like Badhobz are complaining and discouraging because they're old and grumpy, and also richer than most of us. This is waht happens when you've done everything in a short amount of time. Everything becomes boring. Take what he says with a grain of salt.

[bcrdukes]

Oh and yeah, fuck you Gen Zers bunch of losers.

[AstulzerRZD]

life is all about trying, no?

There are so many things I thought weren’t for me until I gave them a shot. Hip-hop dance—who would’ve guessed? Went from fearing the club to being in the middle of the dance circle.

And my car? At first, I thought I'd be a slick back 6MT E46 6MT owner. But trying a convertible... I've got my road bike on the back, top down in the snow, introducing drop top experience to my friends.

But not everything lives up to the dream. Europe, for example—it’s romanticized, love recharging there, but living there? Eh, pas pour moi.

Still, some things take work. A dream road trip, building the perfect ride—they start to need planning in late 20s.

But that’s the beauty, no? The effort makes it worth it. Life is about trying, feeling, and finding what you really care about

[AstulzerRZD]

Oh and yeah, fuck you Gen Zers bunch of losers.

it's the way we're cuspers, not even gen Z :pokerface:

[CivicBlues]

Badhobz definitely doesn't speak for the rest of us in his age cohort. Sorry buddy -much love but my body still works fine at 42. It might not be able to take punishment as much as I did in my 20s but I can probably still run a 5k out of bed, go on long hikes, play sports, etc.

If anything my mind is aging more I'm just sick seeing the shit happening with society over and over again so I'll gladly pay money to avoid such discomforts.

[AstulzerRZD]

I am curious if there is a list or matrix that exists somewhere that defines the criteria you guys speak to, and what the consequences are if you don't meet them by age "X."

You both have a lifetime ahead of you and there are no hard rules to come back to enjoy these things. Guys like Badhobz are complaining and discouraging because they're old and grumpy, and also richer than most of us. This is waht happens when you've done everything in a short amount of time. Everything becomes boring. Take what he says with a grain of salt.

What hehe said was so real - I fear the window is closing.

It almost feels the the time to be chaotic and hoe around Europe is coming to a close
& people starting to care at what you already done/have a bit more.

Almost feels like now or never to take big risk with career/socially to set trajectory
Next thing I know I'll be 35 at a concert with my wife and sold my Ferrari engine for a Yamaha

[underscore]

Whats with you GenZs obsessed with Min-maxing every aspect of your life? Life isn't a game it's not about racking up stats and XP points on spreadsheets. Just do what you enjoy, spend time with those who you like/love and fuck the rest. Lemme tell you this, life doesn't end at 40 - you choose the life you live. Maybe trying to "front-load" everything into your 20s will burn you out but I still enjoy going out and having fun times at my age. Sounds to me you're the ones wasting your life chasing some nebulous FOMO.

I know a few Millennials who are the same way. Getting older is realizing there's no actual age limit on things and ultimately life is a compromise. Your tastes are always changing and there's a good chance that later on you won't care about a lot of things you thought were so important when you were younger. So there's really no point in adding to much stress to it.

[Badhobz]

Badhobz definitely doesn't speak for the rest of us in his age cohort. Sorry buddy -much love but my body still works fine at 42. It might not be able to take punishment as much as I did in my 20s but I can probably still run a 5k out of bed, go on long hikes, play sports, etc.

If anything my mind is aging more I'm just sick seeing the shit happening with society over and over again so I'll gladly pay money to avoid such discomforts.

:okay:

youre like the model geriatric motoring geezer.

Some of us dont plan on being around much longer past 65 okay? especially without any little hobzlets, ill burn this fucking candle out ASAP and go out with a bang surrounded by 10 blonde hookers and a mountain of coke.


Next thing I know I'll be 35 at a concert with my wife and sold my Ferrari engine for a Yamaha

:QQ::QQ: thats rave you motherfucker!!! RAVE!!!!!!!!!!! :QQ::QQ:

[unit]

everyone says they dont wanna live past 60 till they are 55 and doing well and in good health.

[CivicBlues]

What hehe said was so real - I fear the window is closing.

It almost feels the the time to be chaotic and hoe around Europe is coming to a close
& people starting to care at what you already done/have a bit more.

Almost feels like now or never to take big risk with career/socially to set trajectory
Next thing I know I'll be 35 at a concert with my wife and sold my Ferrari engine for a Yamaha

Come Onnnn man. You sound like you're living in the 1950s or something. It's 2025. You wanna live and "hoe around" in Europe? You can do that until you're 60 years old and no eyebrows will be raised. Wanna drive a ferrari until you crash it due to cataracts in your 80 year old eyes? You certainly seem to have enough money to do that. NO one is telling you to settle down and get married or have kids or become a C-suite fuck. Certainly not as a man. You can do whatever the fuck you want and society will literally not give a flying fuck.

Again dude it's 2025.

[Badhobz]

^its quarter life crisis bro. its a real thing for these kids nowadays.

[Gerbs]

Whats with you GenZs obsessed with Min-maxing every aspect of your life? Life isn't a game it's not about racking up stats and XP points on spreadsheets. Just do what you enjoy, spend time with those who you like/love and fuck the rest.

All my boring older friends and family have always said this to me. Why are you tryna mix-max everything, just live without thinking. Be happy with your life, you don't have to strive for more. That mindset handicapped me for awhile, I thought my entire life was just gonna be my highschool friends and maybe some uni friends. My only hobby was cars. It wasn't until I started min/maxing life was when I found tons of characters in various hobbies, most like-minded, and life has never been better. We're all doing more and experiencing as much as life has to offer.


If I never min-maxed, I'd probably be poor, fat, never played sports, never met any of my post hs/college group of friends, never ventured in 10+ hobbies, never move out, buy a business, and probably be mid at anything I try.

I stopped taking advice from people I don't wanna be, who're living lives I don't wanna live.

^its quarter life crisis bro. its a real thing for these kids nowadays.

It's probably because we don't have any struggle anymore, we have all the options to do everything whereas 1980's kids had to survive.

I am curious if there is a list or matrix that exists somewhere that defines the criteria you guys speak to, and what the consequences are if you don't meet them by age "X."

You both have a lifetime ahead of you and there are no hard rules to come back to enjoy these things. Guys like Badhobz are complaining and discouraging because they're old and grumpy, and also richer than most of us. This is waht happens when you've done everything in a short amount of time. Everything becomes boring. Take what he says with a grain of salt.

I don't have a spreadsheet or list, but this is a common topic amongst 25-33 year old, we're in an economy where we are fucked by housing costs that benefited everyone who bought pre 2016. So we wanna maximize life given the constraint which is money and time. You plan your life for career, relationships, and friendships. Why not take the effort to plan experiences and how you want your lifestyle to be.

I follow the mantra of this book
https://www.diewithzerobook.com/welcome

[bcrdukes]

What hehe said was so real - I fear the window is closing.

It almost feels the the time to be chaotic and hoe around Europe is coming to a close
& people starting to care at what you already done/have a bit more.

Almost feels like now or never to take big risk with career/socially to set trajectory
Next thing I know I'll be 35 at a concert with my wife and sold my Ferrari engine for a Yamaha

I'm not sure I agree about whether people care about what you've done. Circumstances matter, too, and you decide who you want to associate yourself with.

Re: 35 at a concert with wife. If you can have both a Ferrari engine and a Yamaha, why not? No hard rule to say you can't. You're at a different stage in your life, so it all boils back down to circumstances. You have the option of choosing to stay single, and if you ask me openly, there's no judgement on that. I'm a pretty care-free liberal, "laissez faire" kinda guy (the type Hondaracer hates so much) so you do you. And you'll be fine.

[CivicBlues]

It's perfectly fine to want to achieve something for yourself or strive to be better. But the way people try to assign value and collect experiences, friends, possessions. I dunno man I don't see that as a healthy mindset in the long run.

It's certainly not something most people can even afford to entertain so erm just check your privilege .

[Gerbs]

:okay:

youre like the model geriatric motoring geezer.

Some of us dont plan on being around much longer past 65 okay? especially without any little hobzlets, ill burn this fucking candle out ASAP and go out with a bang surrounded by 10 blonde hookers and a mountain of coke.



:QQ::QQ: thats rave you motherfucker!!! RAVE!!!!!!!!!!! :QQ::QQ:

Why wait till 65 for a mountain of coke + hookers, ppl are doing that now

top down in the snow, introducing drop top experience to my friends.


That's my favourite memory of the S2000 as well, everyone sitting in their first convertible or sports car is really exciting. 2nd is meeting people who always wanted to sit in one and giving them that experience to drive/sit in it. Third is top down ROAD DOME, you can only do that in early 20's without thinking too much.

NO one is telling you to settle down and get married or have kids or become a C-suite fuck.


I really want kids and ideally in my mid 30's so I can competitively play sports and golf with them like I do with my friends parents. My mom's 74 and she's functional but she can't anything intensive anymore. Dad passed away super early, so it'd be a shame if I didn't see my kids grow up because I had them late.

Hence why time is a constraint, no kids and I'm not worried about time.

[Badhobz]

THATS GEEZER TALK ! you should encourage these kids to min max so we have CPP money left over.... (dont tell them the secret)

Why wait till 65 for a mountain of coke + hookers, ppl are doing that now

Spy balloon knows all and SEES ALL !!!!! she's the eye of sauron

[AstulzerRZD]

It's probably because we don't have any struggle anymore, we have all the options to do everything whereas 1980's kids had to survive.

I can't tell if it's because kids in the 80s had it easier (income x housing/car cost) or if we just chase more because we're exposed to more over social media.

I don't have a spreadsheet or list, but this is a common topic amongst 25-33 year old, we're in an economy where we are fucked by housing costs that benefited everyone who bought pre 2016. So we wanna maximize life given the constraint which is money and time. You plan your life for career, relationships, and friendships. Why not take the effort to plan experiences and how you want your lifestyle to be.

I think you're misinterpreting the message, I don't place high value at all about collecting friends or possessions.

I want to put my best foot forward to meet the great people in life to share extraordinary experiences together. Activities and having nice things is a fun but enjoying them with your friends and loved ones is what makes it an 11/10 experience.


I really feel like we haven't found the right words about optimizing our experiences and lifestyle. I feel like I come across contrived/superficial when I describe how things happened but most of it was really just bringing a good vibe and be someone people wanna introduce to their friends.

[Gerbs]

I'm not sure I agree about whether people care about what you've done. Circumstances matter, too, and you decide who you want to associate yourself with.


Penetrating into social circles that do activities listed in the previous page is difficult because those hobbies are expensive and everyone who can afford to do them are high performers to be able to afford it.

While I think nobody really cares about you and what you do, it's so much easier to make new friends and be "accepted" when you roll in as a solid character. People say it's hard to make good friends post college and I agree because people don't have the time, energy and want to put the effort to meeting new people or developing stronger friendships because they already have their social circle. That's why you have to be strategic on how you make friends in Vancouver, once you figure it out it's easy mode.

It's perfectly fine to want to achieve something for yourself or strive to be better. But the way people try to assign value and collect experiences, friends, possessions. I dunno man I don't see that as a healthy mindset in the long run.

It's certainly not something most people can even afford to entertain so erm just check your privilege .

I think you're misinterpreting the message, I don't place high value at all about collecting friends or possessions.

I want to put my best foot forward to meet the great people in life to share extraordinary experiences together. Activities and having nice things is a fun but enjoying them with your friends and loved ones is what makes it an 11/10 experience.

THATS GEEZER TALK ! you should encourage these kids to min max so we have CPP money left over.... (dont tell them the secret)

Spy balloon knows all and SEES ALL !!!!! she's the eye of sauron

Do a line off her, and then do a line off me

[Traum]

I don't think it's about min-maxing every aspect of your life. IMO it has more to do with having the curiosity, interest, drive, and energy (and funding, of course) to seek out different experiences to see what you enjoy more -- including success.

Many of these qualities seem to be far more readily available in our prime -- when life haven't burdened us with too many responsibilities yet. When we are burdened with too many responsibilities, regardless of whether we got into them willingly or not, we start losing the drive to keep going and trying.

With a day job, mortgage, house chores, family reponsibilities -- including being the support person to my aging parents and inlaws, when my duties for the day are finally done at 11pm or 12am, pretty much the only thing I want to do is to chill or go to bed. There just isn't any gas left in the tank anymore, so to speak, to make the conscious effort to min-max anything.

I realize I am already speaking from a position of relative privilege, since I already have a roof above my head, food on the table, have the time to take on some of those aforementioned responsibilities, and even the luxury to enjoy a hobby or two every now and then. But I sure wish I'd have more time for myself to pursue what I want to do.

[bcrdukes]

This sounds like a pay-to-play transaction model. I don't think making friends this way is all healthy. CivicBlues said it best in his post above. Check your privlege.

Re: The struggle. I don't know how to articulate this but I think feelings and egos get hurt too easily.

One relatable experience of AstulzerRZD not getting the job he wanted resonated with me because I had to turn someone down recently (Gen Z'er.) His approach was he was entitled to it. No, he was not. I explained to him very clearly he did not have the right skills (social / leadership) to do the job well, and to lead others. I gave him valuable feedback on how to improve and that we could revisit this later when the opportunity came again. He didn't like this, told me to rot in hell, and he quit. He is now on welfare.

I remember when I was younger (still in 3rd year) I got passed on for a job. Out of anger, I sent in my resignation letter. Someone had a word with me to reconsider it and I swallowed my pride, went to the director and asked for my resignation latter back. It was painful, but it was a good life lesson. Most people would have just left. If I didn't take a shot to the gut with that situation, I don't think I'd be where I am today.

[Gerbs]

I can't tell if it's because kids in the 80s had it easier (income x housing/car cost) or if we just chase more because we're exposed to more over social media.
s.

They had it easier, we're spending 2x more on housing to get half the bedrooms. So we live the same or worse lifestyle despite making 1.4-2x more. Like my neighbour is 34, his parents bought him a $299K pre-sale in 2010, he lives the same life as me making 50% less, drives a german car. Has pretty much no housing costs because mortgage is so low.

I think Gen Z's chase because of social media and because they don't have to worry about food and shelter, so they're the next generation to strive for more "wealth". I don't care about that, give me my old Honda and some extra bedrooms to pop babies in. I don't need nor want luxury stuff.

[Gerbs]

Civicblues reminds me of everyone in my brother's friend group who are 5-10+ years older than me. Every time we talk about life and what we're up to, 90% of their responses are the same negative feedback.
- "You should be content, why do you wanna do more? Just sit and relax and watch some Netflix"
- "I don't need new friends, my hs friends are enough, you just need 1 close friend"
- "Oh, you shouldn't do those hobbies, they're so expensive, save money"
- "You worry too much about what you eat and exercise too much, that's too much work and you'll hurt yourself"
- "Oh opening a business is so risky, are you sure it makes money?"


Then they also say this a week later
- "Damn, how'd you achieve x,y,z"
- "Vancouver is such a clique city, how do you meet so many people all the time, invite me out"
- "Why don't you invite/teach me to play golf, tennis, grass vball"
- "How do you stay in shape so easily? I need to start dieting"
- "My HS friends never host fun events, do any hobbies or start cool businesses"

[Badhobz]

prease forgive civicblues. thats our generation.

We are all very glum and gloom/doom even though we had it easier than you kids.

Im supportive of you guys min maxing your life. its good, just dont focus too hard on comparing yourselves to others as it seems social media is your greatest enemy. It gives you unnecessary pressures on an already stressful life. Also please go have kids, make up for the ones that i dont have. Otherwise 3rd world countries will overpopulate and take us over.

Just dont expect me to hire any of your shitty kids. FUCK THAT SHIT.

[bcrdukes]

Shut up rich old man :okay: Sucks to be poor, okay?

On a serious note, yes, agreed with Badhobz. Social media is dangerous. I, too, once got caught up in the frenzy and it drove me crazy I didn't have the latest 911, er, beetle, or fly business class on every flight when I was actively traveling on a regular basis. Once I shut all that shit down, life has been tremendously more comfortable. There's more than what meets the eye.

You find simple pleasures in even meeting your old geezer friends in a parking lot for a grocery store burger. I would personally welcome you to come join us to see how retarded we are.

[Badhobz]

Poor people can do fun poor people things!

I remember when i was poor, i enjoyed 2 dollar churchs chicken specials and stealing free slurpee coupons from the back of Z95 stickers.

Ahhh good times. Theft was fun.

[CivicBlues]

Civicblues reminds me of everyone in my brother's friend group who are 5-10+ years older than me. Every time we talk about life and what we're up to, 90% of their responses are the same negative feedback.
- "You should be content, why do you wanna do more? Just sit and relax and watch some Netflix"
- "I don't need new friends, my hs friends are enough, you just need 1 close friend"
- "Oh, you shouldn't do those hobbies, they're so expensive, save money"
- "You worry too much about what you eat and exercise too much, that's too much work and you'll hurt yourself"
- "Oh opening a business is so risky, are you sure it makes money?"


Then they also say this a week later
- "Damn, how'd you achieve x,y,z"
- "Vancouver is such a clique city, how do you meet so many people all the time, invite me out"
- "Why don't you invite/teach me to play golf, tennis, grass vball"
- "How do you stay in shape so easily? I need to start dieting"
- "My HS friends never host fun events, do any hobbies or start cool businesses"

Hey Hey Hey...I maybe only agree with maybe 5 or 6 of these things :D

But seriously go enjoy your life, I'm not telling you not to do it...I'm just telling you to shut up about it and just do it. I've done/tried all these things (except maybe entrepreneurship) and more. What I don't really understand is trying to seek validation from others for doing so as if it's some kinda game you need to "win" at...especially from online strangers.

I guess that's just the Elder Millennial in me. If no one "likes" something, did it really happen?

[underscore]

Hey what's wrong with being 35 and seeing a concert with your wife? I just did that a couple weeks ago seeing Sum 41 :lol The only difference was we were in seats rather than on the floor.

I can't tell if it's because kids in the 80s had it easier (income x housing/car cost) or if we just chase more because we're exposed to more over social media.

People have always been trying to keep up with the Jones', but now you see edited versions of people way outside your social circle and the price of the "best" of things is now way higher than before. Like even if you were insanely rich in the 80's and went out and bought a Ferrari Testarossa it was $115k. In todays money that's about $300k. Sure a normal person can't afford it, but you could at least dream about winning a few million in the lotto and getting one.

Nowadays the F80 is $3.9M. Effectively 13x more expensive. You can't even afford one if you win a regular lotto, it has to be a big one. Now even a lotto win doesn't let you live out the dream of buying the best of the best.

[Badhobz]

yes things are fucked nowadays. The less you compare yourself to others the better. There's always some mofo who has more and the magically the algorithm will find it and send it to your feed to make sure you feel THAT much worse about yourself.

[Hondaracer]

Collecting friends/colleagues to have “experiences” with sounds like some contrived bullshit anyways lol…

So what you’re trying to find these perfect relationships to fill this need in your life? lol sorry but it’s probably not gonna happen.

Firstly anyone with a family, young kids, dependants, they are out of that group.

Second, “high performing” people probably don’t have time to play your games of tagging along till you become good enough friends to do what you’re looking for with them.

I’ve been in and out of a few social circles that were well above my pay grade and outside of the people who were just fake, or wealthy but jaded af, none of them were doing anything so far out of my reach that I thought this was a relationship worth fostering in order to get something out of it. They might spend more money than I’d be comfortable spending on certain things, but other than that I couldn’t care less about hopping up in social status for the sake of personal benefit. It’s way too much work.

If you want torpedo your dreams of freedom, travel, activities, go have a kid. There ya go, your next 20 years of life are planned out for you lol

If you’re already caving to the societal norms that you’re in your mid 30’s and running out of time to have a kid, well.. sounds like you’ve already got a plan.

[Gerbs]

Also please go have kids, make up for the ones that i dont have. Otherwise 3rd world countries will overpopulate and take us over.

Just dont expect me to hire any of your shitty kids. FUCK THAT SHIT.

Stop occupying the mcmansions while we're in 1BR's tryna pop 3 kids, or let me live with you, we can share cars and wives.

We're both XL too!


I’ve been in and out of a few social circles that were well above my pay grade and outside of the people who were just fake, or wealthy but jaded af, none of them were doing anything so far out of my reach that I thought this was a relationship worth fostering in order to get something out of it. They might spend more money than I’d be comfortable spending on certain things, but other than that I couldn’t care less about hopping up in social status for the sake of personal benefit. It’s way too much work.


There's a lot of shitty rich people, just gotta sift through for the good ones that have same values as you!

[Badhobz]

almost none of the rich people i know have a good set of core values.

They got there either by being born into it (which is the worst because they dont value any of it)

Fought and clawed their way to the top (makes them stingy, jaded, and super protective)

Or fell into it due to sheer luck either due to marrying into it, or getting lucky on stocks, or just being at the right time an place. Ideally they came from peasant stock so they remember when they were poor (this is probably your best bet to make a good friend who isnt a complete asshole/retard).

Stop occupying the mcmansions while we're in 1BR's tryna pop 3 kids, or let me live with you, we can share cars and wives.

We're both XL too!
peepoClap you can be my wife's pool boy peepoClap
p.s. we dont have a pool..... so you can just be the boy. my adopted son that i never wanted or know that i have.

[Gerbs]

almost none of the rich people i know have a good set of core values.

They got there either by being born into it (which is the worst because they dont value any of it)

Fought and clawed their way to the top (makes them stingy, jaded, and super protective)

Or fell into it due to sheer luck either due to marrying into it, or getting lucky on stocks, or just being at the right time an place. Ideally they came from peasant stock so they remember when they were poor (this is probably your best bet to make a good friend who isnt a complete asshole/retard).


peepoClap you can be my wife's pool boy peepoClap
p.s. we dont have a pool..... so you can just be the boy. my adopted son that i never wanted or know that i have.

Rich is subjective, I'm talking from my pov of rich from a mid to late 20's standpoint



Your wife's boyfriend would like to drive your LC when you're not using it :lawl:

[Badhobz]

i havent used it in like 2 months. i dont even know why the fuck i treat it like its predecessor, its not like its gonna break. Its got 9000kms on it in almost 3 years while the hitlerbox is already at 7000kms and thats only 7 months old.

[BIC_BAWS]

Civicblues reminds me of everyone in my brother's friend group who are 5-10+ years older than me. Every time we talk about life and what we're up to, 90% of their responses are the same negative feedback.

- "Oh opening a business is so risky, are you sure it makes money?"


Then they also say this a week later
- "Damn, how'd you achieve x,y,z"
- "Vancouver is such a clique city, how do you meet so many people all the time, invite me out"

This one hits hard. I remember when I first started my business that was the most common negative feedback - even with my close friends, with the same comments (a few years later). Some of these people aren't my friends anymore with how different our lifestyles had become and shifting of priorities.

Also, the doom and gloom people are usually the same type of ppl that go like "businesses are evil; I deserve more money", but don't actually know what goes into running a business, let alone the personal risk and manhours required to even keep people on payroll.

(And before someone makes a comment about my previous employment. My issue with them was that they used company funds for non-company activities, then paraded the line we need to cut costs. And I gave them way too much leeway with how they treated employees, having first hand experience with all the backend efforts to run a business.)

Edit: Also, opening a business isn't necessarily about making money. Obviously, that's the goal for any side quest hustle, but it's also about the experiences you'll gain while running this business. I obviously didn't become rich running my business, but I wouldn't trade that experience for anything. Hell, I should have taken that 20K gamble into penny stocks (scam) into running another business, that would have been way more worthwhile LOL.

[68style]

i havent used it in like 2 months. i dont even know why the fuck i treat it like its predecessor, its not like its gonna break. Its got 9000kms on it in almost 3 years while the hitlerbox is already at 7000kms and thats only 7 months old.

I'll take that next time I'm in town... would be even more fun to explain that license plate to people than the Hitlerbox one

[Gerbs]

me too, stretch it's legs


Edit: Also, opening a business isn't necessarily about making money. Obviously, that's the goal for any side quest hustle, but it's also about the experiences you'll gain while running this business. I obviously didn't become rich running my business, but I wouldn't trade that experience for anything. Hell, I should have taken that 20K gamble into penny stocks (scam) into running another business, that would have been way more worthwhile LOL.

Is it really a business if you didn't make money FeelsBadMan

[Badhobz]

I'll take that next time I'm in town... would be even more fun to explain that license plate to people than the Hitlerbox one

Pssshh you’d probably get pulled over. 30 year old looking white guy driving a bright blue ratrolla with a “Moochi” plate looks highly sus.

[bcrdukes]

68style - I will be sure to ask our mutual friend to out out a BOLO for white guy driving blue LC500.

[RabidRat]

I really feel like we haven't found the right words about optimizing our experiences and lifestyle. I feel like I come across contrived/superficial when I describe how things happened but most of it was really just bringing a good vibe and be someone people wanna introduce to their friends.

Eh. I don't think it's you.

I think people who are well along in their lives, are going to have found fulfillment in their own way. It's a long road. And they're likely surrounded by many others who've more or less taken that same road. They're going to be really certain that that's the only possible road. So for you to come in with radically different ideas, they're going to be a little (maybe a lot) rattled and maybe even a kind of defensive.

I think the general wisdom is that of course you shouldn't feel compelled to push yourself past a point that it's detrimental to your wellbeing and health, short and long term. And of course it's healthy and necessary to retain a solid base of relationships that are anchored in genuine care and trust.

I think it's just that what you're describing of your goals, and how you're allocating your efforts socially, probably pushes way past most people's personal capacity. But you're you and you know yourself. You alone can know what you really have capacity for. If you're having fun (sounds like yes), you're feeling fulfilled (sounds like yes), the requisite stress isn't teetering against the limits of what you and your support network can handle (you seem fine?), and you're sufficiently hedged against the worst possible outcomes (sounds like yes?), then honestly why not.

[BIC_BAWS]

Is it really a business if you didn't make money FeelsBadMan

You can call yourself an "entrepreneur" and make lifestyle content to be a "content creator"

[RabidRat]

I don't think it's about min-maxing every aspect of your life. IMO it has more to do with having the curiosity, interest, drive, and energy (and funding, of course) to seek out different experiences to see what you enjoy more -- including success.

Many of these qualities seem to be far more readily available in our prime -- when life haven't burdened us with too many responsibilities yet. When we are burdened with too many responsibilities, regardless of whether we got into them willingly or not, we start losing the drive to keep going and trying.

With a day job, mortgage, house chores, family reponsibilities -- including being the support person to my aging parents and inlaws, when my duties for the day are finally done at 11pm or 12am, pretty much the only thing I want to do is to chill or go to bed. There just isn't any gas left in the tank anymore, so to speak, to make the conscious effort to min-max anything.

I realize I am already speaking from a position of relative privilege, since I already have a roof above my head, food on the table, have the time to take on some of those aforementioned responsibilities, and even the luxury to enjoy a hobby or two every now and then. But I sure wish I'd have more time for myself to pursue what I want to do.

How do I thank you twice? I feel like you dug your hand into my brain and pulled the words out of my mouth. The kids, the house, my in-laws, my parents... I'm so fking beat lol. Seems like the only success metric now is survival. I wish I had gotten off my ass even more in my earlier years, so I could do more while I still could.

[AstulzerRZD]

me too, stretch it's legs



Is it really a business if you didn't make money FeelsBadMan

losses just mean we're paying tuition to learn something

[68style]

That's a nice way to not take responsibility for fucking up lol

[Gerbs]

I love losing money

[AstulzerRZD]

this is really exhausting

- i'm trying to stay afloat a work while the product has gone from 1 version to 3; competitors shipping really dope stuff has accelerated our timeline

- i'm applying for jobs and networking to get referrals to Figma/Notion/Pinterest, etc - jobs I feel with S tier product teams I can really learn from

- Interviewing with DataDog/Bloomberg for AI roles I'm a good fit for but not terribly excited about

- judged the Cornell AI hackathon & participating in the A16z one this weekend

- Shipped an application to YCombinator with a referral, need to finish up the Proof of Concept and demo

I think I have a bit of a roadmap of where my career could go, excited to take y'all up on some calls for feedback and mentorship. A little lost with where this could all go but have some ideas.

I am struggling to take care of myself and my relationship while all this is going on; in a better place with the partner now that we've established a care routine where we give each other spa days at home.

[68style]

You could join the DOGE team and fuck them up from within?

[AstulzerRZD]

oh man..... i think at this rate, the fact that employers are continuing to recruit is amazing to begin with.

we could defs be out of a job if more chaos happens