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Old 05-09-2015, 07:27 PM   #76
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uh...no, it's not an 'excuse' and it has to be proven... unless what you're actually saying is you advocate punishing the mentally insane
I don't see it like that, I think he's to big of a risk to let into a halfway house or group home though. I'd rather error on the side of caution with a case like this, he should never see the light of day. That's my opinion, the judge obviously seen it different which is unfortunate.
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Old 05-09-2015, 09:05 PM   #77
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Protect the guilty.
Umm..no technically he is not criminally responsible on account of mental disorder.
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Old 05-09-2015, 09:45 PM   #78
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uh...no, it's not an 'excuse' and it has to be proven... unless what you're actually saying is you advocate punishing the mentally insane
I completely would advocate punishing the mentally insane.

And yes, it is an excuse. They may have been born with that handicap, but that doesnt' give them the right to do things which are against the social norm. If someone beheads someone, they should do the time. simple.
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Old 05-09-2015, 11:22 PM   #79
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"The 51-year-old member of the Royal Canadian Mounted Police is among 13 first responders who have killed themselves in the past 10 weeks"

Wtf did I read that right?
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Old 05-09-2015, 11:36 PM   #80
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The difference is that as a lawyer you do it for money (a lot of money) and if you can pick the person you are defending.
I don't think that's right for all lawyers... Since everyone's entitled to a fair trial, if the defendant is too poor to afford a lawyer, he gets assigned a lawyer paid for by the government I believe

which is what may have happened here



also, this happened 6 years ago?? holy shit time flies... feels like it was max 2 years ago
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Old 05-10-2015, 12:12 AM   #81
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I completely would advocate punishing the mentally insane.

And yes, it is an excuse. They may have been born with that handicap, but that doesnt' give them the right to do things which are against the social norm. If someone beheads someone, they should do the time. simple.
This is ridiculous. In what way is it an excuse? It's a sickness. If someone had an undiagnosed heart condition and had a heart attack while driving a car and crashed into someone, would you advocate for them to be punished with jail time?

Nobody's saying he has "the right" to kill people, but it's a mitigating circumstance.

So no, it's not simple.
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Old 05-10-2015, 12:17 AM   #82
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I don't see it like that, I think he's to big of a risk to let into a halfway house or group home though. I'd rather error on the side of caution with a case like this, he should never see the light of day. That's my opinion, the judge obviously seen it different which is unfortunate.
Thankfully, the legal system values personal liberties, so someone that isn't guilty of any crime can't be jailed indefinitely just to err on the side of caution. It's the same reason everyone's bitching against Bill C-51 and against the NSA, etc. If the paramount consideration was security, we'd gladly give up privacy and security in exchange for Big Brother looking over everyone's shoulders and making sure nobody gets hurt. But we don't. So yeah, maybe there's a risk he might re-offend. But in the eyes of the experts who know vastly more than you or I, the risk is low, and he is capable of re-entering society and becoming a productive member of the public. If the risk is minimal, isn't that better than just throwing another person in a room with padded walls and having our tax dollars paying for his care for the next 50 years?
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Old 05-10-2015, 12:43 AM   #83
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well enough to live in a group home and eventually become a contributing member of society again? then he's well enough to face a regular sentence

think about how just this decision is to the victim's family, the other passengers, the first responders and even the current residents of the group home he'll be staying with.

If he's really low risk outside of padded walls then may be he should board with the judge and psychiatrist that approved this permission. How can anyone ask the public to trust that he'll be dilligent in taking meds?
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Old 05-10-2015, 12:53 AM   #84
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Face a regular sentence for what? The courts already held that he was not guilty. You can't just throw people in prison for no reason.
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Old 05-10-2015, 02:49 AM   #85
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I would like to see him move right next door to Majestic12
How about Majestic12, give him a ride to where ever he needs to go? make sure he doesn't get lost?
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Old 05-10-2015, 02:54 AM   #86
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I completely would advocate punishing the mentally insane.

And yes, it is an excuse. They may have been born with that handicap, but that doesnt' give them the right to do things which are against the social norm. If someone beheads someone, they should do the time. simple.
You're misguided

Sure, they may "do things" that are "against the social norm"; but, they lack the mental capacity to appreciate the nature & quality of the act or of knowing that it was wrong (quoted from the CCC).

Basically, they don't have guilty minds. If you wanna get all technical n shit, they are unable to form a mens rea.

You would punish someone who couldn't appreciate the weight of his/her actions?
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Old 05-10-2015, 03:09 AM   #87
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Originally Posted by carisear View Post
I completely would advocate punishing the mentally insane.

And yes, it is an excuse. They may have been born with that handicap, but that doesnt' give them the right to do things which are against the social norm. If someone beheads someone, they should do the time. simple.
i guess you cheered the lynch mob in 'of mice and men' and 'Frankenstein'
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Old 05-10-2015, 04:23 AM   #88
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-man does phone sale scam: should be ruined for life. the law says it's fraud! it's fraud!!! hang him!!!

-man cuts another man's head and body parts off and eats some of them: should be helped to be integrated back into society. the law says he's excused... HE'S EXCUSED!!!


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Old 05-10-2015, 05:14 AM   #89
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It is a complicated situation and I can see both sides of the argument...

When someone has a mental condition, they are technically not classified as themselves. What they do in this state is not held accountable according to the law. On the flip side, someone was murdered, and there's no one to be held responsible for it.

As silly as that analogy of him being possessed by a demon, it's actually a really good analogy. Technically, the demon beheaded someone. So you cannot throw the possessed man in jail for something he technically didn't do...

Life isn't fair.
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Old 05-10-2015, 07:02 AM   #90
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I would like to see him move right next door to Majestic12
How about Majestic12, give him a ride to where ever he needs to go? make sure he doesn't get lost?
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We can conclude from the information in this review that individuals with mental illness, when appropriately treated, do not pose any increased risk of violence over the general population. Violence may be more of an issue in patients diagnosed with personality disorders and substance dependence. The overall impact of mental illness as a factor in the violence that occurs in society as a whole appears to be overemphasized, possibly intensifying the stigma already surrounding psychiatric disorders.
Violence and Mental Illness

Sure.
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Old 05-10-2015, 07:07 AM   #91
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-man cuts another man's head and body parts off and eats some of them: should be helped to be integrated back into society. the law says he's excused... HE'S EXCUSED!!!
I must have missed the part where he's "excused". He's not "excused". He's "not criminally responsible". If he was excused, he'd be let back out into the world with no consequences. That isn't the case, is it? No, he's been institutionalized for something like 7 years, undergoing treatment, and is only now being eased back into society. Deemed a low risk to re-offend, and aware of his condition and what it takes to control it.

Plus, this is the decision of experts in law, medicine, psychiatry, etc. What is it that you know that they don't?
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Old 05-10-2015, 07:27 AM   #92
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Well I wouldn't want myself or anyone I know on a bus, in a restaurant, in a mall or anywhere near this guy. I don't care if they found him completely nutter butters and only slapped him on the dick, he cut someones head off I don't think anyone is arguing his elevator stops part ways up. We'll have to agree to disagree I still don't think he should ever be free.

The judge should put him up as a billet when he's done with the group home, saving peoples souls and all that good shit.
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Old 05-10-2015, 11:31 AM   #93
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He isn't responsible for the suicide of that RCMP officer but was that taken into account by the judge?
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Old 05-10-2015, 12:00 PM   #94
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You're misguided

Sure, they may "do things" that are "against the social norm"; but, they lack the mental capacity to appreciate the nature & quality of the act or of knowing that it was wrong (quoted from the CCC).

Basically, they don't have guilty minds. If you wanna get all technical n shit, they are unable to form a mens rea.

You would punish someone who couldn't appreciate the weight of his/her actions?

I would completely punish someone who couldn't appreciate the weight of his or her actions.

Ignorance is NOT an excuse.

But I completely misread the article. This person WAS punished, being in an institution for 7 years, so I am content with that. I don't agree that he should be in a halfway house, but he did his time fair and square.

One thing that alarms me is:
>>Li’s doctors have consistently praised his progress during treatment for schizophrenia, and say he is a very low risk to re-offend violently, as long as he stays on his medication.

once out in the public, there are no checks in place to ensure this happens ...
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Old 05-10-2015, 01:15 PM   #95
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I would completely punish someone who couldn't appreciate the weight of his or her actions.

Ignorance is NOT an excuse.

But I completely misread the article. This person WAS punished, being in an institution for 7 years, so I am content with that. I don't agree that he should be in a halfway house, but he did his time fair and square.

One thing that alarms me is:
>>Li’s doctors have consistently praised his progress during treatment for schizophrenia, and say he is a very low risk to re-offend violently, as long as he stays on his medication.

once out in the public, there are no checks in place to ensure this happens ...
Unfortunately for you, the law says we cannot punish those cannot appreciate the nature and quality of their act.

Yes ignorance is not an excuse, but he is not ignorant, he is mentally disabled.

He wasn't "punished" for 7 years, he was being treated. He couldn't have been "punished" because he wasn't responsible for his actions by law. It was just a response to help the person himself and for societal good.

The ignorance in these posts are astonishing
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Old 05-10-2015, 02:13 PM   #96
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What a waste of tax payers dollars trying to treat him. Kill the pos and get it over with. He's worthless. I don't care if he wasn't in the right state of mind I.e. "insane". If I had done something like I would gladly accept the death penalty to make the victims family feel better. What good is it treating him, will anyone ever hire him knowing what he's done? Just a waste of our dollars. fucking Canada
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Old 05-10-2015, 02:15 PM   #97
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Sounds like a majority of people on this forum rather live in Saudi Arabia.
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Old 05-10-2015, 02:26 PM   #98
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What a waste of tax payers dollars trying to treat him. Kill the pos and get it over with. He's worthless. I don't care if he wasn't in the right state of mind I.e. "insane". If I had done something like I would gladly accept the death penalty to make the victims family feel better. What good is it treating him, will anyone ever hire him knowing what he's done? Just a waste of our dollars. fucking Canada
Unfortunately not everyone is so noble as to allow themselves to be executed for something they don't even remember doing.
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Old 05-10-2015, 02:44 PM   #99
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I would completely punish someone who couldn't appreciate the weight of his or her actions.

Ignorance is NOT an excuse.

But I completely misread the article. This person WAS punished, being in an institution for 7 years, so I am content with that. I don't agree that he should be in a halfway house, but he did his time fair and square.

One thing that alarms me is:
>>Li’s doctors have consistently praised his progress during treatment for schizophrenia, and say he is a very low risk to re-offend violently, as long as he stays on his medication.

once out in the public, there are no checks in place to ensure this happens ...
Like wkbb said, it's not ignorance.

They lack moral compasses and the mental capacity to register what they are doing. Depending on the severity of their illnesses or psychotic episodes, they don't realize what they are doing is wrong. Like babies.

If an autistic person attacked you, would you knock his shit out? Say an infant somehow had his hands on a gun, played around with it, and shot somebody. Would you aim to punish the infant? No, 'cause you would know it wasn't out of malevolence. You would know that they don't know any better, right?

I don't advocate for this guy's release, but don't be an ignoramus.
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Old 05-10-2015, 09:40 PM   #100
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The doctor permitted his release should be charged
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