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When pavement meets dirt, Beautiful British Columbia
When life on tarmac isn't enough. This section is for 4x4 Offroad Events, Pics, Discussion. Places to test your truck, Techniques and Skills. Everyone of all skill levels are welcome. Got a wicked campsite you would like to share? Discover the great outdoors, gear discussion etc.
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Old 11-16-2009, 09:10 AM   #1
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Possible upgrading in the near future, opinions?

Hey all,

i have had my hilux(4runner) up for sale for a long time, but i know i still love it and i have been thinking about keeping it.

and getting a lift kit on it and some fatter tires.


I currently have 265/70/15 which i think are 31x10.5....i think, but dont quote me

and i was looking to get maybe some General Tire Grabber AT2's (33X12.50R15)

and pop on some new offroading rims, but really dont know that much about truck rims ive seen a lot off basic(almost steelie-type black rims) that look pretty sick with some 33's. i would have tried to keep my 15" stockers, but i want a wider tire, so unfortuantely thats why i need new rims, plus id like to stay with 15's and get more sidewall. any input on this would be nice.

also im looking at some lift kits to fit these onto my truck(4runner susp. and hilux surf susp. are idenitcal). I assume im gonna need at least a 2" sus. lift and a 2" body lift or is anyone familiar with these 2nd gen hilux/4runners and know exactly what i will need for these to fit with minimal to zero rubbing while turning?

also what best bang for your buck lift kit could i get. I dont really offroad much, more driving on rough logging roads and some trail breaking in the winter, so i only really need something basic.
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Old 11-16-2009, 10:06 AM   #2
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32X11.5 is as big as u can go with no lift on that genre of 4Runner. Your hilux may have come with a factory lift since they did things a little different for the Japanese spec ones.
In terms of body lift, u can do a 1-3" for cheap if you dont have an auto tranny. If you do have the auto tranny u need to buy the trans adaptor from 4crawler.com.
If you dont want to do body, you can get 1.5" ball joint spacers for the front, and coil spring spacers for the rear again from 4crawler.com
hell you can crank the torsion bars on the front for an extra inch, it is hard on your CV shafts tho and may tear the boots over time, and run some coil spring spacers in the rear.
If you want some flex you can use stock rear springs out of an FJ80 landcruiser for about 3" of lift.
Old man emu makes some high-end lift kits for your surf.. but i would NOT waste the money on an IFS lift (4" prop-cromp genre) if you plan to do any wheeling. In the long run it is more cost effective to get a solid axle put under the front google big country customs - they are based in vancouver and the place to go to for toyota lifts...
33x12.50 tires are pretty fat, and you need a wide rim to accommodate this. I know people have run 8" wide rims with 12.50 tires, but to be safe, and if you actually air down your tires and go wheeling, i'd do a 10" wide rim.

3" lift is all you willl need to run 33x12.50 with very minimal rubbing at full steering lock and flexed
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Old 11-16-2009, 08:30 PM   #3
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thanks for the info, anyone else wanna chime in?
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Old 11-18-2009, 03:44 PM   #4
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If it were my truck,

-ball joint spacers (need an alignment after)
-fj coils in the rear. Some people run the stock HD coils with spacers
-pan hard drop bar
-2 inch body lift
-4 new rancho's

that should clear 33's no problem and thats as big as you really wanna go while staying IFS and not changing your gears.

If your not doing much offroading you can run a wide 33" tire with a fairly offset rim, but no matter what anyone tells you they rub when your offroading.

Stay away from bracket lifts. IMHO there's no point in dumping money into IFS, just spend enough to clear the tires. If you really wanted you could just do a 2 inch body lift.

Here's a nice read to help you make your decision, filled with pictures
http://www.yotatech.com/f116/2gen-4r...-guide-155339/
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Old 11-19-2009, 05:10 PM   #5
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wow, you can actually fit 33 x12.5 without a lift?!?!?!

what do they mean by backspacing? just putting spacers on the hub??
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Old 11-19-2009, 11:35 PM   #6
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wheels with gangstar offset, all those stoopid drifter kids think they have the corner on low offset
my 15x10's in ricer terms are like a -20 haha, there more dish than what goes inwards
solid front that bitch tho, IFS is fail

backspacing is 'merican terms for offset, my wheels are a 15x10 with 4" backspacing, that means 6"s sticks out from the face of the hub
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Old 11-20-2009, 12:51 AM   #7
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http://blog.tirerack.com/blog/eds-ti...setbackspacing
^^ backspacing explained^^

basically a higher offset pushes the wheel and tire combo further away from the body preventing rubbing.

33 x 12.5 on a 2nd gen runner with no lift is one of those things I have read and heard about but never personally seen.
When we put 33 x 10.5 on my Buddy's 2nd gen runner they rubbed taking mild corners it was un-drivable and we put a body lift in the next day. That being said they were mounted on stock steel tundra wheels.

If you want 12.5" wide and you don't want any rubbing you need to lift it.
If you settle for 10.5" wide and spend the money on a good offset rim you might get away without rubbing.
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Old 11-20-2009, 12:57 AM   #8
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here you go

ball joint spacers
fj coils
4 new shocks
under $500

and you can fit 33 x 12.5 no problem
not to mention how sick that looks
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Old 11-20-2009, 03:57 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 00EM1 View Post

here you go

ball joint spacers
fj coils
4 new shocks
under $500

and you can fit 33 x 12.5 no problem
not to mention how sick that looks
i saw that in the thread, thats probably what ill have to do...question is, currently my ass end sits a bit higher than the front, and id like to keep that look, instead of it being even... also with 33's, will i throw the speedo out of sync or having to redo the gears?


i dont think ill go SAS, im not redneck enough, nor do i really do any real wheeling to warrant it....besides fun mud puddles and camping off old logging roads.

like they say, ill start with baby steps, and work out all the kinks i may find along the way and maybe work into something more aggressive down the road
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Old 11-21-2009, 10:27 AM   #10
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your speedo it will be under about 5 km/ph, I have never once bothered fixing a speedo and have no idea how. Most people just get a gps and figure out how much there off.

Do you know your current rear end gear ratio?
Does the tranny have a similar gear ratio to the 3 liter tranny?

I'm not that familiar with the diesel, but if it was a 3 liter
3 liter / auto / 33's = 5.29
3 liter / manual / 33's = 4.88
3 liter / auto / 35's = 5.72
3 liter / manual / 35's 5.29

Most Toyota automatics have a .070 to 1 OD from 1990 to 2002, and because of this gears really do help. I have heard stories of lifted automatic Toyota's where tranny's on the highway were constantly switching between 3rd and 4th causing the tranny to heat up and eventually blow.
This is easily avoided by turning OD off though.

Most people don't bother re-gearing, I know a couple people with 4.10 in the rear end, automatic tranny and 33's.
I would see how it feels after you put the tries on and go from there, but if you are seriously planning on doing lift and tires it would be something I would keep in mind might be needed down the road.

I have the same feeling about SAS, its something you have to work up to. If you go this route you will be amazed how far your yota will go, and as you get more into it (trust me its addicting) you can keep improving and getting bigger as you need.
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Old 11-21-2009, 10:38 AM   #11
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O and for the stance, most 4runner's have a rear end droop so if your rear end is already sitting higher than the front it should stay that way.
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Old 11-23-2009, 02:44 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 00EM1 View Post

here you go

ball joint spacers
fj coils
4 new shocks
under $500

and you can fit 33 x 12.5 no problem
not to mention how sick that looks
do you think i would need a new steering dampener as well with this lift? also, do you think this lift would require extended brakelines?

also, is there a place around vancouver that could get this stuff in cheap and even install it? i dont really have room on the road i live to do an install
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Old 11-24-2009, 02:27 PM   #13
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Update:

doing some searching around the Yotatech link, i found a set up from one of the suppliers that ill probably end up getting. They are from Texas, but prices seem really good with the exchange rate.

http://www.4x4wire.com/toyota/4Runne...sion/philstet/
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Old 11-25-2009, 12:12 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tegra_devil View Post
Update:

doing some searching around the Yotatech link, i found a set up from one of the suppliers that ill probably end up getting. They are from Texas, but prices seem really good with the exchange rate.

http://www.4x4wire.com/toyota/4Runne...sion/philstet/
Awesome Thread! This is exactly what my mod goals would be if I had a 2nd gen 4runner. Can you post the shipped USD price of the kit and the final installed cost? ...and of course pics as well when you are done!!
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Old 11-25-2009, 01:07 PM   #15
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here are the parts required and final cost:

Total Invoice: 910.19USD w/$125 for fedex shipping


PART-NO. DESC. BIN. O.H. Q.S. SALE

OMEN72F OME SHOCK 201 4 2 73.57

OMESD33 DAMPER,ST 201 2 1 65.87

OME303003 TORSIONBA 201 1 1 158.19

BJS1 4WD BALL 201 36 1 99.00

RTC-AT8689 FRAME TRU 201 6 1 80.00

OMEN98 OME SHOCK 201 8 2 73.57

CSS01 1 INCH SD 201 5 1 79.65

OME901 OME COIL 201 4 2 66.60


a couple things that are missing are a REAR Pan Hard Bracket and BPV Bracket....whatever that is :P
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Old 11-26-2009, 10:38 PM   #16
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I'm actually in the middle of doing that exact lift on a Buddy's truck(this thread may have been inspiration)
We got the rear coils in in under a hour.
when we got everything apart for the ball joint spacers we noticed the ball joint were a little worn and put it on hold tell tomorrow.
plus it turned out lordco didn't carry the rancho's we needed, so I tracked down some pro comp shocks we'll get them in the morning.

The rear Pan Hard drop bracket is going in tomorrow also, with the springs in the axle is noticeable off center.

I really like the kit you bought and for a truck that nice you should definitely invest in OME its good stuff that lasts from what I have read but
Just to get a ruff idea of the super cheap way to do it
(1000 dollar lift is a little much for a truck worth 2 grand)

pand hard bar drop bracket
bj spacers
2 inch coil spacers
around $200 shipped

4 shocks were about 50 bucks a piece

alignment 60 to 100 bucks

It should be good to go for a wheeling trip up eagle on Saturday so I will let you know how it feels. We didn't get a steering stabilizer or extended brake lines so I will let you know if that will be a needed upgrade after we go bash through the bush.
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Old 11-27-2009, 08:14 AM   #17
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id love to hear how it goes. ya i was thinking about going the budget route, but i really wanted to get all quality product(not saying the stuff you got isnt just as good).. but im a brandname whore. haha

out of curiousity where abouts did you get the Pan hard drop bracket from and do you think any metal shop would be able to make up a BPV bracket?

how was the install?

i was thinking about doing it myself, but im not sure how much of a pain in the ass it was, but id like to save some money

Also do you know any local places that have great prices. I usually get my stuff from Northshore offroad, but there prices for these parts are way too high

CANADIAN $ -NSOR
2x OMEN72F OME SHOCK $119.08 ea
1x OMESD33 STEERING DAMPER $106.63
1x OME303003 TORSIONBAR $256.05
2x OMEN98 OME SHOCK $119.08 ea
2x OME901 OME COIL(HD) $107.81 ea

USD$ - TRDPARTS4U.COM
2x OMEN72F OME SHOCK $73.57 each
1x OMESD33 STEERING DAMPER $65.87
1x OME303003 TORSIONBAR $158.19
2x OMEN98 OME SHOCK $73.57 each
2x OME901 OME COIL(HD) 66.60 each

even with the conversion rate and shipping i still save a shitload getting it from the states, but i would prefer to send my money to a local company, but im not paying a whole bunch more.
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Old 11-27-2009, 10:15 PM   #18
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Pan hard drop bracket,
http://www.4crawler.com/4x4/ForSale/...anhardDropBrkt
Just get the basic kit and go to lordco for the 40 cents worth of bolts rather than paying 7 dollars more for the "deluxe kit"

I'm assuming a bpv bracket is a proportioning valve bracket, phone sport trucks unlimited and talk to the younger guy on the counter he has a 2nd gen runner he explained to me how to just make one and this also eliminates needing extended brake lines. After a little research I also discovered that the extended brake lines are way to long for 3 inch coils in the rear so its best to just make your own bracket.

Honestly as sad as it is, you have to order everything from the states local shops are not even close to being competitive.

As for the install it was a bitch, but we were working on a Toyota with 300 000 km that was rusty and caked with stave mud. We had to fabricate a little bit to because we used a pieced together kit
front shocks were for a samari
rear shocks from for a f150
but it wasn't nearly as bad as putting a clutch in my civic, all total it took around 8 hours including going to lordco, Tim Horton's, beer store, talking on the phone, going to a Buddy's house to borrow tools.
we did it in a driveway with 1 jack, 2 jack stands, basic hand tools, BFH (big FUCKING hammer), coil compressors, and a 50 dollar grinder.
I got some picks ill try to post to to give you a better idea
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Old 11-27-2009, 10:47 PM   #19
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Yesterday we put in the rear coil spacers and found out the shocks we planned on buying were not available locally,
you can see the 0 to 1 inch rancho's are already maxed just sitting there.


so we tore the front apart and discovered we needed new ball joint so everything got put on hold for the day.

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Old 11-27-2009, 11:11 PM   #20
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So we woke up bright and early at 10 am, and headed out to sport truck unlimited
picked up
4 skyjacker nitro shocks $61.00 x4
Pro comp steering stabilizer $45.00
1 1/4 wheel spacers for the front $90.00
a little over 4 bills with tax out the door

plus coil spacers, bj spacers, and the panhard drop bracket $200
not to bad for lifting on a budget



you have to do a little grinding on the upper control arm to fit the BJ spacers, nothing to serious just a few slits so you can bash everything back with the BFH


the shocks looked a little close to the bump stops, so we figured hey while were in there lets grind them 2. you probably wont need to do this because you bought the proper application shock we bought front shocks for a samari.



front all done


even after a lot of wheeling and driving everyday on 33's for about a year, the stock steering stabilizer was still in good shape



but for around 40 bucks and 15 minutes to put in this is well worth it



The rear shock diffrence form the 0 to 1 inch rancho's to the nitro skyjackers that are ment for a f150. these were a bitch and required a little fab to get to work but just the way she goes sometimes.




with the tire back on you can see why a proper offset wheel or wheel spacers is needed with BJ spacers, the top of the control arm is now about 2 inches away from the tire. So without the 1 1/4' spacers there's a good chance the control arm would slice through the inner sidewall



This picture speaks for itself


^^ thats a big beer 2 the 710 ml^^


sorry but I don't own a camera so there all shitty blackberry pics but you get the jist

hopefully there's somewhere that can fit in the 4runner for an alignment tomorrow so we can go wheeling!!!

Last edited by 00EM1; 11-27-2009 at 11:20 PM.
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Old 11-29-2009, 10:51 AM   #21
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thats sweet man, thanks for the little write up!...ill have to post some pics when i get done
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Old 12-09-2009, 05:31 PM   #22
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what kind of offset rim do you think i could run in a 15x8-9 to give my surf a wider stance, im getting the rubber shortly, but im not sure what rim offset rim i should get for these to get a nice aggressive wide stance, without putting to much stress on hubs and axles?
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Old 12-18-2009, 12:48 AM   #23
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if your planning on running a 12.5 wide tire I would definitely run a 10 inch wide rim.
3.75 to 4.5 inch backspace is fairly standard, shouldn't have to run wheel spacers with that.
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Old 12-19-2009, 01:20 AM   #24
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How thick are those balljoint spacers?Looking at fabbing a set for my truck.
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Old 12-19-2009, 05:04 PM   #25
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1.5"
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