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Old 03-11-2010, 09:21 PM   #1
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Bargaining Power on a New Car

So I have a car cost canada pricing on a car that i want...there it mentions the 'wholesale' price. With this knowledge in hand, how much more on top do you think is fair to give 'em? or do i screw em, and give 'em nothing over the wholesale price (besides tax)?

How do you add some stuff for free? tell them before hand or after the fact? stuff like car mats, free oil changes for x years and all of that...

Would like to know should i be polite and be run over by these 'pros' or be a jerk and be a hard-ass?

TIA
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Old 03-11-2010, 09:46 PM   #2
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is it an import, euro, domestic?

speaking for import experience (nissans), you wont get much off the price. lets say the car is 20-25k new + taxes... chances are you might get an additional $500-1500 off depending on the model and what dealer programs are going on. by this i mean Nissan Canada has like a ''sale'' or promotions on certain models which might get you a few bucks off. check with the dealership to see if there are any sales/promotions are on or check the mfg website.

also, if you are a recent grad (within 48 mo), you are likely elegable for some money off and/or lower interest rate. you have to bring in your diploma/degree. one ive seen as of last month is a PST rebate on specific models/trims.

you can definatly ask about lifetime oil changes/car washes ... its not too unreasonable. any oem accessories, if smaller, should be reasonable to ask - such as rubber floor mats, trunk liner, hood deflector, ect. if you asked for 1-3 you should get them, but if you ask for a a large list or expensive items (ie: spoiler) it prob wont happen as the Sales department has to litteraly buy them from the Parts department. same goes with the Service department.

undercoating and bedliners will are almost never be included. again same thing applies - sales has to buy it from parts.

i would expect these rules would apply to all imports (honda, toyota, mazda, ect). ask and you'll find out.



to give you a scenario, here is what i got for my friend from my old nissan dealership.

2010 Rogue SL w/ Premium package.
$1500 off for friends/family
$1000 off for PST rebate (from Nissan Canada)
$500 off for being a recent grad (from Nissan Canada)
.25% less interest for being recent grad (from Nissan Canada)
4 free oil changes for being recent grad (from Nissan Canada)
free rubber floor mats ($80-100 value)
rear bumper protector and trunk liner were bought at discount but she asked after she bought the car. theres a small chance that she could have got them included in the deal IF she asked at the time the deal was being written up.
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Old 03-12-2010, 01:13 AM   #3
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^ i was looking at a new Subaru forester for my mum, thanks for the info man
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Old 03-12-2010, 01:39 AM   #4
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I got $5000 off Acura MSRP...
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Old 03-12-2010, 02:54 AM   #5
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It depends on the model and the dealership. I usually tack $2-3000 (before incentives etc) on top of the "wholesale" price if I am dealing with Canadian dealers. Asking for free oil change is just tacky and not very useful, get extended service / warranty instead.

You can't expect the dealer to sell you the car a wholesale price. That's just bad business and unrealistic expectations.

I think ~4% for 1/2 hour of paperwork is more than fair. A bit more if you need to custom order, but I usually have that all filled out when I go to the dealership. I usually know what I want and let them know I know the wholesale price up front, there is no pussyfooting around.

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Old 03-12-2010, 09:50 AM   #6
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what are the best ways to find out wholesale pricing on different brands and models?
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Old 03-12-2010, 11:36 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JesseBlue View Post
So I have a car cost canada pricing on a car that i want...there it mentions the 'wholesale' price. With this knowledge in hand, how much more on top do you think is fair to give 'em? or do i screw em, and give 'em nothing over the wholesale price (besides tax)?

How do you add some stuff for free? tell them before hand or after the fact? stuff like car mats, free oil changes for x years and all of that...

Would like to know should i be polite and be run over by these 'pros' or be a jerk and be a hard-ass?

TIA
You don't have to be a hard-ass, but you don't have to be a floormat either. Just be assertive. If you feel you are giving a fair offer, stick to it.

The dealership will not sell you a car that they don't make a profit on.

When I bought my car, the salesman had to talk to his manager THREE times before they settled on my offer. The second time he came back, I told him "Look, I WILL buy today if you accept my offer". That did the trick.
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Old 03-12-2010, 04:04 PM   #8
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I had used carcost canada. There was another one, but it didn't offer BMW / Mercedes prices.. so they offered a refund.

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what are the best ways to find out wholesale pricing on different brands and models?
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Old 03-12-2010, 04:41 PM   #9
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cool thanx
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Old 03-12-2010, 05:40 PM   #10
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Quote:
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It depends on the model and the dealership. I usually tack $2-3000 (before incentives etc) on top of the "wholesale" price if I am dealing with Canadian dealers. Asking for free oil change is just tacky and not very useful, get extended service / warranty instead.

You can't expect the dealer to sell you the car a wholesale price. That's just bad business and unrealistic expectations.

I think ~4% for 1/2 hour of paperwork is more than fair. A bit more if you need to custom order, but I usually have that all filled out when I go to the dealership. I usually know what I want and let them know I know the wholesale price up front, there is no pussyfooting around.
but don't they always tack on this 'administrative' fees for that paperwork? or is that the aftersale paperwork and what you mean is the pre-sale paperwork?

tacking on 2-3 grand then basically means you will pay 1-2k above msrp then basically it will be useless to haggle if you end up paying more than what they are expecting...

reason for me asking all these questions is that i've already been screwed before by being a noob and a misinformed consumer...my last new car purchase i didn't haggle and still paid their 7% apr financing...this was a honda...
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Old 03-12-2010, 06:34 PM   #11
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i got 3000-4000 off for the subaru, and 6000 off for the mazda3.

i asked the sales guy from subaru to give me the total final price with tax and everything included, knowing the total, i thought of a fair price in my mind and told the sales guy that this is the final price that i will write a cheque for.
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Vtec doesn't kick in on Reverse.
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Old 03-12-2010, 06:46 PM   #12
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Quote:
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i got 3000-4000 off for the subaru, and 6000 off for the mazda3.

i asked the sales guy from subaru to give me the total final price with tax and everything included, knowing the total, i thought of a fair price in my mind and told the sales guy that this is the final price that i will write a cheque for.
so you paid in cash...isn't this a little bit different if paying through financing?
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Old 03-12-2010, 09:11 PM   #13
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The "administrative" fee etc you just can't negotiate. They are just there. The 2-3k is to the salesman.. What I am saying is paying a sales a few percentage of the MSRP to ensure quite transaction is worth it. Personally I rather have a price that both party are happy with before I go into a dealership. My time is more valuable than sitting around at the dealerships for a few bucks off.

In the end with all the options and taxes it will go over MSRP. Are you going to haggle over that too? If you do, you will be at the dealership for a looong time.

You can talk all you want, but you are not going to get the dealer to sell it below their price.

Quote:
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but don't they always tack on this 'administrative' fees for that paperwork? or is that the aftersale paperwork and what you mean is the pre-sale paperwork?

tacking on 2-3 grand then basically means you will pay 1-2k above msrp then basically it will be useless to haggle if you end up paying more than what they are expecting...

reason for me asking all these questions is that i've already been screwed before by being a noob and a misinformed consumer...my last new car purchase i didn't haggle and still paid their 7% apr financing...this was a honda...
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Old 03-13-2010, 12:03 AM   #14
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have u guys heard of private dealers? where they are a licensed dealer, but they can sell many different brands of car.
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Old 03-13-2010, 12:37 AM   #15
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friend got $4000 (not sure if it's the MSRP or after taxes) off a Nissan Maxima SE.

I got $6500 off the MSRP for an Acura tsx.

It really depends on the time of the year, the salesperson, the inventory, and YOU.
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Old 03-13-2010, 01:43 AM   #16
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Quote:
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so you paid in cash...isn't this a little bit different if paying through financing?
u never mentioned anything about financing in ur original post.
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I had some girl come into the busser station the other day trying to make out with every staff member and then pull down her pants and asked for someone to stick a dick in her (at least she shaved).
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Vtec doesn't kick in on Reverse.
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its like.. oh yeah oh yeah.. ohhhh yeah... OOoooOohh... why's it suddenly feel a bit better... ohhhh yeahh... ohhh...oh..fuck... it probably ripped.
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Old 03-13-2010, 03:59 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RX_Renesis View Post
i got 3000-4000 off for the subaru, and 6000 off for the mazda3.

i asked the sales guy from subaru to give me the total final price with tax and everything included, knowing the total, i thought of a fair price in my mind and told the sales guy that this is the final price that i will write a cheque for.
$6000 off? Which dealer? I know the cost on your car. They took a loss?

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Old 03-13-2010, 04:02 PM   #18
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$6000 off? Which dealer? I know the cost on your car. They took a loss?

Kev
i forgot the exact number, but it was QUITE A BIT.
there was manufacture cash rebate + the discount he gave me.
i guess being close friends with the saleman helps??
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I had some girl come into the busser station the other day trying to make out with every staff member and then pull down her pants and asked for someone to stick a dick in her (at least she shaved).
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Vtec doesn't kick in on Reverse.
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its like.. oh yeah oh yeah.. ohhhh yeah... OOoooOohh... why's it suddenly feel a bit better... ohhhh yeahh... ohhh...oh..fuck... it probably ripped.

Last edited by TOPEC; 03-13-2010 at 04:10 PM.
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Old 03-14-2010, 01:10 AM   #19
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There are a few however they mostly deal with US cars. (a few of the sponsors).. most higher end European cars require ordering eg BMWs, Mercedes etc. only an authorized dealer can do them.

It depends what level of customization you want.

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have u guys heard of private dealers? where they are a licensed dealer, but they can sell many different brands of car.
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Old 03-15-2010, 10:57 PM   #20
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I got $5000 off Acura MSRP...

thats an Acura Canada offer. its very common to see 2-5k discounts if your buying the car outright 100%. if your not buying the car outright, then they may only offer $0-1500 off and/or maybe a bit lower interest rate if you put money down. im pretty sure its that way with all Import Mfgs. Nissan at one point had 7000 off a specific model of New Titan... but you had to buy the car 100% then and there. as its already been stated here... the model, time of year, dealer programs, and how you pay will vary the price on the car. check with your dealers or online for details.


to respond to some of the other posts in there ...

1) in almost ALL cases, a processing fee is typically only charged on USED Cars. new last years models can be included into this (Maybe Merc, BMW, ect might charge something on new cars but i dont know 100%). a fee could be $300-1000 depending on each dealership and how much they want to charge (again its typically on USED cars). it pays for things like icbc lien checks, icbc accident checks, air care (if needed), usually a safety inspection (AND replacing of parts if needed. ie: tires), paint cleanup (if needed), and complete car detailing/shampoo'ing. i know it sucks to pay it but its ALOT that they do and you couldnt do it for any less. trust me on this.

2) FALSE on that the sales guy gets that process fee no matter if its $300 or $3000. if they were getting it, and a salesmen sold 10 cars a month (very easy), thats $3-30k a month! 36-360k a year in just fee's ... i dont think so! any fee would likely go to admin costs or the dealership for various reasons. each dealership opporates differently. if youre paying a financing fee on a new car, imo youre getting taken to the cleaners. that being said, your avg car sales guy isnt clearing $100k/yr unless they've been in the business for a loooong time (10-20+ yrs) and has a great customer portfolio.

3) im sure most dealerships dont like to deal with "on the road pricing" and especailly not in a shot gun type of manner. it does happen though. at the end of the day, the numbers have to make sense/add up to the dealership. i wouldnt expect this to work when purchasing a new car but more likely on a used car.

4) friends and family discounts DO exist! it will vary on the model of car and even time of year. like i mentioned, i got my friend $1500 off for bringing her in.

5) asking for an extd warranty, to me, seems the least likely to be thrown in as its usually 3rd party covering the car after the mfg warranty. if you got it, good on you but the dealership has to pay for this out of their pocket. its a similar scenario as to asking for a list of OEM accessories. it affects their bottom line and dealerships cant opporate if they dont make money. ask away but dont be surprised or hurt if you dont get it. just my $.02 ...

Last edited by minivan_don; 03-15-2010 at 11:27 PM.
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