BC Conservative Party?

[rslater]

This is how the liberals are going to win next election. Prior to elections they are going to say that the success of the HST on BC's economy has allowed the government to raise the minimum wage to $10 an hour.

[Culture_Vulture]

Originally Posted by JD¹³

Yes it will, because in Australia it's a serious offense not to vote. It also makes it so that whoever is in power actually has the true majority of the vote, they represent what the population wants because EVERYONE had their say. They don't just get in because they were the "best option" and 50% of the eligible voters didn't care enough to do so - like Canada.

Your argument is predicated on that every vote makes a positive difference.
What about those who know little about politics? And the marginalized? And what about those who just outright don't give a shit, but are forced to vote?

[taylor192]

Originally Posted by JD¹³

Canada needs to adopt Australia's policy that voting is required by law.

No we don't. If your vote isn't educated, it is best spoiled or not cast.

The best example I have of this was a city council riding in Ottawa. The incumbent won time after time, although he never showed for city council meetings and didn't do anything for his riding. Why did he win? People ignorantly vote for the incumbent when they don't know any better and things seem fine.

Originally Posted by JD¹³

We need their immigration policies too as far as I'm concerned but that's another thread entirely.

Cause with a birth rate < 2 among established Canadians we really need a declining population and deflation to set in.

You'll be happy to know Australia is a high immigration country like Canada, and that immigration is all that's keeping our population growth positive.

[taylor192]

Originally Posted by carisear

btw we had a politics section at one time .. i remember quite well seeing johnny get flamed non stop in it :P

Do you know, or any mod care to elaborate what happened to it?

[Sid Vicious]

immigration isn't really a problem, it's just the immigrants tendency to form ethnic enclaves

[taylor192]

Originally Posted by Sid Vicious

immigration isn't really a problem, it's just the immigrants tendency to form ethnic enclaves

This is going off-topic, yet why do you think we have "little Italy" in most Canadian cities. Even during European immigration that dominated the early Canadian history this was still true. We just notice it more today cause the cultures are very different than the European cultures that settled here originally.

[Lomac]

Originally Posted by taylor192

Do you know, or any mod care to elaborate what happened to it?

I set one up a few years back (Current Events Forum) but it wasn't active enough to justify remaining as it's own subforum. We merged it with VOT after one of our major upgrades a while ago.

[Lomac]

As for the thread... Well, there's no way in hell that I'd vote for Bill regardless of whatever party he would head. I'm more or less a Liberal, though more along the lines of the Federal party, not the Provincial since they tend to basically fall under the same category as the Federal's Conservative party. The NDP has fucked BC over too many times in the past and while I'm sure Carol James has good intentions, I have no faith in their platform or their ideas of how to fix certain aspects of the economy, their take on taxation, and many other issues.

Personally I have no problem with the HST. Yes, I really don't like how it was implemented, but I notice very little in the way of a difference when I go out and spend money. Most things I buy were already subjected to both PST and GST, and those that were PST exempt beforehand, well... it's not hard to cut back on 'em. So my morning coffee and bagel costs an extra fifteen cents... so my next car might end up being an extra couple thousand after all is said and done... boohoo. I can live with having slightly less change in my car for the first, and I'll just save up for an extra couple weeks for the second. Oh well, it's life. I'd rather have a lower income tax and a higher consumption tax than the other way around. It just means I can be more aware of what I spend my money on, and if I don't spend the money, it's more to save.

At least we aren't paying European gas prices.

[goo3]

Originally Posted by TheNewGirl

Lowered income tax actually hampers stimulus efforts and most of the economic experts say that we would be better off increasing income tax for the top tax brackets.

Lower tax (income or sales) increases stimulus in the economy.

The media is not the place to learn about basic econ. 80% of the experts on tv are liars. If your house had no windows, they'd try to convince you that the sky is purple.

Originally Posted by Sid Vicious

immigration isn't really a problem, it's just the immigrants tendency to form ethnic enclaves

You might as well not have immigration in a free country. Or only allow Canadians to immigrate to Canada, LOL.

[JD¹³]

The theory behind the Australian policy is that if you are required by law to vote you will take at least take the time to learn the differences between parties and vote accordingly. That has been the case with all my Australian friends and their families. They, unlike a LOT of Canadians, care about their country and the governing of it.

Yes Australia is a pro-immigration country but they don't just let anyone in. They have a points system and are very selective. Don't speak English? Don't have a degree or sponsoring employer? Don't pass the national knowledge test after having permanent residency for a minimum of 2 years? You're probably going to be denied. One things for damn sure, the Navy turns away ALL the boats full of freeloaders that Canada so generously let in to suck away money and resources from Canadians themselves. Pathetic.

Anyways way off topic... Carry on
Posted via RS Mobile

[Meowjin]

i will support any party that introduces a 100 dollar fee to enter a casino in bc.

[quasi]

Originally Posted by MajinHurricane

i will support any party that introduces a 100 dollar fee to enter a casino in bc.

The Government benefits from the Casino more then anyone, would never happen. You'd have a better chance finding a party that will pay models to suck your dick for your vote.

[taylor192]

Originally Posted by JD¹³

The theory behind the Australian policy is that if you are required by law to vote you will take at least take the time to learn the differences between parties and vote accordingly. That has been the case with all my Australian friends and their families. They, unlike a LOT of Canadians, care about their country and the governing of it.

Yes Australia is a pro-immigration country but they don't just let anyone in. They have a points system and are very selective. Don't speak English? Don't have a degree or sponsoring employer? Don't pass the national knowledge test after having permanent residency for a minimum of 2 years? You're probably going to be denied.

I have 2 friends that have immigrated to Australia 3 years ago, and were in Canada to visit this summer. They were surprised that I knew more about their politics than they did. So in theory it is a great idea, in practice it just doesn't work, cause they both could care less who is in power.

Australia is harder to immigrate to than Canada, yet don't be fooled by the points and selection system. For a long time being a hair dresser qualified for immigration.

[taylor192]

Originally Posted by TheNewGirl

Lowered income tax actually hampers stimulus efforts and most of the economic experts say that we would be better off increasing income tax for the top tax brackets.

I love Ron Paul's backing of a flat tax. For years the income tax burden has been shifted to the middle class cause the rich can afford investments that are tax preferred, and accountants/lawyers to find all the loopholes.

[TheNewGirl]

Originally Posted by taylor192

No we don't. If your vote isn't educated, it is best spoiled or not cast.

The best example I have of this was a city council riding in Ottawa. The incumbent won time after time, although he never showed for city council meetings and didn't do anything for his riding. Why did he win? People ignorantly vote for the incumbent when they don't know any better and things seem fine.


Cause with a birth rate < 2 among established Canadians we really need a declining population and deflation to set in.

You'll be happy to know Australia is a high immigration country like Canada, and that immigration is all that's keeping our population growth positive.

If your vote is uneducated you should still go in and spoil a vote. Demographics of voters are VERY Important to politicians and define the platforms they run on and the issues they pander to.

If you as a young person don't vote. Politicians go 'Young people don't vote' and they'll never ever ever ever ever address issues that are important to you and your peers.

Also yes, we in Canada DESPERATELY need immigration other wise those of us under 50 will be crushed under the weight of paying for our baby boomer parents retirement.

[JD¹³]

Originally Posted by taylor192

I have 2 friends that have immigrated to Australia 3 years ago, and were in Canada to visit this summer. They were surprised that I knew more about their politics than they did. So in theory it is a great idea, in practice it just doesn't work, cause they both could care less who is in power.
They're not native Aussies though, so they still have the Canadian mindset towards politics

Australia is harder to immigrate to than Canada, yet don't be fooled by the points and selection system. For a long time being a hair dresser qualified for immigration.

At least they're letting people in with a profession that's not "Tamil Tiger"

[Meowjin]

i like how taylor uses a sample of 1 (or in his case 2).

[Culture_Vulture]

Originally Posted by JD¹³

The theory behind the Australian policy is that if you are required by law to vote you will take at least take the time to learn the differences between parties and vote accordingly. That has been the case with all my Australian friends and their families. They, unlike a LOT of Canadians, care about their country and the governing of it.

Posted via RS Mobile

While you're making more sense now, I still disagree with your argument.

The logic behind making everybody vote and giving everybody more reason to "care about their country" goes beyond the surface.
What it does, from the most realist perspective is it allows for a more efficient circulation of election campaigns and political propaganda.

Originally Posted by TheNewGirl

If your vote is uneducated you should still go in and spoil a vote. Demographics of voters are VERY Important to politicians and define the platforms they run on and the issues they pander to.

If you as a young person don't vote. Politicians go 'Young people don't vote' and they'll never ever ever ever ever address issues that are important to you and your peers.

For example, who do you think is benefiting from the increased knowledge of voting demographics?
On the surface of it all, of course the voters. But do you honestly believe that the vote of an uneducated (or otherwise ignorant) person will really make things better?

[taylor192]

Originally Posted by MajinHurricane

i like how taylor uses a sample of 1 (or in his case 2).

I prefer real world examples. JD13's examples could be just as skewed, cause my Canadian friends and family are quite educated on Canadian politics which applying his reasoning would indicate most of Canadians are politically aware - meanwhile a majority of RS members couldn't even name their MLA.

Or you can just nit-pick without offering any opinion on topic at all.

[Meowjin]

I did offer an opinion. I said I'd support any party that had a 100 dollar cover for BC residents.

[taylor192]

Originally Posted by Culture_Vulture

For example, who do you think is benefiting from the increased knowledge of voting demographics?
On the surface of it all, of course the voters. But do you honestly believe that the vote of an uneducated (or otherwise ignorant) person will really make things better?

You missed her point.

If politicians know young voters at least make it to the polls, they will start to campaign to win their votes. Look at the majority of campaigning, it is directed towards types of people who will vote, and usually skips issues affecting young people cause they know campaigning for these issues won't benefit them at the ballot box.

[JD¹³]

Originally Posted by Culture_Vulture

The logic behind making everybody vote and giving everybody more reason to "care about their country" goes beyond the surface. What it does, from the most realist perspective is it allows for a more efficient circulation of election campaigns and political propaganda.

Hold on a sec brb.....










K I'm good, you were saying?

[Culture_Vulture]

Originally Posted by taylor192

You missed her point.

If politicians know young voters at least make it to the polls, they will start to campaign to win their votes. Look at the majority of campaigning, it is directed towards types of people who will vote, and usually skips issues affecting young people cause they know campaigning for these issues won't benefit them at the ballot box.

One can argue, at the same time that, if youngsters don't care enough (for whatever reason is not important) to vote, not much good will be done if you just make them vote under the predisposition that compulsory voting will increase awareness.

The idea of making somebody show up to vote, regardless of reasoning, just doesn't click for me.

[TheNewGirl]

Originally Posted by Culture_Vulture

For example, who do you think is benefiting from the increased knowledge of voting demographics?
On the surface of it all, of course the voters. But do you honestly believe that the vote of an uneducated (or otherwise ignorant) person will really make things better?

Yes.

They know that 18-30 year olds don't vote and so very little of their attention is aimed towards trying to garner those votes. Nor is it aimed at pleasing that particular demographic when their in office. Who cares, there won't be any reprocussion.

Instead they look at people in the 50 + age group who have the most stable voting population and look at business & retirement related concerns. This is part of the reason our country and particularly our province has shifted right over the last 20 years. Even our centerist parties are increasingly right leaning. Because the left leaning folks outside of the very well orginized unions can't be bothered so the politicians don't bother with them.

If you want the politicians to start looking at issues that matter to you, you have to tell them that you're willing to get off your ass and walk down to a voting station. It really isn't asking a lot.

As I said I always suggest people who aren't sure or don't feel informed spoil their votes but make sure your ass gets counted cause that information of who do vote is readily available to the political parties and readily utilized by them.

For the record, I don't support manditory voting. But I do think poorly of people who can't be bothered to vote and then bitch about the state of their country.

[TheNewGirl]

Originally Posted by taylor192

You missed her point.

If politicians know young voters at least make it to the polls, they will start to campaign to win their votes. Look at the majority of campaigning, it is directed towards types of people who will vote, and usually skips issues affecting young people cause they know campaigning for these issues won't benefit them at the ballot box.

This is exactly how it works. I was a card carrying member of a federal political party for years and I heard people talk about this all the friggen time.