Need some legal advice

[Rotary_Rage]

About a year ago I finished my apprenticeship (Automotive collision and repair) I found a job right out of School, an old business that had bought into a franchise. I was in the process of buying some tools when my manager suggested I should see if my boss would cover the cost of some of the tools in exchange for my commitment to the company for the remainder of my apprenticeship. He agree'd to pay 2500$ of the tools purchased. My side of the tool costs where 5500$, total of 7500$ before tax.

We filled out a contract stating if I had left the company before my apprenticeship was up, I forfeited his cost of the tools. both side's agree'd and we signed the contract.

2 months went by and the business was starting to become a sinking ship, my current boss at the time had only paid 1000$ for his end of the tools. By the 3rd month the company had gone bankrupt.

Now I'm being told I have to cover the remaining cost of his side of the tools or they will be repo'd, when I have a contract stating that they were to be paid for.

My question is, is it my responsibility to cover the remaining costs? And can he legally take my tools?

I've still been paying for my end of the tools.

Any help appreciated

[quasi]

Was the agreement strictly between you and your boss? ie: you got loan for tools, he was paying you and you paid tool company? If thats case and he's bankrupt you're fucked, cannot squeeze a rock. If this is how it went down the seller would not give a shit if your boss is bankrupt or not because the agreement was between you and him.

If your boss had an agreement to pay the seller directly for his portion you might be able to negotiate with them a reduced amount on your bosses portion. It's more beneficial for them to get something if he's bankrupt then to take back used tools.

[Rotary_Rage]

I have the option to cover the cost of the tools. Right now I'm not working so taking on the additional 1500$ is out of my budget. Sort of a catch 22 because I need the tools in order to help me find employment, tools work in my favor to find another job.

[Shorn]

rule no 1: never ask for legal advice on rs

[Rotary_Rage]

Believe it or not RS has alot of knowledge you just need to weed out the few

[91LS-VTak]

I would imagine that if your contract was between you and the boss (the business), and the business goes bankrupt, then you're pretty much SOL. I would think that when the business is sold off (if it had any assets) the money would go to paying off creditors (people he owes money to). And he probably owes people a lot more than $1500

[Culture_Vulture]

Originally Posted by Shorn

rule no 1: never ask for legal advice on rs

I know for sure we have at least two practicing lawyers on RS. Now it's up to them whether or not they want to help the OP lol

[Rotary_Rage]

Originally Posted by 91LS-VTak

I would imagine that if your contract was between you and the boss (the business), and the business goes bankrupt, then you're pretty much SOL. I would think that when the business is sold off (if it had any assets) the money would go to paying off creditors (people he owes money to). And he probably owes people a lot more than $1500

by last count he owed 650,000$

[Manic!]

Originally Posted by Rotary_Rage

by last count he owed 650,000$

And the banks get first dibs. Your at the end of a long list of people he owes money to.

[StylinRed]

would need to know exactly what the contract says

but it sounds like you'll have to sue the business to cover the remaining cost of the tools

and they can be repossessed by then unless you fork out the remainder or go to court get a "stay of enforcement"

and in BC there's an option to creditors to either Seize Or Sue for the amount owing

if you wanna do some reading http://www.lss.bc.ca/assets/pubs/con...itDebitLaw.pdf

[parm104]

To be honest with you, legal advice online isn't exactly the best course of action. Take your matter before a real lawyer face to face. We would be able to tell you within 5 minutes if you have a legitimate case or not, what the course of action would be, and what kind of costs you are going to incur.

A "good" lawyer will look over your case, tell you whether you even have one or not, and then suggest; if it's going to cost you a LOT to litigate, to pursue court matters on your own and do all the clerical work with the law firm; or if it's beneficial for you to be represented, he will tell you to let him take care of it all.

That being said, this is most likely a small claims issue and you could even read up on the corresponding documentation online.

Making a Claim in Small Claims Court

Especially take a look into the "How much will it cost me" subheading on that website. It will probably answer a lot of your questions for you.

In a small claims court, after you file your claim, you will most likely get a Hearing date. On this date, you and the other party will meet with a mediator. This is not a person who acts as a judge but rather as a merit-finder to see if you have a case. As you are the plaintiff, you will need to be able to provide substantial evidence to show that you have a legitimate case to be heard infront of a Small Claims Court.

I understand you may be apprehensive of going to see a lawyer personally; as there are several costs that can quickly add up (consultation, clerical fees, evidence gathering.) But online legal advice is definitely not going to be reliable for you.

Best of Luck.

[drunkrussian]

op i suggest also going on linkedin and asking in the law section of linkedin answers. ive had some luck with legal advice there in the past
Posted via RS Mobile

[GLOW]

you could always try to talk to a law student from UBC

Law Students' Legal Advice Program

i used them once. basically a senior law student will open a file, take your case, give his 2 cents, talk it over with a supervising lawyer, who will give his advice, and the student will break down how they both looked at it.

not the same as talking to a real lawyer, but it's free and you would be talking to people familiar with canadian law. but there could be a wait list b/c it's free, so call and see when the earliest appointment is. there is also a delay as the students talk to their supervisors only once a week i think.

i dont know if this is a time sensitive issue for you

[taylor192]

For the amount owed, and current state of the business, I would suck it up and pay for them myself.

Even if you win a judgement, it will be a long time before you're paid, and the bills are due now.

[Ferra]

not much you can do to a corporation going out of business

You can take the case to small claim court yourself, but the process will take well over a year from you initiating the claim, to the settlement conference and you getting a judgement at trial.
and most likely you will need to take additional steps to enforce the judgement....(assuming the company still exist after a year)

for a $1000, it is not worth it

On the other hand, who actually OWNS the tool?? If the company has legal title to the tools and the bank has a lien on it, you could end up with nothing... (no tools, no money, and all the payment you made will be lost)

[vitaminG]

Originally Posted by 91LS-VTak

I would imagine that if your contract was between you and the boss (the business), and the business goes bankrupt, then you're pretty much SOL. I would think that when the business is sold off (if it had any assets) the money would go to paying off creditors (people he owes money to). And he probably owes people a lot more than $1500

+1

the business prolly has multiple creditors and they are not all going to get paid. No offense buy you are probably not too high on the list

If the business owns the tools legally then that would be one of their assets which they may be required to recover in order to pay other creditors.

[tiger_handheld]

I believe ubc law students also offers some sort of advise. i know a friend who went there to see what kind of legal options were available / they drafted a letter for him (no charge or very minimal - ubc kids want experience)

[Majestic12]

I'm a bit confused. Can you answer these questions:


1. Who was paying for the tools, your boss, personally, or your boss on behalf of the company?

2. Does the contract have a provision for reposession on partial payment or just if you left the company early?

3. Did you already pay your portion?

4. This is small help, but I believe what you're looking at is what's called a Purchase Money Security Interest. (PMSI). If you google it you can read up on it.

Sorry at work, and can't help too much, although I am a lawyer. But this isn't my practice area.

[GLOW]

Originally Posted by tiger_handheld

I believe ubc law students also offers some sort of advise. i know a friend who went there to see what kind of legal options were available / they drafted a letter for him (no charge or very minimal - ubc kids want experience)

Originally Posted by GLOW

you could always try to talk to a law student from UBC

Law Students' Legal Advice Program

i'm guessing it's this

[tiger_handheld]

We should have a list of professionals on RS.
username --- professional (doctor/dentist/lawyer/accountant ..etc)

edit: created thread.

[GabAlmighty]

I hear Mexico's nice this time of year..

[Zyzz]

Originally Posted by parm104

To be honest with you, legal advice online isn't exactly the best course of action. Take your matter before a real lawyer face to face. We would be able to tell you within 5 minutes if you have a legitimate case or not, what the course of action would be, and what kind of costs you are going to incur.

thats such a bullshit... Lawyers always say yes no matter what.

[parm104]

Originally Posted by Zyzz

thats such a bullshit... Lawyers always say yes no matter what.

Firstly, a decent practice that values their clients business will tell you ahead of time if you have a case or not. They can even do it on the phone. In our office, all cases are qualified before given to a lawyer. If our office cannot help and we feel there is another way for you to receive help that would suite your needs better, we will provide that alternative and give contact information for that alternative solution. In fact, we have on a few occasions, even gotten people in touch with the Law Students' Legal Advice Program at UBC.

Pleasantries aside, you must be retarded...This is why you're not a lawyer; your inability to read an entire statement before making a judgement or conclusion shows that you most definitely would be the type of person who gets suckered by a slimeball lawyer (and there are quite a few out there.)

If you read my entire statement, and keep things in context, you will understand exactly what I had said.

Originally Posted by parm104

A "good" lawyer will look over your case, tell you whether you even have one or not, and then suggest; if it's going to cost you a LOT to litigate, to pursue court matters on your own and do all the clerical work with the law firm; or if it's beneficial for you to be represented, he will tell you to let him take care of it all.

I never made a statement referring to lawyers in general and I certainly didn't make a generalization of anybody in the field either. I simply said, if you are able to find a good lawyer, he or she will be honest with you and help you in a way that suits your needs best. Hence, if a lawyer doesn't do that, they probably aren't a "good lawyer." It's simple logic; I would avoid taking the LSAT if I were you...

On a side note, it's people like you, professionals prefer not to give free, online advice to their peers. To have someone such as yourself criticize or argue against a legitimate and informed statement, discourages professionals from providing any sort of guidance at all.

[Majestic12]

All very true.
Including the part about not giving free, online advice.

Because if you are a client, then our advice is insured.
If you are not, then it isn't, and that's a headache to be avoided if something goes wrong.

It's also the same reason why it's not the best idea to give legal advice to friends/family when they ask "So, I have this problem I was hoping you'd be able to help me with...".

[FerrariEnzo]

Did the contract also states anything about if the company gone bankrupt?