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Vancouver Off-Topic / Current EventsThe off-topic forum for Vancouver, funnies, non-auto centered discussions, WORK SAFE. While the rules are more relaxed here, there are still rules. Please refer to sticky thread in this forum.
Summary:
- Li was interviewed by a group of foreign media last week about the Tiananmen Square incident
- Li was blind, deaf and couldn't walk after 20 yrs in jail
- Found dead hanging himself in his ward with two legs on the ground
- Other patients in the ward were sent away before that
- "Being suicided" is now a popular term in China
Quote:
Li was blind, deaf and had trouble walking after spending more than 20 years in prison following the Tiananmen Square crackdown in 1989. He was one of China's first labor rights activists and was jailed shortly after the June 4 massacre for urging workers to strike, according to Human Rights in China (HRIC).
After spending 11 years in jail, Li was released in 2000 only to be imprisoned again in 2001 for doggedly petitioning Shaoyang authorities to pay his medical expenses for injuries suffered through torture in prison.
They refused and he was sentenced to a further 10 years for "incitement to subvert state power," according to HRIC. He was released last May but his family said he had been under 24-hour police surveillance in hospital.
"It's unbelievable that he could hang himself. He's weak, couldn't really walk down from the second floor on his own," his friend Zhou Zhirong told CNN.
Friends described a man who was unwavering in his determination to fight for his beliefs.
"It's an insult to say someone like him killed himself this way," Huang said. "Li Wangyang said numerous times to me and others that he would keep fighting till the end of his life. He never quits. It's ridiculous even to think he would commit suicide and none of his friends or family believes what the police say now. He was killed by others for sure," he said.
Li's brother-in-law Zhao Baozhu told HRIC that hospital staff phoned him and his wife, Li's sister Li Wangling, just after 6 a.m. on June 6 to tell them that Li had committed suicide.
Zhao said they rushed to the hospital and found Li's body "hanging by the window." He noted that Li's feet were still on the ground.
"They [hospital staff] did not let us get near him, and did not let us take photos. Then they dragged his body away," HRIC said in statement on its website.
My question is why isn't there protest in the streets over killings like this similar to what you saw during the Arab spring? I know you're dealing with a communist government but Arabs dealt with similar governments and dictators but took to the streets. What, if any, event will make people realize in China that they deserve better and deserve a democracy and it's time to take to the streets.
My question is why isn't there protest in the streets over killings like this similar to what you saw during the Arab spring? I know you're dealing with a communist government but Arabs dealt with similar governments and dictators but took to the streets. What, if any, event will make people realize in China that they deserve better and deserve a democracy and it's time to take to the streets.
Once it stops being easy to make sickening amounts of money. Maybe when the majority of the world starts sourcing manufacturing from India and Brazil and other choices instead? And when more rare earth metals are found outside China?
That's the mentality I get here in HK at least. I don't even argue with anyone about it anymore. They think that since they can make lots of money, why should they care? The only people making noise about it are "poor people with nothing better to do".
Once the formerly rich people start losing their ability to be rich in a massive way, and become the majority, you might start hearing more noise about it. Who knows if or when that will ever happen though. Even universal suffrage gets swept under the rug once everyone was distracted with a free $6000 check.
My question is why isn't there protest in the streets over killings like this similar to what you saw during the Arab spring? I know you're dealing with a communist government but Arabs dealt with similar governments and dictators but took to the streets. What, if any, event will make people realize in China that they deserve better and deserve a democracy and it's time to take to the streets.
Why don't we? Do you really feel the american government has the american people in mind first?
The first thing that happens is complete disarray. So you may be a cog in a billion man wheel, but you get to keep the lights on.
Money. The answer to every question in the world is money.
In a system where the commies are the backbone to the whole chinese organization, you remove that, they die.
Furthermore, the people here that are making money off their backs also lose. The system starts to crumble. Who's going to make our cheap shit?
You think avoiding that is worth working for?
I read this the other day, one of the main messages of the 20th century was the states were fighting against communism. They have blockaded Cuba since the 60's. So where is that similar treatment to China...oh..there is a difference between an island that produces nice cigars, and a country that produces everything else.
It's such a nice little knot. Everyone has their heads up the next guys ass making it all flow together.
I will say, when China has Golden week, every warehouse in vancouver is dead about 6 weeks later as a weeks worth of containers just aren't there. It took us about 1 day to clean out whatever was left, and then an entire warehouse started sweeping up for 4 days.
You want to really fuck up the world economy? Turn off china while the population rises up.
I think that situation is worth fighting for to keep from happening in the minds of those lining their pockets. I'd say for a large enough deposit, its almost worth people dying for.
How much money are we talking? Well, a few years ago, Maersk(the largest shipping company in the world) bought P&O(the second largest shipping company in the world) just cause(well, they wanted route superiority but thats details)
Arab Spring did not happen in China because it was completely different objectives that the people were trying to pursue.
The democracy movement in 89 was sparked by extreme inflation, democracy movements did happen in 85 but was very insignificant compared to this one. It was simply a protest on the cost of foodstuffs but it slowly evolved into a democratic protests as students joined in. The Chinese notion of democracy is completely different from ours compared to the western world. The students simply wanted more say in government, freedom of speech as listed in the Chinese constitution and more judicial independence. They did not say much about universal suffrage, in fact some felt it was better to maintain one party one nation ideology. This is quite different from Arab Spring.
Another difference from the Arab revolution is from the prejudices of the students. The students felt that the workers and the peasants(for lack of a better term) are not educated enough for a Democratic revolution. It was the student's duty to guide the people for a better future. Consequently, you only see a student population at Tienanmen a during may/June 1989. Students rejected workers support until around June 1/2 1989 even though many workers felt obligated to support the students in their pursue for democracy. By that time, it was obviously too late to rally more support. Some scholars even pointed that students were following Confucian principles by looking down on workers and peasants. The one sided support meant the collapse of the movement as a whole, the Chinese government did not fear the students, they feared the workers.
Back in 89, there was no twitter, renren, sina etc. People simply did not know what was going on in Beijing other than word of mouth. Heck, people sitting in the west coast of North America had better coverage on what was going on. Arab Spring on the other hand had numerous cities and more people to rally support to topple regime versus China that had only Beijing and a few major cities to support. It is way easier for the government to control the protests before it went to full bloom.
China will never have an Arab Spring unless the economy flunks. People feel that today is good enough for them to live by. That's why you see the CCP purposely trying to prevent inflation. If people can afford stuff, live happily with benefits, they won't revolt. Freedom of speech/protest,/et al. may be important to 100,000 people but there's a billion that feel okay without it.
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how could you do that to somebody
