NCAA Slams Penn State
 

The NCAA came down hard on Penn State over the whole Sandusky/Paterno sex abuse scandal.

• A $60 million "fine" which must be directed to child sexual abuse prevention programs.
• A 4 year ban on any post-season games.
• All wins from 1998-2011 are vacated (Paterno goes from 409 to 298, dropping him from 1st to 12th overall).
• They must reduce 10 scholarhsips initially and 20 scholarships subsequently for the next 4 years, bringing their 85 scholarhsips down to 65.
• 5 year probationary period.
• Players for Penn State may immediately transfer to other schools if they wish (who'd stay playing for Penn if they have no chance of post-season play?).

I'd say they're sending a pretty clear message.

I still think it's not good enough.... You can't put a price on what happened...

^nothing will ever be "good enough", but I think this sends a strong message.

And the same argument can be used for any sentence that falls short of the death penalty for a murderer, IMO that is akin to circular reasoning.

Opinion piece here from the other side, but the writer has a point. The NCAA shouldn't have rights to interfere with school matters.

The NCAA Is Using Penn State To Justify Its Own Horrid Existence

tl;dr, the NCAA is waving their dick in an issue they really have no power in.

There are STILL ongoing investigations regarding now-NFL player Cam Newton being shopped to college teams FOR MONEY (illegal under NCAA rules), Ohio State football players receiving inpermissible benefits from boosters (gifts, again illegal under the rules), and Oregon allegedly using illegal recruiting services. However, they basically drop the sanctions at the drop of a hat, because it was under a national spotlight. The NCAA is the governing body for regulating college athletics, not a police organization against child molestation. They're punishing the entire school for something a small group of individuals did. Everyone else is innocent, and THAT is my problem here. As if tuition in schools wasn't high enough, this doesn't help and is punishing completely innocent prospective students by driving tuition rates up.

Do not get me wrong, it was absolutely horrible as to what Sandusky did and the cover-ups that followed. But I believe the NCAA overstepped its bounds by handing down what is essentially the SMU Death Penalty without making it look like that.

NCAA should have power..

If somone in the NFL or NHL was doing somthing similar, you dont think the League as a whole would take action? of course they would

Not sure if I totally agree with the punishment. Doesn't make sense to reduce scholarships and have a ban on post-seasons....that is hurting the students/student body. A much larger fine would've been more fitting in my opinion. This is almost like punishing an entire family for a crime that only one family member committed. Yes, I'm aware that there were many others involved, but 99% of the members of Penn State, whether that be board, faculty, students, etc, really have nothing to do with what happened. Just my opinion...

a monetary fine does nothing..

and by taking away scholarships they hit right where it hurts, also allowing players who are there now to leave without waiting a year hurts again

Honestly, i know there are reno's being done there but would you want to go take a shower after a football game in the same shower where sandusky was fucking little boys?

the program is doomed from this point on regardless, they will never recruit the top players anymore

Dat pun intended:fullofwin:

That argument is ) The difference between collegiate and professional athletics is that schools are PUBLICLY funded EDUCATIONAL institutions. They aren't in it for money like pro leagues. Kids go to play collegiate to have a shot at turning pro while getting an education at the same time.

What these sanctions have done is screw over the state of Pennsylvania by likely increasing taxes to cover these costs because Sandusky committed these crimes, not Penn State as a whole. They also screw all of Penn State because no one will really want to go there anymore. If history says anything Penn State will become a graveyard of college football like SMU (Death Penalty in 1986, only becoming successful as of 2010!) hurting the institution in the long run for not being able to bring in revenue to help out students.

i think thats a small price to pay when you've fucked up countless lives..

Football was what was subsidizing all programs within the school, the football team was basically a professional entity running within collegiate boundaries, the money and power that penn state gained was only because the program was allowed to keep running while the heads of the program continually covered up sexual exploitation..

without those coverups, the program would have never been what it is today

I know what Sandusky did was wrong, but for a public institution to be punished by a private, non-government run organization to punish the school as a whole for this? It just isnt right.

If the government levied these fines MAYBE I'd be fine with it, but then we'd have people complaining about government overstepping their boundaries and etc. You don't see the federal or Pennsylvania government coming after Penn State with fines, only the NCAA. At least they're going to something constructive which is fine with me. The NCAA is only supposed to be doing one thing: making sure amateurism is being followed by the athletic side of the school. Why should an entire student body and state have to suffer for the actions of a group of a select view.

I dont think the state could even administer punishment in terms of the actual program outside of civil claims against them?

The school doesn't have to participate in NCAA athletics!!! If you want to receive the benefits of the football program, you're obligated to conduct yourself in a certain way. What you're saying is they should get all of the benefits but none of the responsibility. The NCAA isn't overstepping its bounds; it has the right to dish out the punishment they did. Remember, this is about the cover up that went on for years, not about the crime! The law took care of the crime.

If they didn't want to hurt the whole school, then maybe the administrators, students, players, coaches, etc shouldn't have let the glamor of football blind themselves to something else more important and held the program to a higher standard than they did.

The NCAA has the power and ability to send a message that you can't just make excuses and wash your hands because "I conveniently didn't know what was going on." Well, maybe they should have made it their business to know instead of complaining about it afterwards.

Keep in mind that the NCAA cannot force these punishments upon the school(the fine for example). The school chose to accept these consequences in order to stay in the NCAA football league. Otherwise, they are completely welcome to continue their football program if they wish, but they would no longer be in the NCAA.

Sure, but that doesn't take away from the fact that future athletes who would normally be getting scholarships from the school will no longer get those scholarships....and future athletes get no post-season....These are people who had absolutely nothing to do with anything...

Let me ask you this, if all sports in college were just club sports, would the NCAA exist? Probably not. The only reason they exist is because of the massive amount of money that is being pumped into the schools.

What criminal charges did EVERYONE else at Penn State outside of those involved in the cover up commit to have 20 scholarships taken away, a 4 year bowl ban and 60 million gone? They've screwed the kids who are already there and have committed for 2+ years.

The NCAA process for dealing out punishment used to be very slow (committees, hearings, figuring out the ramifications of the punishment), but because this case was in the national spotlight they threw that out the window and went essentially what was on the Freeh report.

I'm not saying anything about benefits and responsibility. What I'm saying is, those DIRECTLY involved are either dead, their careers are in shambles or will get theirs in court. Those who "conveniently" didn't know what was going on, are dealt with. The football program and Penn State as a whole as it stands AT PRESENT has NOTHING to do with what Sandusky did to those children. They only thought about the past, not about the now and future for the football program. It's pretty much dead for the next decade. I'm not saying that Penn State should get off scot free, they'll get sued for sure and lose tons of money in civil cases.

As I said, the whole cover up of this is just horrible overall, but the NCAA shouldn't be killing an entire football program NOW because of what happened in the past when those who were involved with that are long gone or are getting punished now. The main reason why Penn State took the sanctions was because they just wanted this to get behind them and not seem like monsters for trying to fight them and making their public even worse than it already is.

The main reason Penn State took the sanctions, took down Paterno's statue, fired him before he could retire, etc is because today's administrators have a head on their shoulders and know their priorities.

The buck stops somewhere and not having direct involvement in something is not an excuse. That's how responsibility and accountability in an organization works. The reputation of the school and the future health of the football program is more than fair game. Not punishing them for their past actions because they managed to cover it up long enough where it only hurts current students and athletes is backwards thinking. If you're worried about that, there's other ways to mitigate the damage to the innocent. The first overriding priority by far is to send a message to Penn State and more importantly the other schools that if they fuck up like this, they are gonna pay. So don't fuck up.

College sports a great way to learn about competition and it's a healthy part of a school, until the ppl in charge inside and outside of athletics treat football like a drug and snort it like cocaine. These are the ppl to blame for killing the program, not the NCAA.

So the best way to blame those responsible for this is to punish the people who weren't involved? I'm a biased here because I hate the NCAA because some of their rulings over the years have driven me absolutely nuts but what they've done here is hurt an athletics program and has affected those who they claim to protect; the athletes. They've basically allowed Sandusky to out his mark on this program even though he has nothing to do with it. the NCAA is a Private non government Organization who only did this to show they exist. An organization with ACTUAL authority should be enforcing punishments, not the NCAA.

But if they chose to bow out of the NCAA, then the appeal to play there would be diminished quite badly. The school realized this, so that's why they accepted the punishment.

I'm not quite sure what to think of the punishment levied against Penn State. On the one hand, something obviously had to be done. There's no question about that. To be honest, I think them losing a good chunk of their wins and championships will hurt them more than the monetary fine. While I'm sure many of their donators will stop handing out money, there's enough people out there that the fine shouldn't be too hard on them. As for knocking down scholarships, sure it hurts potential students, but the NCAA is allowing current students to transfer to another Uni with no penalties if they choose to. While it sucks, I think it's fair enough. Sure, you're hurting 90 potential students, but I doubt most potential stars are going to apply for Penn State for at least half a dozen years, especially with the playoff ban.

I dunno, the more I try to think about it from both sides, I think the NCAA levied a relativley fair punishment against PSU. It sucks, yes, but ultimately I'd say it was fair.

I'd say it's fair too!

If a company does something wrong, say pollute the environment...then the CEO dies. Should the company not face fines/punishment even though the guy calling the shots isn't there anymore? What if the fines hurt the company enough that they have to lay off 50 employees..should we now reconsider the fine because innocent people are being 'punished'?

I think the consequence is the consequence, it's unfortunate that other people are being affected but sometimes life is just unfair. The athletes are free to transfer to other schools if they like, and the ones with any real potential will be welcomed with open arms. Less football scholarships? Who cares, like I said the good ones will get a scholarship elsewhere, the ones who aren't will have to come up with another plan like the rest of us who paid for our own schooling.

"It's unfair to punish an entire football program over what someone else did". This..this is why the punishment is so harsh IMO. Because the culture around college athletics in the states has become "football/basketball is more important than anything else". Well the NCAA is saying "No, it's not".

What I think is interesting is the fact that the school averages something like $60+ million per year from the Football. Meanwhile the athletes can't even take a sponsorship deal while playing for the team?

That's fucking bullshit in my opinion, if the school can cash out, why can't the athletes, especially when a lot of them may only have a short window of time physically?

It's the issue of "protecting amateurism" and not allowing benefits that a student-athlete can get that isn't available to a regular student...or so the NCAA claims. The football team is the lifeblood of any university funding. For example, Penn State brought in just over $73 million in revenue last season. With the fine+the Big Ten fine, last years books technically didn't exist.

Athletes can't even get a stipend because the NCAA doesn't allow it. Even with schools making a massive amount of money off these kids, the NCAA won't allow it because of "amateurism." The only kind of free stuff they can get is if they make conference championships because the tournament would give it to them. In the case of football teams, those post season bowl games are corporate sponsored so each player gets a swag bag and even that has a limit on what can be in it because of NCAA rules. for that check this out:

2011 Bowl gifts to participants - SportsBusiness Daily | SportsBusiness Journal | SportsBusiness Daily Global

Bowls are lucrative and players want to go them because it not only gives them exposure on the national scale, but its a reward and the stuff they get from them is about as good as it gets besides the scholarship they have (forget about having a job, its 6AM practice, 9AM class, practice/film again at 3, then an evening rundown before doing homework).

I'm not saying players are spoiled because they're going to school for free, but they work hard to go to those post season games because its a goal, like every other athlete, that they want to achieve and the NCAA has taken away those opportunities from current players. Even if they latch on, playing time at their new schools isn't guaranteed either.

The private NCAA has authority over their own private program. If not them, then who? What makes you think the govt can go in and tell them what to do? Their authority is real.. we've just seen it.. it's not fake!

I think the part you don't understand is when you hire someone to work for your company, their actions represent your company for now and forever. So you better damn be sure they don't fuck your company up. The students & staff represent Penn State. Penn State represents the NCAA. That's how things work because:

Imagine if it's like you say and only certain individuals get punished. Then there's no incentive to hire responsible ppl and eliminate bad behavior. For example, BP can keep hiring ppl who fuck things up time after time because they can deliver better results at no extra risk to them. Other oil companies see the same and will employ incentives for these guys to keep behaving that way. Yeah, it sucks for the employees who lose jobs, won't get raises, etc, who had nothing to do with what happened, but that's life.

If a Dad with 5 kids commits murder, should he not go to jail because the kids will be punished? You stick the Dad in the cellar and manage the effect on the kids. Blame the Dad, not the judge who dishes out the punishment.

Problem, Penn State doesn't represent the NCAA, Penn State represents wait for it... PENN STATE. Penn State does not work for the NCAA, they are there in ONLY athletics, no other connections are made. It's a state funded and run university, not private. There have been cries that the local Pennsylvania government has done little to deal with their own university, and they're the ones who have power. All the NCAA has the authority to do is exist and give out punishments and hope the schools accept them. Of course, they usually do because like Lomac said, it's about the appeal of playing at the highest level. You realize the NCAA brought in over $700 million in revenue last season right? And guess how much the student athletes see? Zero.

So by taking away these scholarships and banning post season play they've handcuffed Penn State and taken away educational opportunities.

Your analogy about BP is flawed because the amount of fuck ups vs. work done isn't exactly a good one. Who in their right mind would hire a constant fuck up at the cost of their reputation? In the case of Penn State, those involved are gone, dead or have nothing to do with the program now. My main argument is that the NCAA is wrongly punishing those who aren't involved. Which is what makes the NCAA punishment wrong.

My main problem with this is that the crime (child molestation) is a criminal issue, not an NCAA issue. The NCAA is only supposed to protect amateurism in the NCAA. Penn State didn't break a specific NCAA bylaw. The Death Penalty in the NCAA happens if there is a lack of institutional control. The biggest case this was used was the recruiting practices of SMU in the late 80's, an investigation that took 2 years. Wins are taken away if an ineligible player is used. Did Penn State break either of these? Nope. I understand that academics should always take precedence over athletics, but why didn't the government give out these punishments, then I'd have no problem with it. But the NCAA and how they do their investigations drives me nuts and their inconsistency with rulings has made it hard to accept that they have any sort of power.