I feel that if I attempt to apologize that he'll belittle and insult me further and reinforce the fact that I should never question him, even if it sounds wrong to me. I noticed that communicating with him is a one-way street; if he wants something he'll be as concise with you as possible, but if you need to ask for something, there's a condescending and annoyed tone in his voice.

id take it to the service manager, if its a bigger issue, the person in charge of that person, and if you get fired, talk to the owner of the dealership

theyre always tough assholes, until their boss puts them in line, seriously.

LOL just do what the managers wants and have it documted or prof that's what the managers want you to do so if something wrong comes up you are not on the hook and you are being told to do so by a higher up.

I leanr it the hard way. Don't agure with the managers even if they are wrong, do what they suggested ask them to send me an E-mail with what they want done so if something happens they are on the hook and not me.

i think while you're working as an apprentice for someone else, do things their way because they have made it very clear this is how they want it done.
when you open your own shop, you can call the shots, but until then.... unless your company has an open door policy and has absolutely no problems with changes and empowering their employees.... just do things their way.

it isnt worth losing a job over if you dont have another sweet gig lined up

Actually a lot can be said for this. I'm by no means the senior guy where I am and when someone above me asks me to do something a certain way I do it that way. I'll record why I did it that way but I'll do it. Sometimes it's just better not to make waves when your new. Once you've been there a while maybe you can argue for doing it another way but when you're new monkey see monkey do.

Some managers are ok with suggestions, some managers wants things done a certain way and it's final. You have to adjust on your approach to different individuals. Getting into a dispute with them and you will always be on the losing end, especially if you're an apprentice getting your first step into the shop.

You're going to experience the same thing everywhere you go. Eventually you will have to learn to how to deal with it appropriately, and that is not to just ignore it.

It also shows great maturity if you actually go talk to the person in a good manner than to simply ignore it. The damage has been done, but you can recover a bit if you're willing to take the first step to rectify the issue.

Oh, I see suggestions from some that you should report this to a higher manager or even to the owner. Seriously, you have not established enough in the company for this method to be effective. In fact, it may get you straight out of the door. In a workplace, the worse thing you can do is to report someone behind their back, let alone a person with high seniority in the company.

Interesting read. It's the CUSTOMER who chose to use synthetic, so regardless of what the "acting" manager decision is irrelevant.

If the dealership imperative to sell dino because of possible higher profit margins and pressure employees to sell dino irregardless of recommended oil by mfg or customer's decision, then it's your moral compass, financial viability, and your employable "worth" to decide whether you want to work for such company.

If sh1t hits the fan, ultimately the customer made the decision. End of story. Strong case for wrongful dismissal if you ask me :)

Not sure why I haven't seen this earlier. Just my .02c since I work at a service department as well;

Talk to the fixed ops manager if your service manager isn't the same title. If not go speak with your HR person there.

In reality, if the service advisor of that work order written up the LOF line specifically to use synthetic oil, AND synthetic oil was billed out on the work order, your ass is safe. Or at least there's paper trail to cover your ass for.

And good on you that you didn't argue with him during his meltdown. And best bet is not to mention about it to him again if you'd like to continue working there with a now inflicted impression.

Good luck

In a perfect world you did the right thing standing up to your acting manager, but in THE REAL WORLD you should of just bit your tounge and did what he asked you to do. A shop is a hard place to work in specially as an apprentice. You're only a first year apprentice...trust me, you'll see many more things happen in a shop that should never happen, but I'm just generally speaking of the REAL WORLD.

Update on this is that my manager sat me down for a talk. While he didn't give a shit about the oil issue, he brought up completely unrelated disciplinary issues that would never have been brought up had I not stood up to the acting manager, and I was subsequently given a written disciplinary warning for things that happened nearly a month ago. While I do understand that I have the odd problem with temper (I have been keeping it strongly in check for the last little while) and supposedly looking angry and frustrated all the time (It's how I'm wired - people have a "switch" that comes on that has them come off as an asshole when they play sports, mine comes on for work) , I feel that I would not have been written up had I not tried to stand up to the acting manager.

In short, I did the right thing and still got screwed in the end because the acting manager decided to dig up the past.

If you have a union rep, they would be a good person to talk to.

Also, lesson learned here: Don't start stirring shit if you have some dirt you don't want brought to light.

Over my many years working, I've learned that with the biggest assholes in your workplace... you almost ALWAYS have to kill 'em with kindness. Otherwise you're just gonna dig yourself a hole.

Swallow your pride, and start looking for a new job. Sounds to me you actually want to be working on cars. If you wanted to change oil all day, you could go work at Mr. Lube. No sense ruining a possible good reference, I mean you're still employed, so they obviously don't hate you.

I would try an work on your temper/anger issues and looking pissed off. Regardless whether you actually are or not, no one wants to work with someone like that. It's tough, but keeping working at it.

For the record, I think you did the right thing. Especially having the parts guy call Nissan to double check. If I were the owner of the 370, I definitely would have appreciated the extra thought that went into it. Too many employees now a days are like robots, and don't give a flying fuck about their work. Yes, it's important to listen to your boss, but with this peticular case, it should have been a great opportunity to earn brownie points with your boss, and especially the customer.

I dunno, just my 2 cents

send in a letter as a customer complaining about the acting service manager. it won't do anything for you now, but at least that might get management to keep an eye on him

I'll just chime in here, working as a service advisor (in a shop that dosen't technically have a manager, we all pull weight to keep things moving smoothly) I would be outright pissed if one of my mechs, let alone a FIRST YEAR apprentice went directly to the customer to tell them they need different oil after me already going through the work order with them and getting a work authorization signature. Regardless if I got it wrong or not. And to take it one step above and go to the parts department and have one of the parts advisors CALL another dealer, that tech would be on thin ice and if it was an apprentice, likely not working there anymore or moved off the bench to clean up duty for a while.

The right step would have been to go directly to the advisor and note your concern. More or less %100 of the time I will agree and allow them to do what they think is best, after consulting the customer of course, which is MY job not the mechanics. There are situations where I've had exactly the same issue with oil. Mech said it should by synth, however I was specifically told by the customer to run mineral oil but they didn't know this and if they put in synth I'd be on the hook for the cost if they made a stink about it.


Yes, by the sounds of it your service guy should have made the fix since the customer at the end of the day wanted synth (but remember the customer only said yes after you talked to them, which you shouldn't have). It should have been him, not you talking to the customer. There is an added cost of synth, and if I had a customer sign for $x for an oil change only to go back to them after the job with a higher bill because we used different oil (oil which they may or may not have known it was more money due to only the mech talking to them and not the service writer who would have told them the added costs) I would have had to still charge them for the cheaper oil because I didnt' have an authorization signature for the higher number.

Lots of things come into play, and I see it more and more on a daily basis that mechanics, even the old timers have absolutely no idea what really goes on at the front counter and how much of a dancing game it is with keeping customers happy and profits coming in. At the end of they day whether the oil was wrong, you shouldn't have done what you did. In my "professional" opinion. Sounds like you're pretty new in the industry, so take this as constructive critisim. There will be days you hate your job, I know there are for me but do your best to say yes sir and nod your head even if you don't agree. I do it all the time and it makes life a hell of a lot easier rather than stressing out over things you can't control.

No, it's not irrelevant. There is a reason he is the manager. And the only reason the customer OK'd the oil is because he was talked to by the OP, which should have never happened in the first place. Not arguing the oil was wrong for the car, but the method that OP chose to forward the information about the oil was very wrong and insubordinate.

Apologies for not clarifying this falcon, but I went to the advisor who THEN went to the customer to ask to use synth. I get what I did was wrong, but I'm not going to hang myself out to dry if anything happened.

Then it shouldn't be your issue and I don't know why this thread exists? The manager should be taking it up with the advisor then, not you.

Nope. Because it was a call that I made, and went behind the acting manager's back because I reversed a decision he made, it resulted in this thread because I reversed his decision since I did not want to put my own job on the line if anything happened as a result. When our dispatch plays acting manager, he micromanages every car that comes into the shop, even if there's no requirement of his involvement. It's led to numerous conflicts that has almost fundamentally rifted the shop, and I'm unable to say anything because I'm a first year.

Wow! Give it up already. Tuck your tail between your legs and apologize to your manager, even if you are right. You are going to make a lot of enemies in your shop if you continue on your path of know it all. You're only a 1st year apprentice???? Lol every shop has someone like you and no one can stand them. License techs won't teach you shit if you're going to question everything they do that you don't agree with. I know I won't teach someone like you or even let you watch me work. Just take out my garbage and sweep my floor. I mean this reply in this thread in a helpful way. Pay your dues and learn as much as you can From all the techs in your shop. Good luck:fullofwin:

^ I've pretty much dropped the issue, so I just answer any questions if anyone asks. I give nothing but respect to the techs and front end staff, but there's a limit, even as a professional, to how much respect I can give to someone who doesn't give any back. Even if that's the way work life functions, I won't yield to anyone that openly treats me like a dumbass. The tech I work under knows that I won't be learning much because of how work is directed, so I make the best of it and clean the floors.