Vancouver's Real Estate Market

[PiuYi]

Originally Posted by nabs

I went both to get more info, went to my bank and a few others on my own as well as had a mortgage broker look into it for me, I ended up getting a better rate at my own bank than anywhere else. I informed the broker, she said she can't match or better and told me to take the bank rate. (in 2022 for renewal)

Interesting, is that where you had the existing mortgage as well?

[JDMDreams]

Outside brokers just takes the money and run. So if you have any questions or make changes after you're Screwed

[EvoFire]

Originally Posted by PiuYi

Is there any reason not to go with a mortgage broker and just deal with banks yourself? Any possibility of a better deal?

A bank's own mortgage specialist will be able to provide better rates than a broker will for the same bank. Ditto if you have one that you've worked with and have a working relationship. It's in their best interest to get you a better rate and for you to sign with them as they are commission based.

The benefit of a broker is being able to cross shop major banks + second and third tier lenders.

Based on what I've learned from friends who have gone with 2nd and 3rd tier lenders, it's not worth it due to the fine print and other limitations. Only reason why I would go with 2nd tier or 3rd tier is if they have SIGNIFICANTLY cheaper, and by that I mean half a point lower, or you can't get approved with a tier one bank.

[Hehe]

If you meet the minimum requirement, consult into private banking as well. Our private banker was able to offer straight away whatever the lowest rate minus 0.1. Many will negotiate the PB rate and I think we pay nothing as long as we keep the investment portfolio with them. And that’s with premium account for the entire family and the best of everything from fancy credit card to your private banker for your day to day banking needs.

When I bought my place, I think it was 1.9 the lowest I was able to quote with broker, PB was able to offer 1.76 at first, then 1.7 when I was ready to pull the trigger.

[bcrdukes]

The only person who even qualifies as a private banking client, besides you, is Badhobz.

[JDMDreams]

I wish I can qualify for PB

[lowside67]

Originally Posted by EvoFire

A bank's own mortgage specialist will be able to provide better rates than a broker will for the same bank. Ditto if you have one that you've worked with and have a working relationship. It's in their best interest to get you a better rate and for you to sign with them as they are commission based.

The benefit of a broker is being able to cross shop major banks + second and third tier lenders.

Based on what I've learned from friends who have gone with 2nd and 3rd tier lenders, it's not worth it due to the fine print and other limitations. Only reason why I would go with 2nd tier or 3rd tier is if they have SIGNIFICANTLY cheaper, and by that I mean half a point lower, or you can't get approved with a tier one bank.

It is also worth noting that several banks (including ours, BMO and I believe RBC) will NOT provide a commission to an external broker, so a broker is absolutely not getting you a 100% cross-section of the market.

A broker makes a lot of sense for a scenario where you need a stretchy approval, or a secondary lender, but frankly I do not see the value they add for a straightforward approval with a big 5 bank.

-Mark

[6thGear.]

Only TD and Scotia pays out commission to brokers. Otherwise brokers fee can vary from .05% and up of the loan amount.

[Hehe]

Originally Posted by bcrdukes

The only person who even qualifies as a private banking client, besides you, is Badhobz.

It’s actually not that high. I mean, yes, it’s not that any Joe can go into. However, Many of my friends actually followed my decision and gone into PB just to save some money.

Depending on banks, I believed it’s anywhere between 700k to 1m in liquidity of some form and/or 2m+ in assets excluding primary residence.

I’d be shocked if hobz is not yet in PB considering many private bankers that face directly to clients are hot chicks and dudes. If hobz didn’t want it, Mrs Hobz I think wouldn’t mind some eye candies.

[bcrdukes]

"It's not that high."

I think the only other person who would qualify is noclue, but he keeps buying BMWs, so I'm not sure anymore.

[BIC_BAWS]

Originally Posted by Hehe

Depending on banks, I believed it’s anywhere between 700k to 1m in liquidity of some form and/or 2m+ in assets excluding primary residence.

I was gonna say... when I gambled my portfolio, I qualified for Nesbitt Burns.

[noclue]

I remember the bank assigned me some private banker dude in toronto who I suspect they picked cause he’s the same ethnicity as me. I sent his calls and emails straight to spam.

And Hehe’s right, the bar for private banking is relatively low in Canada. You made it if you qualify for private banking at US banks or amex sends you an invitation for the centurion card.

[bcrdukes]

You too, eh? They did the same when we went to the Porsche dealer looking to see the Panamera. With an army of sales people, they just HAD to assign me the fob Asian one. I declined and went elsewhere. Same thing happened at Lexus. Ugh!

[Badhobz]

Originally Posted by Hehe

I’d be shocked if hobz is not yet in PB considering many private bankers that face directly to clients are hot chicks and dudes. If hobz didn’t want it, Mrs Hobz I think wouldn’t mind some eye candies.

we were with HSBC and we had that HSBC jade status before it went tits up. i think that was private banking? i don't know.... we don't have a mortgage or any loans so I don't know why we would ever need a private banker.

All of that is gone now anyway with the merger to RBC. We still have the same account rep but RBC is garbage.

All the investments and stuff my wife manages herself since I refuse to let some retard take care of my money. Actually now that I think of it, the only banking I do is press PAY credit card on my banking app and that's it. Tiny midget either steals the rest, or hoards it away, or flushes down the hermes toilet. i don't know what happens. I don't really care.

its a weird fucking flex.. OH I GOT A PRIVATE BANKER!!! how is that a flex!?!!

[Hehe]

Originally Posted by Badhobz

we were with HSBC and we had that HSBC jade status before it went tits up. i think that was private banking? i don't know.... we don't have a mortgage or any loans so I don't know why we would ever need a private banker.

All of that is gone now anyway with the merger to RBC. We still have the same account rep but RBC is garbage.

All the investments and stuff my wife manages herself since I refuse to let some retard take care of my money. Actually now that I think of it, the only banking I do is press PAY credit card on my banking app and that's it. Tiny midget either steals the rest, or hoards it away, or flushes down the hermes toilet. i don't know what happens. I don't really care.

its a weird fucking flex.. OH I GOT A PRIVATE BANKER!!! how is that a flex!?!!

Nah. It’s not really to flex. I rarely ever need to walk into the bank unless I need a larger cash withdraw. And even that, they can have it ready for me. Anything else it’s just an email or call away from being done.

And they can bend some rules or make it more flexible, say last time when we were closing on a property, I had a RBC draft that I needed to cash from selling some stuff and use that fund to close. The rule was 24hr hold for any amount over x dollar. I was like, I need this done today. So gave my lovely bank lady a call, fund released immediately.

It just makes banking less stressful. And the fact that they have a lot of products in both borrowing and investing not available to retail customers make it more convenient when I need to get creative with things.

[Badhobz]

None of those things above required a private banker. Shit my broke ass parents who’s on the government tit can get that from their relationship manager.

[Hondaracer]

Private banking is like the guy making 200k with a $5000 annual fee credit card

“Bro my concierge can get me rolling stone tickets”

Ok, do you ever use it?

No

[Hehe]

Originally Posted by Hondaracer

Private banking is like the guy making 200k with a $5000 annual fee credit card

“Bro my concierge can get me rolling stone tickets”

Ok, do you ever use it?

No

I think it’s more like “for when I need it”.

Stuff like security backed loan, when I need the money but don’t want to sell my stocks, I can do that. Shopping around for mortgage rate? They can always beat whatever rate I can quote on.

It’s more than anything a convenience and to have those kind of flexibilities at your fingertips. And when it doesn’t really cost me anything other than parking my portfolio with them, IMO it’s a no brainer once one can meet the bar.

And they have things like private pool on investment opportunity. It’s just something you’d never see in retail banking.

That’s why I brought it up when the discussion was about finding the best rates on mortgage. PB was always able to beat whatever quote I got. That’s the reason many of my friends got into as well. They could get rates not available anywhere else.

[Gumby]

Hehe's definition of a "flex" is very different from us regular people...

[bcrdukes]

There needs to be a private forum for guys like Badhobz and Hehe. noclue doesn’t want to be associated.

[Manic!]

My dad got a small wooden crate sent to him a number of years back. It was an invitation to get a American express centurion (black) card. He looked at the fee's and said nope. You can buy blank Amex black cards online and have them laser engraved. Then you just glue on your chip from another card. Tap will not work because the antenna is to fragile.

[RabidRat]

Originally Posted by Badhobz

[...] relationship manager.

Anyone know if there's a way to get a relationship manager if you're not willing to let anyone touch your money? I only do self-directed investment unfortunately.

At the same time, I wouldn't mind these perks Hehe's talking about. It's not so bad in the US where so much more is automated & electronic, but now in Canada I'm finding that without an "in" at the bank, I'm constantly stuck wasting time in line at the local branch.

Customer service has been consistently abrasive and unhelpful as well lol. At least comparing CIBC to the few times I've had to talk to someone at Chase and BofA. Though recently switching to TD, they're seemingly a little better.

[carsncars]

Private banking isn't necessary but it is ++helpful, definitely more worthwhile than those "concierge" perks with some CCs which I have also never used. Agree on the not having to walk into a branch to get stuff like a bank draft - those things are conveniences/niceties.

I'd say the real value is in having a single responsible point of contact for basically all of my banking, doesn't matter if I have a query related to my Visa, mortgage, etc. I can reach out to the same person and she does a pretty good job of taking ownership of that. Once, I had a pretty stupid question about qualifying for a welcome offer on a TD Aeroplan card and emailed her, and she had her assistant call TD Visa to confirm the offer and that I personally qualified for it... I was fairly impressed by that as I wouldn't have thought less of her for saying "you need to call TD Visa to confirm".

Ours is also specialized in banking for people in our field so is aware of how personal corps work, so when it comes to working with the lending team you get someone that knows how salaries vs. corp income works. Same with our corp banking vs. personal banking.

Originally Posted by RabidRat

Anyone know if there's a way to get a relationship manager if you're not willing to let anyone touch your money? I only do self-directed investment unfortunately.

At least for TD, there have been very occasional low pressure mentions of TD Wealth Management but no, we have not taken them up on it and it doesn't seem to have negatively impacted the effort our banker puts in. We are pretty early career though, perhaps that will come later. At this point in my life all my investing is self-directed with WS and TD DI and my banker is aware of that.

My experience with HSBC was similar. We maintained the same banker with the move to RBC but it seems she has less latitude and is overworked, so the experience hasn't been as good. Scotia was also not particularly impressive and much more pressure to invest with their wealth management/investment arm (which they spent ++money to acquire so not too surprising).

Obviously all of this is very dependent on the individual you get though. My partner has a regular 'ol banker at Scotia that has been amazing for her and in many ways operates like a private banker.

[Hehe]

Originally Posted by RabidRat

Anyone know if there's a way to get a relationship manager if you're not willing to let anyone touch your money? I only do self-directed investment unfortunately.

At the same time, I wouldn't mind these perks Hehe's talking about. It's not so bad in the US where so much more is automated & electronic, but now in Canada I'm finding that without an "in" at the bank, I'm constantly stuck wasting time in line at the local branch.

Customer service has been consistently abrasive and unhelpful as well lol. At least comparing CIBC to the few times I've had to talk to someone at Chase and BofA. Though recently switching to TD, they're seemingly a little better.

You can certainly make it self directed. The way I did it was the following:

Go to every bank and tell them you want PB, tell what you need and let them come up with a plan.

I basically went to every bank where their private bankers prepared a sales pitch for me.

See which one fits you and go from there.

[bcrdukes]

If you don't really want to deal with a human, there's WealthSimple. $500K gets you their "Generational" tier and you have the options of self-directing. Personal banking, but not personal banking.

If WealthSimple is not your flavour because it truly isn't a classical example of personal banking, you can go the traditional route with TD and BMO since they have cross-border operations and catered to those who need banking services between CA/US.

Edit: I should caveat that a huge difference with WealthSimple and your traditional bank for personal banking is you can't get stuff like bank drafts and stuff like that since they don't openly offer them. If you're needing a bank draft and stuff like on a regular basis, WealthSimple is not for you and I would recommend against it.