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Old 07-24-2013, 10:36 PM   #76
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Quote:
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ronin - exactly.

majority of us don't take public transportation, why would we care.

but since im a complete asshole for showing no compassion towards them, and some of you guys seem to be saints....how much compassion do you have for them? are you willing to walk down a street with me, let me pick one out of a group? you can ask him to come back to your house, have a meal, clean himself up, shit shower shave the works, let him have a comfortable sleep and in the morning let him be on his way with 50$ in his pocket.

like ronin said, you wouldn't voluntarily sit down beside them on the street, and on a packed bus im sure you would be less than happy if the only seat left on the bus was beside you, and jimmy the crack head comes sitting beside you smelling of piss and alcohol while fucked outta his mind slurring at you and saying random things at you. how would you feel then? would you get up and stand near the door as if you were ready to get off? or stay there and ignore him until he leaves while his piss stained clothes rub all over your nice suit/dress/jeans? better yet, what if your on your way to an interview?? if you get up your no better than me. you may have compassion for them but not when it directly affects you.

what do you say when you show up to an interview/date/work and you have to explain to people "oh sorry, I sat beside a homeless man for half an hour on my way". highly unlikely, you'd do the same thing I would, get up and move.
You know there is a difference between blowing the guy and laughing at him right?

No one is saying they need to move into your house. Hell, some of us aren't even saying they should have free transit...what most ARE saying is a little compassion towards a human being goes a long way in life.

You didn't get to where you are on your own.
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Old 07-24-2013, 10:41 PM   #77
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No, it wouldn't. I'm currently not working because its not safe for me to use chain saws, cut off saws, jack hammers, grinders, and back hoes while working unattended in water. Epilepsy's a bitch, I love working outdoors, but I can always work an office job with epilepsy.
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In the light of your previous post, where you note you're unable to leave the house by yourself, I expected otherwise. Nevertheless, it's very possible to stretch beyond your literal circumstances to something hypothetical. Let's say, you were unable to work. Then, you would be in the same position as a mentally ill homeless person.
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Old 07-24-2013, 10:57 PM   #78
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Didn't they cut the benefit for emergency personal to ride for free? and they decide to keep free rides for homeless? If so that is something I do not understand.
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Old 07-24-2013, 11:10 PM   #79
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but since im a complete asshole for showing no compassion towards them, and some of you guys seem to be saints....how much compassion do you have for them? are you willing to walk down a street with me, let me pick one out of a group? you can ask him to come back to your house, have a meal, clean himself up, shit shower shave the works, let him have a comfortable sleep and in the morning let him be on his way with 50$ in his pocket.
This is a straw man argument. No one is saying that you should invite them into your home, but you should at least give them a modicum of respect. Do you know every homeless person out there? No.

I work downtown five days a week and I run into beggars all of the time. When they approach me asking me for change, I always give a polite smile and say, "Sorry, not today." In many cases, they tell me to have a great day. That's all you need to do - give some respect and they will repay you that respect.

I have never been manhandled, nor have I ever had panhandlers to tell me to screw off. I am not a physically big guy, but I am always respectful which is why I never have never had issues with homeless people despite taking public transit all of my life and working downtown for the last decade.

I am probably more well dressed than your average bus rider and I have had had homeless people in my vicinity who smell bad, etc. I usually have no reason to get up or leave my spot as most of the homeless are usually quite respectful and mind their space and belongings. And if you do encounter the odd person who is clearly high, well, it's not much of an inconvenience to move out of the way. What is there to be afraid of? I have never seen a homeless person run around with needles.
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Old 07-24-2013, 11:16 PM   #80
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You know there is a difference between blowing the guy and laughing at him right?

No one is saying they need to move into your house. Hell, some of us aren't even saying they should have free transit...what most ARE saying is a little compassion towards a human being goes a long way in life.

You didn't get to where you are on your own.
well aware of the difference. compassion towards another human may go a long way in someones life, but me giving them compassion does nothing for me in my life. I don't care if im an asshole for the way I think.

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In the light of your previous post, where you note you're unable to leave the house by yourself, I expected otherwise. Nevertheless, it's very possible to stretch beyond your literal circumstances to something hypothetical. Let's say, you were unable to work. Then, you would be in the same position as a mentally ill homeless person.
yes, epilepsy means I cant go out alone. for a lot of people they can easily go out and even drive if they've been seizure free for 6 months. for me, I have grand mal seizures, some violent, some that only last for 10 seconds, some that last for 4-5 minutes straight. I can be in the middle of eating dinner and all of a sudden I'll slowly blank out over the course of 3-5 seconds and every single muscle in my body flexes and jerks, if im holding a fork and knife, guess where those are going? food in my mouth, yeah that's gonna be a problem, my tongue gets bit open and ive swallowed it a few times already from choking during a seizure, which is why im constantly around someone. falling down a flight of stairs, dropping down like a fly in the middle of metrotown, during a movie and start kicking the shit outta the guys chair infront of me, out for dinner on a date with my gf and it happens....I don't ask for compassion. I don't want compassion from strangers.
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Old 07-24-2013, 11:40 PM   #81
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my god...what are you a damn psychologist or something, taking everything I say and interpreting it? youd make a great lawyer

its like your worse than one of those people who look at a picture of andy warhols Campbell soup can in a museum and say "look how the light shines on that part, it signifies the brightness in the world, while that section is so dark that it represents all the bad in this world"....NO...its a damn picture. theres no in depth meaning to it.

those who are still on a god damn payroll, people who have minor set backs in life, people planning on returning to work and actually do, they pay their taxes, pay for transit, a mortgage and groceries. if I hear a story of someone whos in that situation where they hit the gutter, my response would be "sucks to hear, but oh well, its a bummer".

im saying I don't have compassion for homeless people

my position isn't wrong because I don't apply it to myself. I have a job, I pay my taxes I contribute to society. if I was some lazy guy living in my parents basement on disability or ei and refused to get a job simply for the fact that I don't have to cause im being given free money, THEN I would be applying it to myself and calling myself a lazy prick who doesn't deserve compassion.

you show me a homeless man whos willing to clean up the city he lives in and contribute in a way that no other bum does(collecting pop bottles doesn't count). ill give him the most basic form of compassion that I would give others like I said in the previous paragraph. if your bringing a homeless man who sits on a corner begging for money just to use it to shoot up, then no, I could care less if something happened to him. no compassion what so ever.

show me how I do not work/contribute to society? I pay my taxes, I volunteer as a medic wherever possible, and I donate blood when I can. got something else I can do that a dr would let me, bring it to me and i'll gladly volunteer and pull my weight. im not asking for your compassion, I don't ask for any compassion from anyone I don't know, if they have it for me, that's their choice.

im on sick leave and im in a daaaamn good union that would prevent my income source from ever expiring. if I cant do my job, its their job to accommodate me to a job I can do. I still have my job waiting for me when I return, I visit my work all the time just to say hi. I plan on returning to work the day after surgery if drs would let me
I hope you meet a homeless person with epilepsy one day...
Count yourself lucky to be on a payroll without doing any work. Many others are less fortunate. No need to be disrespecting a homeless man when they already have nothing.
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Old 07-24-2013, 11:52 PM   #82
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I hope you meet a homeless person with epilepsy one day...
Count yourself lucky to be on a payroll without doing any work. Many others are less fortunate. No need to be disrespecting a homeless man when they already have nothing.
They have free transit lol (stir the pot up lol)
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Old 07-24-2013, 11:59 PM   #83
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I am beginning to think you do not know what the word "compassion" means.

You do know that lacking empathy is one of the main markers of being a psychopath, right?
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Old 07-25-2013, 12:29 AM   #84
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My solution is to hire a neighbourhood cleaning lady/ group to clean my rentals once a week as part of the utilities. I know it is impossible for a building like yours gridlock.. but my renters are mostly university students, I find it makes a huge difference, they tend to keep their stuff cleaner and I get to contribute directly to some old ladies' pension. So far I haven't have anyone complain.

As much as I like the storyline and acting of Breaking Bad.. Meth is a magnitude worse than Heroin etc (Do you know they execute addicts at countries like Pakistan because they consider them to be terminal?)

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Problem is, you can never quite always tell them apart from the self-entitled fuckwad that thinks the world owes them. They smoke, they drink and god help you if your apartment that you are renting can't honestly be described as "opulent". Think they know how to clean? no. Maintain a decent home? no. Cigarette burns in your carpet, oh sweet jesus yes! I think they honestly do that the first night they move in...I give up on cigarette burns being accidental. They fucking do it just because they can.
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Old 07-25-2013, 12:31 AM   #85
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I am beginning to think you do not know what the word "compassion" means.

You do know that lacking empathy is one of the main markers of being a psychopath, right?
im well aware of what compassion means.

I usually tend to agree with a lot of things you have to say.

but

I don't have to have compassion for anyone I don't want to. if you want to sit there and tell me that "its a main marker of being a psychopath" then please, go ahead.

seriously..screw off with trying to say that my lack of empathy is what psychopaths have. ive countless friends who would say the exact same things I have. and if I have one trait that falls into psychopath, I don't care....how many traits do others have that have them fall into that category? loners...people spending countless hours on the computer...not many friends...anti social....


if you were to meet me in person, im the nicest guy you'll ever meet. bring up a topic that I disagree with, and damn right im going to voice my opinion. like it or not, im going to say it. if you want to think im a tool for it, go ahead, feel free to say im a psychopath for all I care.

some people out there don't care for stray dogs or cats and some don't care about homeless people. I have more compassion for a dog whos with a homeless man for that fact that the dog cant get a job, the dog doesn't do drugs, the dog never had a chance, the best the dog could do is run away and possibly get picked up by the spca and if they're lucky, go to a nice home, if not, get euthanized.

call me an asshole, a psychopath, whatever it be.
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Old 07-25-2013, 12:38 AM   #86
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well aware of the difference. compassion towards another human may go a long way in someones life, but me giving them compassion does nothing for me in my life. I don't care if im an asshole for the way I think.

Spoiler!
health care and other forms of govt services/assistance like the aide i'm assuming you must have had during school, etc...if it wasn't for the compassion of strangers/govt even if it wasn't always in your face..you may not be here today... my point being that there are many services and forms of compassion that you receive from strangers, you don't have to appreciate it or want it or even agree with it, but it's there for you and im sure you can see how those services are beneficial and even necessary for others (if not for you)...as is transit for the homeless

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I don't want compassion from strangers.
That's all many people have, strangers

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Old 07-25-2013, 12:45 AM   #87
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Well Dino said his thing, Stewie said his thing, agree to disagree.. I don't think there is any need to say one's better than the other. If one thing people should learn about early 21st Century is pushing ideas and values on to others often backfires (US freedom experiments, Mr Robertson's bike lanes). People will come around once they have experienced it, if they don't every need compassion, then their lives is really lucky and perhaps they should buy a lotto ticket.

Maybe I am just old and jaded.

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health care and other forms of govt services/assistance like the aide i'm assuming you must have had during school, etc...if it wasn't for the compassion of strangers/govt even if it wasn't always in your face..you may not be here today...



That's all many people have, strangers
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Old 07-25-2013, 12:48 AM   #88
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I have compassion for those that contribute to society
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Some could argue that paying taxes and being someone who doesn't give a fuck about those less fortunate contributes a hell of a lot less to the world than someone who pays no taxes and treats those that they have never met with respect and compassion.
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Old 07-25-2013, 12:49 AM   #89
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Aint that a bitch. The only people that regularly carry change with them are the ones that get to ride the bus for free.

Havent taken a bus in about 10 years but i remember it was a pain in the ass when you had to break a $20 to get a few loonies and quarters
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Old 07-25-2013, 12:49 AM   #90
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Well Dino said his thing
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Old 07-25-2013, 12:52 AM   #91
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bus is a public space
Sure, it is. And if this goes through, it's yet another reason not to take public transportation.

And fill up at Point Roberts as often as possible so you don't have to pay the silly taxes that go towards garbage like this.

Sure, they're human but they're also wicked fucking gross. Especially in the summer.

Is there precedent for something like this? I can't imagine it being a good idea for tourism either but then again, everyone that visits Vancouver rents a car if they aren't crazy.
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Old 07-25-2013, 01:02 AM   #92
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Well Dino said his thing, Stewie said his thing, agree to disagree.. I don't think there is any need to say one's better than the other. If one thing people should learn about early 21st Century is pushing ideas and values on to others often backfires (US freedom experiments, Mr Robertson's bike lanes). People will come around once they have experienced it, if they don't every need compassion, then their lives is really lucky and perhaps they should buy a lotto ticket.

Maybe I am just old and jaded.
agreed, she said hers, others have said theirs, ive said mine. if they're going to push on me ill push back. so im just going to agree to disagree.

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Some could argue that paying taxes and being someone who doesn't give a fuck about those less fortunate contributes a hell of a lot less to the world than someone who pays no taxes and treats those that they have never met with respect and compassion.
I bet they treat others with respect and compassion for the sole sake of getting something out of it. two homeless men are beside each other with a hat for ppl to throw in coins. person A is seated there with a sad look on his face, quiet and humble, person B is sitting there swearing at people as they walk by, if people don't tip him he gives off a sarcastic "thanks for the change asshole" just loud enough for the person to hear. you've got 2$ to give to one of them, who do you pick? im pretty sure theres a damn good reason why they treat you with respect and compassion or at least pretend to display that they do.

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Sure, it is. And if this goes through, it's yet another reason not to take public transportation.

And fill up at Point Roberts as often as possible so you don't have to pay the silly taxes that go towards garbage like this.
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Old 07-25-2013, 01:08 AM   #93
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I'd give change to a homeless person. I'd buy them a burger. But if you told me to give a particularly gross one a hug, I'd tell you to go fuck yourself. That's not a slight against the homeless, that's against gross people in general.

You could be rich as fuck but I'm not shaking your hand if you didn't wash your hands after you peed. I'm not saying ALL but MOST homeless people are gross enough that I don't want them in my personal space.

And you're telling me they don't even have to PAY when I do? There is a limit to compassion and that's way past it.
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Old 07-25-2013, 01:13 AM   #94
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I do agree with that. I just took issue with a stupid blanket statement that was made. I'm not stoked about the bus situation either, but its far from a real issue in my daily life if a poor person doesn't have to pay to take a fucking 2.75 bus.
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Old 07-25-2013, 01:17 AM   #95
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Well Dino said his thing, Stewie said his thing, agree to disagree.. I don't think there is any need to say one's better than the other. If one thing people should learn about early 21st Century is pushing ideas and values on to others often backfires (US freedom experiments, Mr Robertson's bike lanes). People will come around once they have experienced it, if they don't every need compassion, then their lives is really lucky and perhaps they should buy a lotto ticket.

Maybe I am just old and jaded.
I don't know if that true. Pretty much nothing has backfired on Robertson. He got re-elected in a walk. Nothing will change because the hippies are a small but loud bunch. They go out and vote. If everyone in Vancouver voted, no way he'd still be in power but because the indifferent don't vote in great numbers, the hippies win.
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Old 07-25-2013, 09:15 AM   #96
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i take transit (bus and skytrain) to work downtown everyday. every minute i spend on there makes me want to work harder so i never have to take it anymore. it's my only motivation in life (not serious, btw).

i've seen enough disgusting stuff on the #7, 16 and 135 that i *always* stand on the bus or skytrain - even if there are tons of seats available.
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Old 07-25-2013, 09:48 AM   #97
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i doubt the skytrain is just gonna start filling up with homeless people just because they're not allowed to take it for free. most of them arent busy bodies, they arent commuting as regularly as the working class.

if anything, im ok with this because it gives homeless people one less excuse to find work.
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Old 07-27-2013, 01:47 AM   #98
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I might get failed for this but WHY do the homeless people even NEED to take public transit in the first place? It's not like they have to go anywhere, they don't work, they sleep wherever they want, sit wherever they want.
This just gives some of these people a greater range of coverage in terms of "potentially" breaking into cars/homes and otherwise generally stinking up places that aren't normally accessible.
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Old 07-27-2013, 02:11 AM   #99
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Because that's the m.o. Of homeless people. Breaking into cars and stinking places up. Jesus fucking Christ guys have you ever walked down the street with your eyes or ears open? It's fucking painful to see such blind disdain.
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Old 07-27-2013, 02:23 AM   #100
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totally off-topic, but on one occasion a beggar went up to my mom asking for money
mom didn't carry cash with her as she just got off work
beggar walked away and muttered "stupid bitch.."

yea fuck that guy
and fuck the obscene, disrespectful bums

however, i've met a couple of reverent, well-mannered bums
warms my heart, and i'd definitely be in advocacy of passes for them

the idea's still not gonna work out tho
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