ICBC Carrying more then one passenger as a N (Novice)

[rullz]

Hello All,
I currently have my N and wondering that what are the fines, points and penalties for carrying more than one passenger in Novice stage?

I know that there are some exceptions (eg; person 25+ or older with license or family member etc.) but my situation doesn't really fit in one of that category... Two of my old friends coming in town to visit me for a week so we gonna go outside with my car but I can't legally carry them.

so I was wondering that what are the penalties for it?

[MikeHB]

3 points on your record. 90 dollar fine if payed with in 25 days or something. I got the same ticket when I was a novice. Not worth I can tell you that from expirence. Let your other friend drive if its legal with everyone in the car.
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[rullz]

are you sure is that thing 3 points?
I couldn't find any info on icbc's website for some reason.

thank you

[MikeHB]

3 points, trust me got it a few years ago but I doubt it's changed.
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[subordinate]

Took me less than 10 secs to google to the ICBC page of fines/points

It's 3, for driving contrary to restrictions. and 167 fine.

[tiger_handheld]

25+ older with license.

One can argue that an individual from [insert country] who is 25 with a valid [insert country] drivers license fits this description...

[XplicitLuder]

you'd get a ticket of driving contrary to restrictions as someone said and that's 3 pts

[zulutango]

And you will not have valid insurance because you are not legally licenced if you break the restrictions. Get into a crash and your friends will be suing you personally because you have no coverage...and ICBC will be the ones taking the court action against you on their behalf. You will have to dump one of them on the spot when caught. Hope you are not stupid enough to risk all this & get caught. Sorry, this IS RS after all.

[skyline32]

Let's say you have an N, but your carrying 3 people in total, BUT two of them are your cousins with different last names though could you argue that with an officer by any chance? or what would be the best way to prove this? :/

[Spidey]

Originally Posted by skyline32

Let's say you have an N, but your carrying 3 people in total, BUT two of them are your cousins with different last names though could you argue that with an officer by any chance? or what would be the best way to prove this? :/

Passengers You are limited to 1 passenger—unless you're driving a passenger vehicle and have a supervisor 25 years or older with a valid Class 1, 2, 3, 4, or 5 driver's licence.

What about family members? This restriction does not apply to immediate family members: mother, father, sister, brother, child, spouse, grandparent, grandchild; including step and foster relationships..

don't see cousin in there.

Also the fine is 109 and not 167. 167 is driving contrary to restriction: use electronic device.

[- kT]

as spidey said. immediate family members only. $167 fine, and 3 points on your license, AND one of your friends is SOL - he'll have to get a ride from somebody, catch a bus or you'll have to drop your other friend off before you can pick him back up

[skyline32]

ahh i see, how many points can you get until you cannot drive at all ? LOL

[MikeHB]

6 I believe. With your 'N' that is.
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[skyline32]

wow so 2 times for practically anything and its over.. not bad

[bottle]

Last time I checked it's 4 points. With 4, you get suspension/ probation and you have to start your N all over again.

[terkan]

if your friends are visitor with driver licence just let them drive. if i recall somewhere visitors are allowed to drive in canada for up to 90days with a foreign driver licence and they won't be limited to the 1 passenger rule.

[dygital]

Originally Posted by zulutango

And you will not have valid insurance because you are not legally licenced if you break the restrictions. Get into a crash and your friends will be suing you personally because you have no coverage...and ICBC will be the ones taking the court action against you on their behalf. You will have to dump one of them on the spot when caught. Hope you are not stupid enough to risk all this & get caught. Sorry, this IS RS after all.

Not that I don't believe you, but why would ICBC not cover you just because you are overcarrying? If a car hits me and I'm overcarrying, it is still the cars fault, so why would any blame be put on me for overcarrying?

[Vege]

From ICBC's FAQ page.

Say my son drives with an N and violates the "one passenger rule," would he still be covered if he had an accident and the passengers were injured? What about the cost of damage to vehicles involved?

Unfortunately, young drivers are inexperienced and more likely to crash—which is why the “one passenger rule” is in place. If this situation were to happen though, your son will still be covered by insurance. However, he’d likely get a ticket or have his licence suspended for breaking the rules of the graduated licensing program. The rules of the program are in place to keep young drivers as safe as possible while they’re inexperienced.

So looks like your insurance will still be in effect if you violate the one passenger rule for a N Driver. Still doesn't mean it's worth the risk.

[zulutango]

This quote only says..."he had an accident". It does not say that if he was at fault and caused an "accident". Imagine a multi million dollar cost due to multiple deaths or lifetime care requirement...then read the back of your ICBC registration sheet in that red box....about "invalidating the certificate". If they are 100% going to cover him then why do they print that warning on the back of your registration? Given the option of paying out lots of $$ or making the at-fault driver responsible, and having pre-warned the driver, which way do you think they will go? Anyone here ever have an ICBC experience where ICBC volunteered to pay you when they were not required to? Just wondering.

[xpl0sive]

Originally Posted by zulutango

And you will not have valid insurance because you are not legally licenced if you break the restrictions. Get into a crash and your friends will be suing you personally because you have no coverage...and ICBC will be the ones taking the court action against you on their behalf. You will have to dump one of them on the spot when caught. Hope you are not stupid enough to risk all this & get caught. Sorry, this IS RS after all.

Wrong. ICBC will pay the claim. Violating a traffic law does not breach your insurance coverage. If that were the case, ICBC would not pay for claims involving a speeding vehicle either or someone not having an N on their car for that matter.
For ICBC to deny coverage, the driver has to breach the statutory conditions outlined in the Insurance (Vehicle) Act. Speeding, carrying too many passengers, driving without an N sign and a number of other ticketable offences do not breach coverage.

[dygital]

Originally Posted by xpl0sive

Wrong. ICBC will pay the claim. Violating a traffic law does not breach your insurance coverage. If that were the case, ICBC would not pay for claims involving a speeding vehicle either or someone not having an N on their car for that matter.
For ICBC to deny coverage, the driver has to breach the statutory conditions outlined in the Insurance (Vehicle) Act. Speeding, carrying too many passengers, driving without an N sign and a number of other ticketable offences do not breach coverage.

Yeah, that's what I thought as well...

[Raid3n]

Originally Posted by xpl0sive

Wrong. ICBC will pay the claim. Violating a traffic law does not breach your insurance coverage. If that were the case, ICBC would not pay for claims involving a speeding vehicle either or someone not having an N on their car for that matter.
For ICBC to deny coverage, the driver has to breach the statutory conditions outlined in the Insurance (Vehicle) Act. Speeding, carrying too many passengers, driving without an N sign and a number of other ticketable offences do not breach coverage.

i think the issue in question is more about breaking your restrictions invalidating your license, and the insurance not covering an unlicensed driver.

i could be wrong though..

[xpl0sive]

driving contractory to restrictions does not invalidate your license. If that were the case, ICBC wouldn't pay claims if new drivers did not have an N sign on their car when they got into an accident.

[xpl0sive]

Here's the technical wording out of ICBC policy booklet and the Motor Vehicle Act Regs

Prohibited use
3 (1) The insurer is not liable to an insured who breaches this condition or a subcondition
of this condition.
(2) An insured must not operate a vehicle for which coverage is provided under this
contract

(a) if the insured is not authorized and qualifi ed by law to operate the vehicle,
(b) for an illicit or prohibited trade or transportation,
(c) to escape or avoid arrest or other similar police action, or
(d) in a race or speed test.

(3) An insured does not contravene subcondition (2) merely because the insured operates
a vehicle in contravention of a restriction or condition imposed on his or her driver’s
licence by section 30.06 (2), 30.07 (1) or (3), 30.071 (1), 30.08 (1), 30.10 (2) or (4) or
30.11 (1) of the Motor Vehicle Act Regulations, B.C. Reg. 26/58.

Accompanying adult conditions and passenger restrictions for learner's licence
30.06 (2) A person to whom a Class 7L licence is issued must not carry more than one passenger, other than the accompanying person under subsection (1), while operating a motor vehicle of a category designated in section 30.01 (2) for that class of driver's licence.

Hours-of-day restrictions for Class 6L, 7L and 8L licences
30.07 (1) Subject to the exception set out in subsection (2), a person to whom a Class 6L or 8L licence is issued must not operate a motorcycle between sunset and sunrise each day.

(3) A person to whom a Class 7L licence is issued must not operate, between the hours of 12:00 a.m. and 5:00 a.m. each day, a motor vehicle of a category designated in section 30.01 (2) for that class of driver's licence.

Accompanying adult conditions and passenger restrictions for Class 7 licence
30.071 (1) Subject to subsection (2), a person to whom a Class 7 licence is issued on or after October 6, 2003 must not carry more than one passenger while operating a motor vehicle of a category designated in section 30.01 (2) for that class of driver's licence unless the person is accompanied by another person who

(a) is at least 25 years of age or is a licensed driver training instructor engaged in providing practical driver training to the person in accordance with Division 27,

(b) holds a valid and subsisting driver's licence, other than a learner's licence or a Class 7 licence, of a class that permits him or her to operate a motor vehicle of that category, and

(c) occupies

(i) the seat beside the operator, or

(ii) the seat or area immediately behind and to the right of the operator, in the case of a motor vehicle of the category designated for the class of licence issued in which there is no seat beside the operator.

Speed and area restrictions for Class 6L and 8L licences
30.08 (1) Subject to the exceptions set out in subsection (3), a person to whom a Class 6L or 8L licence is issued must not operate a motorcycle at a speed exceeding 60 km/hr until he or she has successfully completed a road skills test required by the Insurance Corporation of British Columbia for that purpose.

30.10 (2) Subject to the exception set out in subsection (3), a person to whom a Class 7L or 8L licence is issued must not operate a motor vehicle of a category designated in section 30.01 (2) for that class of driver's licence unless a new driver sign depicting the letter "L" is clearly visible and prominently displayed from the rear of the motor vehicle or trailer, as the case may be.

(3) The new driver sign condition under subsection (2) does not apply in the course of the person receiving practical driver training conducted in accordance with Division 27 by a licensed driver training instructor, unless the practical driver training is being conducted in a private vehicle under section 27.09 (7).

(4) Subject to the exception set out in subsection (5), a person to whom a Class 7 or 8 licence is issued must not operate a motor vehicle of a category designated in section 30.01 (2) for that class of driver's licence unless a new driver sign depicting the letter "N" is clearly visible and prominently displayed from the rear of the motor vehicle or trailer, as the case may be.

No-alcohol restriction for Class 7L, 8L, 7 and 8 licences
30.11 (1) A person who holds a Class 7L, 8L, 7 or 8 licence must not operate a motor vehicle while having alcohol in his or her body.




Links:
Motor Vehicle Act Regs, Section 30
Motor Vehicle Act Regulations

Autoplan Policy Booklet - Scroll down to Division 8, prescribed conditions
ICBC | Autoplan-Optional.pdf

[xpl0sive]

So as you can see, even if you have an N, are driving with some alcohol in your body, say 0.02, have 4 passengers in your car, no N sign on the back, and get into an accident, ICBC will still pay the claim. If the police attend the scene, you'll have a ton of tickets though