Legal advice (seller was lying but we have proof of that)

[DanHibiki]

this sucks for the dog

[zilley]

Originally Posted by mikey2781

Buyer did not do the surgery on the dog yet, it is a problem that will haunt the dog for the rest of his life when he becomes around 2 years old.

He is currently less than a year old.

So majority of the people on this forum is saying scamming is okay, and there should be no karma for the scammer? Just let the scammer keep scamming other people. The thing is, if the buyer returns the dog to the seller, the seller is just going to get rid of it again.

If I was the seller, no shit I would just rather take the dog back and give the buyer the money back. That's the best case scenario for the seller when all these evidence of the seller lying multiple times.

No need to get all offensive, you asked and we re stating our personal opinions.

If the buyer truly love the dog, then get the surgery done. If the buyer don't have the funds then turn it over to spca. If the dog is suffering it's considered animal abuse as well.

When I got my 2nd dog it had parvo and it costed me 1750.

I went to spca for help but they gave me 2 options. 1. Turn the dog over 2. Put the dog down.

I couldn't do neither so I borrowed money from my parents and saved my dog.
I was underage at the time and 1750 was alot of money.

[zilley]

Also, what is the surgery that the dog needs?

You said it was a small surgery right?

[mikey2781]

Originally Posted by DanHibiki

this sucks for the dog

It does, which is why the buyer wants to keep the dog and make the seller pay for the surgery.

Buyer doesn't mind paying for the surgery, but he doesn't feel that it is right to let a scammer go without suffering any consequences... the seller will never learn.

The buyer didn't want to give too much info just in case the seller knows someone from here.

[zilley]

Originally Posted by mikey2781

It does, which is why the buyer wants to keep the dog and make the seller pay for the surgery.

Buyer doesn't mind paying for the surgery, but he doesn't feel that it is right to let a scammer go without suffering any consequences... the seller will never learn.

The buyer didn't want to give too much info just in case the seller knows someone from here.

this is how it should be done, if the buyer actually cares about the dog.

1. surgery first (buyer pays)
2. take it small claims court.

it doesnt matter if surgery was done first, not like the judge will say "well the dog is fine now and its paid for, cases dropped"

that way the dog dont suffer.

at this moment, I feel that the buyer rather not have the surgery if it Has to come out of its pocket.

[winson604]

Originally Posted by mikey2781

@Nlkko, seller is not a breeder

@mac25, not sure how it is the buyer's fault. Vets keep records of everything, she went to multiple vets that told her the dog has those problems. SPCA calls into vets and can get those info. Seller did sell the dog saying "as far as I know, there are no health problems with the dog".

Everyone is comparing a dog with a car, they are totally different.

Sorry, did the buyer bring the dog to the vet after they already bought the dog?

I hate to compare it to the car thing but if you bought a car, you would bring it for an inspection first prior to buying it wouldn't you?

The last dog I brought the seller let me take it to a vet first to verify it's good before making a decision whether I wanted to buy it or not. After 2 vets stating it has a hernia we decided not to proceed with the purchase and the buyer was ok with that.

Sorry, I probably missed something in the story. Best of luck to the dog.

[BoostedBB6]

Bottom line, if you want to buy a dog that has the backing of the seller, Craigslist is not the place to go.

Go to a breeder who is reputable and has paperwork for the dog.

This is what happens when you try and save money on anything, a car, a dog. You have to do your OWN work if you want to insure that you are getting what you want.
Buying a used dog, you should have taken them to a vet first, done a check up, asked for paperwork, medical history etc etc. Just like you would do with a used car. If you buy blind then you take a chance.

Crappy lesson to learn, even if you manage to get money from the seller, perhaps you should change the way you approach buying used items.

[Soundy]

Originally Posted by BoostedBB6

Bottom line, if you want to buy a dog that has the backing of the seller, Craigslist is not the place to go.

Go to a breeder who is reputable and has paperwork for the dog.

This is what happens when you try and save money on anything, a car, a dog. You have to do your OWN work if you want to insure that you are getting what you want.
Buying a used dog, you should have taken them to a vet first, done a check up, asked for paperwork, medical history etc etc. Just like you would do with a used car. If you buy blind then you take a chance.

Crappy lesson to learn, even if you manage to get money from the seller, perhaps you should change the way you approach buying used items.

Better yet, adopt a dog from a shelter or rescue. There are lots out there besides just the SPCA. The good ones will have full medical records for their dogs, and will have done full evaluations of them to ensure they'll be a good fit for you and your household (ie. they'll know whether the dog is good with kids, other pets, etc.).

Many will also do foster-to-adopt arrangements.

[BoostedBB6]

Originally Posted by Soundy

Better yet, adopt a dog from a shelter or rescue. There are lots out there besides just the SPCA. The good ones will have full medical records for their dogs, and will have done full evaluations of them to ensure they'll be a good fit for you and your household (ie. they'll know whether the dog is good with kids, other pets, etc.).

Even better! Give a dog that's well taken care of another chance at life. The initial purchase may cost you more but you wont have to deal with issues like this.

Pay now or pay later....applies to many things in life.
I hope you guys get the dog to good health regardless of who is paying for it. Hell, I will even donate some money to the cause if its just $$ that is preventing this dog from being healthy.

[Soundy]

Oh yeah... the GOOD rescues will also NOT make it easy for you to just take a dog. The ones who really care about the animals will take the time to make sure you're going to be a good home - in many cases, that includes a home visit. They'll know the kind of situation the dog came out of and what it needs for good development. A "rescue" or "shelter" who is too willing to just hand over a dog for some cash (or for that matter, someone on CL who will just hand over a dog for cash) may well be a "flipper" - people who get animals for cheap or free from other places, then turn around and sell them at a profit.

[zilley]

I still want to know what breed of dog it is and what surgery needs to be done.

[pissedoffe55]

Originally Posted by mikey2781

will update on what happens

Originally Posted by mikey2781

Buyer did not do the surgery on the dog yet, it is a problem that will haunt the dog for the rest of his life when he becomes around 2 years old.

He is currently less than a year old.

So majority of the people on this forum is saying scamming is okay, and there should be no karma for the scammer? Just let the scammer keep scamming other people. The thing is, if the buyer returns the dog to the seller, the seller is just going to get rid of it again.

If I was the seller, no shit I would just rather take the dog back and give the buyer the money back. That's the best case scenario for the seller when all these evidence of the seller lying multiple times.

The dogs health is the first and foremost priority and needs to be dealt with immediately. Maybe your friend isn't getting much help or sympathy because you clearly stated the dog really needs this surgery and it will effect him for the rest of its life- but all you seem to care about is your friend getting scammed out of $$.

Get the dog the surgery it needs and take it as a lesson learnt-your friend is neglecting the poor dog and at this point he is no better then the guy who initially scammed him.

After your friend gets the dog the surgery it needs - and if he still feels the need to pursue reimbursement from the seller tell him to go spend some more $$ not to mention time to get proper legal advice. Provide all the paperwork,proof, receipts etc etc. After months or even 1 year+ your friend will have his day in court and hopefully will be able to prove that he was scammed and collect a settlement...

As for your comment on why everyone keeps comparing this to cars..you logged into a website entitled REVscene.net - Vancouver's Top Classifieds and Automotive Forum - Automotive Chat and Lifestyles for Western Canada, Northwestern United States & Northwestern North America. "Vancouvers top classifieds and Automotive forum."

If you are looking for some better free advice with a wider range of info available...why not try Yahoo answers or a law forum?

at the end of the day i am sorry to hear about your friends bad luck. We have all been scammed I am sure one way or another and we all learned from our mistake. hopefully your friend can get the dog the surgery it needs and the dog lives a long happy life with your friend. If your friend decides to follow through with legal action I hope he is actually able to recoup his losses and not just waste more $$ and time.

[zilley]

I dont think the OP will be coming back to chime in on this, hes been on but no responses to this thread.

[mikey2781]

I already said it's a small surgery that won't affect the dog till almost 2 years later, the dog needs to stop growing before it is done, but everyone continues to say that the buyer should get the dog's surgery done asap. Like previously said, I won't disclose what surgery needs to be done yet.

I don't know how the buyer chose the dog, but if it was me, going to a shelter when the type of dog I want is not there is not smartest choice. Yes you are giving a dog a second chance, but are you going to love it the same way you would love a dog that you have been researching and preparing for? The buyer did already search all the rescues/shelters in BC, he lives in an apartment so the dog has to be medium sized.

Like how the majority of you are comparing a dog with a car: would you buy your dream car you've been preparing and saving for for a long time? or would you accept a car that doesn't appeal to you but all the money you pay for it goes to donation?

You would treat your dream car a lot better than the other car that doesn't appeal to you. Sure you would feel "better" that you did a good deed at the end of the day, but would you care for the other car as much as you would for your dream car? Be honest, answer is no.

If you've been to a shelter, you will know that the dogs that are there are rarely purebred and have a ton of genetic problems. What if the buyer wanted to enjoy the special moment of a dog giving birth? If you go to the shelter and find a dog with genetic problems, the dog will just give birth to more dogs with genetic problems. But at shelters, you will never find a dog that hasn't been castrated.

[Soundy]

Originally Posted by mikey2781

I already said it's a small surgery that won't affect the dog till almost 2 years later, the dog needs to stop growing before it is done, but everyone continues to say that the buyer should get the dog's surgery done asap. Like previously said, I won't disclose what surgery needs to be done yet.

This is fair enough. However...

I don't know how the buyer chose the dog, but if it was me, going to a shelter when the type of dog I want is not there is not smartest choice. Yes you are giving a dog a second chance, but are you going to love it the same way you would love a dog that you have been researching and preparing for? The buyer did already search all the rescues/shelters in BC, he lives in an apartment so the dog has to be medium sized.

Dog SIZE is irrelevant to home size. Jack Russell Terriers are small- to medium-sized, yet very high energy needing lots of exercise, and not typically good condo/apartment dogs. Great Danes, greyhounds, and the like are large dogs, yet very low energy and make great condo/apartment dogs.

Like how the majority of you are comparing a dog with a car: would you buy your dream car you've been preparing and saving for for a long time? or would you accept a car that doesn't appeal to you but all the money you pay for it goes to donation?

REALLY not a good analogy. Cars don't have feelings and unique "personalities".

If you've been to a shelter, you will know that the dogs that are there are rarely purebred and have a ton of genetic problems.

Actually, purebreds these days tend to have more genetic issues, because bloodlines tend to get very thin and with some breeds, there tends to be a fair bit of in-breeding leading to genetic defects. Mixed breeds in general have fewer health issues because of mixing genetic traits.

[mikey2781]

Well I don't know the details but I am sure the buyer did his research before choosing that breed for his apartment. He told me he was going to get a dog when we met in high school, 15 years later and he finally has a dog.

Yes, then why are people comparing dogs and cars? Used cars and dogs for sale by owners are clearly not the same.

Majority of the dogs at SPCA are also pretty old, I don't think anyone would want to bond with a dog and see him pass away ~3 years later due to age.

[zilley]

What is the breed of the dog and how much did he get it for?

Answer this and I ll tell you why I ve asked 3 times.

[Soundy]

Originally Posted by mikey2781

Majority of the dogs at SPCA are also pretty old, I don't think anyone would want to bond with a dog and see him pass away ~3 years later due to age.

There are TONS of rescues and shelters besides the SPCA. One I support has taken in two pregnant mothers, and one new litter, just in the past eight months, meaning she's cared for and re-homed over a dozen puppies just this past year. There are numerous breed-specific rescues as well.

Dogs (and cats and bunnies and even small rodents) of all ages end up in shelters for a lot of reasons, not just because they're old and people don't want to deal with them anymore.

[BoostedBB6]

Mikey, you seem to be poorly informed and making a lot of assumptions about a subject you seem to know very little about and are not willing to share any information.

Here is all the advice your friend needs, if he wants to take legal action call a lawyer. They will tell him if its worth it or not.

But the bottom line is, you friend did not put in the leg work to make sure the dog he was buying was in good health. Regardless of the guy he bough it from not telling the truth, its on the purchaser to make an informed and educated purchase and clearly this was not done.

The analogy of a car works just fine for this.
You talk about "dream car", ok so here is one for you.

You go to buy your dream car, its all shiny, looks good, drives nice and it all seems great. You take it home and find out a short time after it was a rebuilt car and will be having issues later on down the road.
You should have looked into it further before spending the money. Plain and simple.

If you don't yet understand this then I highly recommend you direct your friend to a lawyer, someone who practices law and knows if he can get any money back from the seller for not telling the truth.

[Soundy]

Originally Posted by BoostedBB6

But the bottom line is, you friend did not put in the leg work to make sure the dog he was buying was in good health. Regardless of the guy he bough it from not telling the truth, its on the purchaser to make an informed and educated purchase and clearly this was not done.

Yeah, this is the odd thing: supposedly this person "did all the research" into the TYPE of dog he wanted... but not nearly enough into the ACTUAL dog he ended up getting.

[BoostedBB6]

This "person" is likely him and he just doesn't want to look like an idiot.

[bballguy]

Originally Posted by mikey2781

Like how the majority of you are comparing a dog with a car: would you buy your dream car you've been preparing and saving for for a long time? or would you accept a car that doesn't appeal to you but all the money you pay for it goes to donation?

You would treat your dream car a lot better than the other car that doesn't appeal to you. Sure you would feel "better" that you did a good deed at the end of the day, but would you care for the other car as much as you would for your dream car? Be honest, answer is no.

lol Wow, that's like saying, "if you're having a baby, and you want it to be a boy, and it ends up being a girl, will you care for a daughter as much as you would for a son? Be honest, answer is no"....

....Please don't ever get a dog br0....

[mikey2781]

Originally Posted by BoostedBB6

Mikey, you seem to be poorly informed and making a lot of assumptions about a subject you seem to know very little about and are not willing to share any information.

Here is all the advice your friend needs, if he wants to take legal action call a lawyer. They will tell him if its worth it or not.

But the bottom line is, you friend did not put in the leg work to make sure the dog he was buying was in good health. Regardless of the guy he bough it from not telling the truth, its on the purchaser to make an informed and educated purchase and clearly this was not done.

The analogy of a car works just fine for this.
You talk about "dream car", ok so here is one for you.

You go to buy your dream car, its all shiny, looks good, drives nice and it all seems great. You take it home and find out a short time after it was a rebuilt car and will be having issues later on down the road.
You should have looked into it further before spending the money. Plain and simple.

If you don't yet understand this then I highly recommend you direct your friend to a lawyer, someone who practices law and knows if he can get any money back from the seller for not telling the truth.

Dafuq? Did you not even read? I didn't want to compare with cars in the first place. I said something along the lines of "if you guys want to compare with cars...".

Why would I want to share info when he specifically told me not to? This is clearly a case the buyer can take to court. I never knew revscene was filled with scammers like this and sides with misrepresentation in advertisements.

Seller emails to fake ad says "He has problems X and Y.
Buyer asks seller if seller knows of problems X and Y.
Seller emails to the buyer says "I don't know of any of those problems.".

You will look stupid when I tell you what his health problem is because a simple "heatlh checkup" cannot diagnose this problem that will take affect in the near future.

And comparing with cars, even getting it inspected won't guarantee that it will be problem free. I'm not as good as some of you guys with cars, but I am pretty sure someone can come up with an example where getting the car inspected at say an indy or BCAA does not even imply the car is 100% flawless.

[zilley]

Boosted if only I could thank you multiple times.

I feel like the buyer cheaped out and got fucked with a surgery bill.

You mentioned the buyer is well off. I feel this is not the case.

[mikey2781]

Originally Posted by bballguy

lol Wow, that's like saying, "if you're having a baby, and you want it to be a boy, and it ends up being a girl, will you care for a daughter as much as you would for a son? Be honest, answer is no"....

....Please don't ever get a dog br0....

...Yes lets compare a dog to everything there is in the world. A dog = car = a baby = apple = computer = headphones = cat?

LIke i said, don't look at me making stupid comparisons with a car. Look at the first few replies.