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Questions & info about the Motor Vehicle Act. Mature discussion only.

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Old 12-17-2015, 12:59 PM   #1
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Retrofit Experiences?

Anyone here get pulled over for having retrofit headlights in their cars?
Anyone here have experiences with getting retrofit HIDs?
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Old 12-17-2015, 01:36 PM   #2
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As long as they are CSA/DOT approved you have nothing to worry about. Make sure they ones you are interested in have those markings you have nothing to worry about.
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Old 12-17-2015, 02:08 PM   #3
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my previous two cars had retrofit headlights...drove em around for a few years and never had any issues

i can't remember if they were CSA/DOT but i rmbr i made the effort of properly aiming them
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Old 12-17-2015, 02:40 PM   #4
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I've had them on my car for multiple years with no issues
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Old 12-17-2015, 02:44 PM   #5
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Originally Posted by murd0c View Post
As long as they are CSA/DOT approved you have nothing to worry about. Make sure they ones you are interested in have those markings you have nothing to worry about.


Not exactly. IF the system you retrofitted....notice I said "System"..including the proper reflectors, lenses, washers, levelling system....are the same as offered by the car manufacturer....AND meet ALL federal standards....then yes, you will have nothing to worry about. If not then you are likely in trouble.

I used to issue #1 notice and order at roadside and tow the vehicle. Just because you might have some approved parts of a complete system, that doesn't make your modded setup safe or legal. You can strap a federally approved motorcycle engine onto a skaterboard...but you don't end up with a legal vehicle. Slapping some aftermarket HID bulbs into a halogen designed reflectror and lens setup ends up with uncontrolled light output that blinds other drivers and you don't have proper light output so you can see properly. I'm sure almost everybody here has been blinded by aftermarket HIDs in some oncoming vehicle at one time or another?
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Old 12-17-2015, 02:48 PM   #6
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i believe technically if it wasn't an option offered for your car, any modification to the lighting is illegal.

so it would have to be the projectors from a higher model of your car that has it as a factory option. i don't think retrofitting your headlights falls into this.

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should have refreshed the page before posting lol
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Old 12-17-2015, 03:07 PM   #7
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Not exactly. IF the system you retrofitted....notice I said "System"..including the proper reflectors, lenses, washers, levelling system....are the same as offered by the car manufacturer....AND meet ALL federal standards....then yes, you will have nothing to worry about. If not then you are likely in trouble.

I used to issue #1 notice and order at roadside and tow the vehicle. Just because you might have some approved parts of a complete system, that doesn't make your modded setup safe or legal. You can strap a federally approved motorcycle engine onto a skaterboard...but you don't end up with a legal vehicle. Slapping some aftermarket HID bulbs into a halogen designed reflectror and lens setup ends up with uncontrolled light output that blinds other drivers and you don't have proper light output so you can see properly. I'm sure almost everybody here has been blinded by aftermarket HIDs in some oncoming vehicle at one time or another?
Would you also give a ticket to a properly retrofitted system with a good cutoff?

How strict have you found other LEOs with regards to properly done lighting upgrades?
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Old 12-17-2015, 06:03 PM   #8
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i believe technically if it wasn't an option offered for your car, any modification to the lighting is illegal.
this is what i was told and always heard. if the HID's didnt come straight from factory and mounted on the car, it was considered illegal. Whether an office wants to pull you over for it, well i guess that's another story
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Old 12-17-2015, 06:10 PM   #9
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^ I believe they don't technically have to have been factory installed on your car, but they have to have been optional for that chassis and you have to install all of the OEM components. So if you have a base model and get everything associated with the HID system and install it you're legal, otherwise technically you're not.
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Old 12-19-2015, 07:24 AM   #10
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Would you also give a ticket to a properly retrofitted system with a good cutoff?

How strict have you found other LEOs with regards to properly done lighting upgrades?


This is the standard that must be met..

General lighting requirements
4.02 (1) A vehicle on a highway must only be equipped with and use lamps, reflectors or other illuminating devices authorized by this Division or authorized in writing by the director.

(2) A vehicle on a highway must be equipped with lamps equivalent to those provided by the original manufacturer in accordance with the requirements that applied under the Motor Vehicle Safety Act (Canada), or a predecessor to that Act, at the time of vehicle manufacture.
(3) All lamps, lamp bulbs and reflectors required or permitted by this Division must comply with
(a) the approved standards established by the Motor Vehicle Safety Act (Canada) and the applicable SAE standards,
(b) the conditions of use described in this Division, and
(c) the requirements of Table 1 of the Schedule to this Division.



The problem is not just the cutoff, it is the way the entire light output is directed and controlled and focused. Halogen reflectors and lenses are designed to control halogen output...HID's are a completely different type of light output and the halogen setup can not control it....that's why it blinds other drivers. IF the car had a complete factory retrofit then it would not be noticable and you would likely not be stopped in the first place.

As far as how you might be treated roadside goes? It depends on the knowledge the officer has on the subject. I did lots of reserarch as I was a full time Traffic Member. Others may also do that. A General Duties Member going from call to call, with no knowledge or background or time, may not stop you. IF the Member knows how dangerous it is then you could expect to be treated accordingly.
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Old 12-19-2015, 07:29 AM   #11
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^ I believe they don't technically have to have been factory installed on your car, but they have to have been optional for that chassis and you have to install all of the OEM components. So if you have a base model and get everything associated with the HID system and install it you're legal, otherwise technically you're not.

I used to own a Mini Cooper S with factory HIDs as standard equipment. A Mini Cooper non-S did not have HID's IF you had gone to Mini and requested the HIDs be installed in your Cooper and they installed a full HID setup from an S, then you would be OK, as the HIDs were an optional extra for the standard Cooper. BTW, the complete system with washers and levelling system, reflectors and lenses...costs thousands installed by the dealers.
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Old 12-19-2015, 08:37 AM   #12
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I used to own a Mini Cooper S with factory HIDs as standard equipment. A Mini Cooper non-S did not have HID's IF you had gone to Mini and requested the HIDs be installed in your Cooper and they installed a full HID setup from an S, then you would be OK, as the HIDs were an optional extra for the standard Cooper. BTW, the complete system with washers and levelling system, reflectors and lenses...costs thousands installed by the dealers.
Gee, so you're saying a $40 HID kit from Alibaba isn't the same?
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Old 12-19-2015, 08:46 AM   #13
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Gee, so you're saying a $40 HID kit from Alibaba isn't the same?
$40 HID kit from Alibaba means you over paid for it.
And if you did buy one for $40 from Alibaba, I have a bridge to sell you. It's a good deal.
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Old 12-19-2015, 09:04 AM   #14
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Last night was the second time I had a vehicle coming at me (with nobody behind them) with illegally retrofitted headlights and foglights that were so blinding I flipped on my highbeams. Both times they "highbeamed" me back but their highbeams were these pathetic little things about as bright as a tea candle compared to their other lights. Anyone who can't figure out that your highbeams should be the brightest probably shouldn't have a license.
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Old 12-19-2015, 09:11 AM   #15
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"(2) A vehicle on a highway must be equipped with lamps equivalent to those provided by the original manufacturer in accordance with the requirements that applied under the Motor Vehicle Safety Act (Canada), or a predecessor to that Act, at the time of vehicle manufacture."

Really does not leave much room for interpenetration. Unless the were installed on a factory vehicle as a factory option they are not legal. Does not matter if you use DOT/SAE approved lenses, projectors or anything else. Unless it came on the car from factory or as a factory installed option there not legal.

As for real world, if there not blinding people and aimed you should not see any issues unless you get a VI or something.
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Old 12-19-2015, 01:47 PM   #16
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Has no one read the thread title?

This is about Retrofit HIDs. As in actually putting in a projector for HIDs.

Quote:
Anyone here get pulled over for having retrofit headlights in their cars?
Not just slapping on HID bulbs into your halogen housing.

I've had retrofits with fx-r projectors and minid2s since 2011 and have never had an issue with it. I go through road checks during weekends lots and no one has ever mentioned anything about it.

Illegal? Technically yes. You can be cited for a VI for it as mentioned above:

Quote:
"(2) A vehicle on a highway must be equipped with lamps equivalent to those provided by the original manufacturer in accordance with the requirements that applied under the Motor Vehicle Safety Act (Canada), or a predecessor to that Act, at the time of vehicle manufacture."

Really does not leave much room for interpenetration. Unless the were installed on a factory vehicle as a factory option they are not legal. Does not matter if you use DOT/SAE approved lenses, projectors or anything else. Unless it came on the car from factory or as a factory installed option there not legal.
As for getting blinded "because it's not stock"
A lot of cars with projectors and HIDs do not have a leveling system, so the only thing that contributes to the lighting is the projector itself. So by installing projectors, then your cutoff, spread, width, throw, etc should all be correct according to OEM spec.
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Old 12-19-2015, 03:09 PM   #17
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Gee, so you're saying a $40 HID kit from Alibaba isn't the same?

I have this friend of my girlfriends....she looks just like Jennifer Lawrence...kinds....has hair, 2 legs, 2 arms,..other "approved parts"..wanna date her?

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Old 12-19-2015, 03:17 PM   #18
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Quote:
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Has no one read the thread title?

This is about Retrofit HIDs. As in actually putting in a projector for HIDs.



Not just slapping on HID bulbs into your halogen housing.

I've had retrofits with fx-r projectors and minid2s since 2011 and have never had an issue with it. I go through road checks during weekends lots and no one has ever mentioned anything about it.

Illegal? Technically yes. You can be cited for a VI for it as mentioned above:



As for getting blinded "because it's not stock"
A lot of cars with projectors and HIDs do not have a leveling system, so the only thing that contributes to the lighting is the projector itself. So by installing projectors, then your cutoff, spread, width, throw, etc should all be correct according to OEM spec.

Daniel Stern Lighting Consultancy and Supply


In particular talking about retrofitting HIDs in projectors never designed for them. " be aware that even if the transplanted optics come from a legal headlamp, the end result—the modified headlamp—is no longer compliant with the applicable regulations."

Look at this guy's qualifications...he is an authority and he knows his stuff.
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Old 12-19-2015, 03:52 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by entrax View Post
Has no one read the thread title?

This is about Retrofit HIDs. As in actually putting in a projector for HIDs.



Not just slapping on HID bulbs into your halogen housing.

I've had retrofits with fx-r projectors and minid2s since 2011 and have never had an issue with it. I go through road checks during weekends lots and no one has ever mentioned anything about it.

Illegal? Technically yes. You can be cited for a VI for it as mentioned above:



As for getting blinded "because it's not stock"
A lot of cars with projectors and HIDs do not have a leveling system, so the only thing that contributes to the lighting is the projector itself. So by installing projectors, then your cutoff, spread, width, throw, etc should all be correct according to OEM spec.
OEM = Original Equipment Manufacturer, if its not Original Equipment it does not meet specification, nor is it "equivalent to those provided by the original manufacturer in accordance with the requirements that applied under the Motor Vehicle Safety Act (Canada)"

Blinding people is a side effect of a poor setup and common with cheap HID kids thrown into standard housings. Regardless, the law is the law, and the legality of it is, unless it came with HID from the manufacturer or they offered a kit at the dealer level that was certified by the DOT to be used, its illegal to do so yourself.
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Old 12-19-2015, 09:59 PM   #20
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even if the transplanted optics come from a legal headlamp, the end result—the modified headlamp—is no longer compliant with the applicable regulations.
Without going too far off topic, would a complete replacement of a complete OE headlamp assembly from one vehicle to another of a different make & model be legal?

Specifically that I've got OE BMW E32/E34 Ellipsoids in my Datsun 510. I've always assumed that I was running around with the most modern yet most legal setup but never cared to ask.
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Old 12-20-2015, 01:02 AM   #21
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i have properly aimed and retrofitted hid for over 6 months now. Never hassled.

i really needed the improved visibility while not blinding others...pricey mod but well worth it in vancouver...on the stock halogens I had trouble seeing the lines when it's raining.

My car is stock looking though...no real heat score. My guess is if you have the retrofit aimed down and not some flashy colour temp over 6000k...you should be just fine.
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Old 12-20-2015, 05:25 AM   #22
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Without going too far off topic, would a complete replacement of a complete OE headlamp assembly from one vehicle to another of a different make & model be legal?

Specifically that I've got OE BMW E32/E34 Ellipsoids in my Datsun 510. I've always assumed that I was running around with the most modern yet most legal setup but never cared to ask.

Having driven Datsun 510's back when they were brand new, I'm pretty sure they did not come with HIDs.... BTW, couple of my buddies used to race 510's and they were THEEE hot race ride in their class. In answer to your question....no. Not OE for your car. There may be height differences, distance between the headlights lights different....things that would affect the light output and direction. Will you get stopped??? I'd probably have stopped you just to look at the car I believe Paul Newman used to race 510's at one point in SCCA races and was close to national champion. https://www.pinterest.com/pin/220113500511313991/
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Old 12-21-2015, 11:25 PM   #23
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Personally I'd prefer the regulators ban HIDs altogether.
Properly aimed or not, they're a nuisance.
Roads aren't flat, and this exposes oncoming drivers to the full wrath of the light output below the cut-off shield. When it rains, you get terrible reflection off the road surface.

Nobody needs two collapsing stars on the front of their car.
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Old 12-22-2015, 12:09 PM   #24
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Love your geek reference to death stars.......may The Force be with you.....!!!!!
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Old 12-22-2015, 01:06 PM   #25
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This Tesla was behind me yesterday. I had to dim the mirror.

So it's not just ricers sticking HIDs in reflectors that are the problem.
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