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Vancouver Auto Chat 2016 VAC Community Head Moderator: Raid3n

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Old 08-13-2016, 07:05 PM   #1
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When do you think electric cars will be the standard for performance cars?

I was reading about Rhys Millen's historic Pikes Peak 2016 run where he lost the overall win by 4 secs in a full electric car Vs the fastest gas powered car. Sure the Tesla Model S P90D is super fast in a straight line, but vehicle dynamics? not so much. I am planning on selling my Dinan S3R after the summer and was dead set on getting a 991 C4S or GTS. However, when I looking around on Autotrader, I noticed for same money, I could get a BMW I8. So, I decided to check it out.....boy was I impressed. First off, the tech and look is stunning. However the back seat is very useable for my young son, probably better than a 991. What impressed me more than that was how the car handled and drove overall. The torque is killer and it handles really well because the heavy batteries are placed low in the centre tunnel. The car has minimal lean, but the overall grip was relatively low due to really skinny tires, but most aftermarket I8 guys put on 245/285s for some decent grip. After test driving the I8, I can't believe I am saying this, but I think we are less than 10yrs away from electric cars being the standard bearer for performance cars. I feel really sad, because I love gas guzzling high revving NA cars, but I think those days are really numbered. I am curious what RS members think?
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Old 08-13-2016, 11:19 PM   #2
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There's limitations on price right now, because batteries are expensive. And then there's the purists...you can't get the exhaust burble, the rev-match downshift, the power building, the sounds or smells with an electric car. I always thought a Tesla Model S looks like an extremely fast Toyota Camry.

But then again, the EPA is going to kill off cars which will need to go smaller engines with electric assist or electric altogether. I'd say 20 years.

Then again, ever since I was a kid, I was told that gasoline would long run out by the time I got my license. Been driving well over 10 years and that still has yet to happen....
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Old 08-13-2016, 11:42 PM   #3
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There is no substitute.
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Old 08-14-2016, 12:24 AM   #4
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^ i was reading an article about how the mustang p51 was the absolute pinnacle of piston driven fighter warplanes, but was literally obsolete overnight because the jet airplane was invented.
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Old 08-14-2016, 04:26 PM   #5
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When electric trains first came out, I'm sure all the steam locomotive guys hated it...because I know many of them still do to this day.

It's the sound, smell, feeling, etc.
Steam locomotives are more fun to ride, whereas electric bullet trains are efficient, fast and boring.

Same can be said about electric powered cars vs petro powered cars.

There's no doubt that electric cars are future of performance cars.
The world's most renown high performance cars are already hybrids.

McLaren P1, Acura NSX, Koenigsegg Regera, LaFerrari, BMW i8, Jaguar CX-75, Porsche 918, etc....they're all hybrids.

Just look at Tesla Model S P90D. It does 0-60mph in 2.6 seconds and 1/4 mile in 10.9 seconds.
It can easily put all the high performance sedans in dust... BMW M5, Audi RS7, Lexus IS-F, Mercedes AMG C63S, Cadillac CTS-V, anything.

The only reason those sedans can't beat Tesla is because they have inefficient petro engine.
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Old 08-14-2016, 07:55 PM   #6
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Just look at Tesla Model S P90D. It does 0-60mph in 2.6 seconds and 1/4 mile in 10.9 seconds.
It can easily put all the high performance sedans in dust... BMW M5, Audi RS7, Lexus IS-F, Mercedes AMG C63S, Cadillac CTS-V, anything.
....Except on a real race track where there are corners and those cars can smoke the Tesla in the dust
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Old 08-14-2016, 08:08 PM   #7
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I don't see full electric cars being feasible anytime soon. Canada and U.S. have such boners for oil that they will push back on the infrastructure needed to make the cars reasonable as an only car. Where the fuck are you going to drive a tesla other than kits to horseshoe bay?
It should happen, but it will take a long time I bet.
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Well.. I’d hate to be the first to say it, but Westopher is correct.
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Old 08-14-2016, 11:05 PM   #8
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....Except on a real race track where there are corners and those cars can smoke the Tesla in the dust
They can't really be compared on a real track because the Tesla was not built with racing in mind. I'm sure if they built a suspension for it Tesla could build a pretty badass sports car.
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Old 08-15-2016, 05:33 AM   #9
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Tesla with and without the adaptive suspension option comes with Bilstein yellow struts from factory. The car carries a lot of speed and is very planted for a car its size. Helps a lot since it has a low center of gravity. Just make sure the steering is set to sport.
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Old 08-15-2016, 07:02 AM   #10
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OP, if you have the means i think you should buy something with a V12 for now and enjoy it while you still can. we're still in the early days of electric cars and have plenty of time to adapt them into our lives down the road.

our v8's, v10's and v12's are all eventually going to die off within the next 10-20 years. might as well buy something now while its still semi affordable.
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Old 08-15-2016, 06:18 PM   #11
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They can't really be compared on a real track because the Tesla was not built with racing in mind. I'm sure if they built a suspension for it Tesla could build a pretty badass sports car.
Oh no doubt if Tesla tries to go for racing goals they can make a sick sports car, but at this stage Tesla is nothing but a luxury A to B sedan weighing at 4800lbs.

I'm just saying how asinine Timfuck's statement is saying how Tesla can smoke sports car when it can't even sustain any aggressive driving past 5 minutes since the battery overheats.
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Old 08-15-2016, 06:54 PM   #12
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Very true ^
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Old 08-15-2016, 07:40 PM   #13
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....Except on a real race track where there are corners and those cars can smoke the Tesla in the dust
? 

I don't know where you got that kind of info, but Tesla Model S is smoking fast around the corner.

Just go on YouTube, Tesla Model S can smoke some of the best handling sedans like BMW M5 and Maserati Ghibli.

Just because Model S is an electric sedan, that doesn't mean Tesla will put shitty suspension.
Tesla is indeed, very well engineered machine.

If you're talking about the size of Tesla Model S, it doesn't matter. Just like GT-R can smoke many supercars around the corner, Tesla does pretty much the same thing with well engineered suspension.
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Old 08-15-2016, 08:27 PM   #14
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Until the battery dies after 2 laps at mission.
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Old 08-15-2016, 09:30 PM   #15
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just think of how dependent we have become on batteries the past decade
one of these days we're bound to hit an advancement and petrol vehicles will become a niche
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Old 08-15-2016, 10:24 PM   #16
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Battery will only charge faster, weight less, does not heat up as much and smaller.

Some top performance cars are already hybrids. Only a matter of time until the next tech breakthrough.

The model S ws not built with track performance in mind. Its a perfect daily driver.
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Old 08-16-2016, 12:05 AM   #17
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We know petro engines are extremely inefficient.

Internal combustion engines aren't really a motor, it's more like a heat generator.
Most of fuel is used/wasted to generate heat, and only 30+% of that is to generate hp/torque to move a car.

If you factor in everything, in general, petro-powered vehicles can only use 15% of energy to move a car...all the other energy is simply wasted to generate heat or drag/friction losses.

Mazda Skyactive is one of the most advanced petro engine in the world with very high compression and low friction. Mazda say their goal is to waste only 40% of the energy(or use 60% of energy available), but I don't know...with all the electric technology, internal combustion engine will become obsolete.

It's just that amount of torque it creates is not even close to petro engine.

American V8s tend to brag about torque, but it can only generate for very short amount of time. (like 0.1 second?) Whereas electric motor can generate MAX TORQUE ALL THE TIME.
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Old 08-16-2016, 07:26 AM   #18
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I don't see full electric cars being feasible anytime soon. Canada and U.S. have such boners for oil that they will push back on the infrastructure needed to make the cars reasonable as an only car. Where the fuck are you going to drive a tesla other than kits to horseshoe bay?
It should happen, but it will take a long time I bet.
We're also way too spread out, and in a lot of areas way too cold for parts of the year for it to be feasible. Looking at the Tesla I doubt it could make it from Kelowna to Tsawwassen on one charge with one passenger, so bye bye road trips.
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Old 08-16-2016, 08:22 AM   #19
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Electric sports cars and electric sport sedans, I personally can embrace and look forward to the crazy torque


What I cannot embrace, is self-driving cars.
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Old 08-16-2016, 09:40 AM   #20
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Old 08-16-2016, 11:20 AM   #21
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Electric sports cars and electric sport sedans, I personally can embrace and look forward to the crazy torque


What I cannot embrace, is self-driving cars.
Self driving cars are a lot safer, more convenient, more efficient, more usable.

I know it's boring and all that, but I'm sure there's a huge market for it.
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Old 08-16-2016, 12:01 PM   #22
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Love self driving car. Give you an option to just sit back if you are tired and would rather sleep and drive when you want. What's not to like?
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Old 08-16-2016, 12:41 PM   #23
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Self driving cars are a lot safer, more convenient, more efficient, more usable.

I know it's boring and all that, but I'm sure there's a huge market for it.
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Love self driving car. Give you an option to just sit back if you are tired and would rather sleep and drive when you want. What's not to like?
I can understand how this would be good if you are on the road all day (Truck driver) but it will just take the enjoyment out of driving.
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Old 08-16-2016, 12:54 PM   #24
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It's pretty close to the same but some days when I just didnt want to get up to go to work I used to just be happy knowing I was going to get on my motorcycle for 35 minutes and have fun even in traffic.

Dont think that would be the same with a self driving car.
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Old 08-16-2016, 01:23 PM   #25
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I can understand how this would be good if you are on the road all day (Truck driver) but it will just take the enjoyment out of driving.
Just so you know, to the vast majority of population, that are not car/motorcycle enthusiast, driving is simply waste of time.

or transportation/commuting in general, is a waste of time.

Because you're doing nothing productive other than going from point A to point B.

People would rather sit back and relax when you have to go home from work.
Some people may have to spend over 1hr each way for commuting, I'm sure they would rather sit back in your vehicle and watch YouTube or check your email, go on Skype, etc.

Seriously, people would rather do those thing that I just listed ^ than going in your V8 Mustang or Miata/Elise and rev the engine and take corners and stuff.

Young people have lost interest in cars. It's a fact and auto manufactures are well aware of this.
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