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-   Vancouver Off-Topic / Current Events (https://www.revscene.net/forums/vancouver-off-topic-current-events_50/)
-   -   27 dead Texas church shooting (https://www.revscene.net/forums/713672-27-dead-texas-church-shooting.html)

welfare 11-05-2017 09:20 PM
Pretty sad the pastor's 14y/o daughter was one of the fatalities. Her parents were away while this happened

GS8 11-05-2017 09:51 PM
This is the shooter

Is this a terrorist?

https://everipedia-storage.s3-accele...ley__18361.png

https://www.10tv.com/sites/10tv.com/...0mug%20CBS.jpg

How about now? :troll:

(same person)

RIP to the innocent victims in this tiny town.

welfare 11-05-2017 11:01 PM
https://www.rt.com/usa/408865-texas-...identity-name/

Quote:
Kelley is said to be 26 years old and a resident of New Braunfels, a city near San Antonio, located some 30 miles from the site of the attack. As it appears from his Facebook account, since taken down, he was a fan of guns, with his cover photo showing an assault rifle. Purported screenshots of his FB page, whose authenticity cannot be immediately confirmed, appear to feature an Antifascist Action banner, which sparked speculation online about his ties to the left-wing scene
Lotta speculation going on..

Slifer 11-06-2017 06:09 AM
In before ISIS claims they were the mastermind behind this shooting.

white rocket 11-06-2017 09:38 AM
No disrespect implied but every time there is a shooting in the U.S. now I can't help but think of this guy.

threezero 11-06-2017 05:00 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by welfare (Post 8870541)
:thumbsup:
good for him for stopping further killing. but what about those that already died?

welfare 11-06-2017 06:03 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by threezero (Post 8870768)
good for him for stopping further killing. but what about those that already died?
The killer wasn't legally allowed to carry due to his military dismissal. I'm not sure how stricter gun control would have stopped anyone from being killed.
What I am pretty sure of is that more relaxed gun control did in this case.

Manic! 11-06-2017 06:37 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by welfare (Post 8870775)
The killer wasn't legally allowed to carry due to his military dismissal. I'm not sure how stricter gun control would have stopped anyone from being killed.
What I am pretty sure of is that more relaxed gun control did in this case.
From my understanding he was legally allowed to buy guns because the military did not report the domestic violence cases against him. The people that did not report it should be held responsible.

westopher 11-07-2017 09:47 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by 320icar (Post 8870517)
It’s like the boy who cried wolf. I really don’t care anymore.
Except every time the boy cried wolf, the wolf killed like 20 people, and everyone still continued to ignore him.
Soooooooo its like the opposite haha.

Berzerker 11-08-2017 09:38 AM
The worst part is of this whole gun control debate is that it's never going to be solved by debating. It's going to take action. Period. Just like Australia did. It actually hurts my brain watching US people on FB argue for their right to guns to "protect themselves from the government" Its mind bottling. (trailer park boys)

Berz out.

320icar 11-08-2017 09:55 AM
^^ it ain’t rocket appliances

originalhypa 11-08-2017 10:48 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Berzerker (Post 8871079)
Just like Australia did.
It's crazy to compare Australia's gun culture to ours in North America. Australia really didn't have a problem with guns until that douchey prick slaughtered all those people in 96'. It was a terrible massacre, and led to a nationwide gun ban. But there were so many studies which concluded that the gun ban didn't change anything as far as gun crime goes. There were studies done that compared Australia to New Zealand (who had no anti-gun laws) and found that there was no statistical evidence that the gun ban had worked.

One of the most pressing facts to take into account is that not all of Australia abided by the gun bans.

Quote:
A 2017 study commissioned by Gun Control Australia found that Australian states had significantly weakened gun laws since the NFA was first introduced, with no jurisdiction fully compliant with the NFA. For example, many states now allow children to use guns and the mandatory 28 cooling-off period required for gun purchases has been relaxed in many jurisdictions, with no waiting period for purchasers who already own at least one gun.New South Wales also allows the limited use of silencers, even though they are supposed to be a prohibited weapon. No state or territory has outlined a timeframe for achieving full compliance with the NFA.
Australia didn't have a problem with guns prior to 1996.

People need to take into account the fact that non-gang related gun homicides are still incredibly rare. You're more like to get raped while contracting cancer from a drunk driver who is texting while driving, than you are to be shot.

But hey, let's ban guns so the masses have a false sense of security.

Hondaracer 11-08-2017 11:20 AM
Another fact that had been brought up in the vegas thread was that more than 2/3 of gun related deaths in the US are from suicides, not homicides.

IMO a more disturbing statistic in a lot of ways.

320icar 11-08-2017 12:41 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by originalhypa (Post 8871091)
It's crazy to compare Australia's gun culture to ours in North America. Australia really didn't have a problem with guns until that douchey prick slaughtered all those people in 96'. It was a terrible massacre, and led to a nationwide gun ban. But there were so many studies which concluded that the gun ban didn't change anything as far as gun crime goes. There were studies done that compared Australia to New Zealand (who had no anti-gun laws) and found that there was no statistical evidence that the gun ban had worked.

One of the most pressing facts to take into account is that not all of Australia abided by the gun bans.



Australia didn't have a problem with guns prior to 1996.

People need to take into account the fact that non-gang related gun homicides are still incredibly rare. You're more like to get raped while contracting cancer from a drunk driver who is texting while driving, than you are to be shot.

But hey, let's ban guns so the masses have a false sense of security.
So you suggest doing nothing?

originalhypa 11-09-2017 06:59 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by 320icar (Post 8871111)
So you suggest doing nothing?
It’s not my place to suggest anything.
I’m a fan of guns and the culture that surrounds it. I enjoy shooting and hunting, and would be pretty upset if some pussy senator or mp tried to take that away.

It’s not my problem to make everyone feel safe. Let’s face it, if you take guns away from regular folks the criminals will still have guns. It’s insane to think that any legislation put forward will stop criminals from having guns.

Berzerker 11-09-2017 08:29 AM
It's not criminals doing these mass shootings though is it. It's normal people going to a gun store and buying weapons designed to kill humans. No one is hunting with an AR-15 or an AK or any other assault rile now are they?

Criminals get guns, yes but not from gun stores. They get black market guns but those guns come from somewhere.

Berz out.

welfare 11-09-2017 09:53 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Berzerker (Post 8871269)

Criminals get guns, yes but not from gun stores. They get black market guns but those guns come from somewhere.

Berz out.
Do you think that the ambition, and therefore the ability, to kill is dependant on this?

These arguments: statues, guns, video games, etc, all boil down to your belief in human nature and it's reaction to environment.
Constrained or unconstrained. Left or right.

You can remove the "tools" (at the cost of every individual who appreciates and respects such freedoms) But the vehicle will always remain. IMO

320icar 11-09-2017 11:34 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by originalhypa (Post 8871250)
It’s not my place to suggest anything.
I’m a fan of guns and the culture that surrounds it. I enjoy shooting and hunting, and would be pretty upset if some pussy senator or mp tried to take that away.

It’s not my problem to make everyone feel safe. Let’s face it, if you take guns away from regular folks the criminals will still have guns. It’s insane to think that any legislation put forward will stop criminals from having guns.
I get it. I have my pal/rpal. But when something’s fucked up, it’s fucked up. No ones taking away our Canadian pea shooters. But the us and gun culture has just gone too far. They’ve flown too close to the sun

Berzerker 11-09-2017 11:45 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by welfare (Post 8871279)
Do you think that the ambition, and therefore the ability, to kill is dependant on this?

These arguments: statues, guns, video games, etc, all boil down to your belief in human nature and it's reaction to environment.
Constrained or unconstrained. Left or right.

You can remove the "tools" (at the cost of every individual who appreciates and respects such freedoms) But the vehicle will always remain. IMO

I think that when guns aren't readily available the average person will have a hard time trying to locate and purchase them. Most people wouldn't even know how or where to procure and illegal assault weapon. So yes I think that taking them and regulating them and making them not available would make them harder to get. It would also drive the price up so a kid like the one that shot up the church might not even be able to afford them even if they could find them.

Berz out.

Hondaracer 11-09-2017 12:10 PM
Someone who is willing to kill dozens of people can probably Scrounge up enough money to buy one of the 300 million guns in circulation in the states regardless of cost.

Whether that’s breaking into homes, robbing banks, etc if your mindset is to kill I doubt the means to obtain a weapon is a deterant.

westopher 11-09-2017 12:54 PM
The whole point is, something should have been done before there were 300 million guns. I do t know. Maybe let’s make it harder to get guns before there is 400 million?
Or just keep saying here is nothing that can be done.

Manic! 11-09-2017 01:14 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hondaracer (Post 8871303)
Someone who is willing to kill dozens of people can probably Scrounge up enough money to buy one of the 300 million guns in circulation in the states regardless of cost.

Whether that’s breaking into homes, robbing banks, etc if your mindset is to kill I doubt the means to obtain a weapon is a deterant.

Yet for some reason us government thinks it can stop terrorism and spends 100's of billions fighting it. Maybe they should classify every mass shooting as a terrorist attack.

Great68 11-09-2017 01:15 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hondaracer (Post 8871303)
Someone who is willing to kill dozens of people can probably Scrounge up enough money to buy one of the 300 million guns in circulation in the states regardless of cost.

Whether that’s breaking into homes, robbing banks, etc if your mindset is to kill I doubt the means to obtain a weapon is a deterant.
Ah, the old "It's too hard, so might as well do nothing" argument.

Doing nothing has seemed to be working well for the USA over the last 20 years.

Hondaracer 11-09-2017 01:32 PM
So you do all the things people want done, big background checks, criminal records get denied purchase, waiting periods, gun show loop holes, etc.

Then these keep happening, then what?

100% you are never going to get much further with legislation than that.

the "it's a start" mentality is going to see soooo much pushback people are just going to be buying more and more ammo and high capacity mags etc

not saying i have the answer, nor do i really care what the states do, let them implode upon themselves. However, these minor tweaks to legislation wont do shit.

People are driving down people with vehicles now, who needs a gun

MarkyMark 11-09-2017 02:26 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hondaracer (Post 8871320)
So you do all the things people want done, big background checks, criminal records get denied purchase, waiting periods, gun show loop holes, etc.

Then these keep happening, then what?

100% you are never going to get much further with legislation than that.

the "it's a start" mentality is going to see soooo much pushback people are just going to be buying more and more ammo and high capacity mags etc

not saying i have the answer, nor do i really care what the states do, let them implode upon themselves. However, these minor tweaks to legislation wont do shit.

People are driving down people with vehicles now, who needs a gun
Of course it will keep happening, but as the decades go by the hope is that it'll be less frequent. It doesn't have to be instant to work.

And yes the car thing... How many people were killed with that latest car killing compared to Vegas or Texas? Pretty sure a car ain't killing 50 people, and if they do, they are one excellent driver.

I don't see why people say things like "and when it doesn't work?" So what? Do we have to sacrifice a million puppies in the name of a failed attempt of stopping mass shootings? We're still trying to figure out this cure for cancer thing, would we just give up on that too, because heaven forbid a fix didn't come in the first year of trying.


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