5 New B.C. Ferries Being Built
 

You know we have an NDP government when they want to build new ferries again... I have a feeling we will be paying for this from the mobility tax, extra gas tax and I wouldn't be surprised if they raise the PST as well..

https://vancouversun.com/news/local-...box=1530725189

i think they need to keep the ferry costs down by just making the ferries as basic as possible. it's a 2 hour ride, you don't need every friggin amenity in there. make them simple and hold lots of cars, strip out all the bells and whistles and keep the costs down.

The amenities like the gift shop and cafeteria are revenue generators for BC ferries, and due to Transport Canada regs a specified number of staff are required to be on board so might as well have them flipping burgers or selling gifts rather than twiddling their thumbs in a staff room for 2 hours.

Remember back in the day when the NDP government under Glen Clark built those fast ferries in the late 90s?

That project wasted over hundreds of millions of taxpayer dollars for ferries that ended being auctioned for about 19 million to an American company. LUL

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fast_Ferry_Scandal

If BC is anything like the federal government for procuring boats for the Navy, they should see them hit service anytime between 2030-2040.

Well the two Spirit boats were built in BC back in the 90's under the NDP and they worked out fine.

The fast ferries was the NDP trying to support the local shipbuilding industry by ramming through designs and technology that the local workforce had absolutely no experience and thus business in doing.

As long as they keep these new C class boats traditional, they'll be fine.

That being said, I don't support mandating them be built in BC if we can't be competitive. I don't want my tax money to be on the hook for ferries that cost 50% more than we could get them elsewhere simply to support a single industry here.

Can we vote the NDP out before they finalize this?

I think we need new ferry’s regardless so the Beaucracy of cancelling then having a new govt build them anyways is probably most costly than just going ahead with this plan

They're replacing ferries that are 40+ years old. No problem with that unless it's way short of their supposed life span.

Fast Cats anyone?

Unless I'm mistaken weren't the S-Class vessels planned under the SoCreds (today's BC Liberals)?

Taking out amenities like the video arcades makes sense at least. About two years ago I was on a Tssawassen-Swartz Bay sailing aboard Spirit of Vancouver Island, back when it had an arcade. It was in very poor condition. There was Mario Kart Arcade GP, NFS Carbon, a Sega Rally Championship cabinet (Sega Model 2), a Konami!Simpsons cabinet, plus some others I don't remember (I think Tekken 5 and Guitar Hero Arcade). The steering wheels on NFS and Sega Rally were busted (I tried out all three driving cabinets), and all the cabinets in general seemed poorly maintained. The arcade itself was empty for most of the voyage.

I wasn't surprised that few people tried out the arcade. Arcades, at least in the U.S. and Canada (Japan/South Korea/Taiwan/SE Asia are a different story) started dying ever since home consoles and PCs began reaching arcade quality starting in the late 90s/early 2000s. Maybe even earlier if you count the PS1, Saturn, etc. as close to arcade quality. Then smartphone gaming buried arcade culture and poured six feet of cement on top of it, except for niche audiences (e.g. CHQ or E-Spot). I think smartphones have replaced arcade machines as the electronic time wasters of choice. Everyone's got smartphones these days, and all you need is wi-fi (which BC Ferries offers on board) to watch Youtube videos or play mobile games. Compare that with the costs of maintaining arcade cabinets and it's a no-brainer.

I only wonder why arcades are still healthy in the wealthier countries of east/southeast Asia, despite PCs and smartphones being widely available (and the population being rich enough to buy them for home use, so not counting China where many citizens are poor and can't afford a home PC).

Speaking of smartphones, Spirit of Vancouver Island has a Best Buy Express vending machine that sells headphones, portable chargers, etc. That seems like a good idea. I wonder if Best Buy pays BC Ferries to place their kiosks on vessels; or if BC Ferries gets a commission from Best Buy for each kiosk item sold on board the vessels. It could be a nice revenue stream for BC Ferries.

Also, does anyone think that Pacific Buffet is ludicrously overpriced? $20.75 for lunch, that's comparable with lunch at casino buffets. And casino buffets aren't very good overall (I've never tried Pacific Buffet so I can't compare the quality). Actually, most food onboard seems to be expensive, like the Coastal Cafe. I'm sure BC Ferries has their own reasons to price food that high, but I've had to remind myself to pack my own lunch/snacks if I take a ferry in the future.

You could be right, The Spirits were built in 1993 & 1994, NDP assumed power in 1991. They could have been in design phase prior to NDP power. I would have been around 9-10 years old at the time so I wasn't paying too much attention to politics back then

They've been pulling the arcades from the ships for a while now as they've been undergoing their refits.

We use the buffet from time to time. It's no five star restaurant, but what it IS is a nice comfortable place to have a table to yourself for the whole voyage, especially if you're walking on or your car gets put on the bottom deck where you can't stay in your car anymore (so now even MORE people on the passenger decks competing for seating), and bonus that you get food. If I look at it that way, it's more than worth it for the price.

The replacement Queens should have themes.

Queen of Surrey could have gun racks, complementary Laddus and a shrine to Bindy Johal.

I remember having the buffet one time. Then I had the 'all you can poop' in my hotel room.

Crazy, never had once had an issue with the food, I think they take sanitation and food safety pretty seriously at BC Ferries. Last time I had the buffet one of the workers was doing the checks on temperatures of all the food on the line.

I used to frequently take the Sunshine Coast ferries during August long etc.

There is very little around those ferries, it’s kind of a saving grace to get on after sitting in your car for a few hours and have white spot

I can't recall ever seeing anyone using the SeaWest Lounge on the Coastal ships in my travels. Do they make any money on them?

The kids play areas could use some entertainment upgrades. I feel they should also try to do more to encourage sick kids to stay out of the play area like they do with daycares and schools. It seems every time we go in there a kid is coughing and dripping with snot. Over a weekend we start to get sick and we've also passed it on to my parents, who can't afford to be sick.

I'm as old as the youngest C Class ships. I will feel older when they are gone.

No, I do know that. I think BC Ferries started stripping arcades from vessels in October of 2016, I was on Spirit of Vancouver Island in April so this would have been before the arcades were removed.

Your point about not being able to sit in your car anymore on the ferry (except on the uppermost car decks) was one I hadn't considered. When I took the ferry it was before the ban was even announced, so the passenger decks were still pretty busy but not crammed as balls (since many car passengers on the lower decks sat in their vehicles on the lower decks, alleviating pressure for seating space).

Also, you make a good point about walk-ons. Of all the times I've taken a ferry, only once has it not been as a walk-on passenger, so it's likely that I'll be a walk-on for future sailings (i.e. hitching a ride to Tssawassen or taking the 620 bus). I'm sure that if I were to sail nowadays I'd be pissed at how crowded the upper decks would be. Personal space, food and free wifi for $39 ($17.20 walkon fare + $20.75+GST for lunch) seems like a pretty good deal.

I'm not sure I'd do the Pacific Buffet both ways though, it starts getting into the $80 range if you do that. I'd rather have one meal not on the ferry. e.g. if I had breakfast at home, then I'd have the dinner buffet aboard the ferry. Or, if I had breakfast on the ferry, I'd have lunch in Victoria, pack my own snacks, then have dinner at home.

If you want the personal space, do you have to shell out for Pacific Buffet to get it? My other idea was booking a stateroom on the Spirit-class vessels, but the staterooms have now been removed.

I have another OT question about BC Ferries. It's well known that car spaces can sell out fast, and there can be a 1-2+ sailing wait on major routes if you're driving, especially during holiday periods (like the Friday and Saturday 9am/10am sailings from the mainland to Swartz Bay during the recent Canada Day long weekend), so it's highly recommended to make reservations. Are any routes which can sell out for walk-on passengers, and if so, for which periods can this occur? If I had to guess, I'd say it stands to reason that the following routes can sell out for foot passengers:

• Southern Gulf Islands routes during long weekends
• The big Metro-Island routes in mid-late March, which is GVSD's spring break. This is when students from the Island visit Vancouver. I'm pretty sure Saanich (SD63), SD62 (Sooke) and Nanaimo-Ladysmith align their spring breaks with Victoria, too
• Tssawassen-Swartz Bay during reading break in February, when UVic students visit Vancouver

There are probably some edge cases I'm missing, like if a tour group snaps up foot passenger space for a single sailing, but I don't know much about that.

Anyway, getting back on topic...I'm pleasantly surprised that the NDP is calling for the new vessels to be built here in BC. They could have saved money by having them built in Washington state or Germany (like the Coastal-class vessels) or Poland, but I think they struck a balance between protecting in-province jobs from the disproportionate effect of globalization, without going full Trump about it.

In 2004 when I was in grade 7, my class went on a trip to Victoria. The return trip to Tssawassen was on Queen of Vancouver (which was a V-class vessel but I digress). A few months later, I was off to Grade 8 Camp (my school had rented YMCA Camp Elphinstone for the event), and what should be the vessel on the Horseshoe Bay-Langdale sailing but the Queen of Vancouver, and in both directions! Even back then I had a feeling that the V-class ships were getting on in years, especially after having been on board the Spirit-class vessels which seemed futuristic at the time. I'm a bit too young to have fond nostalgic memories of the V-class or C-class vessels.

On my most recent trip to Victoria, I kind of wished I was able to sail on board the Coastal Celebration or Coastal Renaissance. Those Vancouver 2010 liveries looked great. But friends have told me the Spirit-class vessels are better quality overall. I can't vouch for that, since I've never been on a Coastal-class vessel.

As long as they have at least the same capacity, I don't have a problem with this. Building locally would be more expensive than in Poland, but I wonder by how much? Maybe the extra expense would be worth the jobs it would create .

I'm worried that they'll want to make these fancy cruise-like ships that carry like 50 vehicles each though.

The other option is the "Seawest Lounge" which is $12 vs the Buffet's $24.50. You get light snacks coffee and crackers, comfy chairs and some tiny barstool tables. Personally I'd rather pay the extra $12.50 for a full table and better food selection.

Yes walk-ons do occasionally sell out. They can only let as many people on board as they have lifejackets, so your tourbus example is a good one. Happened to me only once in all the years of using the ferries

Depends on how much more they'll cost to be "Built in BC". 5-10% sure that doesn't bother me. 20+%, fuck that.

The Spirits are better than the coastals, IMO. Just better layout of the decks, amenities and seating areas.

I remember my first day at Seaspan, one of the Fastcats was docked there for years before a buyer was found.

If anyone cares, the Fastcats were bought by the Washington Marine Group. It's local but owned by Dennis Washington out of Montana. His son Kyle lives in Vancouver and is chairman. Pretty sure he's a Canadian citizen now.

The Washington Marine Group consisted of Seaspan Marine, Vancouver Drydock, Vancouver Shipyard, Victoria Shipyard and a few smaller companies like Seaspan Ferries. The name was changed to Seaspan ULC back in 2012, WMG no longer exists.

Cant remember what happened to the Fastcats after they left Seaspan.

If they're looking to build the new ferries locally, I'm not sure where they can build it. Vancouver Shipyard is at capacity with the Federal Fleet Renewal program. Started on ship 2 a few months ago.

just read those fastcats could do 39 knots! thats pretty damn fast for a ferry!
apparently they were hard to load which slowed down the overall crossing time. I remember people complaining about the huge waves that they cast off, wrecking docks and boats on the smaller islands.

20% is easily made back in income taxes from the middle-class jobs provided (federal tax rate on $75k job is 17.2%, plus provincial of 6.3%). Add on secondary taxes (sales taxes, spending money in local communities providing more jobs, etc) and the number is way higher than 20% to break even.

I'd venture a guess that anything less than 40%, we're still coming out ahead.

I bet it's going to be at least 2 to 3 times the cost of a foreign builder and It will take years instead of months to build. When they built the ships in Germany it took about 6 months. Washington Marine Group can charge pretty much whatever they want because the government wants them built in B.C. and Washington Marine Group is I the only company that can build them in B.C. from what I know.

Seaspan (formerly WMG) doesn't have the capacity to build the FFR ships and these new ferries. We occasionally get a ferry in for maintenance to keep the trades busy but can't build them right now.

It could be as high as 250% more.

To put it in some perspective (from another VancouverSun article):
I'd rather the money saved go to other needed infrastructure in the province, which would still be providing middle class jobs in BC.