REVscene Automotive Forum

REVscene Automotive Forum (https://www.revscene.net/forums/)
-   Vancouver Off-Topic / Current Events (https://www.revscene.net/forums/vancouver-off-topic-current-events_50/)
-   -   Birthright citizenship (https://www.revscene.net/forums/715528-birthright-citizenship.html)

originalhypa 10-31-2018 10:53 AM

Birthright citizenship
 
Is Richmond's mayor elect Malcolm Brodie alienating himself from his constituents, or could he be the first public official to actually stand up to this practice?

Quote:


Richmond’s mayor thinks being born in Canada shouldn’t automatically grant you citizenship


RICHMOND (NEWS 1130) – As U.S. President Donald Trump pushes to end birthright citizenship in the United States, a local mayor is making comments on the subject.

Richmond’s re-elected mayor doesn’t believe people should be granted citizenship simply because they were born here. He thinks a specific problem in his city is birth tourism and those who profit from it.

“The concept of birth tourism is people flying in from elsewhere in the world to have a child here. That’s what it is, by definition,” said Malcolm Brodie, who is still seeking support from other levels of government to stop the practice.

Spoiler!


“But the way our system works isn’t that you simply show up at the hospital and give birth. A doctor has to give notice — usually three, four, five months in advance — that their patients will be going to the hospital. It’s not a situation where you have Joseph and Mary showing up, saying, ‘My wife is pregnant. She has to give birth.'”



It's not just happening in Richmond either.

Quote:

I Stayed in a Los Angeles Chinese Maternity Hotel

Every year, hundreds of Chinese women come to Los Angeles as "birth tourists" to give birth in hopes of providing their children with a safer, brighter future. While more and more of them DIY the experience by renting their own apartment, many still choose to pay up to $50,000 to stay in an exclusive "maternity hotel" where all their needs are taken care of.

I was one of those women.
Spoiler!


https://mom.me/pregnancy/88466-i-sta...ternity-hotel/

welfare 10-31-2018 11:21 AM

anchor babies

CivicBlues 10-31-2018 12:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by originalhypa (Post 8926269)
Is Richmond's mayor elect Malcolm Brodie alienating himself from his constituents, or could he be the first public official to actually stand up to this practice?

How so? His constituents are the Canadian Citizens and Residents of Richmond. The ones doing the anchor babying are neither.

Seems like Trump beat Brodie to it if you didn't know.

Jus Soli citizenship has been pretty much enshrined New World countries since colonization. Rather than throw the baby out with the bathwater (pun intended), has anyone explored giving the Provincial or Municipal gov't greater authority and oversight in shutting down these birth hotels?

yray 10-31-2018 01:14 PM

well a few babies owe Richmond hospital a couple mil

Why is CBSA and global affairs canada letting them in. They should've been rejecting their visa/entry outright.

Great68 10-31-2018 01:41 PM

Just because something was "enshrined since colonization" doesn't mean that the modern landscape and reality doesn't change.

Made sense when you were trying to boost citizen numbers of your developing country as quickly as possible back in those days, but can't say that's really necessary anymore.

What are the actual upsides these days to keeping this system in place, other than "because it feels good"?

68style 10-31-2018 01:47 PM

Keep it in place but charge like $200,000+ per birth and put all the money back into the hospital and housing ventures.

They’re just setting up shop to import “no income” (even though they’re wealthy) claim all the child tax / welfare from stupid Government of Canada satellite families anyway, might as well cut into their profit margin upfront.

welfare 10-31-2018 01:50 PM

or just get rid of it. in this day and age the system is pretty much an invitation for abuse

68style 10-31-2018 01:54 PM

They’ll just find another way... need to think more like China “how can we also make money off this?” Lol

The funniest thing will be if the government decides on a date to kill this and watching Richmond’s population literally double in a matter of weeks as they all try to squeeze in before the deadline. Whole bunch of dudes in China gonna be fucking non stop 10 months before the deadline hahahaha

CivicBlues 10-31-2018 01:55 PM

I didn't make any qualifications as to whether Jus Soli is still valid for contemporary times, just that it is firmly established as a founding principle of our nation. Thus making it a bit harder to just "get rid of" than say, Marijuana prohibition.

Not saying either that it's a fool proof system immune to abuse, but rather, what alternatives are we to adopt? And what limits are we to place on them? We can't really use Jus Sanguinus (citizenship by blood) because we would have to define what "Canadian blood" is - which really goes against most principles of Multiculturalism. If we use some modified form of Jus Soli which requires a residency period, what is to become of stateless persons or refugees who give birth on our soil? Would their children remain stateless? What about criminal parents who are deported? Are their adult children who are born here to be deported as well to a country they have no memory of? And to dismiss these an examples as outliers not worthy of consideration, well the same can be said of the birthing hotels themselves. While egregious and uproarious, it is hardly the rule.

An argument for Birthright citizenship from a Conservative American blog, no less:
https://www.redstate.com/diary/daven...t-citizenship/

TDLR: Among other things, it basically states that the concept of "Citizenship" has been frequently used to deny minorities of their rights. As an Asian person born to naturalized Canadian citizens, this is always top of mind. The fact that Chinese Canadians weren't given the right to vote until 1947 and that only a couple of years before that Japanese Canadians were stripped of any citizenship rights altogether. It's why I always carry my passport with me when I'm abroad, lest some foreign official stopping me in the streets refusing to believe I am a citizen of this country. The very definition of "White Privilege" that visible minority Canadians are not afforded.

nsmb 10-31-2018 02:34 PM

make richmond great again

Kappa

freakshow 10-31-2018 02:36 PM

My understanding is that someone born to Canadian citizens would be granted citizenship.
But it doesn't make sense to me why someone born in the country from a non-citizen would automatically be granted citizenship.

Traum 10-31-2018 02:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CivicBlues (Post 8926288)
Seems like Trump beat Brodie to it if you didn't know.

In Trump's case, his executive order is little more than a disguise to drum up support for the GOP among his Trump voter base. 2 or 3 years ago when Obama tried a similar thing by imposing an executive order to allow Dreamers to stay, the executive order was quickly overturned by the court to say that the president does not have the power to unilaterally change the policies like that.

With birthright citizenship enshrined in the US constitution, nothing short of a constitutional amendment will stand in the eye of the legal system. Trump is no stranger to having his executive orders revoked, but he still chose to do this because the GOP is sweating bullets about losing the midterms.

Hondaracer 10-31-2018 03:04 PM

pretty hard to enforce but really what reason do you have to travel to Canada from China while thoroughly pregnant and having (at best) loose relations here..

if people are getting interrogated like crazy for bringing packs of beef jerky into Canada, you should be essentially held at gun point when you arrive in Canada 8 months pregnant...

originalhypa 10-31-2018 03:12 PM

^
That's the thing that frustrates me.
I get a letter from the CRA saying that I owe them $800 from my taxes 5 years ago. But these assholes bring in hockey bags full of $20s into the casino, then Weissach, and no one bats an eye.

The double standard is infuriating.

Infiniti 10-31-2018 03:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by yray (Post 8926296)
well a few babies owe Richmond hospital a couple mil

Why is CBSA and global affairs canada letting them in. They should've been rejecting their visa/entry outright.

Well for starters, this is not within the purview of Global Affairs Canada. This is dealt with by Immigration, Refugees and Citizenship Canada (IRCC)

Manic! 10-31-2018 05:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by freakshow (Post 8926316)
My understanding is that someone born to Canadian citizens would be granted citizenship.
But it doesn't make sense to me why someone born in the country from a non-citizen would automatically be granted citizenship.

When white people first came here Canada was not a country.

welfare 10-31-2018 05:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 68style (Post 8926308)
They’ll just find another way... need to think more like China “how can we also make money off this?” Lol

I thought we already have a program where foreigners can buy citizenship. The IIP.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Traum (Post 8926317)

With birthright citizenship enshrined in the US constitution, nothing short of a constitutional amendment will stand in the eye of the legal system. Trump is no stranger to having his executive orders revoked, but he still chose to do this because the GOP is sweating bullets about losing the midterms.

He doesn't need to amend the constitution. Only issue an executive order concurrent to it.

Section1 clause1 reads:
'All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the state wherein they reside'

FerrariEnzo 10-31-2018 05:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 68style (Post 8926304)
Keep it in place but charge like $200,000+ per birth and put all the money back into the hospital and housing ventures.

They’re just setting up shop to import “no income” (even though they’re wealthy) claim all the child tax / welfare from stupid Government of Canada satellite families anyway, might as well cut into their profit margin upfront.

Doesnt matter how much they charge, the problem is they dont pay the bills.. just up plop out the babies, get the papers and their gone...

Manic! 10-31-2018 06:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by welfare (Post 8926342)
I thought we already have a program where foreigners can buy citizenship. The IIP.



He doesn't need to amend the constitution. Only issue an executive order concurrent to it.

Section1 clause1 reads:
'All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the state wherein they reside'

We got a constitutional lawyer over here. That's never going to fly and I'm willing to put money on it.

https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/01...g?v=1437534569

PeanutButter 10-31-2018 06:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hondaracer (Post 8926321)
pretty hard to enforce but really what reason do you have to travel to Canada from China while thoroughly pregnant and having (at best) loose relations here..

if people are getting interrogated like crazy for bringing packs of beef jerky into Canada, you should be essentially held at gun point when you arrive in Canada 8 months pregnant...

With a lot of these women, you can't even tell they're pregnant. They will come here in their first trimester and likely won't even be showing yet.

BIC_BAWS 10-31-2018 07:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by welfare (Post 8926342)
I thought we already have a program where foreigners can buy citizenship. The IIP.


Just walked out of a meeting where the client, specifically deals with immigration investments, said that it's actually far more difficult to do now. Don't quote me on it cause she was speaking in Canto and my understanding is crap at best.

From what I heard, you need to invest into raw land or projects in the DP stage. But they cannot be hotels/casinos/resorts. A really good option for immigration investment is actually senior home care centers. You also need to have at least 5 years of Canadian ___ or smt.

The sum of it was that it's actually much harder to do now than like 5 years ago.

welfare 10-31-2018 08:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Manic! (Post 8926351)
We got a constitutional lawyer over here. That's never going to fly and I'm willing to put money on it.

It doesn't matter much whether you think it'll fly. If he does impose an executive order, ultimately it would likely end up being for the supreme court to dictate.

68style 10-31-2018 08:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by welfare (Post 8926342)
I thought we already have a program where foreigners can buy citizenship. The IIP.

But that was only Quebec taking all that money...

Zedbra 10-31-2018 08:34 PM

Having restricted Jus Soli is common throughout the world, the 30 countries without restrictions are the odd ones out here. My wife and I had our first child prior to her becoming a Canadian citizen and was grateful for the law of Jus Soli. Having to pay for every doctor's visit was the norm, and some special visits required payment up front. Our son was a $12k baby.

Going through the process we learned that countries with Jus Soli do actually make a lot of money from tourist birthing, in particular from countries that still have mandatory military service like: Korea, Germany, Brazil, and others. Having their child born in another country, then returning home and getting their own citizenship afterwards voids the requirement of the military service.

Lol White Privilege. Say any colour except white followed with pride and then explain that term and the definition of hypocrisy one after the other.

welfare 10-31-2018 08:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 68style (Post 8926377)
But that was only Quebec taking all that money...

I believe the money can be invested nationwide. They are required to "intend" to stay in Quebec. Of course about 90% head straight to either here or Toronto.

https://www.immigration.ca/quebec-im...estor-program/
Quote:

The Quebec Immigrant Investor Program is passive in nature, meaning individuals are not required to establish or actively manage a business in the province.


All times are GMT -8. The time now is 08:54 AM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2025, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
SEO by vBSEO ©2011, Crawlability, Inc.
Revscene.net cannot be held accountable for the actions of its members nor does the opinions of the members represent that of Revscene.net