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Police Forum Police Head Mod: Skidmark
Questions & info about the Motor Vehicle Act. Mature discussion only.

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Old 07-25-2003, 01:39 PM   #1
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illegal to cover VIN?

just wondering if it's illegal to cover the VIN on your dashboard?
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Old 07-28-2003, 01:57 AM   #2
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how bout to change the vin on the dash?
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Old 07-28-2003, 07:47 AM   #3
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Quote:
Originally posted by p0lar
how bout to change the vin on the dash?
illegal
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Old 07-28-2003, 08:56 AM   #4
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Section 354 C.C.

(2) In proceedings in respect of an offence under subsection (1), evidence that a person has in his possession a motor vehicle the vehicle identification number of which has been wholly or partially removed or obliterated or a part of a motor vehicle being a part bearing a vehicle identification number that has been wholly or partially removed or obliterated is, in the absence of any evidence to the contrary, proof that the motor vehicle or part, as the case may be, was obtained, and that such person had the motor vehicle or part, as the case may be, in his possession knowing that it was obtained,

(a) by the commission in Canada of an offence punishable by indictment; or

(b) by an act or omission anywhere that, if it had occurred in Canada, would have constituted an offence punishable by indictment.

(3) For the purposes of subsection (2), "vehicle identification number" means any number or other mark placed on a motor vehicle for the purpose of distinguishing the motor vehicle from other similar motor vehicles.

From the MVA:

New vehicle identification numbers

16 (1) If, with respect to a motor vehicle or trailer, any of the following circumstances exist, the owner of the motor vehicle or trailer must immediately apply to the Insurance Corporation of British Columbia for a new vehicle identification number for the motor vehicle or trailer:

(a) the vehicle identification number on a motor vehicle or trailer has become illegible or has been removed or obliterated;

(b) a vehicle identification number is not the same as any other vehicle identification number on the motor vehicle or trailer;

(c) the motor vehicle or trailer does not have a vehicle identification number.

(2) On being satisfied that the applicant is the lawful owner of the motor vehicle or trailer, the Insurance Corporation of British Columbia may assign a new vehicle identification number to it, and the owner must then cause the number so assigned, with the initials "B.C." to indicate British Columbia, and the date of the assignment of the number to be applied by a method designated by the corporation on the part or parts of the motor vehicle or trailer designated by the corporation.

(3) If the Insurance Corporation of British Columbia is satisfied that a new vehicle identification number has been assigned to and applied to a motor vehicle or trailer under this section, the corporation must cause the new number to be inserted in the registration record and licence of the motor vehicle or trailer.


Not a good idea to mess around with VINs. Too much chance of being seriously inconvenienced.
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Old 08-25-2008, 11:35 AM   #5
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sorry to bump this thread from the grave, but maybe I'm having trouble understanding the replies. Aren't posts 3 and 4 replying to post 2? I'm curious to whether or not covering the VIN is illegal as well, but the original post in my opinion hasn't really been replied to.

My friend told me that he has heard of stories where a person who is a close friend to a parts guy at a car dealer, was able to get a car key cut from a dealer by providing the VIN of a car. If that's the case, wouldn't theft of a car be easy?
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Old 08-25-2008, 05:38 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cyclonus View Post
sorry to bump this thread from the grave, but maybe I'm having trouble understanding the replies. Aren't posts 3 and 4 replying to post 2? I'm curious to whether or not covering the VIN is illegal as well, but the original post in my opinion hasn't really been replied to.

My friend told me that he has heard of stories where a person who is a close friend to a parts guy at a car dealer, was able to get a car key cut from a dealer by providing the VIN of a car. If that's the case, wouldn't theft of a car be easy?
Key cut, no. Coded alarm, yes.

If you think it's that easy, try walking into a dealership, give them a vin of a car you see on the street and see what they ask you for.

I lost my mercedes code key and I had to go in. I had to sign a ton of papers, get it approved on a few levels, they sent the request to the factory, factory generated a new key, sent it back, went through more paperwork, id, proof of ownership and then finally got a key.

It's not exactly walk in with a vin, walk out with a key.
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Old 08-25-2008, 08:19 PM   #7
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It's not exactly walk in with a vin, walk out with a key.
with normal keys it could be. normaly they ask for an insurance paper or something though.

Last edited by johny; 08-25-2008 at 08:20 PM.
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Old 08-26-2008, 12:54 AM   #8
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Thanks guys for the details regarding obtaining a key if one were to lose it, but the question by the OP has yet to be answered.

"Is it illegal to cover the VIN on the dash by the windshield of the drivers side." Yes or No, and if one of the police officer mods can answer it, that would be great too!
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Old 08-26-2008, 07:24 AM   #9
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It is legal to cover it with some temporary means, like a piece of tape, but you might get some extra time chatting with a cop who pulls you over as to why its covered and whether or not he feels like believing you.
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Old 08-26-2008, 01:07 PM   #10
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Quote:
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just wondering if it's illegal to cover the VIN on your dashboard?
I can't think of any reason as long as you are able to easily remove the cover to allow an officer to examine it if requested.
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Old 08-27-2008, 03:10 AM   #11
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^ what about in the case of a parked violation? I was under the impression that the reason the VIN is placed on the dash like that was so that it could be easily read by officers and the like.
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Old 08-27-2008, 07:59 AM   #12
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I've never seen my VIN recorded on a parking ticket, so I don't see why anyone would care. In fact, I have a City of Vancouver parking ticket right here in front of me - plate is listed, VIN isn't.
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Old 08-28-2008, 01:59 AM   #13
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parked, not parking.
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Old 08-28-2008, 08:58 AM   #14
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Sorry, just figured it was typical RS Engrish I am out of word!

So what's a "parked violation"?? Not asking to be snide, I just can't make sense of the term.
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Old 08-29-2008, 01:06 AM   #15
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I'm a white guy born and raised in Kelowna i spek vry gud engrish lulz

Anywho, I'm referring to the purpose of the dashboard VIN, which I believe was to be viewed easily (mostly by officers) regardless of whether or not you're in the car. I'm not saying they'd bother to list the VIN but they may check it from time to time to ensure it matches up. Stolen plates etc.
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Old 08-29-2008, 10:45 PM   #16
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i have had my vin covered up by a piece of foam for the past year.
none of the officers i encountered gave me any problem with it.
drove thru the boarder a few times, no problem either

on a side note about making a key with the VIN: I have seen a dealership do it in less than 10 minutes.
story behind it:
- dealership people locked key inside car.
- didn't want to ask the customer for spare key.
- read vin
- come back within 10 minutes with a new key to unlock car.
- "you didn't see this"
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Old 08-30-2008, 01:41 AM   #17
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yes but that's a dealership doing it for dealership personal-based errors. I highly doubt any of you have cars so nuts that people are paying off dealership management to get a key based on the VIN.
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Old 11-01-2009, 03:52 PM   #18
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I guess ill take my car back to the body shop they replaced my dash and said they forgot to remove the VIN plate off my old dash and attach it to the new one. And now its gone in the trash.
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Old 11-01-2009, 05:07 PM   #19
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Unfortunately it is not so simple. Once you have removed a VIN, you are supposed to replace it with an assigned VIN. An officer finding a VIN plate reattached with pop rivets may consider the vehicle stolen according to the Criminal Code. A search should find the thread where this was discussed.
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Old 11-01-2009, 11:59 PM   #20
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"reattached"? My original VIN plate is still attached, with pop rivets... as supplied by the factory.
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Old 08-23-2011, 08:11 PM   #21
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I know i am bumping another old thread in additional to the rebadging thread.
The last post i made in this thread, I said i haven't been given trouble over the sticker over the vin.
Things have changed. A few days ago, a VPD officer told me he could have ticketed me for covering my VIN with a sticker.
The sticker is just a sticker placed on the windshield. I also have a piece of foam covering it from the inside.
At the officer's request, I removed both in under 10 seconds so he could run a check on the VIN to match the plate.

I am wondering if there is an exact law saying I can or can't cover my VIN with a sticker?
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Old 08-23-2011, 10:57 PM   #22
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illegible [ɪˈlɛdʒɪbəl]
adj
unable to be read or deciphered
illegibility , illegibleness n
illegibly adv
Collins English Dictionary – Complete

(a) the vehicle identification number on a motor vehicle or trailer has become illegible or has been removed or obliterated;

I believe that a case could be made for a hidden VIN being illegible if it is unable to be read? It would be up to the J.P. to decide. In the meantime, why are you driving around with it being "unable to be read"? Why attract heat? I know if I couldn't easliy see the VIN I would be taking a very close look at the vehicle, as that is very suspicious.
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Old 08-26-2011, 07:36 AM   #23
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illegible [ɪˈlɛdʒɪbəl]
adj
unable to be read or deciphered
illegibility , illegibleness n
illegibly adv
Collins English Dictionary – Complete

(a) the vehicle identification number on a motor vehicle or trailer has become illegible or has been removed or obliterated;

I believe that a case could be made for a hidden VIN being illegible if it is unable to be read? It would be up to the J.P. to decide. In the meantime, why are you driving around with it being "unable to be read"? Why attract heat? I know if I couldn't easliy see the VIN I would be taking a very close look at the vehicle, as that is very suspicious.
I think this doesnt matter.

take for instance a Japanese Car, like a Toyota Soarer. There is no VIN on the dash, or any at all facing the outside of the car. Without opening the door or hood, it is impossible to verify the VIN. Just because it isnt visible, doesn't mean its Illegible. Illegible is more like, I cant read it when I can see it, like scratching, grinding, rubbed off/partially removed VIN's in the correct spot.
If a Cop cannot see the VIN from walking around and inspecting it, and he can run the plates, its his duty to contact the owner and have him pop the hood or where-ever its located. Not issue a ticket.... geez.

try reading a car's VIN at 6am, with condensation on the window. You Cant.. That but doesn't make it illegible.
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Old 08-27-2011, 11:27 PM   #24
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got my dash replaced. new vin has to be placed in jamb according to icbc ,so should be fine to have it covered cuz i dont even have one visible.
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Old 08-28-2011, 07:45 AM   #25
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If a Cop cannot see the VIN from walking around and inspecting it, and he can run the plates, its his duty to contact the owner and have him pop the hood or where-ever its located. Not issue a ticket.... geez

Running the plates gives them the information for those plates on file, and the VIN number attached to those plates....however, if you can't find the VIN on the vehicle itself to confirm that the car is the one listed on the plates, then you have nothing. It is not uncommon to have people take plates from one similar car & run with them on another.

I know one company that used a series of pickup trucks to collect oysters on the beach and they were all Chevy. They would just flip the same plate from truck to truck instead of registering them all. The only way you could tell was by the VIN numbers. I used to check them, write a no insurance VT and call a tow truck. After the second time I began seizing the plates as well. If a plate is regsitered to a blue Civic and it's on a blue Civic how can you tell if it's the correct one unless you have a visible VIN? I'm not going to spend a lot of time playing VIN hide and seek. It must be there and it must be visible. If I can't find it then the car gets removed until the driver can prove that the plates belong to that car.
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