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The thin line between love and hate
Mature discussion about understanding the opposite sex...

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Old 03-14-2010, 03:59 PM   #26
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Actually, the reason most relationships fail is that couples are not honest with each other. Well, actually, it's usually money. THEN it's dishonesty. If the guy hides his love for/use of pornography until they are 1-2 years into a relationship (or until she moves in, which is often the case), then she suddenly feels violated or like she is inadequate. By that same token, if she never mentions her loathing of pornography or her use of sex toys when he leaves her unsatisfied, that would fall under a similar category, no?
I used to think it was money but ironically, money is a smokescreen for larger underlying issues. Most people do argue about money but the reason people argue about money is because they feel the other person is violating their ideals or principles. This is typical when one person feels the other party is irresponsible with money, or that their expectations of money differ. I would agree with you that anything that kills honesty, kills the realtionship. I don't think there is one exclusive deal breakers in a realtionship but rather a few things that can cause problems. While I do agree with you comment above, I think we've drawn a little off the path here. The concern is when what you're doing becomes an addiction. In your ice cream example, there are cases where there could be cause for alarm as someone can become addicted to just about anything.

The main point was that porn addiction is one of the hardest, if not the most hardest addicitions to overcome and it can have tragic effects on relationships. It can also have an effect on a personal life of a single person as well to be fair.


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Why not? Why shouldn't sex be viewed in a transactional basis like everything else is? What makes sex so special? Morality? Christian mores?

My family has an odd habit of getting into discussions at family gatherings--and several of my aunts and uncles are anthropologists. We had a very interesting discussion about a tribal village in which men cannot create children--they simply allow women to release them. As a result, there is no concept of philandery, since there is no concept of monogamy--the children of the village are the children of the village; all of the men are the fathers.

So what makes sex different, and why is transactionizing sex 'heading in the [wrong] direction?'
Again, I can think of some great arguments for saying 'yes' to transactional sex or various elements of sexuality. Like it or not, I think society has been there for a long time. I think the concept of this change when we ourselves are in this situation. I guess a good case in point is how many people would be okay never having a girlfriend or boyfriend but still have sex? How many people could have sexual realations with someone and not fall in love? How many people could fall in love, want to be with someone, but allow freedom of sexuality with that partner?

I'm not suggesting that it's a no for everyone, but it's not a yes for everyone either. Again though, we're straying away from the initial point of addiction. If what you're doing is not hurting yourself or anyone else, then what's the harm? There isn't in my opinion.



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I agree, if she is doing it in place of being intimate. However, you imply that pornography replaces sexual contact with a partner. In truth, for most men, it is simply something that will allow them to take care of their needs at their own pace in their own time. I am, admittedly, a copious masturbator, and yet I have NO issues insofar as intimacy with significant others and/or people with whom I have sex. Your implication that pornography and masturbation replace intimacy with a partner is a misrepresentation.
I agree as well, as you mentioned, so long as it is not hurting the other person. While pornography may not have the effect of substitution for you or I, the scary thing is that there are countless cases of people in that very situation. It's like if you and I go grab a beer. If we have a few drinks and then go home, there isn't much harm in that. However if I'm missing work or drinking all the time, there might be a problem. Just because we can have a drink and walk away, there are countless others that have a problem controlling themselves.

This is a big problem because we legally have to be 19 in order to have a beer. Pornography now, due to the computer age, is for all to see. There are kids in primary grades talking about stuff I didn't even know about until I was in my later teens - and I was not a sheltered child.

Coupled with the clinical proof that pornography is more addictive than drugs, I find that dangerous.


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I'm snipping your last paragraph here 'cause this is the only part I think you and I see eye-to-eye on. Honesty is what's necessary, and I think you and I are coming at this perspective with a different idea of what an 'emotionally healthy sexual relationship' is.
I have a feeling we might agree on far more than this, however the way I worded my first post may have made it look more like a specific case rather then the overall general element of the addiction.


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Now, you said that a man would promise to 'delete the material' to keep his girl/wife happy. This is the essential problem. Not the porn itself, but the man lying to his woman. The man lying to the woman in saying that he will delete it and never use it again. Yet, he is lying because he is often being forced--"You're cheating on me if you're looking at porn!". But why do we have this view? Again, why is it that transactional sex--even with oneself--is a bad thing?


Communication is a key point in relationships, and I am a dirty old man. I cannot think of a single person I know (relatives included, sadly), who do not know this. I am upfront and honest--sex is important to me, and even if my partner and I are having a great deal of congress on a regular basis, I still have the need to relax on my own schedule, on my own time, with my long-time FWB, Palmela. Communication [of desires and needs] and Education [of the idea that sex does not need to be dealt with in a non-transactional method] are the key factors in eliminating the concept of 'addiction' related to pornography.
This is a grey area although I agree about the honest part. Addiction is classified as something that you cannot stop that is not required. As a man, I would agree, stopping sex, while not a killer right away, is a one way ticket to death. For many women this is also true. We are hard wired to have sex and when it's not there, we as a semi-advanced society, find ways to deal with it (since we've banned clubbing woman and dragging them back to the cave).

At the end of the day though, it's when we use the man made elements to substitute the real thing, or when it has an effect on our lives that is damaging. I'm not saying NEVER watch porn, just that it's something that can sneak up on a person and clutch them with an addiction that is hard to break free from.

The younger generation will be a good test of this due to the ease of obtaining that material.

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Old 03-14-2010, 05:40 PM   #27
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there's a refractory period to masturbation though

if i knew certain drugs had no health risks and they were much cheaper, i would make the substitution no problem
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Old 03-15-2010, 07:18 AM   #28
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If you prefer pornography over your gf, call the situation next time so i can make a situation out of your situation.
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Old 03-16-2010, 02:42 PM   #29
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hahahahhahahahahaha^

"i am a copious masturbator"
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Old 03-16-2010, 04:40 PM   #30
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what are the hidden problems? i'm not going to go blind am i?
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Old 03-16-2010, 05:52 PM   #31
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cool, thanks for sharing my life story
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Old 03-16-2010, 06:12 PM   #32
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I only watch porn when I'm single.
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Old 03-18-2010, 04:58 PM   #33
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^ i call BS.
you're telling me if ur gf was going back to vacation for a good 2 mnths during the summer (if u're in HS) and you have nothing to do on a friday you wo'nt even turn the cpu on for a good flap/
wow...
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Old 03-18-2010, 05:42 PM   #34
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I hate it when CRS gets involved in a topic. It's like watching a Discovery program on archeology. You KNOW there will be no definitive answer but you still want to watch it.
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Old 03-19-2010, 07:35 AM   #35
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shit i already came twice while typing this
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Old 03-21-2010, 12:48 AM   #36
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I hate it when CRS gets involved in a topic. It's like watching a Discovery program on archeology. You KNOW there will be no definitive answer but you still want to watch it.
I came across a special the other day about this guy hunting for Atlantis. Now knowing that "Holy shit we found Atlantis" hasn't been a headline, I easily skipped the entire show because I knew that at the very end it's just gonna be him walking somewhere during a sunset narrating somn about "we still have yet to uncover it...but it's out there!"
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half those dudes are hotter than ,my GF.
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reading this thread is like waiting for goku to charge up a spirit bomb in dragon ball z
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OH thank god. I thought u had sex with my wife. :cry:
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Old 03-22-2010, 08:43 PM   #37
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Reminds me of Hanks best buddy in Californication who was addicted to porn and then ended up fucking his life up ahahah
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Old 03-23-2010, 03:12 AM   #38
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I'm a man...etc
u should watch South Park Season 14 Episode 1, u can learn about sex addiction there
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Old 03-25-2010, 12:28 AM   #39
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The main point was that porn addiction is one of the hardest, if not the most hardest addicitions to overcome and it can have tragic effects on relationships. It can also have an effect on a personal life of a single person as well to be fair.
How does one define porn addiction though?

Quote:
I'm not suggesting that it's a no for everyone, but it's not a yes for everyone either. Again though, we're straying away from the initial point of addiction. If what you're doing is not hurting yourself or anyone else, then what's the harm? There isn't in my opinion.
If what you're doing is not hurting yourself or anyone else, then what's the harm? Thank you.

Quote:
This is a big problem because we legally have to be 19 in order to have a beer. Pornography now, due to the computer age, is for all to see. There are kids in primary grades talking about stuff I didn't even know about until I was in my later teens - and I was not a sheltered child.

Coupled with the clinical proof that pornography is more addictive than drugs, I find that dangerous.
Show me this clinical proof. I remain highly skeptical.

Quote:
This is a grey area although I agree about the honest part. Addiction is classified as something that you cannot stop that is not required. As a man, I would agree, stopping sex, while not a killer right away, is a one way ticket to death. For many women this is also true. We are hard wired to have sex and when it's not there, we as a semi-advanced society, find ways to deal with it (since we've banned clubbing woman and dragging them back to the cave).

At the end of the day though, it's when we use the man made elements to substitute the real thing, or when it has an effect on our lives that is damaging. I'm not saying NEVER watch porn, just that it's something that can sneak up on a person and clutch them with an addiction that is hard to break free from.

The younger generation will be a good test of this due to the ease of obtaining that material.
So you say that porn addiction is harder to break than cocaine addiction, and you yourself in this post claim that something is an addiction "only when it interferes with normal life".

But your anecdote is as follows:
Quote:
I know of a few people that are essentially addicted to pornography. They don't feel they are but if asked to go a week without even a small peek on the internet, they all fail. This is a huge problem because they feel as though they are not addicted but cannot stop.

Some of these people, not just friends but co-workers as well, figured that they wasted nearly 10 hours a week looking for pornography.
10 hours a week doesn't seem like an addiction to me. If it is, then I'm also addicted to TV and the internet (the internet I don't totally deny). What you seem to be doing is trying to overstate and overgeneralize by saying that any guy who can't stop from watching porn once a week is addicted (me, I just think he suffers from a lack of imagination).

You say that it's harmful, but you post no studies.
You say that it's an addiction, but give conflicting logic on what qualifies it as an addiction.

I'm still waiting for proof.
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I hate it when CRS gets involved in a topic. It's like watching a Discovery program on archeology. You KNOW there will be no definitive answer but you still want to watch it.
I don't see him posting in this thread...
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Old 03-25-2010, 12:56 AM   #40
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I meant you. :$
Don't know what I was thinking when I typed CRS.
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Old 03-25-2010, 01:39 AM   #41
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How does one define porn addiction though?
How does one define any addiction? Technically you can get addicted to anything.
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half those dudes are hotter than ,my GF.
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reading this thread is like waiting for goku to charge up a spirit bomb in dragon ball z
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OH thank god. I thought u had sex with my wife. :cry:
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Old 03-25-2010, 01:43 AM   #42
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How does one define any addiction? Technically you can get addicted to anything.
Indeed, but where do you draw the line?

In his latest post, he says that an addiction is something that interferes with a normal life; but in his first example he says that 10 hours a week should be considered internet addiction.

I know some people who, by that definition, are addicted to spending time in coffeeshops.
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Old 03-25-2010, 12:41 PM   #43
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The wikipedia definition:

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Originally Posted by Wikipedia
An addiction is a persistent behavioural pattern marked by physical and/or psychological dependency that causes significant disruption and negatively impacts the quality of life of an organism.
I think the main thing is the negative impact on your life. If you're turning down invitations to things and not having sex with your SO as much because of porn, then I'd call that addicted.
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half those dudes are hotter than ,my GF.
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reading this thread is like waiting for goku to charge up a spirit bomb in dragon ball z
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OH thank god. I thought u had sex with my wife. :cry:
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Old 03-25-2010, 12:57 PM   #44
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Anything becomes an addiction when it rules your life, when it becomes a neccesity to watch porn on a daily routine. Then you know you have a problem
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Old 03-25-2010, 06:24 PM   #45
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So what if I have an insanely hot girlfriend who satisfies me in every way, but when she's not around/breaks up with me, I turn to porn to satisfy my voracious appetites, as I did before.

Is this sexual addiction or pornographic addiction? If I spend a great deal of my life thinking about and planning for sex, will you call me a sex addict as long as I find partners and a porn addict when I am without?

Where's the line between "too horny" and "porn addict"?
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Old 03-25-2010, 07:34 PM   #46
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are you srs bro?
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