impersonation claim

[jackp0t]

hello
a little background last nov and dec 2009 i supposedly got a bunch of ticket
24 hour prohibition , 12 hour prohibition , (4) driving contrary to restriciton ,
driving without consideration , fail to display "l" or "n" sign.
thats alot of ticket . so when i got the letter i immediately called icbc and told them that this wasnt me. so i went to the icbc for the impersonation claim. at this point thise tickets are on hold until its settled. officially the claim was started on jan/feb 2010 . so after a year feb2011 i gave them a call regarding the progress.and i was told that they give the claim to the police officers (two of them separate tickets) and icbc is just waiting for their response.
now my license is expiring on friday. so i gave icbc a call again regarding this and they said the police officers said that the ticket are valid and im getting fine
the points and fine is worth 4 grand on top of that i have to take the responsible driver program which is $985. they will suspend me for 2 years.
this is fucked . what can i do to dispute this?

im thinking of talking to the police officers regarding this

is there better solution?
after a year you think i can dispute this in court?

thanks in advance!!

[Qmx323]

Impersonation?

How did this other person get your DL?

[jackp0t]

i lost my license at that time . somehow someone was able to use it
and went drunk drive

ps
i also filed a police report regarding my license at that time

[zulutango]

So in every case the driver who personated you, produced your picture DL and looked enough like you, and signed the VTs just like you, did it so well that he was able to convince both Cops? Their investigations showed that they were convinced you were the driver. Whenever I issued a VT I always noted in my notes that the driver matched the DL picture....I used a check mark to show I checked the ID. I assume they also had some sort of system to note the same thing.

I'm sure one question I have for you is....who do you know who looks exactly like you, was driving your car on two different occasions (the plate of the car used and the owner info is on the VT and they would check if it was someone else's car) when they got stopped & ticketed and had your DL....or knew your full name, birth date, address and code word and could tell the Police all of those correctly, twice. ICBC can give you copies of the VTs and you can see what vehicle was used and what the signatures looked like.

You say you got 2 different tickets but FOUR drive contrary to restrictions, among others? So they put two 25(15) charges per ticket, twice, plus a fail to display L/N? Plus your DL was seized ( or should have been) twice, on each occasion, and your car impounded ( with supporting paperwork and on PRIME). There are signatures and descriptions on the 12 and 24 hr suspensions and physical descriptors are supposed to be added to each entity added to a PRIME file entry. If a roadside screening device was used and a test given at roadside, the DL info will be recorded in the Officer's notebook and noted on the RSD log as well. The test is usually given in the rear seat of the PC and there is plenty of time to look very closely at the person being tested. The DL should have been seized when the first roadside suspension was issued and the thief would have had to come to the Police station to get it back 24 hours later, to be used in the second suspension. Pretty ballsey of him, considering he would be on video at the time.

This does not sound right at all. Maybe the Police and ICBC have difficulty in believing you, as do I. Too many things just don't add up.

[jackp0t]

@zulutango thanks for the reply

the car that was used wasnt my car . in fact i didnt have a car at that moment because i was in an accident. and the signature was TOTALLY different than mine .that's why i thought the investigation would end fast

in fact in the beginning of the investigation i told icbc if i should just contact the police officers myself and talk to them directly regarding the claim but they told me that they do their own investigation.

i have no doubt in my mind that this are not my tickets.
im trying to get a hold of them left them a message but no reply back.
so im gonnna try again tomorrow and maybe talk to their superintendent if i sitll get no luck on contacting them.

[zulutango]

OK, so it was not your vehicle and the signatures don't match. What troubles me is how the personator was able to convince 2 different Police officers that they were you? Your DL must have been produced at least once when it should have been seized for the first suspension. When a driver does not produce a DL you establish identity by a number of ways and use the PRIME MDT to check on things. I can't understand how this driver knew all your personal info, including your code word? That usually means it was a family member, brother or sister and all the cases I investigated where the description and code word matched, involved a family member. I would assume that Police would interview the owner/s of the vehicle/s used to see how that vehicle was driven by "you". The owner of the vehicle is required to identify the operator when it's involved in an offence. I would also think that the owner/s would be examined to see if they looked exactly like you, knew you etc.

I would suggest that you contact the Police who did the investigation and start a Police file/s on the personation. All the personation investigations I did came after ICBC informed me that the real driver had contacted them, they sent me all the copies of the VTs and other info and I did the interviews and investigation because I wrote the VTs. I'm still having trouble with both officers doing separate investigations both coming to the conclusion that it was you and not somebody else...specially with all the procedural details I have given you. You can request that they show you the files to see what they found. It may help you identify your "evil twin".

[jackp0t]

the thing is the two police officer never even contacted me not once.
i put all my info in the icbc impersonation form

i tried contacting them but the officer in surrey is not coming in till march 21st
and the officer in vancouver i cant get a hold of

mi license is expiring tomorrow. i basically have to wait around till im able to talk to them .
ICBC said it will b up to the police officers to reverse the verdict

@zulutango thanks for the info

[skidmark]

Have you looked at copies of these tickets that ICBC says were issued to you?

I find it a bit difficult to understand why a personation investigation would take a year to conclude. The longest one I ever did was probably less than 60 days after I received the paperwork from ICBC.

[jackp0t]

yes ive seen all the tickets when i filed the impersonation paper work from icbc
and like i said the signature was totally different than mine!


i wanted to just talk to the police officer myself but icbc told me they do their own investigation. they said they will contact me soon but they never did
everytime i ask icbc for the update they said they are just waiting for the verdict of the police officers
and now just 2 days ago.i got a call fromm icbc that they(the police officers) concluded that the tickets are valid on the last week i can renew my license.
i mean how could they conclude the investigation w/o speaking to the person that filed the impersonation.

going to loose my license on my birthday.WEAK!
hopefully i can get a hold of the vancouver police officer.
i know the surrey police officer is coming in on monday.
i just learn that police works for 4 days and 4 days off

[fsy82]

Why don't you get your lawyer involved here? If your claim is true than it is pretty serious. They have your personal information and who knows what else they can do to your personal records.

[skidmark]

Originally Posted by jackp0t

yes ive seen all the tickets when i filed the impersonation paper work from icbc

So, whose vehicle is described on the tickets?

[jackp0t]

Originally Posted by fsy82

Why don't you get your lawyer involved here? If your claim is true than it is pretty serious. They have your personal information and who knows what else they can do to your personal records.

because the impersonation claim just ended 2 days ago.
i was advice by icbc to talk to the police officers first because they are the only one who can reverse the tickets
and im still trying to get a hold of the police officers.its a little bit premature to get a lawyer right away with out speaking to the police officers .imo
i got nothing to hide and confident if i talk to the police officer and meet them in person it will be reverse.

[jackp0t]

Originally Posted by skidmark

So, whose vehicle is described on the tickets?

it was some random person i dont even know
the car was a pontiac. if i remember correctly

[Spidey]

Sounds like you SHOULD get a lawyer.... you are being fined pretty heavily. Also, this sounds really fishy.... Do you have any enemies that could be members of the RCMP or VPD? I don't want to make assumptions that the officers are setting you up (which is very very slim considering one is from the RCMP and the other VPD).

Get a lawyer.

[zulutango]

Very slim...how about non-existant? 2 different Cops, 2 different forces and criminal charges, disgrace, fines, loss of employment when you get found out, as you will...for what?

[skidmark]

Originally Posted by jackp0t

it was some random person i dont even know

It's interesting how intimately that they know you in order to supply enough information to the officer to convince him.

[Spidey]

Originally Posted by zulutango

Very slim...how about non-existant? 2 different Cops, 2 different forces and criminal charges, disgrace, fines, loss of employment when you get found out, as you will...for what?

Well, you can't say non-existent because you really never know. But I agree it is very unlikely to the 10000th degree

[Soundy]

Originally Posted by skidmark

It's interesting how intimately that they know you in order to supply enough information to the officer to convince him.

Yeah, but how much info did YOU normally ask someone for when you pulled them over? Most times for me, whether stopped for an infraction or just a road check, the cop will usually take my license and insurance, give it a look or take it back to his car, and come back with the ticket or warning or whatever - no third degree, not even the NEED to convince them of anything.

I can count on two fingers the number of times I've been stopped that a cop has asked my address - or ANY sort of personal info - and both times were after I'd moved and had the change-of-address sticker on the back of my license.

In fact, even recently, when I went through a vehicle check just outside of Kelowna (I've told the story here before), and didn't have my driver's license with me, the only thing the cop asked me for (beyond my name) was my SIN number. My company van was in my boss's name - he looked at the insurance, asked if that's who I was... I told him no, that was my boss, and I was driving the work van, and he seemed fine with that.

*I* probably could have flashed the OP's license and slipped through, at that point... so I don't see why this story is so hard to believe.

[skidmark]

Originally Posted by Soundy

Yeah, but how much info did YOU normally ask someone for when you pulled them over?

When I stopped someone and they could not produce a DL I asked:

First name, middle name, last name, birthdate, address, phone number, DL number, class, expiry date, restrictions, security keyword, height, weight, hair and eye colour. I recorded all of this in my notebook and if I was still uncomfortable I took a picture of the offender, printed it and stapled it to the notes for my ticket.

I had very few problems with personation complaints after this. The memorable one was a little sweetie from Nanaimo whose mother told me that if you stood her up with her two sisters you would have difficulty telling them apart. She didn't get away with it the second time she tried though.

[Soundy]

Er... but the OP isn't talking about not producing a DL; he's talking about someone else supposedly producing HIS. If someone handed you a license and looked substantially like the picture on it... didn't give you any particular reason to be suspicious that he wasn't the same person on the license... would you still give him the third degree?

I have a longtime friend who's part native... he and his brother look similar in as much as both had long black hair, yet they were regularly mistaken for each other by cops (moreso, my friend being mistaken for his brother).

[zulutango]

Hence my post saying that all the personation investigations I got involved a family member impersonating aother family member. I also wonder how this person was able to convince BOTH Police that they were you? Was the DL produced both times, was it seized for the suspensions, if so, how did they get it back for at least the second VT? Many questions, many missing answers.

[skidmark]

Originally Posted by Soundy

Er... but the OP isn't talking about not producing a DL

Sort of. He says that somehow someone was able to use it. There is a box on the ticket for a Y or N to say whether a DL was produced or not. I would be a lot more comfortable with the story if he was able to unequivocally state that in each case a DL was produced and the ticket was marked to say that.

I would be willing to bet that the DL wasn't produced.

Produced or not, chances are very good that he knows the person that is using it and should have a good clue from the vehicle identified on the ticket. I've always suspected that these people are interested in getting out from under the tickets but are not interested in getting buddy into trouble.

Of course there are genuine unknown person situations too, but they have to be someone that knows you well enough to provide details.

[mr_chin]

Originally Posted by jackp0t

i lost my license at that time . somehow someone was able to use it
and went drunk drive

ps
i also filed a police report regarding my license at that time

You reported your license were stolen at the time? Is that what you mean?

If that's the case, the how did it pass the check when the personator present it to the officer?

Get a lawyer and have all evidence be presented in court. If the signatures on the ticket didn't match the one on your license, and all your other important document (to prove that the signature is not yours), there is a chance to fight it off.

But something tells me this is not a case of impersonation.

[sho_bc]

Originally Posted by aznlangjai

You reported your license were stolen at the time? Is that what you mean?

If that's the case, the how did it pass the check when the personator present it to the officer?

Because its easy to get duplicate licences from ICBC when you lose the original. The minimum information I get from a driver after I've stopped them is their name, address and date of birth. If they've provided a DL, then I compare the photo to the driver. If they don't provide a DL, then all that was listed by skidmark above, gets asked and verified. I also ask for other forms of ID in order to verify who I'm dealing with. People generally carry credit cards and membership cards with them that carry a name, and membership cards often have a photo.

When people report a lost/stolen licence, there is a small notation on their DL file that it has been reported lost/stolen. There is no mention of where or when, and it stays on for a long time.

[skidmark]

Originally Posted by jackp0t

somehow someone was able to use it and went drunk drive

I should have caught this the first time around. If the driver was impaired and charged, the officer will have their fingerprints....