Stephen Hawking: "There is no Heaven"

[gdoh]

im not really religious but why mess religion when it helps so many coop with the hardships in life.

[woob]

Originally Posted by observer

I'm not sure if anyone here is familiar with Confucius teaching. Morality need not come from religion per se.

Fuck yes.

"Developing love and compassion and reducing anger and spite is a universal activity which requires no faith in any religion whatsoever."

- Dalai Lama

[Bouncing Bettys]

[freakshow]

Religion and faith certainly have their flaws, and most people don't know why they believe what they believe, but most atheists don't either.

It's Hawkings, he MUST be right. It's Dawkins, Hitchens, Harris, well, they MUST be right after all the books they've written..
Well, why don't we look at Collins, Keller or Baucham? Oh.. right, no one knows those names because no one takes a serious look at what they believe, and possibly more importantly, at those who oppose what they believe.

Religion has caused many of the bad things in the world, but if you think atheism is innocent, you're unbelievably ignorant.

Thankfully, I'm not an atheist, because I would either have to be a nihilist or a hypocrite.

If we had meme comics for atheists, they would go something like this:
LOL @ FAITH
BELIEVES IN KARMA

HERE BY CHANCE
PROMOTES ALTRUISM

DON'T PUSH YOUR BELIEFS ON ME!
YOU SHOULD BELIEVE WHAT I BELIEVE!

CAN'T HAVE FREE WILL + DETERMINISM
NO PROBLEM WITH WAVE-PARTICLE DUALITY

NO OBJECTIVE BASIS FOR MORALS
PUSHES THEM ON OTHERS ANYWAYS

LOVES NATURAL SELECTION
OPPOSED TO KILLING

YOU MUST PROVE BIBLE SCIENTIFICALLY
DOESN'T KNOW SCIENTIFIC METHOD

NO BASIS FOR EXISTENCE
BELIEVES IN HUMAN RIGHTS


PS. I've asked to have my fail button back, but no cigar.. sorry.

[TheNewGirl]

Originally Posted by gdoh

im not really religious but why mess religion when it helps so many coop with the hardships in life.

Because orginized religion makes so much hardship for so many people.

I have NO beef with people who are spiritual or who have faith. I'm all down with self awareness and introspection and morality and personal growth (though these are not only achieved through faith for sure).

I have a HUGE issue though with hate spewing sheeple who use God as an excuse to be close minded bigots.

[SkinnyPupp]

Originally Posted by freakshow

Well, why don't we look at Collins, Keller or Baucham? Oh.. right, no one knows those names because no one takes a serious look at what they believe, and possibly more importantly, at those who oppose what they believe.

Umm I think it has more to do with that these people believe in fairy tales, and they think such utterly stupid things like denying the existence of dinosaurs, etc.

It is easy for an atheist to just completely dismiss any arguments coming their way, because it is all based on total nonsensical stories.

[TheNewGirl]

Originally Posted by 97ITR

You do realize that it's not just religious folks that have these extreme opinions, right? Ridding this world of religion would not stop the fact that a subset of people have a deep emotional attachment to a cause that drives them to irrational and sometimes destructive behavior.

Oh I agree.

I know that also religion is often the excuse and not the reason as well.

But I think it would be a nice start.

[Ferra]

I am sure most of us don't believe in heaven or an almighty God...but I find these ultra atheism ideas very depressing...

e.g. The idea that "conscious" does not exist, and nothing lies beyond our body...
We are just bunch of electrical pulses that bind together to give an illusion of oneself (no free will, no soul, no minds)
and eternal emptiness and nothingness follow after death...


I am not sure if such belief is good for the world too...the idea that we are nothing more than electrical pulse seem very nihilistic...

[Ferra]

btw...that right angle example is retarded....
Right angle is a descriptive terms "we invented" to describe an observation....it is like calling a color red or purple. It is not ambiguous and it can be measured (unlike the ideas of parallel line and infinity)

[Skyline350gt]

I used to go to church back in the day, and was in a church that really had a strong community. Needless to say I had a relationship with God and thought that I would believe and be a follower for the rest of my life.

Coming from someone that has life long experience, one thing people have to realize is just because you go to church doesn't mean you are a Christian. You actually have to harness a relationship.

But anyway as time went by everything was okay I felt like something was a little off.
It was hard enough living a life trying not to sin.

Fast forward 4-5 years or so, I now believe it's IMPORTANT to live the life you want to live. And not be stuck in a huge bubble, life is short and every moment is beautiful.
Reason being not to long ago my mother passed away and..damn do I regret not talking and sharing more moments with her..

I think Stephen Hawking is on the right track, but I think when you die you choose where you want to go. I read a study where they measure brain activity, the last few moments of your life you will emit large amounts of DMT, which apparently can feel like time last longer. In that time frame you have in your final moments you will let go of all your worries and choose a place, for most people they will picture some type of heaven possibly in the sky. If you are a murderer with that type of conscience when you die wouldn't you picture hell? I think so. Since you know you fucked up big your conscience will lead you there.

[!LittleDragon]

To the Christians, everyone else is a heathen
To the Muslims, everyone else is an infidel
To an Atheist, everyone else is weak minded

Religion doesn't start wars, people do. I'm surprised that a fanatical atheist hasn't tried to purge the world of religion. In the end, just be who you want to be, believe what you want to believe and accept the fact that others may not share the same view.

[flagella]

Wow... some extreme stereotype here. Idiots bashing religions without any basis are as dumb as some of the religious fanatics.

A lot of people have already made good points here. An idiot who believes in a religion blindly will continue to be an idiot. He'll interpret whatever he reads into his liking and uses them as excuses.

[drunkrussian]

Originally Posted by flagella

An idiot who believes in a religion blindly will continue to be an idiot. He'll interpret whatever he reads into his liking and uses them as excuses.

I agree. To add though, someone who doesn't believe in religion is just as blind as an idiot who does. The fact is that nobody knows anything and are just arguing for their side, with...no real argument. One side has some books...the other demands proof. Therefore to even get into the religious argument is moronic in and of itself, no matter which side you're on.

[neggo]

Anybody can have beliefs of a higher power without having to belong to a religion or strongly associate with one. Religion and faith can essentially be viewed as different entities.

Religion is created, institutionalized and bureaucratized by people. Faith, however, is unconstricted and unconstrained by any of those elements.

As long as people, theists and atheists alike, tell you to rigidly believe in a particular set of rules or doctrines without any room for personal interpretations and beliefs, the tensions between religions and atheists will always exist.

Simply put? Believe in what you want to believe. Just don't be a fucking jackass about it.

[optiblue]

I wonder how many services will argue against Hawkings with more quotes from the bible?
Posted via RS Mobile

[Ulic Qel-Droma]

religion is just a misinterpretation by uneducated human beings of what the universe really is.

[RacePace]

[The7even]

Originally Posted by EmperorIS

Religion was just there to teach us morals and how to behave
the way i see it
humans weren't smart enough or had the technology to understand much back then
like a little kid learning right or wrong .. you wouldn't lay some scientific complicated facts on him .. the kid won't understand .. we have story books that ends with a moral teaching to teach kids right or wrong ... and how the world works

now that the human race is getting older and more mature ... we need to ditch these religious beliefs and start thinking on our own

I'm very bothered by this comment...

Because what you said is fucking false.. Humans, 10,000 years ago we're smart as FUCK! They we're incredibly smart. Looking at today, you could say that we're all dumb because most of us know who snooki is but not who stephen hawking is..

Let me say this.. 10,000 years ago people fucking built structures that we can't build today with all our technology.. it's not possible for us. I don't know how they did it, nor do I believe aliens built it, but the humans back then did. they were smart and you fucking taking away their credibility is what angers me.

I'm a person of faith and people need to understand this.. science is the art of explaining HOW everything in our life works, and it tries to explain it all to us, and rightfully so. I also believe that science is restricted to this universe and the laws that are in it. My belief in God is NOT FACT, I believe it to be 100% true, but I cannot prove it scientifically . It literally takes FAITH to believe in a creator.

Stephen Hawking is limited, just as we all are, to the limits implemented on us by this universe... I really admire him, he's on of my favorite people in the world and i'm thankful to be alive during his time... but his theory doesn't bother me in the least.. nor do I take that as fact.. and this is not me choosing to believe one thing and then ignore another when it doesn't suit me. I just realize God is faith AND science based. Science and faith together for me paint the whole picture and it makes sense to me. Science without faith, paints the TRUE and real picture of the universe and existence that we know here and now. But it CANNOT and never will explain it fully. It's not possible because It's a human practice. we have limits..

now if you ever come across faith that completely ignore and / or contradicts irrefutable science, then you ought to question your faith.

The thing is, 97% of westerners know of Christianity and when they use science vs faith they use Christianity as a representation for God. That's one wrong thing that science mostly does. But it's ok with me.

[bloodmack]

Originally Posted by Jsunu

How about resources? Or race related genocide? or Class struggles?

Religion does play a large part in human suffering, but they are not the sole cause of it. It's funny when people say that if we got rid of religion wars will end. I a pretty sure people will find ideological differences, removed from religion, to start wars with.

The only other reason we fight is for power, but power is so heavily associated with religion that the line is very blurred. Our want for hope and a better means is what powers religious leaders and religion will NEVER disappear because we all believe in something. I have had a taste of a few different religious beliefs and in the end they're all the same.

I don't believe in a god, because no one being should have that much power.

[twitchyzero]

I will ask what the Jeovah's Witness thinks about this interview the next time they are knocking on my doors.

[Ulic Qel-Droma]

Originally Posted by bloodmack

The only other reason we fight is for power.

no, we fight because we are humans. if there was no power to fight over, we'd still fight. that is what we are. we are instruments of war.

if we took away power, we'd create an artificial way of competition and fight that way. well we already have, it's called the economy.

either way, we're hardwired to compete/fight amongst ourselves.

Originally Posted by !LittleDragon

To the Christians, everyone else is a heathen
To the Muslims, everyone else is an infidel
To an Atheist, everyone else is weak minded

Religion doesn't start wars, people do. I'm surprised that a fanatical atheist hasn't tried to purge the world of religion. In the end, just be who you want to be, believe what you want to believe and accept the fact that others may not share the same view.

that's because atheism is a religion in itself. they themselves are the gods of this planet. they direct their own life.

[Alatar]

Originally Posted by twitchyzero

I will ask what the Jeovah's Witness thinks about this interview the next time they are knocking on my doors.

Make sure you answer the door in your birthday suit. That should get them in a talking mood.

[JD¹³]

Originally Posted by The7even

I'm very bothered by this comment...

Because what you said is fucking false.. Humans, 10,000 years ago we're smart as FUCK! They we're incredibly smart.

The irony of this post made me laugh out loud

I agree with Emperor. In the past, before established modern science, religion filled the void for inexplicable occurrences. Natural phenomenon such as the Aurora Borealis and volcanic activity were beyond the scope of man's understanding and so our imagination took over: they were signs from the gods. Even just a few hundred years ago our modern aircraft would be seen as chariots of the gods, supernatural phenomenon. Diseases and illnesses were punishments for our sins, we barely understood how our own bodies worked and that there were living organisms much smaller than can be seen by the human eye.

As modern science has explained away more and more of what has escaped mans understanding the need for the religious safety net has evaporated. So too has the church's influence. I say church meaning the various establishments of every religion. We're in the middle of a very important transition period right now. We're moving away from imagination and ignorance towards a true understanding of what we are as a species and our place in the universe, hence the rapidly declining belief in gods. The church is fighting this obviously as they are losing power, influence, and MONEY as a result.

I think it's fine if people still believe in a high power, if that makes you happy that's fantastic. For me I can only hope one day man loses that crutch entirely. There will always be conflicts over all kinds of issues but I think we as a whole will change our outlook on petty differences when we all have a greater understanding of our place on Earth as one species: unique in our own ways but all on the same team.

[murd0c]

Originally Posted by Alatar

Make sure you answer the door in your birthday suit. That should get them in a talking mood.

with a raging hard on and ask if they want to play


But seriously I don't believe in god and heaven but I do feel religion does great things by helping people out when they are down and really trying to motivate people in helping others. But you don't see much of that anymore it's starting to get dirty and it will be the end of life as we know it.

[Culverin]

Originally Posted by neggo

Simply put? Believe in what you want to believe. Just don't be a fucking jackass about it.

Just want to point out that's a western philosophy. It doesn't quite happen like that in other cultures. And some belief systems, secular and religious believe that we are all connected, what happens in 1 part of society affects the rest, even if you're not outwardly pushing your values onto others.

Originally Posted by bloodmack

I don't believe in a god, because no one being should have that much power.

lols, just because you think a situation is unjust does not invalidate the existence of anything. Example: Just because I think the Conservative's Internet Surveillance is wrong doesn't mean it isn't true. Thinking otherwise is to stick your fingers in your ears and go "la la la, it isn't true".