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Old 02-12-2012, 02:26 PM   #1
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Minor traffic infractions a major police distraction

Thought this was an interesting article - the writer has been a repeat victim of crime and has received very little support from the police, yet when he's the perpetrator of very minor offenses Johnny Law is on him like wasps at a picnic.

I don't think it's a biased article either, just telling it like it is.

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I drive my wife to work each morning because I like to spend as much time with her as I can. But the commute has also provided an unexpected education on modern law enforcement – and by “law enforcement” I mean “revenue collection.”

Virtually every day, my wife and I see police stationed on Shaw Avenue, a quiet, tree-hung street that looks like anything but a crime hotbed. But there’s always a cruiser there. Some days there are two, or even three. Their job? To issue tickets to drivers who make the mistake of going straight at the intersection just to the north. (It’s illegal to go straight between 7 and 9 a.m., and 4 to 6 p.m.)

[...]
Rest of the story


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Old 02-12-2012, 02:50 PM   #2
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I don't think it's a biased article either, just telling it like it is.
I'm sure the editor of the Osoyoos paper though he wasn't writing a biased editorial, either... "just telling it like it is." Oops... right up until video proved otherwise.

"Their job? To issue tickets to drivers who make the mistake of going straight at the intersection just to the north. (It’s illegal to go straight between 7 and 9 a.m., and 4 to 6 p.m.)"

I'm betting this is a location where LOTS of commuters REGULARLY flaunt the law in order to get a jump on traffic... the kind of thing that pisses me off royally. I could point to a half-dozen places within five minutes of home that this sort of thing happens constantly, every day of the week - twits who fly up the bus lane to get a jump on the rest of us waiting patiently and legally at the light; two lanes of merging traffic that view their red light (and accompanying "no right turn on red" sign) as little more than a suggestion, where four or five cars IN EACH LANE regularly sail right through the red without slowing down, and barely a glance to the left to see if traffic is halfway through the intersection yet.

And every time I wish there was a cop sitting behind the next billboard or stand of trees, because I know I would laugh hysterically to see these asses get nailed.

This, to me, is the ultimate proof cops don't have quotas: this area (and most others) is ripe with fishing holes that would let them reel in the suckers - the proverbial fish-in-a-barrel - who seem to think the law doesn't apply to them and their inconvenience. Most of these spots could fill a department's monthly quota (if it existed) in less than a week.

No, you're right... having read this whole article, it doesn't sound biased AT ALL
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Old 02-12-2012, 04:15 PM   #3
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Then I got a ticket for going straight through the intersection on Shaw between 7 and 9 a.m. The restriction sign was hidden by trees, and I didn’t notice it.

So now we know why he wrote the column. He broke the law and got caught....even though you might have thought thst sometime during..[]Virtually every day, my wife and I see police stationed on Shaw Avenue, a quiet, tree-hung street that looks like anything but a crime hotbed he mighty have noticed, say in the winter when there were no trees there, that a sign was there....or maybe wondered why the Police were always there???? Ya think!?


BTW The parking tickets were issued by a bylaw officer, not Police.[/I]

I had listed the first three letters of our plate number as BXF instead of BFX. I was being fined $30 (plus payment surcharges) for a typographical error.


I believe the ticket was issued for a parking violation...a typographical error didn't park the car there.

Several friends got bagged for speeding at a spot where the limit drops unexpectedly as you come off the Don Valley Parkway. Several others got ticketed for failing to put their renewal stickers on their vehicle documents as well as their plates.

So they were speeding and didn't remember to stck their val tags on their plates...


Last year, I was pulled over in a Porsche Turbo as I drove my wife to work well below the speed limit. The officer told me the front plate on the car was missing. (I’d picked up the Porsche the night before in the dark, and hadn’t noticed.)

You were pulled over for no front plate because there was no front plate.

I showed the prosecutor photographs of the car, the plate, copies of the registration and the insurance documents, and explained what had happened. She dropped the charge.

So you broke the law, they gave you a break and you're upset because......?

As far as the B&E's go...many large city Police Depts will not respond to a B&E because of call priority. It was nothing personal, it was City Hall who decided they would not respond. I believe Vancouver has the same policy.


So I just want to see if I have this correct......the Police gave him a ticket for an illegal and unsafe turn, the bylaw enforcement gave him parking tickets, The Police gave him a ticket for no front plate but withdrew it (in spite of him being guilty), The Police caught some of his friends speeding and driving with no insurance stickers...when they were speeding and had no sticker, City Hall decided that Police would not attend a B&E with no suspects, and they didn't and the Police are at fault. I can see how he is being persecuted.

This is typical of the media attitude rowards the Police, like the editor of the Osoyoos paper who believes that laws don't apply to them because they are in the media and are special. It seems like his world of hurt from the Cops all started...When I launched my driving column in 2009. I wonder why that happened?

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Old 02-12-2012, 04:34 PM   #4
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"Obliviousness and self-delusion, thy names are sebberry."

This explains it.

Cliff-notes for the articles:

A member of the media thinks he's entitled to special treatment because of this because of that. Yada, yada, yada. Move on, nothing to see here. Porsche Turbo huh. Didn't win any brownies points I suppose.
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Old 02-12-2012, 04:42 PM   #5
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So if I have $15,000 worth of stuff stolen from my home, as well as become the victim of identity theft and credit fraud I should just not bother calling the police and be on my best behavior while driving around. Good, got it.


Officer: Do you know why I stopped you?
Driver: You found the $15,000 worth of stuff stolen from my garage?
Officer: Er.. no.
Driver: You found the guy who skimmed my credit cards?
Officer: Here's your ticket for not having a front plate. If you talk to the prosecutor and explain the situation, she'll likely drop the charges.
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Old 02-12-2012, 05:36 PM   #6
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So if I have $15,000 worth of stuff stolen from my home, as well as become the victim of identity theft and credit fraud I should just not bother calling the police and be on my best behavior while driving around. Good, got it.


Officer: Do you know why I stopped you?
Driver: You found the $15,000 worth of stuff stolen from my garage?
Officer: Er.. no.
Driver: You found the guy who skimmed my credit cards?
Officer: Here's your ticket for not having a front plate. If you talk to the prosecutor and explain the situation, she'll likely drop the charges.
Your argument makes absolutely no sense, it's comical. The officer who refused to investigate his case have no business with the officer who gave him the traffic violation tickets. Don't try to twist it. Poor attempt at mixing apples and oranges.

$15,000? I have my doubts. Sounds more like one of those tools who have some minor scratches and want to sue for assault.
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Old 02-12-2012, 05:44 PM   #7
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Maybe they need the money from tickets so they can buy all the fancy CSI stuff to investigate the breaks-ins with?
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Old 02-12-2012, 06:56 PM   #8
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Maybe they need the money from tickets so they can buy all the fancy CSI stuff to investigate the breaks-ins with?
Perhaps, but there comes a time where they should stop fundraising and use the damn CSI stuff on real crimes
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Old 02-12-2012, 07:04 PM   #9
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Old 02-12-2012, 07:22 PM   #10
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Likewise...
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Old 02-12-2012, 08:21 PM   #11
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Seb, you don't seem like a bad guy but your unbelievable need to discredit law enforcement makes it hard to take anything you post seriously. There are cases where you are right - there is NO shortage of coverage of boneheaded police maneuvers and I have gotten more than a few tickets in my time, but by displaying such bias, you make your information less believable.

The article you posted is laughably easy to discredit, as some members above me have done... the parking lot behind his house seems a reasonable point, but whining because he got a ticket for driving without a front plate - sorry, no dice.

There are plenty of much harder to justify examples of mis-use of police authority; you seem to have the need to post regarding the police on a daily basis so I would recommend you pick your ammunition a bit more carefully.

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Old 02-13-2012, 08:38 AM   #12
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The decision to not investigate B&E's is a political one made by the employer (City hall in this case), usually due to high call levels for Police service. A friend had his van broken into in Vancouver and thousands of $$ in professional locksmith tools were stolen from it. Van PD said they would not attend the break. It was handled thru his insurance company. Our self-important media friend's quarrel is with City officials who set policy for response, not the Police. I

If he had done a bit of reasearch ( imagine that?) he may have found why the no-turn sign was installed. My quess would be in response to many traffic problems and crashes in rush hour that blocked traffic, cost money and damaged property.


To say that his B&E and fraud charges were not investigated by Police because some traffic members were on duty elsewhere is an unreasonable stretch of the imagination. It's like complaining that you didn't get attention in the hospital emegency ward for a cut becaue the oncologist was busy elsewhere.
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Old 02-13-2012, 09:30 AM   #13
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You have to put it in terms the members here will understand: it's like complaining that your car's dents aren't getting fixed, because the muffler guy is working on another car.
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Old 02-13-2012, 09:45 AM   #14
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The decision to not investigate B&E's is a political one made by the employer (City hall in this case), usually due to high call levels for Police service. A friend had his van broken into in Vancouver and thousands of $$ in professional locksmith tools were stolen from it. Van PD said they would not attend the break.
What makes that even more concerning is that the tools that were stolen were locksmith tools, potentially to be used for further break-ins.

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To say that his B&E and fraud charges were not investigated by Police because some traffic members were on duty elsewhere is an unreasonable stretch of the imagination. It's like complaining that you didn't get attention in the hospital emegency ward for a cut becaue the oncologist was busy elsewhere.
Reading between the lines, I think his concern was with the allocation of police resources. An oncologist will never deal with a cut in the hospital, but a traffic member isn't necessarily a traffic cop for the duration of his career.
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Old 02-13-2012, 09:47 AM   #15
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I really wish there were more police at some intersections. Rupert and 49th is one. There's so many dicks that will blow by on the right (right turn only lane) and they are the ones causing the traffic jam cause they force their way back in either right before the intersection but most of the time after the intersection. Wish there were more cops there giving those guys tickets. Same with Elliot and Marine Way, there are signs stating you can't go straight, yet there are so many that do go straight anyways. When coming down Elliot, you can't always see a car racing up the hill to make the light which is why I love that you can't go straight there, but every time I'm there, there'll be at least one that will go straight through.
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Old 02-13-2012, 09:48 AM   #16
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the bylaw enforcement gave him parking tickets,
I do believe in Toronto the police issue parking tickets.
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Old 02-13-2012, 10:26 AM   #17
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What makes that even more concerning is that the tools that were stolen were locksmith tools, potentially to be used for further break-ins.
Think about how many man-hours it would take to print the entire van, then contact every single person who works in the company, plus friends who may have been in the van, get them finger-printed, so you can rule them out. If the crook was smart - he would have worn gloves.

want to take it further? Find every scrap of DNA available in the van. Every hair, every fingernail. Grab any used cups - maybe the thief drank a drink and left it in the van. You can grab DNA off their saliva. Use the UV light to look through the van. Maybe he cut himself and left a drop of blood somewhere. Maybe he got bored in the middle of the break-in and jacked off in the corner.

Then grab all the employees and their friends and family and get them DNA tested to rule them out.

Not enough manpower available? Grab every single traffic cop off the streets because they're all CSI experts.
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Old 02-13-2012, 11:11 AM   #18
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Old 02-13-2012, 11:35 AM   #19
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I think the biggest problem isn't so much in what the Police actually do, but the optics of it.

Sure, it's a great idea when the police is trying to make the roads safer by catching the speeders, but do we really need to have an officer stand there to make sure everyone stops at a red line? or when the speed limit drops from 80 km/h to 50 km/h?

I think public opinion would be little better if you see the cops doing something (such as walking the beat or driving around) instead of "camping" (for a lack of a better term)
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Old 02-13-2012, 12:41 PM   #20
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do we really need to have an officer stand there to make sure everyone stops at a red line? or when the speed limit drops from 80 km/h to 50 km/h?
Obviously we do as many drivers consistently disregard the signs.

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I think public opinion would be little better if you see the cops doing something (such as walking the beat or driving around) instead of "camping" (for a lack of a better term)
In which case more complaints would come in that "I never see police officers doing anything, they're always just walking or driving around not doing anything."
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Old 02-13-2012, 01:20 PM   #21
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I think public opinion would be little better if you see the cops doing something (such as walking the beat or driving around) instead of "camping" (for a lack of a better term)
Camping is the most effective way, so effective that the people caught get upset that they didn't know better.

Most spots chosen to camp are known bad traffic areas. I went on a ride along and for an hour we camped at an intersection where many people roll the stop. The reason this one was chosen out of hundreds of other intersections in the area was that:
a) It was a known shortcut off the highway
b) It borders a park

So you get lots of people in a hurry to get home not paying attention around an area that kids play. Ticket deserved. Meanwhile no cops camp on my residential street, and I roll that stop sign everyday.
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Old 02-13-2012, 01:55 PM   #22
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Not enough manpower available? Grab every single traffic cop off the streets because they're all CSI experts.
You know, you're a funny guy.
That is, until one considers that they stole $15k worth of tools specifically designed to disable locks and other security devices. It would be in the best interest of society to catch these thieves and get those tools out of the wrong hands. But hey, that's much less profitable (and a lot more difficult) than ticketing drivers, right?



What frustrates me about that story is that the cops didn't even bother to show up. Who knows if the guy had dropped his wallet in the van. Sure, it's unlikely, but at least they could have put in some effort on the off chance that they could find these tools.
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Old 02-13-2012, 02:01 PM   #23
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What frustrates me about that story is that the cops didn't even bother to show up. Who knows if the guy had dropped his wallet in the van. Sure, it's unlikely, but at least they could have put in some effort on the off chance that they could find these tools.
The officers hands are tied by politics, as zulutango stated. Blame city hall, not the officers.

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The decision to not investigate B&E's is a political one made by the employer (City hall in this case), usually due to high call levels for Police service.
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Old 02-13-2012, 02:10 PM   #24
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The officers hands are tied by politics, as zulutango stated. Blame city hall, not the officers.
I wonder why we can't blame the whole system?
If I don't like what upper management is doing, I'll voice my concerns. Can't this be done in the police networks too?

Or is that why our old friend Dave T (dbt) left the force?
I seem to remember him at his wits end trying to deal with his half assed management, and finally just saying "fuckit" to his future as a police officer.
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Old 02-13-2012, 02:46 PM   #25
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You know, you're a funny guy.
That is, until one considers that they stole $15k worth of tools specifically designed to disable locks and other security devices. It would be in the best interest of society to catch these thieves and get those tools out of the wrong hands. But hey, that's much less profitable (and a lot more difficult) than ticketing drivers, right?



What frustrates me about that story is that the cops didn't even bother to show up. Who knows if the guy had dropped his wallet in the van. Sure, it's unlikely, but at least they could have put in some effort on the off chance that they could find these tools.
My aunts place was broken into. We called the cops, and they did show up, but basically only to do a quick look over the place, and then give us a police report number which we can provide to the Insurance Company.

Is it really worth it to have 2 police officers spend an hour or more just to issue a police report number? That's the thing, that's all they can do for a B&E in houses. Most people don't have security cameras, nevermind a camera which will actually provide you with enough clarity to use as evidence to catch a crook.

Of course, if it was my place that was broken into, I'd be upset too if I was told the Police aren't even coming in - because it's not about the money, but the fact that my personal possessions were stolen - doesn't matter if Insurance will cover it. But looking from a neutral standpoint, I understand why they didn't send someone...
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