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Old 02-15-2012, 04:09 PM   #51
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yes it does, also would make smaller unions such as the one im in have to hire 1 or 2 people to do all this new accounting and reporting which could possibly drive our union dues even higher than they already are.

Since all financial information is already available to members and the audits done anually theres no point of making it public information, this bills not intended to help unions just another small step of trying to take them down
Do you see the big hole in your argument? If its all available and published to members, there's zero to be done except release a copy publicly. That is unless the union is hiding something that members haven't seen.

A "right to work" bill would be a much better way to kill unions if Harper really wanted to - hopefully that comes next.

Have you heard the latest radio ads for BC teachers? Imagine if the dues wasted on that was actually given back to the teachers, they probably wouldn't have their hands out looking for more money.
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Old 02-15-2012, 05:55 PM   #52
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Taylor im glad you have the patience to go over all this, because ive given up on revscene and politics haha.

hopefully you can open an eye or 2
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Old 02-15-2012, 05:58 PM   #53
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I remember when I used to take the internetz seriously...
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Old 02-15-2012, 06:00 PM   #54
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considering all of these posters are going to base a vote probably on only this thread,
yeah, it is kinda serious buisness
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Old 02-15-2012, 06:58 PM   #55
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Do you see the big hole in your argument? If its all available and published to members, there's zero to be done except release a copy publicly. That is unless the union is hiding something that members haven't seen.

A "right to work" bill would be a much better way to kill unions if Harper really wanted to - hopefully that comes next.

Have you heard the latest radio ads for BC teachers? Imagine if the dues wasted on that was actually given back to the teachers, they probably wouldn't have their hands out looking for more money.
You don't mean the ad where the teachers are complaining that their salaries have dropped to 9th place in Canada and that sole reason is what is going to hold our kids back, do you? You don't mean the ad where the teachers themselves say that money motivates them to do a better job(apparently, as we should aim for 1st place), but at the same time, we fight to keep from having a pay scale system where teachers get paid based on performance.

I completely disagree with your stance on drugs Taylor, but unions I'm on board!

Let's talk unions a little bit. Why would Harper be all about busting them? Which I don't think he is, btw. Unions wield a considerable amount of power over the workforce. I am not against unions per se. I think they have their place. BUT...I have a huge problem with situations like the teachers, where its a oneupmanship game of salaries compared to other districts. Nova Scotia gets a raise, becomes #1, Alberta says, NS makes this much more. Alta becomes #1. BC says, we #3 and all the way around until the NS teachers are saying, "we're last!" It has nothing to do with marketable rates, or living cost or anything else. It's keeping up with the Jones'.

If you don't want the gov't to dictate your salary-DON'T BECOME A TEACHER!

Publishing information for all to see that is already collected and collated is not a huge deal. If the union movement can't take that, then they ARE in trouble.
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Old 02-15-2012, 07:24 PM   #56
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yeah i actually agree with the union transparency bill too

but i can understand why union reps etc would be at unease with their personal info made public
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Old 02-15-2012, 10:29 PM   #57
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Taylor im glad you have the patience to go over all this, because ive given up on revscene and politics haha.

hopefully you can open an eye or 2
LOL

I think its universal on car forums, politics just isn't a good topic to discuss, everyone hates "the man". Even on the Mercedes forums with a typically older educated conservative membership, political discussions quickly go downhill.
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Old 02-15-2012, 10:35 PM   #58
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Let's talk unions a little bit. Why would Harper be all about busting them? Which I don't think he is, btw.
Oh he absolutely is. Unions support the NDP and Liberals far more than the Cons. This is why Harper pushed the political contribution limits even lower, as this limits large organizations like unions from buying votes.

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I have a huge problem with situations like the teachers, where its a oneupmanship game of salaries compared to other districts. Nova Scotia gets a raise, becomes #1, Alberta says, NS makes this much more. Alta becomes #1. BC says, we #3 and all the way around until the NS teachers are saying, "we're last!" It has nothing to do with marketable rates, or living cost or anything else. It's keeping up with the Jones'.
Ontario and BC have the same problem, 5-7 unemployed teachers for every job opening. Alberta and other provinces have the opposite problem, not enough teachers. This is why Alberta has the highest salaries to attract teachers, and BC among the lowest cause we don't need to attract teachers, we have too many.

I also love the ads, it only shows how greedy teachers are, and how dumb they are that those ads are just wasting their own money they could be using to offset the raise they won't get.
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Old 02-15-2012, 11:18 PM   #59
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The bill has good intentions, it just needs to be re-written as it currently gives too much power to authorities who can abuse this power as well. Giving up freedom is never a good thing but there needs to be a balance between freedom and security.

They also fucked up in presenting the bill by having Toews say those idiotic comments.
This is the same guy that's suppose to be all christian and conservative with all his "family values", but he cheated on his wife with a 20 year old secretary. The chick ended up having his kid out of wedlock while he was married.
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Old 02-16-2012, 09:47 AM   #60
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Oh he absolutely is. Unions support the NDP and Liberals far more than the Cons. This is why Harper pushed the political contribution limits even lower, as this limits large organizations like unions from buying votes.



Ontario and BC have the same problem, 5-7 unemployed teachers for every job opening. Alberta and other provinces have the opposite problem, not enough teachers. This is why Alberta has the highest salaries to attract teachers, and BC among the lowest cause we don't need to attract teachers, we have too many.

I also love the ads, it only shows how greedy teachers are, and how dumb they are that those ads are just wasting their own money they could be using to offset the raise they won't get.
You don't mean to say that education is a business like any other, do you?

Because I thought that if little Johnny's teachers all make 90 thou, he'll start getting A's.

I could get behind a teacher program that describes teachers using their own money to supplement classroom materials, thus the need for more supplies for your children. An ad that describes teachers working free overtime to supplement the education of children, and a voice over saying, "and yes, we'd like a cost of living increase as well" Because all of that happens, and I understand that not increasing pay is a pay decrease.

BUT

They go on about BC PLace(which I'm not going to lie, I kind of get) and tell me that their salaries are in 9th place.

Well, so are the provinces finances.

Maybe you could mow lawns during the summer to make a little extra scratch.
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Old 02-16-2012, 09:57 AM   #61
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And let's bring this back to the topic at hand. People's expectations that electing the conservatives was like inviting the National Socialist German Workers' Party to form government.

People get pissed off when anyone tables a bill to change the internet-which I get! But making it a little easier to find pedobears and hardcore copyright infringers adds a layer of responsibility to the internet in my mind.

It isn't the child porn that pisses people off, its the guys that put the latest movie online for download, and those that download that movie to watch that everyone wants to protect.

"I want you to spend $100 million on this movie so I can watch it for free."

Further, everyone was watching for what the conservatives would do with a majority. Oh shit! They are going to lock Canada down and start voting through a conservative social agenda! Mayhem.

They got rid of a useless gun registry and bought a few flying guns. Made some motions to make health care funding in some way match the finances of the country.

PURE insanity.

I don't actually regret my vote. As I said, I would prefer that there was a liberal party that wasn't imploding, but they obviously were not ready to even form opposition in the last election, but I don't think the conservatives have done a bad job.

Harper has even loosened the stick in his ass a smidge and learned to fake a smile.
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Old 02-16-2012, 10:05 AM   #62
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You don't mean to say that education is a business like any other, do you?
All jobs should reflect market value salary, not be artificially protected by unions/government/...

We have too many teachers. Why? Cause it seemed like a nice job that paid well, so too many people went to school for it. If the market reflected that, perhaps some people wouldn't have gone to school for it, perhaps some wouldn't be teachers, and we'd find a balance. If the balance swings the other way, like in Alberta, salaries go up to attract teachers and students to become teachers.
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Old 02-16-2012, 10:15 AM   #63
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People get pissed off when anyone tables a bill to change the internet-which I get! But making it a little easier to find pedobears and hardcore copyright infringers adds a layer of responsibility to the internet in my mind.

It isn't the child porn that pisses people off, its the guys that put the latest movie online for download, and those that download that movie to watch that everyone wants to protect.

"I want you to spend $100 million on this movie so I can watch it for free."
Nail on head.

Opinions online, especially on forums with younger memberships are going to be very against censoring the internet cause they are the largest demographic for distributing pirated material. Ask my mom what she thinks of this bill, she wouldn't give 2 shits.

I used to be there, downloading music, moves, games, programs, .... yet not that I'm older, have a few $$$ to spare, and there's many legal ways to download I'd rather just buy it and avoid the hassle.

If Harper really wants to see that I surf RS too much, go ahead. Hi Stevie!
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Old 02-16-2012, 04:55 PM   #64
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Conservatives... I don't think this deserves its own thread but since were on the topic of politics. Im starting to worry about where the conservatives plan to take this country. I think this bill is aimed to slow/stop a possible future revolution, if anybody has seen V for vendetta then you will know what I'm talking about. i also just bought 2 guy fawkes mask from ebay for $7 each just because of this

Bill C-309 | openparliament.ca
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Bill C-309

Preventing Persons from Concealing Their Identity during Riots and Unlawful Assemblies Act
An Act to amend the Criminal Code (concealment of identity)
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Old 02-16-2012, 04:57 PM   #65
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Conservatives... I dodn't think this deserves its own thread but since were on the topic of politics. Im starting to worry about where the conservatives plan to take this country. I think this bill is aimed to slow/stop a possible future revolution, if anybody has seen V for vendetta then you will know what I'm talking about. i also bought 2 guy fawkes mask from ebay $7 each

Bill C-309 | openparliament.ca
Where'd you get the masks?
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Old 02-16-2012, 05:00 PM   #66
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Ebay, search "guy fawkes mask" there all between $5-10 each w/shipping
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Old 02-16-2012, 10:57 PM   #67
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It's amazing to see how easily you guys give up on free speech that was paid for with the blood of your forefathers. Oh well who needs a constitution anyways.
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Old 02-16-2012, 11:13 PM   #68
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It's amazing to see how easily you guys give up on free speech that was paid for with the blood of your forefathers. Oh well who needs a constitution anyways.
Canada doesn't have freedom of speech built into our constitution. Stop quoting stupid American TV shows.

In the US you can get away with saying racist things under the protection of their constitution. Here we decided people don't have the right to say hateful things and are not protected by our constitution.

If you're going to quote what our forefathers fought hard for, you might want to respect them by at least getting it right.
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Old 02-17-2012, 07:33 AM   #69
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Old 02-17-2012, 07:47 AM   #70
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Canada doesn't have freedom of speech built into our constitution. Stop quoting stupid American TV shows.

In the US you can get away with saying racist things under the protection of their constitution. Here we decided people don't have the right to say hateful things and are not protected by our constitution.

If you're going to quote what our forefathers fought hard for, you might want to respect them by at least getting it right.
Number 1 complaint when discussing Canadian politics is the fact we usually discuss some hybrid US/Canada system invented by Canadians watching US TV.

Our forefathers fought for nothing. The American Revolution was Americans fighting to cut ties with England over issues of taxation, among other things. Meanwhile, Canadians said, "we cool" and Canada was used as a base of attack on several occasions against America.

We finally severed ties politically in a reading of a bill in the British Parliament in the 80's I think. There were several moves towards affirming our own independence at several points through the earlier 20th century.

Our constitution is very different from the US, and that is why we don't have guns.
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Old 02-17-2012, 08:16 AM   #71
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Our constitution is very different from the US, and that is why we don't have guns.
Though it's really not all that difficult for Canadians to purchase and own legal guns.
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Old 02-17-2012, 08:27 AM   #72
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Though it's really not all that difficult for Canadians to purchase and own legal guns.
Yes, I vastly over-simplified that statement. We certainly don't do guns the way Americans do guns. Try doing an open carry in Vancouver and tell me how it goes.

Although major props to getting rid of the long-gun registry.
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Old 02-17-2012, 12:33 PM   #73
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I used to be there, downloading music, moves, games, programs, .... yet not that I'm older, have a few $$$ to spare, and there's many legal ways to download I'd rather just buy it and avoid the hassle.

If Harper really wants to see that I surf RS too much, go ahead. Hi Stevie!
Great reasoning! "I used to pirate shit and got away with it, but now that I don't do it anymore and this won't affect me, please bust every 12 year old out there downloading Hollywood's crapola flicks." Must be fucking convenient!

You're a hypocrite just like this clown that's trying to bring this bill.

I find it ironic you are a software developer? When did you stop stealing programs, before or after you got hired?
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Old 02-17-2012, 12:38 PM   #74
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This is bull.

If the conservatives are really against pedophiles, they should push our judicial system to have stricter penalties on pedophiles. e.g. life in prison sentences, placing the convicted pedophiles to the general prison population... etc.
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Old 02-18-2012, 09:18 PM   #75
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Great reasoning! "I used to pirate shit and got away with it, but now that I don't do it anymore and this won't affect me, please bust every 12 year old out there downloading Hollywood's crapola flicks." Must be fucking convenient!

You're a hypocrite just like this clown that's trying to bring this bill.

I find it ironic you are a software developer? When did you stop stealing programs, before or after you got hired?
I did a lot of stupid shit when I was younger. I grew up. You might one day tooo.
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