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Questions & info about the Motor Vehicle Act. Mature discussion only.

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Old 06-02-2012, 06:50 AM   #26
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Out of curiosity, how long does it take for the officer to set up the radar gun while the vehicle is in motion before the gun can be used to obtain a speed reading?
The RADAR set is hard-wired and bolted into place in the PC. Antenna in the front and rear windows. When turned on and on standby, readings are displayed within a second after it being taken off standby.
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Old 06-02-2012, 06:55 AM   #27
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I'm curious to know what zulutango's thoughts are on my experience listening to multi-member enforcement operations getting vehicle descriptions mixed up over the radio...[/QUOTE]


As I didn't hear the conversations you mention I can't possibly comment on them. Would need to hear the entire series of transmissions and would have to be actually watching what was going on and compare it to the dialogue. I worked hundreds of multi man ops and never had any confusion. We always worked so that the pickup team could see the RADAR/LASER/ seatbelt spotter and see the vehicle as it was targeted and drove right at us. No way for confusion that way. When I acted as a spotter I took vehicle and operator description as part of my notes on the contact and confirmed that I saw the pickup Member stop the car I just described and issued a violator number.
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Old 06-02-2012, 10:16 AM   #28
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As I didn't hear the conversations you mention I can't possibly comment on them. Would need to hear the entire series of transmissions and would have to be actually watching what was going on and compare it to the dialogue. I worked hundreds of multi man ops and never had any confusion. We always worked so that the pickup team could see the RADAR/LASER/ seatbelt spotter and see the vehicle as it was targeted and drove right at us. No way for confusion that way. When I acted as a spotter I took vehicle and operator description as part of my notes on the contact and confirmed that I saw the pickup Member stop the car I just described and issued a violator number.
Fair enough, every situation is different. I've heard vehicle makes and models get mixed up, vehicle colours get mixed up, vehicle types ("The lady in the brown wagon is on her cell phone" "I've stopped the tan SUV and she's saying she wasn't on her phone"...)

Perhaps not fatal flaws, but they do cast doubt on the accuracy of all aspects of the traffic stop.
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Old 06-02-2012, 04:48 PM   #29
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Fair enough, every situation is different. I've heard vehicle makes and models get mixed up, vehicle colours get mixed up, vehicle types ("The lady in the brown wagon is on her cell phone" "I've stopped the tan SUV and she's saying she wasn't on her phone"...)

Perhaps not fatal flaws, but they do cast doubt on the accuracy of all aspects of the traffic stop.
That is why articulation is required by the Crown to remove any doubt of the accuracy. None of the operations I ever worked over the years had that problem. If in doubt then let 'em go. No VT should be issued unless the issuer is 100% convinced of the identity of the vehicle/driver. It's one of the cornerstones of prosecution.
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Old 06-02-2012, 11:09 PM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sebberry
I'm curious to know what zulutango's thoughts are on my experience listening to multi-member enforcement operations getting vehicle descriptions mixed up over the radio...

As I didn't hear the conversations you mention I can't possibly comment on them. Would need to hear the entire series of transmissions and would have to be actually watching what was going on and compare it to the dialogue. I worked hundreds of multi man ops and never had any confusion. We always worked so that the pickup team could see the RADAR/LASER/ seatbelt spotter and see the vehicle as it was targeted and drove right at us. No way for confusion that way. When I acted as a spotter I took vehicle and operator description as part of my notes on the contact and confirmed that I saw the pickup Member stop the car I just described and issued a violator number.
Five bucks says the cops' communication wasn't mixed up at all and the only one who mis-heard anything was sebberry, hearing what he WANTED to hear.

(edit: make that a five-dollar gift card from Timmy's )
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Old 06-03-2012, 06:08 AM   #31
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im guessin 75% chance of him showing up
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Old 06-03-2012, 01:03 PM   #32
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Five bucks says the cops' communication wasn't mixed up at all and the only one who mis-heard anything was sebberry, hearing what he WANTED to hear.

(edit: make that a five-dollar gift card from Timmy's )
Why don't you spend a little time listening yourself and then report back.
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Old 06-04-2012, 11:11 AM   #33
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Why don't you spend a little time listening yourself and then report back.
Don't need to - I totally believe that everything you say is the 110% complete and accurate truth and you could never make a mistake even if you tried!

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Old 06-04-2012, 12:16 PM   #34
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That was nice in my inbox...
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Old 06-04-2012, 12:23 PM   #35
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I understand where your coming from sebbery, it seems like a lost cause, but I will fight it regardless as i feel i am in the right and I have nothing to lose. I have a feeling the judge will obviously take the cops side even if the has "evidence" that wasnt correct.

Just curious, how many of you RSers have took a charge to court and has had the cop show up and you win the case?
First off, quit calling them judges. For most traffic violations, you will be standing in front of a Justice of the Peace (JP for short). When you go to court, remember to call them "your worship" and not your honour.

Basically without any evidence on your part, it comes down to he said she said and the police officer will be more credible due to their position.

So, if you plan on disputing the ticket, which I think you should, then you can either go there with no evidence and hope the officer doesn't show up or go talk to the officer before the court.

Also, if you are going to dispute the ticket, call the police station and try to contact the officer that issued the violation ticket and ask for his notes from that night.
"Disclosure" is a must and will go a long way to help you fight your ticket. Like what happened to BPH, if he asked for disclosure ahead of time, he would have known the officer was full of it and able to walk into court like a boss.
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Old 06-04-2012, 08:31 PM   #36
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Calling the Police station and asking for "disclosure" will get you nothing. When you start demanding stuff in a legal process you must be specific and detailed. You must ask the right questions in the right legal way and you had better know what you want and ask for it. Fishing expeditions and requests for things you will not get are a waste of your time. Even IF you get what you want, you had better know how to use the information.
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Old 06-05-2012, 12:19 AM   #37
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Having a ticket like this is a pretty big deal. From what I've seen, the officer will most likely be there; just prepare all your evidence and notes beforehand, regardless of whether the officer shows up or not. From what my friends have done, all they do is take it to court and they pray that they don't show up.

I disputed a ticket very similar to yours but it was during the Olympics, before the impounding and shit kicked in. Excessive, overloading and failure to display an N sign. That was a $500+ ticket, but I prepared several pages of notes and evidence based on what happened that day. I got into court a year and three months after the incident happened, and to my relief the officer did not present himself. I do admit I have done the things that the officer cited me for, but I believe I do not go down without a decent fight. I was prepared for the consequences if the officer was there that day.

Think about your decision to dispute the ticket, and if you do lack the proper evidence to prove that you are innocent, you can always talk to the officer and work out a deal... have the fine reduced. They'll respect you more that you knew what you did was wrong, instead of being blatantly oblivious about what you were ticketed for.
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Old 06-05-2012, 08:59 AM   #38
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"Disclosure" is a must and will go a long way to help you fight your ticket. Like what happened to BPH, if he asked for disclosure ahead of time, he would have known the officer was full of it and able to walk into court like a boss.
Oh yeah, I failed to mention that.

There is a form one can sign and deliver to obtain "disclosure".

Sign one and keep it as a paper trail.

I did that with my case, and disclosure was never given to me. I sent it via certified mail and it was signed for, so the PD couldn't say they didn't get it.

So yes. If she tried to argue it, I would've just told the JP that I was refused disclosure, therefore ending the case on the spot.

So yes. Still was like a baws.
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Old 06-05-2012, 09:43 AM   #39
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To keep your faith up. I had won 2 excessive speeding tickets. It really depends if the cop works morning or night shift. If you were caught during the night. The chance of him showing up is less. Since he's would be focusing on his sleep and work when he's up.
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Old 06-05-2012, 11:18 AM   #40
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To keep your faith up. I had won 2 excessive speeding tickets. It really depends if the cop works morning or night shift. If you were caught during the night. The chance of him showing up is less. Since he's would be focusing on his sleep and work when he's up.
Umm...they actually alternate night and day shift. If you got your ticket at night, then you still have the same chance of him showing up. It's just whether you're lucky enough for the court date to happen on a day where it's his night shift week.
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Old 06-05-2012, 12:52 PM   #41
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Somewhat related. Was going to work last week at around 830am, passing down a side road through Port Moody before jumping on Barnet Highway. Some really slow lame drivers who double cross lanes during turns/lane merges had just turned onto the road in front of me, so I just hammered it down the next lane. Cop car was apparently waiting on a perpendicular road to get onto that street.
I saw him and almost flipped my shit, so I slowed down and continued on, checking the rear mirror (ya'll know that feeling).
He followed me a couple cars behind until I turned onto Barnet highway probably about 2-3 minutes in, then turns on his sirens. Pulls me over.
He said he clocked me around 85-90km/h in a 50 zone so I said, no contest I was speeding and explained I accelerated out of the way
Gave me a $140 ticket , BUT get this;
HE WROTE MAZDA MR2 TURBO on my ticket. MAZDA. ROFL
So my 91 Toyota Mr2 Turbo is apparently a Mazda now; can I go to court and tell them I don't own a Mazda?
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Old 06-05-2012, 08:17 PM   #42
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^ this has been discussed before i believe. just he fked up one word doesnt mean you werent speeding lol. most cops write down your plate on the ticket dont they ? so that plate # = your plate # = GG ?
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Old 06-05-2012, 08:21 PM   #43
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so that plate # = your plate # = GG ?
Yes, GG
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Old 06-06-2012, 11:10 AM   #44
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Oh yeah, I failed to mention that.

There is a form one can sign and deliver to obtain "disclosure".

Sign one and keep it as a paper trail.

I did that with my case, and disclosure was never given to me. I sent it via certified mail and it was signed for, so the PD couldn't say they didn't get it.

So yes. If she tried to argue it, I would've just told the JP that I was refused disclosure, therefore ending the case on the spot.

So yes. Still was like a baws.
where and how can i obtain this form for disclosure?
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Old 06-06-2012, 11:16 AM   #45
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where and how can i obtain this form for disclosure?
Do a search on RS. There was a very detailed post but I can't remember from who.
And make sure you leave a solid paper trail so that if you do not get it, you can show it to the JP when you go to court.

I'll try searching for it later when I have more time at work.
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Old 06-08-2012, 11:05 PM   #46
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Oh yeah, I failed to mention that.

There is a form one can sign and deliver to obtain "disclosure".

Sign one and keep it as a paper trail.

I did that with my case, and disclosure was never given to me. I sent it via certified mail and it was signed for, so the PD couldn't say they didn't get it.

So yes. If she tried to argue it, I would've just told the JP that I was refused disclosure, therefore ending the case on the spot.

So yes. Still was like a baws.
I don't think that failing to provide disclosure is grounds for dismissal...

If anything, you would be granted a second hearing at a later date after the notes are provided to you.
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Old 06-09-2012, 05:32 AM   #47
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It depends.....IF the request is made in writing far enough in advance so that a response can be made ( 2 weeks is not reasonable because of shifts, time required to do the work etc), the response is reasonable and detailed in what you are requesting ( not from some sort of anti-Police website), you will get a reply for exactly what you have asked. Demanding things that do not exist or requesting things that violate confidentiality or copyright laws will get you nada. Then you have to actually understand what you got and how to use it in court to raise reasonable doubt. A lot to ask from someone who is not legally trained or an expert or qualified to speak to the things you are trying to raise.

When I got the internet form letters it told me that the person who had sent it knew almost nothing about the process or the info they wanted. They would get back only what was required by law, period. I watched several of them in court ask questions that supported my case and helped me in my prosecution. As the saying goes....never ask a question to which you do not know the answer. Also goes to say that you never should ask a question that would help convict yourself. One of my favourites was one guy who said..."but Cst you couldn't possibly have seen me going XXXXkmh on XXXX street because I saw you coming and ducked down the side street before you got your RADAR on". I had instant-on RADAR on the Police MC and he didn't know I had the readings before he recognized it as a Cop bike.
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Old 06-10-2012, 09:53 AM   #48
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Five bucks says the cops' communication wasn't mixed up at all and the only one who mis-heard anything was sebberry, hearing what he WANTED to hear.

(edit: make that a five-dollar gift card from Timmy's )
Just like you read what YOU wanted to read in regards to the new "appeal" process for traffic tickets?
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Old 06-13-2012, 08:24 PM   #49
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I think I may have found a way to "leave him speechless"!
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Old 06-13-2012, 10:24 PM   #50
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Just like you read what YOU wanted to read in regards to the new "appeal" process for traffic tickets?
I read exactly what was in the quoted article, rather than inventing things that it DIDN'T say.
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