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Old 10-26-2012, 01:19 AM   #26
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at least he planned to cook them first
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Old 10-26-2012, 01:43 AM   #27
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Not only is your view anthropocentric, but it is completely inconsistent with anthropolgical data.

Cannibalism remains common among non-human animals, and was common among indigenous human cultures. Animals don't suffer from morality, so they eat members of their own species without concern; indigenous cultures did not share our contemporary ideas on morality, so they ate fellow humans without concern.

The only reason for you to view cannibalism as wrong are your contemporary ideas on morality, which are subjective. A person can adopt ideas on morality that allow cannibalism without suffering from a mental defect or demonic possession, because no sound argument that one set of morals is superior over the other can be made. It amounts to a difference of opinion.

The officer and his accomplice are completely sane, they're just not interested in abiding by the rules we as a society generally agree everyone must obey. Charge them, convict them, ship them off to prison, and amp up the screening process NYPD officers go through.



Please cite a side effect of eating flesh taken from a human healthy at time of death.
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The capacity to rape and torture does not imply a lack of sanity, only a willingness to interfere with the fundamental interests of another human. In this case, the interest to not suffer and the interest to not die prematurely. Possessing that willingness only implies a set of morals far separated from the standard.

If the capacity to rape and torture were to imply insanity, explaining the disproportionately high number of soldiers compared to civilians who are insane would be a difficult task.

The Cop would be insane if he believed Jesus told him to rape, torture, and murder the women, because they were evil aliens come to destroy Earth.
I agree with everything, so this is mostly to add.

I eat the meat from cows, chickens, and turkeys, and some of you are saying that human meat is any different? As MB mentioned, it's a case of what people see as moral behaviour in comparison to social standards. The only reason most of you scoff at it, is because you've grown up in a priveledged society. Take away everything you take for granted, and you will learn that such acts as eating meat from humans is the farthest from taboo. What you percieve as a crime is only a crime because certain people in power have said so, it does not make it an illness or malfunction of the brain, such crimes as rape, murder, cannibalism, thievery, and blackmail apply.

That does not go to say that I would personally commit such acts, it simply means that the norm creates us, and as such, alienates anything that does not comply to that norm. If a society ending event should occur, you would quickly learn how the human race really is, we are all animals, much like every other animal on this planet. People such as this policeman do not surprise me, it simply comes off as an individual's will, a will in which I acknowledge as essentially human, regardless of what I feel is right or wrong. He is still a human biologically and mentally, whether or not you would wish to exile him or not.

You may not dispel humanity if you yourself are human, you must accept it for what it is. If you consider a human to be evil, then all of mankind is evil, as every human is capable of the same thing. Realising that the line between good and evil is a paradox when dealing with humans is essential, as there are infinite "good" and "evil" acts a human may commit, according to any social standard in existence.
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Old 10-26-2012, 02:12 AM   #28
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Let me first note,
if you enjoy Les Stroud, you may recall the New Guinea episode of Survivorman. In that episode, Les lives with the Hewa people and participates in a ritual banned by Christian Missionaries that involves necrocannibalistim. That is one of the tribes that Kuru disease circulates among.

Moving along,
it's difficult to call this a negative effect resulting from eating healthy human flesh, because the body being eaten needs to carry Kuru disease as far as I understand. The majority, if not all, other indigenous cannibal societies suffered no ill-effects as a result of eating people.

Finally,
Natural selection has effectively killed off Kuru, and by studying the changes that evolution caused within the indigenous population a template may be developed to eliminate similar, far more prevalent, diseases. Fascinating.

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Old 10-26-2012, 12:02 PM   #29
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I wouldn't call him insane.

insane is like, your mind is completely preoccupied/manifested with some ideology or line of thought, that you are unable to function in everyday life.

he was able to function, he's just... his... scale of morality is different than most people's.

uh regardless, he shouldn't be a cop haha, or allowed to live with other people if he wants to eat them.
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Old 10-26-2012, 12:16 PM   #30
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god damn... Lets cook him instead
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Old 10-26-2012, 12:23 PM   #31
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im not to concerned about what anyone says about this but ANYONE who plans to rape, torture, cook not only one but a list of people is FUCKING INSANE!

i dont even know how someone could argue that, let this guy live with you if you think otherwise, i understand thought are thoughts, but detailed planning and bragging to another person going as far as saying "her days are numbered"

im sure no one would be defending this guys sanity if it was someone they knew in the list of raping, torturing and eaten by this fuck
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Old 10-26-2012, 12:50 PM   #32
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raped then cooked?? Damn...special sauce?
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Old 10-26-2012, 01:06 PM   #33
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raped then cooked?? Damn...special sauce?
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Old 10-26-2012, 01:06 PM   #34
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Old 10-26-2012, 01:09 PM   #35
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im not to concerned about what anyone says about this but ANYONE who plans to rape, torture, cook not only one but a list of people is FUCKING INSANE!

i dont even know how someone could argue that, let this guy live with you if you think otherwise, i understand thought are thoughts, but detailed planning and bragging to another person going as far as saying "her days are numbered"

im sure no one would be defending this guys sanity if it was someone they knew in the list of raping, torturing and eaten by this fuck
My defense of the Officer's sanity would be unparalleled in dedication if he were to rape, torture, and eat someone I know. Mental illness is an accepted reason to escape culpability for an act. The Officer being entirely sane, I would fight to ensure he does not escape the consequences.

I would not allow the Officer to live with me, I do not aspire to be his dinner.

I still have yet to see someone present an argument for why the desire to rape, torture, and kill makes a person insane. People are simply repeating that the desire to commit these actions makes a person insane, but giving no explanation as to why. Seriously, it would be great to read a strong counter to my position, someone write one!
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Old 10-26-2012, 01:12 PM   #36
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Old 10-26-2012, 01:22 PM   #37
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My defense of the Officer's sanity would be unparalleled in dedication if he were to rape, torture, and eat someone I know. Mental illness is an accepted reason to escape culpability for an act. The Officer being entirely sane, I would fight to ensure he does not escape the consequences.

I would not allow the Officer to live with me, I do not aspire to be his dinner.

I still have yet to see someone present an argument for why the desire to rape, torture, and kill makes a person insane. People are simply repeating that the desire to commit these actions makes a person insane, but giving no explanation as to why. Seriously, it would be great to read a strong counter to my position, someone write one!


i dont think someone needs to show an example of why its insane, thoughts of rape are normal? and putting another innocent human through torture is sane? if the fucking guy is hungry why not go eat a steak, the animal has been bred for consumption unlike a human.

im going to define sanity in my own words, people dont have to be social, popular, friendly or generous at all, but, people need to be able to make definitions while considering the welfare of fellow humans without purposely harming them, mentally, or physically. Someone who can go on in life wanting others to suffer for their own amusement is not stable, and im sure there is some sort of chemical imbalance or defect in the brain causing it, unless he/she is just some sick fuck that needs to be put down like a ravage animal.



ps missed part of your post, i dont think "insane" is a reason to get off the hook either, im sorry, this is going to be harsh, but like anything with serious faults needs to be taken care of, lets just call it a recall, human comes out fucked up enough to want to harm other humans without a justifiable reason need to be put down, tainted meat gets thrown away, as should a human not capable of living in a society, if i went off the wagon and was plotting shit like this i think i would deserve to die as well.

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Old 10-26-2012, 02:09 PM   #38
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there are plenty of people that like to hurt other people.

just look around you.


if your definition of insane is "abnormal" thinking, then, well, people that like S&M are insane.
gay people are insane.

wouldn't all smokers be insane as well? i mean you know it's killing you, yet you keep doing it. that's pretty insane too right?

what about doubling down at the casino on a losing hand, isnt that fucking insane too?

what about skipping a meal to keep studying or working? that sounds insane to me too.

what about someone that works at a slaughter house? all you do all day is kill 100's of animals without remorse or regret. that sounds insane to me too.

or the soldier that goes to war and shoots people.

or the people that direct the war.

what about the guy that stays at home all day and jerks off and cant get anything done cuz he's addicted to masturbation. sounds insane to me too.


just cuz someone does some action you don't like, doesnt make them insane.

insane has a real definition. a definition you can't just make up and change on the spot.


i agree, he's fucked in the head for wanting to do those things, fucked in the head COMPARED TO US. but compared to other people who want to do it, he's totally normal.

he's totally 100% able to take care of himself, make a living, and contribute to society and not need any assistance to survive. that already rules him out of the insanity bracket.

you've never met insane until you've been in a nut house. insane is insane. your mind is gone. lost. you're so obsessed over some conspiracy theory or some idea, that you cannot even take care of yourself. you cant get any work done, you cant feed yourself, you cant do anything right, because you're constantly obsessed over some idea, that supersedes all aspects of life. THAT is insane.

he could just be a plain old psychopath.
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Old 10-26-2012, 02:11 PM   #39
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i dont think someone needs to show an example of why its insane, thoughts of rape are normal? and putting another innocent human through torture is sane? if the fucking guy is hungry why not go eat a steak, the animal has been bred for consumption unlike a human.

im going to define sanity in my own words, people dont have to be social, popular, friendly or generous at all, but, people need to be able to make definitions while considering the welfare of fellow humans without purposely harming them, mentally, or physically. Someone who can go on in life wanting others to suffer for their own amusement is not stable, and im sure there is some sort of chemical imbalance or defect in the brain causing it, unless he/she is just some sick fuck that needs to be put down like a ravage animal.

ps missed part of your post, i dont think "insane" is a reason to get off the hook either, im sorry, this is going to be harsh, but like anything with serious faults needs to be taken care of, lets just call it a recall, human comes out fucked up enough to want to harm other humans without a justifiable reason need to be put down, tainted meat gets thrown away, as should a human not capable of living in a society, if i went off the wagon and was plotting shit like this i think i would deserve to die as well.
Every human mind is entirely capable of conceptualizing rape, torture, and murder. It's the willingness and desire to act on such thoughts that differentiates normal from abnormal, or moral from immoral, and these are subjective concepts. While your morals would prevent you from committing rape, torture, and murder, they also allow you to support capital punishment, which most people consider immoral. Your support of capital punishment contrasted with my opposition of it, is no different from our opposition to rape, torture, and murder. A difference in subjective opinion, nothing more. Lots of people enjoy harming other people, a large contingent of military members worldwide take pleasure in the act of killing and rape, and all these people could not be mentally ill. A statistical argument showing a hugely disproportionate percentage of soldiers as insane is impossible. They simply adopt the morals of the environment that surrounds them, which allow them to enjoy rape and killing. Morals are very fluid, so this is entirely possible.

To say, a cow is bred for consumption and a human is not is inconsistent. A human is an animal, composed of blood, flesh, and bone. A cow is an animal, composed of blood, flesh, and bone. There is no significant distinction between a cow and human outside of the arrangement of parts. Human is as fitting for consumption as cow, we're just not inclined to do it, because of our morals, but the majority of indigenous societies are so committed to cannibalism they find it immoral to not partake. There's no argument than can definitely say we're right and the indigenous people are/were wrong.
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Old 10-26-2012, 02:14 PM   #40
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well lets see what the dictionary says

sane:
1. free from mental derangement; having a sound, healthy mind: a sane person.
2. having or showing reason, sound judgment, or good sense: sane advice.
3. sound; healthy.

the guy passes the first point, fails the second point, passes the third point

so...he's sort of sane?
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Old 10-26-2012, 02:16 PM   #41
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I wouldn't call him insane.
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The capacity to rape and torture does not imply a lack of sanity, only a willingness to interfere with the fundamental interests of another human.
Perhaps you missed the part where it said

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Among Valle’s ideas was to slow cook a woman so she would stay alive as long as possible


Sure it's hard to define sanity but I think any 'normal' people would not cook their food this way...Does it give him more satisifaction when he eats it when cooked in this fashion? Does it tastes better?
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Old 10-26-2012, 02:17 PM   #42
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Old 10-26-2012, 02:50 PM   #43
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Perhaps you missed the part where it said



Sure it's hard to define sanity but I think any 'normal' people would not cook their food this way...Does it give him more satisifaction when he eats it when cooked in this fashion? Does it tastes better?
I'll relate it to execution methods... beheading or burning at the stake.

A few centuries ago, burning at the stake was chosen over beheading as a preferable execution method. Burning at the steak would create unimaginable suffering in comparison to a quick beheading. A shift in ideology occurred, now IF we execute someone choosing the quickest and most painless method is of the utmost importance. Why do we feel the need to minimize suffering now? As a society our morals tell us minimizing suffering is important. If the persons morals say another beings suffering is of no relevance, only ones' own pleasure, then slow roasting a person alive doesn't seem to be a moral obstacle.

I don't think it's 'normal' to slow roast a person, but I don't think the willingness to do it implies insanity. If it did, all those villages that burned people at the stake would be filled with crazy people.
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Old 10-26-2012, 06:33 PM   #44
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well lets see what the dictionary says

sane:
1. free from mental derangement; having a sound, healthy mind: a sane person.
2. having or showing reason, sound judgment, or good sense: sane advice.
3. sound; healthy.

the guy passes the first point, fails the second point, passes the third point

so...he's sort of sane?
sane advice is subjective, as to what activity you're advising for.

if you asked me how to keep out of trouble and live a peaceful life, and I advised you to slow cook a woman after raping her, you'd call me insane.

but if you wanted advice on how to slow cook a woman after raping her, and i told you to become a sneaky two faced cop, so you could have access and power to things normal people don't have. my advice would have shown reason, sound judgement, and good sense. it would be sane advice.


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Sure it's hard to define sanity but I think any 'normal' people would not cook their food this way...Does it give him more satisifaction when he eats it when cooked in this fashion? Does it tastes better?
normal has nothing to do with insanity. being a psychopath and not feeling remorse/sympathy/apathy is not insane. it's psychopathic. not insanity.

i don't think you guys really get what these terms mean at all.

you guys do know psychopath is different from psychotic right?

psychotic=insane/crayzayyy

psychopath=you are the the only thing that matters, EVERYTHING ELSE is an object placed in the universe, to serve you, if you so choose to use them. the only thing that's alive, is yourself. no other life is regarded as life. they're just objects. everything is an object. you only care about you. and only you, and nothing else. you only feel pain for yourself. you completely lack the ability to feel sympathy. watching someone else get hurt is no different than watching someone paint a painting. perhaps you observe someone paint a painting because of the technique or cool colors. you would observe someone scream in pain, for the exact same reason. you would be examining it because it's interesting and you've never seen it before, or it gives you some thrill. the fact that they are getting hurt and it PAINS them, doesnt even register in your brain, it's just another experiment, just another day in your life.


insane would be him saying the illuminati and lizardmen have to be defeated by slow cooking and raping women. all he talks about is lizardmen and illuminati. his whole life is dedicated to his delusions and his real world actions reflect that. he is so obsessed with the idea of saving the world through some INSANE reasoning, that he cannot even take care of himself or do anything else properly. he's obsessed with an idea. the idea is so far out there and so improbable, yet he is unable to see that his actions and reasoning is leading him to do things that are deemed unreasonable. he's a risk for everyone else, and most importantly, himself. that, is insane. that is psychotic.

insanity is when people do things, not because they WANT to, but because of some irrational logic, warped by some underlying fundamental ideal, which is of course totally fucked up.

the cop isnt insane. he just gets a thrill out of planning to rape, slow cook, kill, then eat women. and since he hasnt actually carried out the action, i cant say that he actually does enjoy it. he could totally be grossed out by dead bodies and realise his fantasies arent exactly synchronous with reality. dead bodies stink. dead people are repulsive and gross.

either way. he gets a thrill out of "power tripping" in the most perverse way.

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Old 10-27-2012, 07:17 PM   #45
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Old 10-27-2012, 07:21 PM   #46
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are you guys seriously in here trying to defend that nypd officer from ridicule?

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Old 10-27-2012, 07:29 PM   #47
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are you guys seriously in here trying to defend that nypd officer from ridicule?

No, not at all.

Ulic, Yoda, and I are defending the Officer's sanity, not saying it's okay to rape, torture, murder, and eat people.

In fact, the Officer being sane makes the actions more horrendous.
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Old 10-27-2012, 07:39 PM   #48
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they could call him a homophobic anti-semite right now wth cares fact remains he's innocent until proven guilty but come on it's expected people are going to be calling him all sorts of names

arguing over his level of sanity or lack thereof is pointless; for all we know he is insane or isn't neither of you can come to one conclusion or another on what we're provided with




/rant sorry all just seems a bit silly :P
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Old 10-27-2012, 07:59 PM   #49
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they could call him a homophobic anti-semite right now wth cares fact remains he's innocent until proven guilty but come on it's expected people are going to be calling him all sorts of names

arguing over his level of sanity or lack thereof is pointless; for all we know he is insane or isn't neither of you can come to one conclusion or another on what we're provided with




/rant sorry all just seems a bit silly :P
It's not really about this specific case, so the general facts are sufficient detail.

The only person qualified to pass a meaningful judgement on a specific person's sanity is a psychiatrist who has met with the concerned.

You and I can discuss, whether deriving pleasure from the suffering of another human precludes sanity as a general rule though.

If you go back to my original post in this thread, you'll see my comments were on general rules and directed at Drew's comments on general rules.

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Old 10-27-2012, 10:18 PM   #50
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holy shit, an insightful well thought out response on RS

my take; if he was in any way trying to keep this plan from being discovered by authorities, then he is indeed sane.

he can tell the difference between right and wrong, he is not sick. he just needs a small cell to think about this for the rest of his life
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