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Old 02-16-2013, 12:03 PM   #1
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BMW M5 - Unjust banning

Quote:
Originally Posted by SkinnyPupp
If you guys want to talk about it, I would recommend opening a new thread in the support forum.
well, since you guys asked me to do it... here it is.

http://www.revscene.net/forums/68017...ml#post8159913

What he said wasn't nice. and his history doesn't show any bad behaviour (regardless whether he "contributed" or not... contribution is subjective).

As much as people didnt like what he said, more people disagree that he was banned.

You must realise, whatever he said, wouldn't of been more than a quick thought in many of our minds as well... Just he was the first to write it.

No one thinks what he said was "against RS law" or whatever. If he gets banned, that sets a precedent that any of us could be banned for writing our thoughts down (Thoughts that could be right, I mean, what he said could very well be true, and I wouldn't even call it as something far off).

for those of you that already have a pre subjective train of thought because the post was started by me... no i'm not trying to start shit (take note: I never do).


Quote:
Originally Posted by 7seven
What I don't get is why that guy in the local girl missing in LA thread got banned and Hondaracer got banned for basically just stating their view/opinions that maybe a mod didn't like, seems touch sensitive no?
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nipples neways...wat is with those fuck'n asians! i mean you would think they've never seen a dentist in their life. are dentists really that rare over there in ricey ricey and? looks like they're star trek ferrengi rejects! fuck'n have broken glass for teeth! goddaymn! and the smell....did a rat crawl in there and shit itself then marinate in its own shit as it decayed?ewwwwwwwwww! i swear...if one of those ferrengi asian girls gave head...when u pull the dick out it looks like it went thru a meat grinder! prolly shaved off a few slices of meat! *shudder*
Greebo i t-boned some guy and killed their baby, it was funny
silvia i have a couple asian guy friends that do very well with the ladies. but guess what, they go to the gym, they dont have long hair, they dont wear orange pants, and they dont play counterstrike. its not the ethnicity that the girls dont like, its the style and personality.
450HP Supra I am about to use your eye sockets as a shoe rack for my nuts. ...something about chinks, j-bodys, I can't quite remember as I was drunk and looking for a girl to punch in the clit. Think of it as a digital urinal, and you are the mint, except, instead of actually smelling mint, you smell like mothballs, rotten kimchee and virginity. I'm about to start drinking heavily now and you better be gone before I get back or I swear to god I will break the internet over my knee and use the pieces to beat you in the deformed skull with, cock muffler.
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Last edited by Ulic Qel-Droma; 02-16-2013 at 12:13 PM.
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Old 02-16-2013, 12:25 PM   #2
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I do agree that BMW M5's banning was harsh. I don't know him or her, but I was surprised that they were banned for just that. Maybe a warning would have sufficed?

People should be entitled to their own opinion on things regardless of how cynical they may be.

I don't believe that what he said was derogatory for the fact that his statements are a possibility. I would never want such things to happen to anyone, but these things do sadly happen.

We may think the worst, but that doesn't mean we don't hope for the best.
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Old 02-16-2013, 12:36 PM   #3
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I agree, the post does not appear to violate any rules.

I'm not clear why it would lead to a ban, its a completely reasonable thesis on potential outcomes. It's the outcome I expect.

I also saw this ban, and I'm unclear to its reasons.

It says spam, but the person has a series of normal, albeit stupid, prior posts.

http://www.revscene.net/forums/67912...ml#post8153957
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Old 02-16-2013, 01:26 PM   #4
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Some mods on rs need to have their shit revoked. I see too much power power tripping and the like. Leads me to believe these people have the emotional IQ of a 5 year old.
Ya, people say stupid shit on the internet but it's THE internet, it's expected, get over it.
If you don't like what someone says, fail them, tell them how and why they're dumb, don't ban them.
The trolls and idiots provide value in that it can be entertaining.
Members make this board, mods ruin it.
When I first joined rs, rules were lax and it was so much more fun. Bring it back!
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Old 02-16-2013, 02:18 PM   #5
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Ah, the joys of moderating an interwebs forum.


Yes, I admit I've been a bit quicker on the draw with the banhammer lately. The two that Ulic brings up are both bans of mine. And while it is true that those bans may seem unwarranted and overly harsh, I felt they were appropriate at the time.

One of the difficulties of moderating a board such as this is finding a balance between speech which is conducive to further discussion and posting, and speech which is inflammatory and just boils down to everyone screaming and threads being locked. One of the things that is challenging is in finding a way to make sure that threads don't get derailed (such as the Porsche build thread--I'll touch on that a bit later), while still maintaining some semblance of variety. Threads are boring if there's no discussion.

When I make a decision about who to ban or what kind of punitive actions to take, it's not that often that I will take action immediately. In the case of HR's ban, it was several posts over several days in some threads which I felt were in extremely poor taste. I know he's been around for a long time, and his ban is not a permanent one. He contributes a great deal on RS, and being a former mod is undoubtedly still lurking on an account which he had as a backup. When it comes to BMWM5, that one I did do almost immediately. I looked at the post, the comments and discussion that were happening around it, and then into his user history, his join date, and a variety of other things. Then I banned him.

There is no hard and fast rule when it comes to moderating sites like this one. One of the biggest problems with rules is that as soon as you say "This is the rule for what you can and cannot do", then people will look for ways to break the spirit and keep to the word. Yes, mods can be excessive. Yes, mods can go over the top. Yes, we need to keep ourselves in check. I'm glad Ulic started this thread. Full disclosure: Ulic and I have contact off RS, and very often agree in principle in many things. Funnily enough, we actually agree on this topic: checks and balances. It just so happens we're on opposite sides of the line this time.

Now, about the other issues.
Mindbomber: Users like that show up periodically at times just before hallowe'en and Valentine's. Usually accounts like that can be traced back to IPs which have other registered users. People will start new accounts, make some sparse posts in order to make themselves blend in, and then post their business/service/what-have-you. While I'm not responsible for that one, it wouldn't surprise me if that were the case. This person registered in February and *gasp* ended up posting inanities just in time to be ready to sell stuff on Valentine's.

The Porsche tuning thread: I was not involved in the deletion of the first one, I was involved in the cleanup of the fallout from that, however. Not fun. My understanding is thus:
1) A person who is associated with a shop posted a single picture of a porsche and a link to a build thread elsewhere
2) The thread got a bit of discussion
3) The thread was deleted
4) People interested in the thread and/or the OP were like "WTF where did the thread go?"
5) A new thread was created with more pictures, a detailed story, and more information
6) That thread went all to hell in a handbasket because of thread one.

I don't work in the car industry anymore. I don't know who works for what shops and where. This is simply what I was given to understand, and it's entirely possible that it's wrong. However. My rule of thumb has always been thus: "If it's a teaser, that's not okay because it's leading people away from RS. If it's original content with a link to the source, that's fine because it encourages discussion and more posting here".

Now, as I said. This is my rule of thumb. It's difficult to have hard and fast rules in situations like this. Different people have different knowledge and experience. Some people know users and don't know others. Some people are friends offline and will say "that's just how he talks" or "he didn't mean anything by it" and so on and so forth. That's great. I don't know that. I don't know you. I only know what's here on RS.

And it's my job to try and keep things clean.


TL;DR: I banned HR and M5, I try to find a balance but yes I've been banhammerhappy recently. Threads like this are good for helping you guys to understand my rationales and also for you guys to tell me why I'm an asshole.
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Old 02-16-2013, 02:26 PM   #6
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they call you "VAC AssMod" for a reason lol

bmw m5's post don't see how that should be ban, HR.. whatever almost all of his posts are derogatory
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Old 02-16-2013, 03:38 PM   #7
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Well, there can certainly be some confusion for people when this:

Quote:
RULES & GUIDELINES. Approx read time = less than 3 mins.




Rule 1: Post on topic! (and in the right section)

Revscene is a diverse place. Car discussion, entertainment, sports, music, health advice, classifieds, current events, everything!
Every topic you can think of has a place to be posted. Please use the right forum when posting a new thread.

Posting a thread in the wrong place "because more people will see it here" is unacceptable.

Keep your post on topic with the thread - nobody wants to see the picture of the bunny with a pancake on his head.


Rule 2: All posts that may be offensive MUST HAVE a warning in the title.

This includes porn, and anything else people may find offensive or inappropriate to view at work.

Use something like *NSFW* or *warning*.


Rule 3: Absolutely NO spam

Linking to affiliate referrals, promoting your product or event, soliciting members, or trying to drive volume somewhere to benefit yourself is prohibited. These types of posts are considered SPAM and the complaints we received are taken seriously.

If you are Interested in advertising with REVSCENE - you can contact us through Advertisement@revscene.net


Rule 4: Junk Posts

Deliberately stupid and useless posts, general jackassery, Rickrolls and R-E-P-O-S-T are not tolerated. The aim is to make your post contribute to the thread.


Rule 5: Tolerance/Flaming

The use of personal attacks and racial slurs are not tolerated. If you feel you are the victim of uncalled for or inappropriate behaviour, or come across a deconstructive post, please us the report post button (small yield sign logo) and a moderator will address the situation. If you feel the need to call someone out, or personally attack another member, take it to Fight Club. Zero tolerance for personal attacks in the general forums. Ignore this, and you WILL get a point salad fed to you up the wrong opening.


Rule 6: Fail Button Abuse

The thanks/fail system is there for your usage, abuse it and you will lose it. We take complaints of Fail stalking ie. following another member around and failing their posts for the sake of it seriously; not only is it a nuisance, it also undermines the system. NOTE: you must have a minimum of 100 posts for your fail button to become enabled!


Rule 7: Post Whoring

Useless post whoring is a gigantic annoyance to everyone and is not tolerated. No need to define this any further.


Rule 7: No links to torrent sites

We ask that you DO NOT post up links to download of any copy written material - episodes of any tv show/movie etc.

Thank you.

IF YOU ARE EVER IN DOUBT OR HAVE ANY QUESTIONS, ASK A MOD. THAT'S WHY WE'RE HERE, AND WHAT THEY PAY US THE BIG BUCKS FOR!

Each sub-forum may have their own specific rules and guidelines that may expand from this list, so if you are new please take a moment to review the stickys (they will always be at the top section of the forum)! A couple minutes can save you 15%, and your account from getting banned!
is the content of the rules.

It still shows that NSFW content can be posted with a NSFW tag. Nothing about no swearing in titles.

Sooo...I could put a thread in OT of "Come Look at these bouncing fucking titties-NSFW" and be fine.

But a member was banned(temp) for posting NSFW content in the main forums.

There is nothing in the rules regarding a racial policy or a cyber-stalking policy and I believe that both are drastically required. When is sarcasm ok, and when does it go too far? Somewhere it should be written.

I really don't appreciate seeing threats against people on the site. It doesn't give me a "for the members, by the members" feeling-which is what revscene is. Yeah, its privately owned. Yahoo! Try getting sponsors when you don't have members. There are so many private alliances between mods who pretend to be neutral, that aren't. I get private messages off revscene how I've said something to offend a member, that just happens to be friends with a different mod. Give me a break.

BUT. In regards to the Porsche build thread, I found it rude when the administration of this board goes off on people(all nicely cleaned out of said thread) about protecting sponsors(which I agree is important) but basically "when you people do something to contribute, you get to say something".

No one here does NOT value the work that people do to get money and keep the site running, but no one has ever asked what members can do to self-support the site. Whenever the topic is brought up, its hushed like someone is asking for the nuclear codes. There are tons of things that can be done to support the site from the people that USE the site, making it self-sufficient, without going user-pay. But I read that whole thing as "you don't work on sponsors, so you don't know, but no one is offered a single chance to work on money, so you'll never know. So basically, shut up. " I know I felt valued as a member.

None of this is revscene specific, its forums in general. Too many mods, its over-modded. Not enough, and its a free for all.

I think all people want is an open dialogue, and a more open membership.

Someone mentioned that there is a file on everyone where shit gets logged. Can't that be made public when a person is banned? Sample dialogue: "Shit guys, you want to know why this guy is gone? Here you go. He's a racist prick, we warned him 3 times. We nuked him"

No one is asking to be involved in every monotonous detail, but opening things up clears the air, and kills a lot of debate before it starts.

TL;DR: this isn't the nixon white house.
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Old 02-16-2013, 03:40 PM   #8
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Oh, and please stop closing threads all over the place just because 'A' mod deems the conversation to be over.
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Old 02-16-2013, 04:04 PM   #9
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You gunna get banned, Gridlock.
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Old 02-16-2013, 04:24 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bcrdukes View Post
You gunna get banned, Gridlock.
Irony: getting banned unfairly in a thread about unfair bans.

Honestly, if no one wants my opinion-delete it. No harm, no foul. I certainly don't want to start 'a thing'.
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Old 02-16-2013, 04:52 PM   #11
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why can't we just let the people who were banned do their own propaganda to the mods. why is it that whenever some has been banned lately there is a flock of white knights attempting to sway the mods?

who cares....this shit is annoying to read in all the OT threads.
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Old 02-16-2013, 07:16 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gridlock View Post

BUT. In regards to the Porsche build thread, I found it rude when the administration of this board goes off on people(all nicely cleaned out of said thread) about protecting sponsors(which I agree is important) but basically "when you people do something to contribute, you get to say something".
I found it rude that the OP tried to post that thread when he knows better (which he's admitted to) as well as his affilation with the shop. He's benefitted from RS and for him to try that really struck a nerve.

I also found it rude that some of the members in that thread were trying to start shit b/c they something personal against RS. I'm not going to name who or why but I'm honestly done talking about that thread.

C'mon grid, you know whats its like and how easy it is to lose your cool on here. Difference being that with my position, i have to hold back from what I want to say most of the time. I admit I lost my cool with that thread and I apologized for it.
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Old 02-16-2013, 07:17 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gridlock View Post
Well, there can certainly be some confusion for people when this:



is the content of the rules.
Good point, the rules page needs to be updated.
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Old 02-16-2013, 08:23 PM   #14
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Nice edit. I read the 'before' version. If I'm such a problem, and a pain in people's sides, then I should go back and read all the official messages I've received about my actions. It will be easy. There are zero.

Given what happened, I would like to think that people might not appreciate what I did, but at least understand it. It's easy to talk generalities until your family is on display(I am being intentionally vague here as to not draw new attention to an old item)-then, you might be willing to offend a few people slightly with the larger goal of finding who did it. It was a singular pm...not the end of the world.

Honestly, I wasn't actually talking about you in the build thread. I support the idea that linking it back to a shop was wrong. You are right. It was spam, pure and simple. What I'm talking about is some of the other things that were written in the thread, that were deleted. My opinion, on reading it, was not a professional duty to eliminate spam. It was rude. But that is only my opinion. And you are also right...it's water under the bridge.

Anyhoo...on a lighter note, I do think there are some good points in my suggestions that might go along way to maintaining operational privacy, while at the same time clearing some of these issues off the main boards.
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Old 02-16-2013, 08:35 PM   #15
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Create a thread and post when someone is banned;

[USERNAME] was just banned for [DURATION] by [MOD NAME].

That account was created on [DATE] and had [# of fails/thanks/post whatever you seem fit]

Reason: [STUFF]

Just my 2 cents.
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Old 02-16-2013, 08:54 PM   #16
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TBH, I don't think it is any of our business why some users get banned.

I am sure there are a lot of private issues that happen behind the scenes that should not be discussed in an open forum.

Announcing user bans opens it up for discussion...which, as I am sure we can all agree, craps up threads. If the banned user has an issue, there are ways to contact the mods\admin to inquire why and petition to be unbanned.
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Old 02-16-2013, 09:07 PM   #17
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so ulic is mad because his bf got banned?
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Old 02-16-2013, 09:34 PM   #18
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I wrote that VOT rule thread maaaaaaany years ago before a bunch of the new rules were implemented (which, unless you're a relatively new member, you all should now be familiar with.) That said, it looks like someone forgot to update that thread since I switched over to looking after the Tech Forums. We'll make sure that it gets fixed asap.

As for banning members, as has been stated by others here, there is usually a longer process behind doing it. Unless it's obvious spam (BUY OUR CHEAP PHONES!! WE HAVE BEST SELECTION IN ALL OF TAIWAN!), we look into a member's previous history, how long they've been here, their overall contributions to the forums, etc. It's almost never done on a whim. Ulic, you mentioned that you went through a member's post history and couldn't find anything. That may be true that you didn't see anything, but threads and posts that we delete, edit, or move out of the public's eyes can only be seen by those running the website. While you may not see anything wrong, we can take a quick look and check out various flagged posts that may sway our decision.

One other thing to remember is that even if a member was banned for a post, it wasn't necessarily because of that post. Our warning system auto bans members temporarily if they given points x-amount of times (I believe it's 5 separate instances), so even if a particular post was worthy of points but not bad enough to be banned for it, they may still have hit that threshold... pushing them over the edge until they're reinstated in a week.
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Old 02-17-2013, 02:04 AM   #19
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When you guys say contribution.... to what extent is considered a worthy contribution? Just posting on average and fueling conversation considered contribution? or something like a coupon to benefit the community?
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Old 02-17-2013, 02:25 AM   #20
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Quality posts, basically. Doesn't matter if they're two sentences or two paragraphs, really.
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Old 02-17-2013, 03:08 AM   #21
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Maybe a bit off-topic, but if someone were to suddenly get banned? Is there a way to contact a mod to try and explain or get the account back?


On that note, I have to admit I'm slightly jealous that so many people even cares about a guy that had an account for slightly over a year, with 171 posts with a pretty bad thanks/fail ratio.

Unless it's a 2nd account or you guys knew him personally...
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Old 02-17-2013, 03:09 AM   #22
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What needs to be discussed is the censored content in discussions due to sponsors. Yes, I understand that sponsors help pay for the site, but they sponsor because they see enough members to make it deem fit. The members help the site just as much as the sponsors but if we can't even discuss topics because of sponsors, what can we discuss?

This is like Boom 2001 all over again!

Soon half the posts will look like this:

So I went to ****** and got ***** done. Purchased ****** and thought ****** did a good job.


Might as well just censor half the words since it can either affect a sponsor or be a derogatory term.
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Old 02-17-2013, 09:10 AM   #23
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What needs to be discussed is the censored content in discussions due to sponsors. Yes, I understand that sponsors help pay for the site, but they sponsor because they see enough members to make it deem fit. The members help the site just as much as the sponsors but if we can't even discuss topics because of sponsors, what can we discuss?

This is like Boom 2001 all over again!

Soon half the posts will look like this:

So I went to ****** and got ***** done. Purchased ****** and thought ****** did a good job.


Might as well just censor half the words since it can either affect a sponsor or be a derogatory term.
Honestly, I have NEVER seen that.

And I think everyone needs to understand there is a difference between "where can I get my brakes done?" and "come and do your brakes here...at this shop...say you're with rs and get 10% off...we're on this road. Here's our facebook."
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Old 02-17-2013, 01:25 PM   #24
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Grid, you bring up a lot of awesome points. Your feedback is appreciated her.

1) Rules: yes, you're right. They need to get updated badly. That'll be happening once I'm done this (Thanks for the rewrite, Lomac) and your feedback on the updated ones would be appreciated

2) Logging: One of the great and terrible things about logs is that it requires (essentially) omnipotence. One user proved to be quite a headache when he got points for bumping threads and then went on a stream reporting EVERY SINGLE THREAD in the buysell that had been bumped by someone other than the OP. This resulted in a flood of nearly a hundred emails for the buy/sell mods to go through. Why? Because he thought it was unfair that he had been punished when others hadn't. This is one reason why we don't include a 'fails' notification along with a 'thanks' notification. If we put up everything in all the logs that people have been punished for, it just creates more opportunity for drama. As much as I would love to be fully transparent on this kind of issue...it's a challenge. It's a lot easier to get e-butthurt than real-life butthurt, and while a real-life butthurt incident ends up in an argument and/or the end of a friendship....it can be the creation of a horrible type of troll that takes a frakton of time and energy to deal with.

3) Thread closing: We (I) try to close threads when they're being derailed or have descended to the point of arguing about things that aren't productive. Can you give some examples of threads that you think shouldn't've been closed? Other points of view are always good--more content is more clicks, and if there's the opportunity for more discussion, I'm all for it.

4) 'take it or leave it' mentality: I'm personally not a fan of that. You'll notice that even though I'm being directly criticized (and it's not just here--some other mods are not fans of my decisions, and I respect that and am glad that I'm getting the opportunity to hear feedback from others. It's an opportunity I don't often get, since...well, it's the interwebs) I'm trying to keep an open dialogue and not shut anyone down. Ain't nobody gonna get banned for raising reasonable points, especially in this forum. People will get points and banned for continually derailing threads bringing up topics like this. Yet another reason I'm glad this thread exists. And yes, I realize the irony of me not being in favour of take-it-or-leave-it and being banhappy. Cognitive Dissonance at its finest.


Radioman: As I said to grid before, it's more opportunities for drama. I don't want to say "We don't have to tell you", but when people ask why others were banned, mods will generally give a reason. If, however, we make new threads for each banning...it'll bring up more opportunities for chaos.

Emperor: Lomac has it. Keeping the discussion going, posting more than just "LOL" or "you go girl" and all that jazz.

AzN: generally, people have friends on RS who will PM mods or make a thread here and ask. We've also had some people sign up on new accounts and PM asking to have their accounts back and what have you.

RFlush: I think you'll notice that hasn't been happening lately. Much of the issues with that was that some companies were approached for advertising opportunities, turned it down, and then would post from an account from their IP address talking about the great services; or they'd ask their customers to post on RS to say what a good job they did or what have you. It was the equivalent of getting on the skytrain with a book of 9 bus tickets, and then when you get checked saying "oh shit, I know I had it somewhere..." Fortunately, things in that regard have calmed down for the most part. But as I've said before, it's difficult and a fine line.


-edit-
rules updated to indicate no NWS at all; any other suggestions for rules?

Last edited by Graeme S; 02-17-2013 at 01:31 PM. Reason: edited rules
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Old 02-17-2013, 02:26 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Graeme S View Post
Grid, you bring up a lot of awesome points. Your feedback is appreciated her.

1) Rules: yes, you're right. They need to get updated badly. That'll be happening once I'm done this (Thanks for the rewrite, Lomac) and your feedback on the updated ones would be appreciated

2) Logging: One of the great and terrible things about logs is that it requires (essentially) omnipotence. One user proved to be quite a headache when he got points for bumping threads and then went on a stream reporting EVERY SINGLE THREAD in the buysell that had been bumped by someone other than the OP. This resulted in a flood of nearly a hundred emails for the buy/sell mods to go through. Why? Because he thought it was unfair that he had been punished when others hadn't. This is one reason why we don't include a 'fails' notification along with a 'thanks' notification. If we put up everything in all the logs that people have been punished for, it just creates more opportunity for drama. As much as I would love to be fully transparent on this kind of issue...it's a challenge. It's a lot easier to get e-butthurt than real-life butthurt, and while a real-life butthurt incident ends up in an argument and/or the end of a friendship....it can be the creation of a horrible type of troll that takes a frakton of time and energy to deal with.

3) Thread closing: We (I) try to close threads when they're being derailed or have descended to the point of arguing about things that aren't productive. Can you give some examples of threads that you think shouldn't've been closed? Other points of view are always good--more content is more clicks, and if there's the opportunity for more discussion, I'm all for it.

4) 'take it or leave it' mentality: I'm personally not a fan of that. You'll notice that even though I'm being directly criticized (and it's not just here--some other mods are not fans of my decisions, and I respect that and am glad that I'm getting the opportunity to hear feedback from others. It's an opportunity I don't often get, since...well, it's the interwebs) I'm trying to keep an open dialogue and not shut anyone down. Ain't nobody gonna get banned for raising reasonable points, especially in this forum. People will get points and banned for continually derailing threads bringing up topics like this. Yet another reason I'm glad this thread exists. And yes, I realize the irony of me not being in favour of take-it-or-leave-it and being banhappy. Cognitive Dissonance at its finest.


Radioman: As I said to grid before, it's more opportunities for drama. I don't want to say "We don't have to tell you", but when people ask why others were banned, mods will generally give a reason. If, however, we make new threads for each banning...it'll bring up more opportunities for chaos.

Emperor: Lomac has it. Keeping the discussion going, posting more than just "LOL" or "you go girl" and all that jazz.

AzN: generally, people have friends on RS who will PM mods or make a thread here and ask. We've also had some people sign up on new accounts and PM asking to have their accounts back and what have you.

RFlush: I think you'll notice that hasn't been happening lately. Much of the issues with that was that some companies were approached for advertising opportunities, turned it down, and then would post from an account from their IP address talking about the great services; or they'd ask their customers to post on RS to say what a good job they did or what have you. It was the equivalent of getting on the skytrain with a book of 9 bus tickets, and then when you get checked saying "oh shit, I know I had it somewhere..." Fortunately, things in that regard have calmed down for the most part. But as I've said before, it's difficult and a fine line.


-edit-
rules updated to indicate no NWS at all; any other suggestions for rules?
First, thanks for taking the time to write that out. I think it clears up a lot of the inner workings of some decisions.

On the rules:

I think someone needs to spend some time on a policy regarding racism. I have noticed that its being addressed on the forums, and its appreciated by the casual viewer(ie. me). Whether that policy is straight out zero tolerance, or a warn then ban, or a loophole for obvious sarcasm-not really my call. I personally don't care for zero tolerance policies because a lot of people can get caught up in that type of thing, and it comes across as draconian. As it stands now, once again, officially there is nothing to prevent people syaing whatever they want in regards to racially derogatory comments.

Sexist comments: How the hell you navigate that one, I really don't know. It's prevalent all over the internet-almost popular. I will say that if you want to edge this site more mainstream, that brings women into the mix and I don't think they would feel welcome on this site...at all.

I think the second one should at least be something written to the effect of not taking your fights off revscene. Will it stop it? Probably not, but at least its out there. Maybe that one person will read it and think that there could be some unintended consequences when you breach the relative anonymity that a forum provides and start taking it real life, with real names and consequences for real careers and real people's lives.
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